So presumably it was the person in PRF who submitted the name to the temple and in newfamilysearch they were just people who cleaned up the information? Her record has been removed from the online IGI now. Paula On May 7, 2009, at 1:03 PM, W. David Samuelsen wrote: > I checked, the submitter that showed up in nFS does not match at all > to > the ones that show up in Pedigree Resource File (PRF). Stanley Ann > Durham is listed there. PRFs do not necessarily have dates listed. > > David Samuelsen > > Paula Goodfellow wrote: >> I'm wondering about the submitter. I'm guessing that it went through >> the Temple Ready since it was done in Provo. But wouldn't nfs have >> prevented them from submitting the ordinance if it wasn't linked into >> their tree? I suppose they could have created a fake connection >> somewhere, but that seems pretty far-fetched. Paula > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

I'm wondering about the submitter. I'm guessing that it went through the Temple Ready since it was done in Provo. But wouldn't nfs have prevented them from submitting the ordinance if it wasn't linked into their tree? I suppose they could have created a fake connection somewhere, but that seems pretty far-fetched. Paula On May 7, 2009, at 12:18 PM, Jill N. Crandell wrote: > I'd like to make a point that some may not have thought of with this > situation. We don't know whether it was done appropriately or > inappropriately, but we all suspect that the rules of contacting the > nearest > living relative were probably not followed. > > However, there is another disobedience that has also occurred. Helen > Radkey > gives the Church a lot of grief over these ordinances, and her > ability to do > that is because she has access to the ordinance information in the > IGI. > Notice that she knew the dates the work was done for Obama's mother. > There > is a member of the Church somewhere who is giving her access, which > gives > her the ability to create these news reports. Either someone has > given her > their sign-in and password to use as she pleases, or she is able to > get > someone at an FHC or the FHL to "help" her by signing in for her-- > possibly > not knowing who she is. As consultants, we all need to remember that > the > rules are in place for a reason, and if someone is unable to sign > in, we > should "help" them contact their ward clerk--not sign in for them. > > Jill Crandell > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

Yes, so unless President Obama or his sister gave permission, this name shouldn't have been submitted. The entry's been removed from the IGI, so I imagine that permission had not been granted. Paula On May 7, 2009, at 11:08 AM, kinman kinman wrote: > Here is the guideline for submitting names (copied from the Help > secton of > nFS) > > Before you reserve ordinances for individuals who were born in the > last 95 > years, please get permission from the closest living relative. The > closest > living relatives are, in this order: spouse, then children, then > parents, > then siblings > > On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 9:26 PM, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> > wrote: > >> I thought some of you might be interested in this story that's >> hitting >> the news tonight: >> >> http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,705301616,00.html >> >> ABC news has reported on it, and there are also some pretty mean blog >> posts about it. All the more reason to make sure we follow the rules >> when submit names. Stanley Dunham's name does appear in the IGI, >> with >> ordinances, but at newfamilysearch, it's not clear that the >> ordinances >> were actually done. (Yes her name was Stanley. Born Kansas 1942 if >> you >> want to look for her.) >> >> You can also see the names of the submitters at newfamilysearch. I >> imagine they've been contacted already by the church, from the sound >> of the Deseret News article. Paula >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > -- > Now is Family History Time. > Tommorrow is another Family History Day. > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

Here is the guideline for submitting names (copied from the Help secton of nFS) Before you reserve ordinances for individuals who were born in the last 95 years, please get permission from the closest living relative. The closest living relatives are, in this order: spouse, then children, then parents, then siblings On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 9:26 PM, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> wrote: > I thought some of you might be interested in this story that's hitting > the news tonight: > > http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,705301616,00.html > > ABC news has reported on it, and there are also some pretty mean blog > posts about it. All the more reason to make sure we follow the rules > when submit names. Stanley Dunham's name does appear in the IGI, with > ordinances, but at newfamilysearch, it's not clear that the ordinances > were actually done. (Yes her name was Stanley. Born Kansas 1942 if you > want to look for her.) > > You can also see the names of the submitters at newfamilysearch. I > imagine they've been contacted already by the church, from the sound > of the Deseret News article. Paula > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- Now is Family History Time. Tommorrow is another Family History Day.

Oh, believe me, I know that. I tell people they *can* use paper, but then I show some of what they can do with a computer. The advantages of the electronic system are easier to perceive and appreciate as databases grow. The thing is, genealogy can seem pretty overwhelming to beginners, and I try to keep that in mind at all times. A brother in my ward was interested in getting started and I showed him a couple of things he could do, such as researching local archives and ordering a microfilm. I showed one example of my early research, a record from the 1890s (one of my grand-aunts). His reaction? He said, "wow, 1890." And we on this list know that 1890 is like yesterday in genealogy terms. If I tell him on his first visit to the FHC that he needs to research, read old handwriting and then record everything on two computer systems, that might be the last time I see him there. -------------------------------------------------- From: <Sahara346@aol.com> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 9:38 AM To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > On the other hand, when they find that third cousin twice removed down in > GA, or up in ME, or overseas, who is willing to exchange data, it is much > quicker, and far more economical to send them a GEDCOM from their > genealogy > program with the appropriate links than it is to send them a packet of > hand > written papers xeroxed off. That is seriously something to think about > too. I have exchanged GEDCOMs with a couple of distant cousins, both in > and > out of the Church. Well researched lines from non-member relatives give > us > more family that we can get temple work for, as long as we remember to > stay > outside that window that belongs to closer related relatives. > > Karen > > > In a message dated 5/7/2009 5:44:27 A.M. Central Daylight Time, > jorgetodeschini@hotmail.com writes: > > The leader should have said "we no longer need PAF > _for_temple_submission_." We still need a tool to research genealogy -- > mostly for recording > information and sources. nFS is a tool for temple submitting, only. It > can help > a bit with research as you search for duplicates, but that's it. You > know, > I have even told some people who do not want to "keep two databases" and > "learn two computer systems" that they can submit with nFS and > research/record info on paper sheets with pedigree charts and family > group records. > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Kathy Scott" <kathyscott1@ntlworld.