Nivard, A few years ago I questioned the CWGC about a note that was on one of my ancestors records. They told me that where a parent could be found they would write to them, inform them that their name was listed and provided them with a book of all who are listed. I still have this book. Therefore the address you have on there is the address where the family were to be found when your ancestor was listed and where they contacted them. I would therefore assume that you are right in your belief that they died in France. The surname is typically French and if you cannot fine a Birth of either I would suggest looking at France Switzerland or even Belgium Rob -----Original Message----- From: Nivard Ovington <ovington.one@gmail.com> To: leicestershire-plus <leicestershire-plus@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tue, Dec 24, 2013 5:46 pm Subject: [LEI] Arthur HURST wife Amy TURNER curiosity on sons CWGC entry residence in France Hi all I am seeking information on my wifes great grandparents Arthur HURST b1866 Wigston married Amy TURNER b1872 Birdingbury Warwickshire According to the 1911 they had five children, four living in 1911 Albert Edward 1894 - 1965 Edith Agnes 1898 - 1933 Archie 1900 - 1918 Leonard 1910 - 1976 Albert is my wifes grandfather and we have more on him Edith married Fernand DE HOUX (or DEHOUX) in 1917 They had one son who died young in 1924, Edith died in 1933 no idea what became of Fernand Leonard married Doris BROOKS in 1933 Archie was a casualty of WW1 and his CWGC creates a curious question Private Archie HURST age 18 Devonshire Regiment Unit: 1st/5th Bn. Date of Death: 30/09/1918 Service No: 72087 Additional information: Son of Arthur and Amy Hurst of 65, Rue de L'eglise, A'Fromelennes, pras Givet, Ardennes, France. Native of Leicester. Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead Grave/Memorial Reference: II. A. 14. Cemetery: MASNIERES BRITISH CEMETERY, MARCOING Arthur & Amy are in England in 1911, the question being what were they doing in France Given the CWGC form would be around 1920/1922 Arthur was a compositor, he could be working in France I suppose but we have nothing to back that theory up I have failed to find deaths or burials for either Arthur or Amy so I suppose they could have died in France but again we have nothing on that One theory is that Fernand DEHOUX was French but haven't found him apart from the marriage I do not as yet have the marriage cert for DEHOUX to HURST -- Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Brian, Very interesting but I have some good news for you!! You can get your Walkers Pie again!! The shop has been reopened http://www.walkerspies.co.uk/index.php/news You also buy from some supermarkets..info on their site BTW I do not work for any Pork pie company Happy Christmas Regards Paul Taylor On 23/12/2013 8:57 AM, Brian Binns wrote: My recent posting on Christmas recipes has been expanded on the Leicestershire forum to a discussion on Pork Pies, and as the history of local producers concerns both Notts and Leics, I am posting this summary to both. In the early 1940s, Ken Parr, a recently qualified baker, took out a loan to set up his own pie shop in Nottingham. He developed a reputation founded on good baking, and developed the first "original" pork pie based on an old recipe, with signature dark and crispy pastry. He then bought another local pie shop, founded in 1931 which traded under the name Pork Farms, which he adopted for all shops after that. <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pork_Farms#cite_note-1> In the mid-1960s, Parr's business was bought by food tycoon W. Garfield Weston who made Parr Chairman. In 1969, rival Nottingham pie company TN Parr, formerly owned by Parr’s uncle, but then by Samworth Brothers, bought out Pork Farms, again bringing together the two companies together under the Pork Farms brand. In 1971, the group was floated on the London Stock Exchange as Pork Farms Ltd. In 1978 the Samworth family sold Pork Farms to Northern Foods, later merged by Northern with both Palethorpes of Market Drayton and Bowyers of Trowbridge, Wiltshire to form Pork Farms Bowyers. Later the company sold the Bowyers and Palethorpes pork sausage business and brands to concentrate on baked meat products. Northern Foods transferred the production of Pork Pies from Nottingham, which they later came to regret. In 2007, the name of Melton Mowbray Pork Pies became protected and they had to be made within a defined distance of Melton Mowbray to qualify. The company then chose to close the Trowbridge plant and invest £12million into the Nottingham plant to bring back and increase Melton Mowbray Pork Pie production. In the meantime, the Samworth Family had started building another food “empire” starting with Ginsters Pasties in Cornwall and then expanding back into the East Midlands. They now own Dickinson and Morris, probably the iconic Melton Mowbray Pork Pie makers, and Henry Walker of Leicester, as well as producing Melton Mowbray Pork Pies for most of the major supermarkets in the UK. Henry Walker is an interesting company. Walker & Son was founded in Leicester 1824 by Mark Walker, who with his son opened a butchers shop on Leicester High Street, in the early days their sausages were a hit! But then they built a bakery and the famous Walkers pork pie was born! Leicester loved our pies so much that thousands of families would buy them every week, on Christmas Eve people would queue around the block just to purchase their Walkers pork pie, your Christmas dinner table was not complete without one and isn't to this day! During the meat rationing of World War II, Walker & Son, diversified the business and using the surplus fat of meat products and locally grown potato's they began producing potato crisps, they were the original creators of the famous snack brand. This side of the business then grew into Walker’s Crisps, once just a local Leicester company, but since being bought by American giant PepsiCo has expanded into the biggest UK crisp and snack manufacturer, and has expanded into Europe with the “Lay’s” brand. Although brought up in Nottingham on Pork Farms Pies, I have to declare that I actually prefer Walker’s Pies, though their retail shops closed years ago, and I haven’t bought one for years. Pork Farms shops also closed years ago, so this Christmas we have bought a Melton Mowbray Pork Pie from Sainsbury’s, which I believe will have been made by Walkers, as they are the biggest (only) supplier of own label Melton Pies. Pork Pie and Piccalilli on Boxing Day for me! With best wishes to all I have had the pleasure to correspond with on these forums over the past year. Brian Binns