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 8:32 PM > To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > >> Thank you Gaylon for such a helpful answer. I think I will move onto >> Ancestral Quest myself as a starter. My sensitivity about PAF comes from > a >> careless leader's remark " We no longer need PAF". and that, after my >> spending years teaching how to use it for data gathering and Temple > work!!! >> >> God bless us in our efforts to be helpful to each other. >> Kathy >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Gaylon Findlay" <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 9:43 PM >> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >> >> >>> Kathy and others: >>> >>> As you say, "PAF is my 'friend' and ... it is the 'friend' of most >>> members ...". Ever since we gave the Ancestral Quest code to the Church >>> over 10 years ago, we have recognized this friendship relationship >>> between PAF and the members. And we know that if "most members" will >>> just take a look at Ancestral Quest, they will feel like they are still >>> in the house of a friend. It will be a comfortable adjustment to use >>> the >>> new tools, like NFS syncing, for most members, as AQ and PAF are so > much >>> alike, except for the newer features, which aren't in PAF. >>> >>> One of the other cool things about AQ's relationship with PAF is that >>> you can use most PAF add-on utilities with it. For example, you should >>> be able to use FamilyInsight and PAF Companion with it. (AQ can let you >>> use either of two database types: PAF and its own. If you will use the >>> .paf database, then you can continue to use PAF, FamilyInsight, PAF >>> Companion and other PAF add-ons with AQ.) >>> >>> Gaylon >>> >>> >>> Kathy Scott wrote: >>>> To all especially Harry, >>>> >>>> I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding > it >>>> difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and > many >>>> of >>>> us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and >>>> then >>>> teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not > because >>>> the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly > has >>>> to >>>> be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to >>>> others. >>>> >>>> I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs > >>>> but I >>>> know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those >>>> whom >>>> I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the > ground. >>>> I >>>> enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the >>>> 'friend' >>>> of most members over in England; those not using it or not > comfortable >>>> with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they > will >>>> get hooked into the work. >>>> >>>> Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is >>>> concerned You can't be older than I am! >>>> Kathy >>>> >>>> I ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> >>>> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:11 AM >>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>> >>>> >>>> So Gaylon are you and all the discussion in the past 24 hours on here >>>> saying >>>> get rid of PAF and get another program? I don't like NFS as a working >>>> program and at my age will most likely never process another name with >>>> it. >>>> >>>> Reason I like PAF and had so many people get it I , a computer dummy, >>>> could >>>> put my data into it and knew where it was and what I had and explain > it >>>> when >>>> I was teaching it. >>>> >>>> Harry >>>> >>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who > we >>>> are when we learn our past >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 11:05 AM >>>> >>>> >>>> Harry: >>>> >>>> Personal Ancestral File (PAF) is the trademarked name of the LDS >>>> Church's desktop database manager. >>>> >>>> PAF versions 4 and 5 (with the latest subversion being 5.2) are >>>> derived >>>> from Ancestral Quest 3.0. These are the Windows versions of PAF. >>>> >>>> Earlier versions of PAF (3.0 and earlier) were DOS programs, and were >>>> not derived from Ancestral Quest. >>>> >>>> Gaylon >>>> >>>> >>>> Harry Laughman wrote: >>>> >>>>> Ok now I am confuse, I have been useing Personal Ancestral File 5.0 >>>>> Gaylon is this what your refering to or are you refering to something >>>>> all >>>>> together different? >>>>> >>>>> Harry >>>>> >>>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know > who >>>>> we >>>>> are when we learn our past >>>>> >>>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:21 AM >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Peter: >>>>> >>>>> I suspect that you mean, "Personal Ancestral File" rather than > "Personal >>>>> Ancestry File". Affectionately known as "PAF". >>>>> >>>>> A little known fact is that the Windows versions of PAF were created >>>>> from an older version of Ancestral Quest, by Incline Software. > (Incline >>>>> Software donated a copy of the AQ code to the LDS Church in 1999, and >>>>> thus most members of the Church are using a slightly modified copy of >>>>> Ancestral Quest, but with the name changed to "Personal Ancestral >>>>> File".) You might want to look at the current version of Ancestral > Quest >>>>> (you can download a free trial of the program at www.ancquest.com). > You >>>>> will find that it looks and acts an awful lot like PAF, because it is >>>>> mostly the same as PAF, but with many major enhancements -- like the >>>>> ability to sync your PAF data with New FamilySearch. >>>>> >>>>> Gaylon Findlay >>>>> Incline Software >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Peter F. Thorne wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Hi! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I have been using Personal Ancestry File published by the Church. > With >>>>>> the >>>>>> announcement that this program will no longer be supported, I have > been >>>>>> considering selecting a commercial program. While NFS is great for >>>>>> recording >>>>>> information, I felt that research for new information might be > enhanced >>>>>> by >>>>>> subscribing to Ancestry, RootsMagic or similar program. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I realize that I have no knowledge about commercial programs and > what >>>>>> they >>>>>> offer. Consequently, I felt some of you might share some of your >>>>>> insights >>>>>> and experiences that would help me in this decision. I am also > looking >>>>>> for >>>>>> other programs for personal history, family atlas or any other > programs >>>>>> you >>>>>> might recommend. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Peter F. Thorne >>>>>> >>>>>> Toms River, NJ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word >>>>>> 'unsubscribe' >>>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without >>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without >>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in > the subject and the body of the message >> > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the > subject and the body of the message > > > **************Big savings on Dell’s most popular laptops. Now starting at > $449! > (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222382499x1201454962/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B214663472%3B36502367%3Bg) > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I have looked at the early St. George temple records from 1877 and on.  When my family was doing baptisms for family members, they often used the term "friend".   On further investigation, the "friend"  turned out to be a family member.    When the husband was proxy for his wife's family and ancestors, he gave the relationship "friend".   When the wife was proxy for her husband's family and ancestors, she gave the relationship "friend".   So, look closely at those entries for "friends". Rebecca Christensen --- On Thu, 5/7/09, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> wrote: From: Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Date: Thursday, May 7, 2009, 9:25 AM Thanks to everyone who's responded so far. We certainly have it easier now. I've seen entries in old temple records that say "friend" for relationship as someone else mentioned, and thought that that was odd. So would someone in SLC have been checking these against the Temple Index Bureau to get them approved? Thanks, Paula

On the other hand, when they find that third cousin twice removed down in GA, or up in ME, or overseas, who is willing to exchange data, it is much quicker, and far more economical to send them a GEDCOM from their genealogy program with the appropriate links than it is to send them a packet of hand written papers xeroxed off. That is seriously something to think about too. I have exchanged GEDCOMs with a couple of distant cousins, both in and out of the Church. Well researched lines from non-member relatives give us more family that we can get temple work for, as long as we remember to stay outside that window that belongs to closer related relatives. Karen In a message dated 5/7/2009 5:44:27 A.M. Central Daylight Time, jorgetodeschini@hotmail.com writes: The leader should have said "we no longer need PAF _for_temple_submission_." We still need a tool to research genealogy -- mostly for recording information and sources. nFS is a tool for temple submitting, only. It can help a bit with research as you search for duplicates, but that's it. You know, I have even told some people who do not want to "keep two databases" and "learn two computer systems" that they can submit with nFS and research/record info on paper sheets with pedigree charts and family group records. -------------------------------------------------- From: "Kathy Scott" <kathyscott1@ntlworld.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 8:32 PM To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > Thank you Gaylon for such a helpful answer. I think I will move onto > Ancestral Quest myself as a starter. My sensitivity about PAF comes from a > careless leader's remark " We no longer need PAF". and that, after my > spending years teaching how to use it for data gathering and Temple work!!! > > God bless us in our efforts to be helpful to each other. > Kathy > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gaylon Findlay" <gfindlay@ancquest.com> > To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 9:43 PM > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > > >> Kathy and others: >> >> As you say, "PAF is my 'friend' and ... it is the 'friend' of most >> members ...". Ever since we gave the Ancestral Quest code to the Church >> over 10 years ago, we have recognized this friendship relationship >> between PAF and the members. And we know that if "most members" will >> just take a look at Ancestral Quest, they will feel like they are still >> in the house of a friend. It will be a comfortable adjustment to use the >> new tools, like NFS syncing, for most members, as AQ and PAF are so much >> alike, except for the newer features, which aren't in PAF. >> >> One of the other cool things about AQ's relationship with PAF is that >> you can use most PAF add-on utilities with it. For example, you should >> be able to use FamilyInsight and PAF Companion with it. (AQ can let you >> use either of two database types: PAF and its own. If you will use the >> .paf database, then you can continue to use PAF, FamilyInsight, PAF >> Companion and other PAF add-ons with AQ.) >> >> Gaylon >> >> >> Kathy Scott wrote: >>> To all especially Harry, >>> >>> I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding it >>> difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many >>> of >>> us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then >>> teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not because >>> the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has >>> to >>> be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to >>> others. >>> >>> I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs >>> but I >>> know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those >>> whom >>> I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the ground. >>> I >>> enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the >>> 'friend' >>> of most members over in England; those not using it or not comfortable >>> with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they will >>> get hooked into the work. >>> >>> Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is >>> concerned You can't be older than I am! >>> Kathy >>> >>> I ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> >>> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:11 AM >>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>> >>> >>> So Gaylon are you and all the discussion in the past 24 hours on here >>> saying >>> get rid of PAF and get another program? I don't like NFS as a working >>> program and at my age will most likely never process another name with >>> it. >>> >>> Reason I like PAF and had so many people get it I , a computer dummy, >>> could >>> put my data into it and knew where it was and what I had and explain it >>> when >>> I was teaching it. >>> >>> Harry >>> >>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we >>> are when we learn our past >>> >>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 11:05 AM >>> >>> >>> Harry: >>> >>> Personal Ancestral File (PAF) is the trademarked name of the LDS >>> Church's desktop database manager. >>> >>> PAF versions 4 and 5 (with the latest subversion being 5.2) are derived >>> from Ancestral Quest 3.0. These are the Windows versions of PAF. >>> >>> Earlier versions of PAF (3.0 and earlier) were DOS programs, and were >>> not derived from Ancestral Quest. >>> >>> Gaylon >>> >>> >>> Harry Laughman wrote: >>> >>>> Ok now I am confuse, I have been useing Personal Ancestral File 5.0 >>>> Gaylon is this what your refering to or are you refering to something >>>> all >>>> together different? >>>> >>>> Harry >>>> >>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who >>>> we >>>> are when we learn our past >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:21 AM >>>> >>>> >>>> Peter: >>>> >>>> I suspect that you mean, "Personal Ancestral File" rather than "Personal >>>> Ancestry File". Affectionately known as "PAF". >>>> >>>> A little known fact is that the Windows versions of PAF were created >>>> from an older version of Ancestral Quest, by Incline Software. (Incline >>>> Software donated a copy of the AQ code to the LDS Church in 1999, and >>>> thus most members of the Church are using a slightly modified copy of >>>> Ancestral Quest, but with the name changed to "Personal Ancestral >>>> File".) You might want to look at the current version of Ancestral Quest >>>> (you can download a free trial of the program at www.ancquest.com). You >>>> will find that it looks and acts an awful lot like PAF, because it is >>>> mostly the same as PAF, but with many major enhancements -- like the >>>> ability to sync your PAF data with New FamilySearch. >>>> >>>> Gaylon Findlay >>>> Incline Software >>>> >>>> >>>> Peter F. Thorne wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hi! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I have been using Personal Ancestry File published by the Church. With >>>>> the >>>>> announcement that this program will no longer be supported, I have been >>>>> considering selecting a commercial program. While NFS is great for >>>>> recording >>>>> information, I felt that research for new information might be enhanced >>>>> by >>>>> subscribing to Ancestry, RootsMagic or similar program. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I realize that I have no knowledge about commercial programs and what >>>>> they >>>>> offer. Consequently, I felt some of you might share some of your >>>>> insights >>>>> and experiences that would help me in this decision. I am also looking >>>>> for >>>>> other programs for personal history, family atlas or any other programs >>>>> you >>>>> might recommend. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Peter F. Thorne >>>>> >>>>> Toms River, NJ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message **************Big savings on Dell’s most popular laptops. 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Thanks Kathy LOL Hey I taught   family history for 7 years  and had between 6 to 10 every Sunday.   I can stand in front of a class and bring tears of joy to your eyes, I can tell you stories that will make the hair on your head stand up.   But than you all can do that.   Yes I still have people calling and asking me to help them with NFS. But I have a kindergarden approach to it. To those I have helped it works and that is what counts. But when it comes to a new computer program  let me alone.   Kathy I'll be 66 in three weeks and feel like 96 some days can't even walk. WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we are when we learn our past --- On Thu, 5/7/09, Kathy Scott <kathyscott1@ntlworld.com> wrote: From: Kathy Scott <kathyscott1@ntlworld.com> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Date: Thursday, May 7, 2009, 9:16 AM Harry Oh, you're just a pain in the butt eh? is that what you are saying?  We do need a few of those it makes us look good!  Kathy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 10:11 PM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > Kathy, compared to you I most likely not even born yet. Harry > > WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we > are when we learn our past > > --- On Wed, 5/6/09, Helle Thor Hirschmann <helle@hirschmann.dk> wrote: > > > From: Helle Thor Hirschmann <helle@hirschmann.dk> > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com > Date: Wednesday, May 6, 2009, 12:28 PM > > > Kathy is right! > > > > Find someone in the ward/your family who knows computers and has the > patience to let YOU sit at the computer and let you work your way around. > > > > One learns absolutely nothing from seeing someone work at the computer. > And > what you do has to interest you. > > > > Which ever program you choose has to work properly. So from the ones > mentioned here there is actually no difference in that respect. They work > ok. And which to choose is a matter of preference. > > > > I was at a computer course once; the teacher suggested we tried on our own > as far as we could go, when a problem surfaced consult the manual. If it > did > not work after extensive trying – “-call the nearest 14-year-old and watch > closely!”. > > > > You may have genealogy knowledge and the other person computer knowledge – > swap. > > > > Helle > > > > > > -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- > Fra: lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com] På vegne af Kathy Scott > Sendt: 6. maj 2009 22:55 > Til: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com > Emne: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > > > > To all especially Harry, > > > > I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding it > > difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many of > > us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then > > teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not because > > the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has to > > be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to others. > > > > I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs but > I > > > know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those > whom > > I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the ground. I > > enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the > 'friend' > > > of most members over in England; those not using it or not comfortable > > with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they will > > get hooked into the work. > > > > Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is > > concerned You can't be older than I am! > > Kathy > > > > > > E-mail checket af Spyware Doctor(6.0.1.441) > Databaseversion: 6.12330 > http://www.pctools.com/dk/spyware-doctor-antivirus/ > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