from Archive.org Leicestershire marriage bonds closest to area Thos. WHALLEY , Norton-juxta-Galbie marries Agnes COULTON, Owdbye 1608 others on page Ambrose,Jos,Peter page sent separately jim On 2013-12-23, at 12:53 AM, John Phillips wrote: > Hi all > > New to the list and trying to find the baptism of John Whalley son of > William the elder (d 1719)born circa 1660-5, presumably at Norton or Galby. > This is my missing link so if SKS could provide a baptism I would be very > grateful. > > Have a good Christmas and all the best for 2014. > > Many thanks > > John > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

My recent posting on Christmas recipes has been expanded on the Leicestershire forum to a discussion on Pork Pies, and as the history of local producers concerns both Notts and Leics, I am posting this summary to both. In the early 1940s, Ken Parr, a recently qualified baker, took out a loan to set up his own pie shop in Nottingham. He developed a reputation founded on good baking, and developed the first "original" pork pie based on an old recipe, with signature dark and crispy pastry. He then bought another local pie shop, founded in 1931 which traded under the name Pork Farms, which he adopted for all shops after that. <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pork_Farms#cite_note-1> In the mid-1960s, Parr's business was bought by food tycoon W. Garfield Weston who made Parr Chairman. In 1969, rival Nottingham pie company TN Parr, formerly owned by Parr’s uncle, but then by Samworth Brothers, bought out Pork Farms, again bringing together the two companies together under the Pork Farms brand. In 1971, the group was floated on the London Stock Exchange as Pork Farms Ltd. In 1978 the Samworth family sold Pork Farms to Northern Foods, later merged by Northern with both Palethorpes of Market Drayton and Bowyers of Trowbridge, Wiltshire to form Pork Farms Bowyers. Later the company sold the Bowyers and Palethorpes pork sausage business and brands to concentrate on baked meat products. Northern Foods transferred the production of Pork Pies from Nottingham, which they later came to regret. In 2007, the name of Melton Mowbray Pork Pies became protected and they had to be made within a defined distance of Melton Mowbray to qualify. The company then chose to close the Trowbridge plant and invest £12million into the Nottingham plant to bring back and increase Melton Mowbray Pork Pie production. In the meantime, the Samworth Family had started building another food “empire” starting with Ginsters Pasties in Cornwall and then expanding back into the East Midlands. They now own Dickinson and Morris, probably the iconic Melton Mowbray Pork Pie makers, and Henry Walker of Leicester, as well as producing Melton Mowbray Pork Pies for most of the major supermarkets in the UK. Henry Walker is an interesting company. Walker & Son was founded in Leicester 1824 by Mark Walker, who with his son opened a butchers shop on Leicester High Street, in the early days their sausages were a hit! But then they built a bakery and the famous Walkers pork pie was born! Leicester loved our pies so much that thousands of families would buy them every week, on Christmas Eve people would queue around the block just to purchase their Walkers pork pie, your Christmas dinner table was not complete without one and isn't to this day! During the meat rationing of World War II, Walker & Son, diversified the business and using the surplus fat of meat products and locally grown potato's they began producing potato crisps, they were the original creators of the famous snack brand. This side of the business then grew into Walker’s Crisps, once just a local Leicester company, but since being bought by American giant PepsiCo has expanded into the biggest UK crisp and snack manufacturer, and has expanded into Europe with the “Lay’s” brand. Although brought up in Nottingham on Pork Farms Pies, I have to declare that I actually prefer Walker’s Pies, though their retail shops closed years ago, and I haven’t bought one for years. Pork Farms shops also closed years ago, so this Christmas we have bought a Melton Mowbray Pork Pie from Sainsbury’s, which I believe will have been made by Walkers, as they are the biggest (only) supplier of own label Melton Pies. Pork Pie and Piccalilli on Boxing Day for me! With best wishes to all I have had the pleasure to correspond with on these forums over the past year. Brian Binns http://www.samworthbrothers.co.uk/ourbusiness.asp http://www.walkerspies.co.uk/