And it took forever to see the results of all our hard work and expenses! Barbi in Manahawkin NJ ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephen J. Kelsey To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 10:11 PM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures 1)There was a period where ward genealogical reps did review submissions. 2)Most of my early work was submitted on family group sheets. Work was Done as a family and the sealings were done using the family group sheet And rather than seal one child to parents at a time, numerous children Were sealed at once if there were enough people to do it. Usually for A family sealing session, I spent a lot of time planning who was going To be proxy for each individual and seeing that there were enough people. 3)Very early on when the FHL was in the basement of the building that was Where the Relief Society Building is now, patrons were not allowed behind The counter and the worker had to get everything for them and they had to Sign it out==one thing at a time. Later they moved to a building on Main Street where Montgomery Wards used to be==I spent many hours searching films In the basement there. 4) Later the library was housed in the west wing of the church office building England was still in the basement as it is now in the FHL. 5) I still have some very early sheets which were submitted for temple work In the early 1900's===quite different. I have some problems there as many times the relationship was shown as friend. Steve Kelsey -----Original Message----- From: lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Harry Laughman Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 6:57 PM To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures I remember: 1. When I join the church in 1963 in Lompoc,Ca members were sending their names to Salt Lake City for approval, it seemed to take for ever. 2. I remember visiting a ward in 29 Plams, Ca in 1965 and a young man , black man, had the PH. He had a card from David O McKay (MS) that he carried every where he went. They asked for people to pass the sacrament and he volunteered and was told no. When asked why he was told he had to be a member. He showed his card. I have only come accross one other member that has had that experience. Harry Tucson WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we are when we learn our past --- On Wed, 5/6/09, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> wrote: From: Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> Subject: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Date: Wednesday, May 6, 2009, 6:28 PM A friend of mine asked me today how ordinances were cleared to be done in the past, before computers. For example, how did you find out if the ordinance had been done? Was it the Temple Index Bureau? And, what about people whose ordinances shouldn't be done? For example, a relative of mine who was excommunicated. If I understand correctly, his descendants will have to go through extra procedures to do temple work for him, if it's done at all. How was that handled in the past? I assume there might be a marker on his file now, in nfs. And what about black people before 1978? Were baptisms for the dead permitted for them? If not, how would that have been screened? I remember my grandmother showing her research to someone in the ward before submitting, but not sure if that was an official procedure, or just that she was trying to make sure she'd done everything correctly. Paula Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Paper still works! Barbi in Manahawkin NJ USA ----- Original Message ----- From: Jorge Todeschini To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 6:43 AM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? The leader should have said "we no longer need PAF _for_temple_submission_." We still need a tool to research genealogy -- mostly for recording information and sources. nFS is a tool for temple submitting, only. It can help a bit with research as you search for duplicates, but that's it. You know, I have even told some people who do not want to "keep two databases" and "learn two computer systems" that they can submit with nFS and research/record info on paper sheets with pedigree charts and family group records. -------------------------------------------------- From: "Kathy Scott" <kathyscott1@ntlworld.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 8:32 PM To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > Thank you Gaylon for such a helpful answer. I think I will move onto > Ancestral Quest myself as a starter. My sensitivity about PAF comes from a > careless leader's remark " We no longer need PAF". and that, after my > spending years teaching how to use it for data gathering and Temple work!!! > > God bless us in our efforts to be helpful to each other. > Kathy > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gaylon Findlay" <gfindlay@ancquest.com> > To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 9:43 PM > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > > >> Kathy and others: >> >> As you say, "PAF is my 'friend' and ... it is the 'friend' of most >> members ...". Ever since we gave the Ancestral Quest code to the Church >> over 10 years ago, we have recognized this friendship relationship >> between PAF and the members. And we know that if "most members" will >> just take a look at Ancestral Quest, they will feel like they are still >> in the house of a friend. It will be a comfortable adjustment to use the >> new tools, like NFS syncing, for most members, as AQ and PAF are so much >> alike, except for the newer features, which aren't in PAF. >> >> One of the other cool things about AQ's relationship with PAF is that >> you can use most PAF add-on utilities with it. For example, you should >> be able to use FamilyInsight and PAF Companion with it. (AQ can let you >> use either of two database types: PAF and its own. If you will use the >> .paf database, then you can continue to use PAF, FamilyInsight, PAF >> Companion and other PAF add-ons with AQ.) >> >> Gaylon >> >> >> Kathy Scott wrote: >>> To all especially Harry, >>> >>> I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding it >>> difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many >>> of >>> us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then >>> teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not because >>> the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has >>> to >>> be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to >>> others. >>> >>> I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs >>> but I >>> know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those >>> whom >>> I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the ground. >>> I >>> enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the >>> 'friend' >>> of most members over in England; those not using it or not comfortable >>> with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they will >>> get hooked into the work. >>> >>> Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is >>> concerned You can't be older than I am! >>> Kathy >>> >>> I ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> >>> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:11 AM >>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>> >>> >>> So Gaylon are you and all the discussion in the past 24 hours on here >>> saying >>> get rid of PAF and get another program? I don't like NFS as a working >>> program and at my age will most likely never process another name with >>> it. >>> >>> Reason I like PAF and had so many people get it I , a computer dummy, >>> could >>> put my data into it and knew where it was and what I had and explain it >>> when >>> I was teaching it. >>> >>> Harry >>> >>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we >>> are when we learn our past >>> >>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 11:05 AM >>> >>> >>> Harry: >>> >>> Personal Ancestral File (PAF) is the trademarked name of the LDS >>> Church's desktop database manager. >>> >>> PAF versions 4 and 5 (with the latest subversion being 5.2) are derived >>> from Ancestral Quest 3.0. These are the Windows versions of PAF. >>> >>> Earlier versions of PAF (3.0 and earlier) were