-----Original Message----- On Behalf Of Donald Hurd Subject: [LEI] Pork Pie for Christmas > I think we had this discussed a year or two ago............ ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------- There was a long thread on pork pies at Christmas as long ago as December 2004. Sobering thought. I think it was generally agreed that Christmas pork pies (especially at breakfast) were most common in Leicestershire and sometimes cropped up in surrounding counties, but the custom may well have kicked off in Leicestershire. They must be Melton Mowbray pies of course, but better not bang that drum yet again! Jill Grey

Hi all New to the list and trying to find the baptism of John Whalley son of William the elder (d 1719)born circa 1660-5, presumably at Norton or Galby. This is my missing link so if SKS could provide a baptism I would be very grateful. Have a good Christmas and all the best for 2014. Many thanks John

Hi Well this has nothing to do with your genealogy question but I do understand not having Pork pie for Christmas we are from Leicester to and we were back there in September and we ate many Walkers pork pies. We are in Perth Australia where it is quite warm at the moment and would like to wish our family and friends in Canada a very Happy Xmas and New Year peter -----Original Message----- From: leicestershire-plus-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:leicestershire-plus-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Donald Hurd Sent: Monday, 23 December 2013 4:22 AM To: LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS@rootsweb.com Subject: [LEI] Pork Pie for Christmas I think we had this discussed a year or two ago. I grew up in Leicester, my grandparents were from Leicester. We usually had pork pie for Christmas morning. I came to Canada in 1968. In the 1970s and 80s Marks and Spencer operated stores in Canada where they sold pork pies - a reasonable facsimile of the real thing. So we were able to keep up the tradition Sadly M&S are gone now. It is possible to get pork pies in various places including Pete's Frootique in Halifax, Nova Scotia. My son bought some in Buffalo in the USA last year. But none available here in Newfoundland. Nowadays for Christmas morning we have bacon, eggs, sausages, fried bread etc. (some people don't know what fried bread is) Anyway happy Christmas to all and spare a thought for the unfortunates in Toronto who may facing Christmas Day without electricity due to an ice storm. To return to genealogy does anybody have information on the Corts of Great Bowden or the Wales of the Lutterworth area? Don Hurd, St John's, NL, Canada Sent from my iPad ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I think we had this discussed a year or two ago. I grew up in Leicester, my grandparents were from Leicester. We usually had pork pie for Christmas morning. I came to Canada in 1968. In the 1970s and 80s Marks and Spencer operated stores in Canada where they sold pork pies - a reasonable facsimile of the real thing. So we were able to keep up the tradition Sadly M&S are gone now. It is possible to get pork pies in various places including Pete's Frootique in Halifax, Nova Scotia. My son bought some in Buffalo in the USA last year. But none available here in Newfoundland. Nowadays for Christmas morning we have bacon, eggs, sausages, fried bread etc. (some people don't know what fried bread is) Anyway happy Christmas to all and spare a thought for the unfortunates in Toronto who may facing Christmas Day without electricity due to an ice storm. To return to genealogy does anybody have information on the Corts of Great Bowden or the Wales of the Lutterworth area? Don Hurd, St John's, NL, Canada Sent from my iPad

We emigrated to the US in 1966, but when ever we went back, my Nana would always have a Pork Farms Pork Pie.  She lived in Nottingham.. I have tried to make them, some years are better than others.. I saw on Amazon.co.uk that they had pork pie seasoning, but they couldn't send it overseas.  There is a company called "The English Pork Pie Company" near or in Buffalo NY. I bought one last week from British food store in Westford, MA.  Hope it will be good! On Sunday, December 22, 2013 3:23 PM, Donald Hurd <donaldhurd@hotmail.com> wrote: I think we had this discussed a year or two ago. I grew up in Leicester, my grandparents were from Leicester. We usually had pork pie for Christmas morning. I came to Canada in 1968. In the 1970s and 80s Marks and Spencer operated stores in Canada where they sold pork pies - a reasonable facsimile of the real thing. So we were able to keep up the tradition Sadly M&S are gone now. It is possible to get pork pies in various places including Pete's Frootique in Halifax, Nova Scotia. My son bought some in Buffalo in the USA last year. But none available here in Newfoundland. Nowadays for Christmas morning we have bacon, eggs, sausages, fried bread etc.  (some people don't know what fried bread is) Anyway happy Christmas to all and spare a thought for the unfortunates in Toronto who may facing Christmas Day without electricity due to an ice storm. To return to genealogy does anybody have information on the Corts of Great Bowden or the Wales of the Lutterworth area? Don Hurd, St John's, NL, Canada Sent from my iPad ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Bacon and eggs for us as well , that's if we could eat it after plundering the selection box ! But if pork pie for breakfast floats your boat , good stuff . Our tradition seemed to be the argument between mum and dad as they sewed the chicken up after stuffing it ! Happy Christmas to everybody . Sent from my iPhone On 22 Dec 2013, at 11:47, "Nivard Ovington" <ovington.one@gmail.com> wrote: > It is certainly something I have heard of in Leicestershire but not in > our family > > It sounds like a tradition brought in by Melton butchers <vbg> > > It was always bacon and egg for us :-) > > After mass of course > > Pork pie was reserved for tea on Christmas day or Boxing Day > > Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) > > On 22/12/2013 11:33, DrGeneal@aol.com wrote: >> My late wife always insisted on a Pork Pie for breakfast on Xmas day and >> said it was a Leicestershire habit. Is this true or was it due to the family >> originating close to Melton Mowbray? Merry Xmas and a Happy New Year >> to All DrGeneal > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

My dad always had pork pie for breakfast as well on Christmas Day so perhaps it is a Leicestershire habit We lived in Belgrave along way from Melton Mowbray Margaret On 22/12/2013 11:33, DrGeneal@aol.com wrote: > My late wife always insisted on a Pork Pie for breakfast on Xmas day and > said it was a Leicestershire habit. Is this true or was it due to the family > originating close to Melton Mowbray? Merry Xmas and a Happy New Year > to All DrGeneal > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > . >

It is certainly something I have heard of in Leicestershire but not in our family It sounds like a tradition brought in by Melton butchers <vbg> It was always bacon and egg for us :-) After mass of course Pork pie was reserved for tea on Christmas day or Boxing Day Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) On 22/12/2013 11:33, DrGeneal@aol.com wrote: > My late wife always insisted on a Pork Pie for breakfast on Xmas day and > said it was a Leicestershire habit. Is this true or was it due to the family > originating close to Melton Mowbray? Merry Xmas and a Happy New Year > to All DrGeneal

Hi Brian No I don't fancy the original "mince pies" it doesn't sound very appetising these days :-( The mention of old recipes makes me wonder what became of my mothers recipe books, one in particular, was a large foolscap sized, hard blue covered note book type, it was full of handwritten recipes gathered over the years with a liberal amount of loose leaves and scraps of paper added It was in the second drawer in a cupboard just inside the kitchen, under a marble slab which was used for making pastry on, funny what you remember eh I hope someone acquired it rather than it was binned Must ask around now I think of it Best wishes to all whilst I am here, have a good Christmas and a prosperous New Year May all your brick walls crumble :-) Nivard Ovington in Cornwall (UK) On 22/12/2013 10:23, Brian Binns wrote: > A couple of recipes from the "Magazine of Domestic Economy" which I have I > in two rather dilapidated hard back compilations. Copied as written. > > > >>From November 1836. > > Minced Meat. - A pound and a half boiled tongue; two pounds of beef suet; > two pounds cleaned currants; one pound cleaned and stewed raisins, chopped