DOS programs, and were >>> not derived from Ancestral Quest. >>> >>> Gaylon >>> >>> >>> Harry Laughman wrote: >>> >>>> Ok now I am confuse, I have been useing Personal Ancestral File 5.0 >>>> Gaylon is this what your refering to or are you refering to something >>>> all >>>> together different? >>>> >>>> Harry >>>> >>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who >>>> we >>>> are when we learn our past >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:21 AM >>>> >>>> >>>> Peter: >>>> >>>> I suspect that you mean, "Personal Ancestral File" rather than "Personal >>>> Ancestry File". Affectionately known as "PAF". >>>> >>>> A little known fact is that the Windows versions of PAF were created >>>> from an older version of Ancestral Quest, by Incline Software. (Incline >>>> Software donated a copy of the AQ code to the LDS Church in 1999, and >>>> thus most members of the Church are using a slightly modified copy of >>>> Ancestral Quest, but with the name changed to "Personal Ancestral >>>> File".) You might want to look at the current version of Ancestral Quest >>>> (you can download a free trial of the program at www.ancquest.com). You >>>> will find that it looks and acts an awful lot like PAF, because it is >>>> mostly the same as PAF, but with many major enhancements -- like the >>>> ability to sync your PAF data with New FamilySearch. >>>> >>>> Gaylon Findlay >>>> Incline Software >>>> >>>> >>>> Peter F. Thorne wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hi! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I have been using Personal Ancestry File published by the Church. With >>>>> the >>>>> announcement that this program will no longer be supported, I have been >>>>> considering selecting a commercial program. While NFS is great for >>>>> recording >>>>> information, I felt that research for new information might be enhanced >>>>> by >>>>> subscribing to Ancestry, RootsMagic or similar program. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I realize that I have no knowledge about commercial programs and what >>>>> they >>>>> offer. Consequently, I felt some of you might share some of your >>>>> insights >>>>> and experiences that would help me in this decision. I am also looking >>>>> for >>>>> other programs for personal history, family atlas or any other programs >>>>> you >>>>> might recommend. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Peter F. Thorne >>>>> >>>>> Toms River, NJ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The CDs were introduced at a training session during a FH workshop at BYU in Summer 1987. I attended it. Jayare Roberts was the one who taught us about the FH VDs that would soon be coming to our FHCs. Barbi in Manahawkin NJ ----- Original Message ----- From: W. David Samuelsen To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 11:16 PM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures Procedures changed in 1969 then again in 1974. I remembered more of 1974 procedures... 1. Individuals were submitted on the purple sheets, up to 5 per sheet, 3 front and 2 back 2. Race was required to be listed, white, Polynesian, black 3. Wait 2 to 5 months for approval Eventually the process got perfected toward 1988 with waiting time reduced from 2 months to mere 2 weeks for family files. David Samuelsen Stephen J. Kelsey wrote: > 1)There was a period where ward genealogical reps did review submissions. > 2)Most of my early work was submitted on family group sheets. Work was > Done as a family and the sealings were done using the family group sheet > And rather than seal one child to parents at a time, numerous children > Were sealed at once if there were enough people to do it. Usually for > A family sealing session, I spent a lot of time planning who was going > To be proxy for each individual and seeing that there were enough people. > 3)Very early on when the FHL was in the basement of the building that was > Where the Relief Society Building is now, patrons were not allowed behind > The counter and the worker had to get everything for them and they had to > Sign it out==one thing at a time. Later they moved to a building on Main > Street where Montgomery Wards used to be==I spent many hours searching films > In the basement there. > 4) Later the library was housed in the west wing of the church office > building > England was still in the basement as it is now in the FHL. > 5) I still have some very early sheets which were submitted for temple work > In the early 1900's===quite different. I have some problems there as many > times the relationship was shown as friend. > > Steve Kelsey Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The leader should have said "we no longer need PAF _for_temple_submission_." We still need a tool to research genealogy -- mostly for recording information and sources. nFS is a tool for temple submitting, only. It can help a bit with research as you search for duplicates, but that's it. You know, I have even told some people who do not want to "keep two databases" and "learn two computer systems" that they can submit with nFS and research/record info on paper sheets with pedigree charts and family group records. -------------------------------------------------- From: "Kathy Scott" <kathyscott1@ntlworld.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 8:32 PM To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > Thank you Gaylon for such a helpful answer. I think I will move onto > Ancestral Quest myself as a starter. My sensitivity about PAF comes from a > careless leader's remark " We no longer need PAF". and that, after my > spending years teaching how to use it for data gathering and Temple work!!! > > God bless us in our efforts to be helpful to each other. > Kathy > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Gaylon Findlay" <gfindlay@ancquest.com> > To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 9:43 PM > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > > >> Kathy and others: >> >> As you say, "PAF is my 'friend' and ... it is the 'friend' of most >> members ...". Ever since we gave the Ancestral Quest code to the Church >> over 10 years ago, we have recognized this friendship relationship >> between PAF and the members. And we know that if "most members" will >> just take a look at Ancestral Quest, they will feel like they are still >> in the house of a friend. It will be a comfortable adjustment to use the >> new tools, like NFS syncing, for most members, as AQ and PAF are so much >> alike, except for the newer features, which aren't in PAF. >> >> One of the other cool things about AQ's relationship with PAF is that >> you can use most PAF add-on utilities with it. For example, you should >> be able to use FamilyInsight and PAF Companion with it. (AQ can let you >> use either of two database types: PAF and its own. If you will use the >> .paf database, then you can continue to use PAF, FamilyInsight, PAF >> Companion and other PAF add-ons with AQ.) >> >> Gaylon >> >> >> Kathy Scott wrote: >>> To all especially Harry, >>> >>> I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding it >>> difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many >>> of >>> us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then >>> teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not because >>> the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has >>> to >>> be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to >>> others. >>> >>> I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs >>> but I >>> know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those >>> whom >>> I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the ground. >>> I >>> enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the >>> 'friend' >>> of most members over in England; those not using it or not comfortable >>> with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they will >>> get hooked into the work. >>> >>> Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is >>> concerned You can't be older than I am! >>> Kathy >>> >>> I ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> >>> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:11 AM >>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>> >>> >>> So Gaylon are you and all the discussion in the past 24 hours on here >>> saying >>> get rid of PAF and get another program? I don't like NFS as a working >>> program and at my age will most likely never process another name with >>> it. >>> >>> Reason I like PAF and had so many people get it I , a computer dummy, >>> could >>> put my data into it and knew where it was and what I had and explain it >>> when >>> I was teaching it. >>> >>> Harry >>> >>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we >>> are when we learn our past >>> >>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 11:05 AM >>> >>> >>> Harry: >>> >>> Personal Ancestral File (PAF) is the trademarked name of the LDS >>> Church's desktop database manager. >>> >>> PAF versions 4 and 5 (with the latest subversion being 5.2) are derived >>> from Ancestral