My mother also had pork pie for breakfast as a child. No connection to Leicestershire though, born and bred in Northampton (the town) My other half had (and still has)ham sandwiches Christmas morning. So I always cook ham for Christmas Eve dinner and that has evolved into another tradition. Marilyn -----Original Message----- From: leicestershire-plus-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:leicestershire-plus-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of DrGeneal@aol.com Sent: December 22, 2013 3:34 AM To: LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS@rootsweb.com Subject: [LEI] Xmas food My late wife always insisted on a Pork Pie for breakfast on Xmas day and said it was a Leicestershire habit. Is this true or was it due to the family originating close to Melton Mowbray? Merry Xmas and a Happy New Year to All DrGeneal ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Family documents passed down from the BAGHURST family have the wife of James BAGHURST, Sr. (1791-1846) as Maria HILL (b. 14 May 1791 in Ticknall, Derbyshire; m. 23 Oct 1813 in Coleorton, Leicestershire; d. Apr-Jun 1846 in Derby, Derbyshire), and her parents as Lord and Lady Mary HILL, both born in Shrewsbury, Shropshire. I have not been able to find anything else on the HILLs. The very clear images of the baptismal records of the last three sons state that Maria was the daughter of John and Mary HOPE, not HILL. Searching the main databases online has not turned up anything on HOPE either. I am "hoping" someone on the lists for Derbyshire, Leicestershire or Shropshire will have some information or suggestions. Thanks in advance. The children of James and Maria were: John (1814-1893) b. in Coleorton Maria (1815-1844) b. in Coleorton Edward (1816-1845) b. in ? James, Jr. (1821-1854) b. in ? Mary Maria (1821-1896) b. in Derby Emma (1826-1868) b. in Derby Benjamin (1828-1855) b. in Ashby de la Zouch Joseph (1828-1829) b. in Ashby de la Zouch George (1831-1927) b. in Donisthrope Merry Christmas and a Healthy New Year to all. Winston Cochrane Maineville, Ohio

A couple of recipes from the "Magazine of Domestic Economy" which I have I in two rather dilapidated hard back compilations. Copied as written. >From November 1836. Minced Meat. - A pound and a half boiled tongue; two pounds of beef suet; two pounds cleaned currants; one pound cleaned and stewed raisins, chopped fine; three quarters of a pound fine moist sugar; the peel of two large lemons chopped fine; half an ounce cloves and mace; one ounce nutmeg; the juice of one lemon; half-pint brandy; half-pint of port wine; candied peel according to taste. The mixture improves by standing a few weeks, and adding a little brandy from time to time. To be kept in a cool dry place. December 1836. Christmas Pudding.- One pound of bread crumbs, rubbed through the cullender; half-pound flour; one pound and quarter suet, very finely chopped; quarter pound sugar; one pound currants; half-pound raisins, stoned and chopped. Mix well together, and then add - two ounces candied citron; one ounce ditto orange-peel; one ditto lemon-peel; one nutmeg, grated; a little mace; cinnamon and three cloves pounded; quarter of a tea-spoonful of powdered ginger; the peel of one lemon finely-chopped. Mix well again, and then add - one wine-glassful of brandy; one ditto white wine; the juice of one lemon. Mix well together, then stir in gradually six well-beaten eggs. Boil five hours and sift sugar over the top when served. It is exceedingly convenient when making Christmas pudding, to boil several at once in various sized moulds or basins, as they will keep well for a month or six weeks, and can be served on an emergency by merely re-boiling them - say one hour for a pint basin. After the first boiling remove the cloth, and when the pudding is cold cover it with a dry clean cloth. Probably too late for this Christmas, but makes interesting reading - though I wouldn't fancy the literal and original style of mincemeat! Note that this magazine was aimed at upper class ladies, so I can't see any of my ancestors ever reading it. Brian Binns Loughborough, but born in Nottingham.

Hi all New to the list and searching for WHALLEY family, particularly a baptism for John Whalley, son of William who was born circa 1660-5 for starters. If anyone can help I would be very grateful. He is my missing link! Thanks, and best for Christmas and 2014 John

Greetings from Canada: My wife's grandparents always had a Pork Pie for breakfast on Christmas - they were from Barrow-upon-Soar and came to Canada in 1912 and continued the 'habit' well into the 1950's . Her dad was born in Barrow as well and likely would have preferred bacon and eggs. After my wife's grandparents died, the Pork Pie seemed to be replaced with sausages and mushrooms fried with tomatoes for Christmas breakfast. Me - I preferred the bacon and eggs.........<vbg> Merry Christmas and Happy New Year John -----Original Message----- From: leicestershire-plus-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:leicestershire-plus-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Fabis Sent: Sunday, December 22, 2013 8:11 AM To: leicestershire-plus@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LEI] Xmas food My dad always had pork pie for breakfast as well on Christmas Day so perhaps it is a Leicestershire habit We lived in Belgrave along way from Melton Mowbray Margaret On 22/12/2013 11:33, DrGeneal@aol.com wrote: > My late wife always insisted on a Pork Pie for breakfast on Xmas day > and said it was a Leicestershire habit. Is this true or was it due to the family > originating close to Melton Mowbray? Merry Xmas and a Happy New Year > to All DrGeneal > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message . > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LEICESTERSHIRE-PLUS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

My late wife always insisted on a Pork Pie for breakfast on Xmas day and said it was a Leicestershire habit. Is this true or was it due to the family originating close to Melton Mowbray? Merry Xmas and a Happy New Year to All DrGeneal