Quest 3.0. These are the Windows versions of PAF. >>> >>> Earlier versions of PAF (3.0 and earlier) were DOS programs, and were >>> not derived from Ancestral Quest. >>> >>> Gaylon >>> >>> >>> Harry Laughman wrote: >>> >>>> Ok now I am confuse, I have been useing Personal Ancestral File 5.0 >>>> Gaylon is this what your refering to or are you refering to something >>>> all >>>> together different? >>>> >>>> Harry >>>> >>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who >>>> we >>>> are when we learn our past >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:21 AM >>>> >>>> >>>> Peter: >>>> >>>> I suspect that you mean, "Personal Ancestral File" rather than "Personal >>>> Ancestry File". Affectionately known as "PAF". >>>> >>>> A little known fact is that the Windows versions of PAF were created >>>> from an older version of Ancestral Quest, by Incline Software. (Incline >>>> Software donated a copy of the AQ code to the LDS Church in 1999, and >>>> thus most members of the Church are using a slightly modified copy of >>>> Ancestral Quest, but with the name changed to "Personal Ancestral >>>> File".) You might want to look at the current version of Ancestral Quest >>>> (you can download a free trial of the program at www.ancquest.com). You >>>> will find that it looks and acts an awful lot like PAF, because it is >>>> mostly the same as PAF, but with many major enhancements -- like the >>>> ability to sync your PAF data with New FamilySearch. >>>> >>>> Gaylon Findlay >>>> Incline Software >>>> >>>> >>>> Peter F. Thorne wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> Hi! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I have been using Personal Ancestry File published by the Church. With >>>>> the >>>>> announcement that this program will no longer be supported, I have been >>>>> considering selecting a commercial program. While NFS is great for >>>>> recording >>>>> information, I felt that research for new information might be enhanced >>>>> by >>>>> subscribing to Ancestry, RootsMagic or similar program. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I realize that I have no knowledge about commercial programs and what >>>>> they >>>>> offer. Consequently, I felt some of you might share some of your >>>>> insights >>>>> and experiences that would help me in this decision. I am also looking >>>>> for >>>>> other programs for personal history, family atlas or any other programs >>>>> you >>>>> might recommend. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Peter F. Thorne >>>>> >>>>> Toms River, NJ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without >>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Thanks to everyone who's responded so far. We certainly have it easier now. I've seen entries in old temple records that say "friend" for relationship as someone else mentioned, and thought that that was odd. So would someone in SLC have been checking these against the Temple Index Bureau to get them approved? Thanks, Paula On May 6, 2009, at 8:16 PM, W. David Samuelsen wrote: > Procedures changed in 1969 then again in 1974. > > I remembered more of 1974 procedures... > > 1. Individuals were submitted on the purple sheets, up to 5 per > sheet, 3 > front and 2 back > 2. Race was required to be listed, white, Polynesian, black > 3. Wait 2 to 5 months for approval > > Eventually the process got perfected toward 1988 with waiting time > reduced from 2 months to mere 2 weeks for family files. > > David Samuelsen > > Stephen J. Kelsey wrote: >> 1)There was a period where ward genealogical reps did review >> submissions. >> 2)Most of my early work was submitted on family group sheets. Work >> was >> Done as a family and the sealings were done using the family group >> sheet >> And rather than seal one child to parents at a time, numerous >> children >> Were sealed at once if there were enough people to do it. Usually >> for >> A family sealing session, I spent a lot of time planning who was >> going >> To be proxy for each individual and seeing that there were enough >> people. >> 3)Very early on when the FHL was in the basement of the building >> that was >> Where the Relief Society Building is now, patrons were not allowed >> behind >> The counter and the worker had to get everything for them and they >> had to >> Sign it out==one thing at a time. Later they moved to a building >> on Main >> Street where Montgomery Wards used to be==I spent many hours >> searching films >> In the basement there. >> 4) Later the library was housed in the west wing of the church office >> building >> England was still in the basement as it is now in the FHL. >> 5) I still have some very early sheets which were submitted for >> temple work >> In the early 1900's===quite different. I have some problems there >> as many >> times the relationship was shown as friend. >> >> Steve Kelsey > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

Thank you Gaylon for such a helpful answer. I think I will move onto Ancestral Quest myself as a starter. My sensitivity about PAF comes from a careless leader's remark " We no longer need PAF". and that, after my spending years teaching how to use it for data gathering and Temple work!!! God bless us in our efforts to be helpful to each other. Kathy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gaylon Findlay" <gfindlay@ancquest.com> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 9:43 PM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > Kathy and others: > > As you say, "PAF is my 'friend' and ... it is the 'friend' of most > members ...". Ever since we gave the Ancestral Quest code to the Church > over 10 years ago, we have recognized this friendship relationship > between PAF and the members. And we know that if "most members" will > just take a look at Ancestral Quest, they will feel like they are still > in the house of a friend. It will be a comfortable adjustment to use the > new tools, like NFS syncing, for most members, as AQ and PAF are so much > alike, except for the newer features, which aren't in PAF. > > One of the other cool things about AQ's relationship with PAF is that > you can use most PAF add-on utilities with it. For example, you should > be able to use FamilyInsight and PAF Companion with it. (AQ can let you > use either of two database types: PAF and its own. If you will use the > .paf database, then you can continue to use PAF, FamilyInsight, PAF > Companion and other PAF add-ons with AQ.) > > Gaylon > > > Kathy Scott wrote: >> To all especially Harry, >> >> I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding it >> difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many >> of >> us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then >> teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not because >> the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has >> to >> be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to >> others. >> >> I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs >> but I >> know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those >> whom >> I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the ground. >> I >> enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the >> 'friend' >> of most members over in England; those not using it or not comfortable >> with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they will >> get hooked into the work. >> >> Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is >> concerned You can't be older than I am! >> Kathy >> >> I ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> >> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:11 AM >> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >> >> >> So Gaylon are you and all the discussion in the past 24 hours on here >> saying >> get rid of PAF and get another program? I don't like NFS as a working >> program and at my age will most likely never process another name with >> it. >> >> Reason I like PAF and had so many people get it I , a computer dummy, >> could >> put my data into it and knew where it was and what I had and explain it >> when >> I was teaching it. >> >> Harry >> >> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we >> are when we learn our past >> >> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >> >> >> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 11:05 AM >> >> >> Harry: >> >> Personal Ancestral File (PAF) is the trademarked name of the LDS >> Church's desktop database manager. >> >> PAF versions 4 and 5 (with the latest subversion being 5.2) are derived >> from Ancestral Quest 3.0. These are the Windows versions of PAF. >> >> Earlier versions of PAF (3.0 and earlier) were DOS programs, and were >> not derived from Ancestral Quest. >> >> Gaylon >> >> >> Harry Laughman wrote: >> >>> Ok now I am confuse, I have been useing Personal Ancestral File 5.0 >>> Gaylon is this what your refering to or are you refering to something >>> all >>> together different? >>> >>> Harry >>> >>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who >>> we >>> are when we learn our past >>> >>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:21 AM >>> >>> >>> Peter: >>> >>> I suspect that you mean, "Personal Ancestral File" rather than "Personal >>> Ancestry File". Affectionately known as "PAF". >>> >>> A little known fact is that the Windows versions of PAF were created >>> from an older version of Ancestral Quest, by Incline Software. (Incline >>> Software donated a copy of the AQ code to the LDS Church in 1999, and >>> thus most members of the Church are using a slightly modified copy of >>> Ancestral Quest, but with the name changed to "Personal Ancestral >>> File".) You might want to look at the current version of Ancestral Quest >>> (you can download a free trial of the program at www.ancquest.com). You >>> will find that it looks and acts an awful lot like PAF, because it is >>> mostly the same as PAF, but with many major enhancements -- like the >>> ability to sync your PAF data with New FamilySearch. >>> >>> Gaylon Findlay >>> Incline Software >>> >>> >>> Peter F. Thorne wrote: >>> >>> >>>> Hi! >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I have been using Personal Ancestry File published by the Church. With >>>> the >>>> announcement that this program will no longer be supported, I have been >>>> considering selecting a commercial program. While NFS is great for >>>> recording >>>> information, I felt that research for new information might be enhanced >>>> by >>>> subscribing to Ancestry, RootsMagic or similar program. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> I realize that I have no knowledge about commercial programs and what >>>> they >>>> offer. Consequently, I felt some of you might share some of your >>>> insights >>>> and experiences that would help me in this decision. I am also looking >>>> for >>>> other programs for personal history, family atlas or any other programs >>>> you >>>> might recommend. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Peter F. Thorne >>>> >>>> Toms River, NJ >>>> >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without >> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

A lot depends on who the person doing the sealings is. We have a couple of brethren here at Winter Quarters Temple that likes doing family groups if we have enough people, rather than doing individuals. It really gives a strong feeling of family to do it that way. Karen In a message dated 5/6/2009 9:11:43 P.M. Central Daylight Time, sjkelsey@msn.com writes: 1)There was a period where ward genealogical reps did review submissions. 2)Most of my early work was submitted on family group sheets. Work was Done as a family and the sealings were done using the family group sheet And rather than seal one child to parents at a time, numerous children Were sealed at once if there were enough people to do it. Usually for A family sealing session, I spent a lot of time planning who was going To be proxy for each individual and seeing that there were enough people. 3)Very early on when the FHL was in the basement of the building that was Where the Relief Society Building is now, patrons were not allowed behind The counter and the worker had to get everything for them and they had to Sign it out==one thing at a time. Later they moved to a building on Main Street where Montgomery Wards used to be==I spent many hours searching films In the basement there. 4) Later the library was housed in the west wing of the church office building England was still in the basement as it is now in the FHL. 5) I still have some very early sheets which were submitted for temple work In the early 1900's===quite different. I have some problems there as many times the relationship was shown as friend. Steve Kelsey -----Original Message----- From: lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Harry Laughman Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 6:57 PM To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures I remember: 1. When I join the church in 1963 in Lompoc,Ca members were sending their names to Salt Lake City for approval, it seemed to take for ever. 2. I remember visiting a ward in 29 Plams, Ca in 1965 and a young man , black man, had the PH. He had a card from David O McKay (MS) that he carried every where he went. They asked for people to pass the sacrament and he volunteered and was told no. When asked why he was told he had to be a member. He showed his card. I have only come accross one other member that has had that experience. Harry Tucson WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we are when we learn our past --- On Wed, 5/6/09, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> wrote: From: Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> Subject: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Date: Wednesday, May 6, 2009, 6:28 PM A friend of mine asked me today how ordinances were cleared to be done in the past, before computers. For example, how did you find out if the ordinance had been done? Was it the Temple Index Bureau? And, what about people whose ordinances shouldn't be done? For example, a relative of mine who was excommunicated. If I understand correctly, his descendants will have to go through extra procedures to do temple work for him, if it's done at all. How was that handled in the past? I assume there might be a marker on his file now, in nfs. And what about black people before 1978? Were baptisms for the dead permitted for them? If not, how would that have been screened? I remember my grandmother showing her research to someone in the ward before submitting, but not sure if that was an official procedure, or just that she was trying to make sure she'd done everything correctly. Paula Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message **************Big savings on Dell’s most popular laptops. Now starting at $449! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221827510x1201399090/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B214663377%3B36502382%3Bh)

Kathy is right! Find someone in the ward/your family who knows computers and has the patience to let YOU sit at the computer and let you work your way around. One learns absolutely nothing from seeing someone work at the computer. And what you do has to interest you. Which ever program you choose has to work properly. So from the ones mentioned here there is actually no difference in that respect. They work ok. And which to choose is a matter of preference. I was at a computer course once; the teacher suggested we tried on our own as far as we could go, when a problem surfaced consult the manual. If it did not work after extensive trying – “-call the nearest 14-year-old and watch closely!”. You may have genealogy knowledge and the other person computer knowledge – swap. Helle -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- Fra: lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com] På vegne af Kathy Scott Sendt: 6. maj 2009 22:55 Til: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Emne: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? To all especially Harry, I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding it difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many of us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not because the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has to be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to others. I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs but I know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those whom I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the ground. I enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the 'friend' of most members over in England; those not using it or not comfortable with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they will get hooked into the work. Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is concerned You can't be older than I am! Kathy E-mail checket af Spyware Doctor(6.0.1.441) Databaseversion: 6.12330 http://www.pctools.com/dk/spyware-doctor-antivirus/

Procedures changed in 1969 then again in 1974. I remembered more of 1974 procedures... 1. Individuals were submitted on the purple sheets, up to 5 per sheet, 3 front and 2 back 2. Race was required to be listed, white, Polynesian, black 3. Wait 2 to 5 months for approval Eventually the process got perfected toward 1988 with waiting time reduced from 2 months to mere 2 weeks for family files. David Samuelsen Stephen J. Kelsey wrote: > 1)There was a period where ward genealogical reps did review submissions. > 2)Most of my early work was submitted on family group sheets. Work was > Done as a family and the sealings were done using the family group sheet > And rather than seal one child to parents at a time, numerous children > Were sealed at once if there were enough people to do it. Usually for > A family sealing session, I spent a lot of time planning who was going > To be proxy for each individual and seeing that there were enough people. > 3)Very early on when the FHL was in the basement of the building that was > Where the Relief Society Building is now, patrons were not allowed behind > The counter and the worker had to get everything for them and they had to > Sign it out==one thing at a time. Later they moved to a building on Main > Street where Montgomery Wards used to be==I spent many hours searching films > In the basement there. > 4) Later the library was housed in the west wing of the church office > building > England was still in the basement as it is now in the FHL. > 5) I still have some very early sheets which were submitted for temple work > In the early 1900's===quite different. I have some problems there as many > times the relationship was shown as friend. > > Steve Kelsey

is any of this really helping anyone? i say we are asked to leave all judgments to Heavenly Father. none of us know what the circumstances are here, nor does the sl tribune or the deseret news. it could be a relative (i don't know why this is such a stretch of the imagination for some-even in kenya) and again, it may not be. i guess i prefer to think it's a relative because negative thinking brings me down. i'm sure our leaders will take the proper direction. either way, why crowd up our mind with mean thoughts and worries about what other people do? just keep moving forward and get our work done. sometimes we (meaning, the list) just carry a subject to the limits of credibility and my patience. that's about 3 cents form me. patricia stewart, lv, nv **************Big savings on Dell’s most popular laptops. Now starting at $449! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221827510x1201399090/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B214663377%3B36502382%3Bh)

1)There was a period where ward genealogical reps did review submissions. 2)Most of my early work was submitted on family group sheets. Work was Done as a family and the sealings were done using the family group sheet And rather than seal one child to parents at a time, numerous children Were sealed at once if there were enough people to do it. Usually for A family sealing session, I spent a lot of time planning who was going To be proxy for each individual and seeing that there were enough people. 3)Very early on when the FHL was in the basement of the building that was Where the Relief Society Building is now, patrons were not allowed behind The counter and the worker had to get everything for them and they had to Sign it out==one thing at a time. Later they moved to a building on Main Street where Montgomery Wards used to be==I spent many hours searching films In the basement there. 4) Later the library was housed in the west wing of the church office building England was still in the basement as it is now in the FHL. 5) I still have some very early sheets which were submitted for temple work In the early 1900's===quite different. I have some problems there as many times the relationship was shown as friend. Steve Kelsey -----Original Message----- From: lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Harry Laughman Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 6:57 PM To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures I remember: 1. When I join the church in 1963 in Lompoc,Ca  members were sending their names to Salt Lake City for approval, it seemed to take for ever. 2. I remember visiting a ward in 29 Plams, Ca in 1965 and a young man , black man, had the PH.  He had a card from David O McKay (MS)  that he carried every where he went. They asked for people to pass the sacrament and he volunteered and was told no. When asked  why he was told he had to be a member. He showed his card.   I have only come accross one other member that has had that experience.   Harry Tucson WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we are when we learn our past --- On Wed, 5/6/09, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> wrote: From: Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> Subject: [LDS-WC] Pre-computer procedures To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Date: Wednesday, May 6, 2009, 6:28 PM A friend of mine asked me today how ordinances were cleared to be done  in the past, before computers. For example, how did you find out if  the ordinance had been done? Was it the Temple Index Bureau? And, what  about people whose ordinances shouldn't be done? For example, a  relative of mine who was excommunicated. If I understand correctly,  his descendants will have to go through extra procedures to do temple  work for him, if it's done at all. How was that handled in the past? I  assume there might be a marker on his file now, in nfs.  And what  about black people before 1978? Were baptisms for the dead permitted  for them? If not, how would that have been screened? I remember my grandmother showing her research to someone in the ward  before submitting, but not sure if that was an official procedure, or  just that she was trying to make sure she'd done everything correctly.  Paula Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

To all especially Harry, I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding it difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many of us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not because the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has to be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to others. I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs but I know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those whom I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the ground. I enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the 'friend' of most members over in England; those not using it or not comfortable with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they will get hooked into the work. Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is concerned You can't be older than I am! Kathy I ----- Original Message ----- From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:11 AM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? So Gaylon are you and all the discussion in the past 24 hours on here saying get rid of PAF and get another program? I don't like NFS as a working program and at my age will most likely never process another name with it. Reason I like PAF and had so many people get it I , a computer dummy, could put my data into it and knew where it was and what I had and explain it when I was teaching it. Harry WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we are when we learn our past --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 11:05 AM Harry: Personal Ancestral File (PAF) is the trademarked name of the LDS Church's desktop database manager. PAF versions 4 and 5 (with the latest subversion being 5.2) are derived from Ancestral Quest 3.0. These are the Windows versions of PAF. Earlier versions of PAF (3.0 and earlier) were DOS programs, and were not derived from Ancestral Quest. Gaylon Harry Laughman wrote: > Ok now I am confuse, I have been useing Personal Ancestral File 5.0 > Gaylon is this what your refering to or are you refering to something all > together different? > > Harry > > WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who we > are when we learn our past > > --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: > > > From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com > Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:21 AM > > > Peter: > > I suspect that you mean, "Personal Ancestral File" rather than "Personal > Ancestry File". Affectionately known as "PAF". > > A little known fact is that the Windows versions of PAF were created > from an older version of Ancestral Quest, by Incline Software. (Incline > Software donated a copy of the AQ code to the LDS Church in 1999, and > thus most members of the Church are using a slightly modified copy of > Ancestral Quest, but with the name changed to "Personal Ancestral > File".) You might want to look at the current version of Ancestral Quest > (you can download a free trial of the program at www.ancquest.com). You > will find that it looks and acts an awful lot like PAF, because it is > mostly the same as PAF, but with many major enhancements -- like the > ability to sync your PAF data with New FamilySearch. > > Gaylon Findlay > Incline Software > > > Peter F. Thorne wrote: > >> Hi! >> >> >> >> I have been using Personal Ancestry File published by the Church. With >> the >> announcement that this program will no longer be supported, I have been >> considering selecting a commercial program. While NFS is great for >> recording >> information, I felt that research for new information might be enhanced >> by >> subscribing to Ancestry, RootsMagic or similar program. >> >> >> >> I realize that I have no knowledge about commercial programs and what >> they >> offer. Consequently, I felt some of you might share some of your insights >> and experiences that would help me in this decision. I am also looking >> for >> other programs for personal history, family atlas or any other programs >> you >> might recommend. >> >> >> >> Peter F. Thorne >> >> Toms River, NJ >> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message