Jill, I know that non-member FHC librarians are given special sign-ins for New FamilySearch. Are they also given that privilege for the IGI? If that is the case, then she might not have had access via church member's lack of following guidelines. Nancy Scott Cincinnati, Ohio -----Original Message----- From: lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Jill N. Crandell Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 03:18 PM To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] President Obama's mother's temple work done, inappropriately I'd like to make a point that some may not have thought of with this situation. We don't know whether it was done appropriately or inappropriately, but we all suspect that the rules of contacting the nearest living relative were probably not followed. However, there is another disobedience that has also occurred. Helen Radkey gives the Church a lot of grief over these ordinances, and her ability to do that is because she has access to the ordinance information in the IGI. Notice that she knew the dates the work was done for Obama's mother. There is a member of the Church somewhere who is giving her access, which gives her the ability to create these news reports. Either someone has given her their sign-in and password to use as she pleases, or she is able to get someone at an FHC or the FHL to "help" her by signing in for her--possibly not knowing who she is. As consultants, we all need to remember that the rules are in place for a reason, and if someone is unable to sign in, we should "help" them contact their ward clerk--not sign in for them. Jill Crandell Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

What a game!! but this bit of it is fun but it distracts me from my work.....no not FH work ....housework! Bye Kathy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jorge Todeschini" <jorgetodeschini@hotmail.com> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 3:10 PM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > Oh, believe me, I know that. I tell people they *can* use paper, but then > I > show some of what they can do with a computer. The advantages of the > electronic system are easier to perceive and appreciate as databases grow. > > The thing is, genealogy can seem pretty overwhelming to beginners, and I > try > to keep that in mind at all times. A brother in my ward was interested in > getting started and I showed him a couple of things he could do, such as > researching local archives and ordering a microfilm. I showed one example > of > my early research, a record from the 1890s (one of my grand-aunts). His > reaction? He said, "wow, 1890." And we on this list know that 1890 is like > yesterday in genealogy terms. If I tell him on his first visit to the FHC > that he needs to research, read old handwriting and then record everything > on two computer systems, that might be the last time I see him there. > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: <Sahara346@aol.com> > Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 9:38 AM > To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > >> On the other hand, when they find that third cousin twice removed down in >> GA, or up in ME, or overseas, who is willing to exchange data, it is much >> quicker, and far more economical to send them a GEDCOM from their >> genealogy >> program with the appropriate links than it is to send them a packet of >> hand >> written papers xeroxed off. That is seriously something to think about >> too. I have exchanged GEDCOMs with a couple of distant cousins, both in >> and >> out of the Church. Well researched lines from non-member relatives give >> us >> more family that we can get temple work for, as long as we remember to >> stay >> outside that window that belongs to closer related relatives. >> >> Karen >> >> >> In a message dated 5/7/2009 5:44:27 A.M. Central Daylight Time, >> jorgetodeschini@hotmail.com writes: >> >> The leader should have said "we no longer need PAF >> _for_temple_submission_." We still need a tool to research genealogy -- >> mostly for recording >> information and sources. nFS is a tool for temple submitting, only. It >> can help >> a bit with research as you search for duplicates, but that's it. You >> know, >> I have even told some people who do not want to "keep two databases" and >> "learn two computer systems" that they can submit with nFS and >> research/record info on paper sheets with pedigree charts and family >> group records. >> >> -------------------------------------------------- >> From: "Kathy Scott" <kathyscott1@ntlworld.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 8:32 PM >> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? >> >>> Thank you Gaylon for such a helpful answer. I think I will move onto >>> Ancestral Quest myself as a starter. My sensitivity about PAF comes >>> from >> a >>> careless leader's remark " We no longer need PAF". and that, after my >>> spending years teaching how to use it for data gathering and Temple >> work!!! >>> >>> God bless us in our efforts to be helpful to each other. >>> Kathy >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Gaylon Findlay" <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >>> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 9:43 PM >>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>> >>> >>>> Kathy and others: >>>> >>>> As you say, "PAF is my 'friend' and ... it is the 'friend' of most >>>> members ...". Ever since we gave the Ancestral Quest code to the >>>> Church >>>> over 10 years ago, we have recognized this friendship relationship >>>> between PAF and the members. And we know that if "most members" will >>>> just take a look at Ancestral Quest, they will feel like they are >>>> still >>>> in the house of a friend. It will be a comfortable adjustment to use >>>> the >>>> new tools, like NFS syncing, for most members, as AQ and PAF are so >> much >>>> alike, except for the newer features, which aren't in PAF. >>>> >>>> One of the other cool things about AQ's relationship with PAF is that >>>> you can use most PAF add-on utilities with it. For example, you should >>>> be able to use FamilyInsight and PAF Companion with it. (AQ can let >>>> you >>>> use either of two database types: PAF and its own. If you will use the >>>> .paf database, then you can continue to use PAF, FamilyInsight, PAF >>>> Companion and other PAF add-ons with AQ.) >>>> >>>> Gaylon >>>> >>>> >>>> Kathy Scott wrote: >>>>> To all especially Harry, >>>>> >>>>> I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding >> it >>>>> difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and >> many >>>>> of >>>>> us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and >>>>> then >>>>> teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not >> because >>>>> the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly >> has >>>>> to >>>>> be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to >>>>> others. >>>>> >>>>> I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy >>>>> programs >> >>>>> but I >>>>> know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of >>>>> those >>>>> whom >>>>> I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the >> ground. >>>>> I >>>>> enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the >>>>> 'friend' >>>>> of most members over in England; those not using it or not >> comfortable >>>>> with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they >> will >>>>> get hooked into the work. >>>>> >>>>> Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is >>>>> concerned You can't be older than I am! >>>>> Kathy >>>>> >>>>> I ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> >>>>> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:11 AM >>>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> So Gaylon are you and all the discussion in the past 24 hours on here >>>>> saying >>>>> get rid of PAF and get another program? I don't like NFS as a working >>>>> program and at my age will most likely never process another name >>>>> with >>>>> it. >>>>> >>>>> Reason I like PAF and had so many people get it I , a computer dummy, >>>>> could >>>>> put my data into it and knew where it was and what I had and explain >> it >>>>> when >>>>> I was teaching it. >>>>> >>>>> Harry >>>>> >>>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know >>>>> who >> we >>>>> are when we learn our past >>>>> >>>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 11:05 AM >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Harry: >>>>> >>>>> Personal Ancestral File (PAF) is the trademarked name of the LDS >>>>> Church's desktop database manager. >>>>> >>>>> PAF versions 4 and 5 (with the latest subversion being 5.2) are >>>>> derived >>>>> from Ancestral Quest 3.0. These are the Windows versions of PAF. >>>>> >>>>> Earlier versions of PAF (3.0 and earlier) were DOS programs, and were >>>>> not derived from Ancestral Quest. >>>>> >>>>> Gaylon >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Harry Laughman wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Ok now I am confuse, I have been useing Personal Ancestral File 5.0 >>>>>> Gaylon is this what your refering to or are you refering to >>>>>> something >>>>>> all >>>>>> together different? >>>>>> >>>>>> Harry >>>>>> >>>>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know >> who >>>>>> we >>>>>> are when we learn our past >>>>>> >>>>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:21 AM >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Peter: >>>>>> >>>>>> I suspect that you mean, "Personal Ancestral File" rather than >> "Personal >>>>>> Ancestry File". Affectionately known as "PAF". >>>>>> >>>>>> A little known fact is that the Windows versions of PAF were >>>>>> created >>>>>> from an older version of Ancestral Quest, by Incline Software. >> (Incline >>>>>> Software donated a copy of the AQ code to the LDS Church in 1999, >>>>>> and >>>>>> thus most members of the Church are using a slightly modified copy >>>>>> of >>>>>> Ancestral Quest, but with the name changed to "Personal Ancestral >>>>>> File".) You might want to look at the current version of Ancestral >> Quest >>>>>> (you can download a free trial of the program at www.ancquest.com). >> You >>>>>> will find that it looks and acts an awful lot like PAF, because it >>>>>> is >>>>>> mostly the same as PAF, but with many major enhancements -- like >>>>>> the >>>>>> ability to sync your PAF data with New FamilySearch. >>>>>> >>>>>> Gaylon Findlay >>>>>> Incline Software >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Peter F. Thorne wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I have been using Personal Ancestry File published by the Church. >> With >>>>>>> the >>>>>>> announcement that this program will no longer be supported, I have >> been >>>>>>> considering selecting a commercial program. While NFS is great for >>>>>>> recording >>>>>>> information, I felt that research for new information might be >> enhanced >>>>>>> by >>>>>>> subscribing to Ancestry, RootsMagic or similar program. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I realize that I have no knowledge about commercial programs and >> what >>>>>>> they >>>>>>> offer. Consequently, I felt some of you might share some of your >>>>>>> insights >>>>>>> and experiences that would help me in this decision. I am also >> looking >>>>>>> for >>>>>>> other programs for personal history, family atlas or any other >> programs >>>>>>> you >>>>>>> might recommend. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Peter F. Thorne >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Toms River, NJ >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word >>>>>>> 'unsubscribe' >>>>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word >>>>>> 'unsubscribe' >>>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>>> >>>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word >>>>>> 'unsubscribe' >>>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without >>>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without >>>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in >> the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the >> subject and the body of the message >> >> >> **************Big savings on Dell’s most popular laptops. Now starting at >> $449! >> (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1222382499x1201454962/aol?redir=http:%2F%2Fad.doubleclick.net%2Fclk%3B214663472%3B36502367%3Bg) >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Sylvia, I do not know if you use Ancestry. com or like me ancestry.co.uk. I find that when I log out of co.uk at the Centre I need to log out of .com as well even though I did not log in there!! Weird. But it seems to work. Kathy p.s. I have just thought of a possible cause. I leave my Ancestry logged on at home do you think that makes a difference? Weird again! Kathy again! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sylvia H. Sonneborn" <slysyl@verizon.net> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 4:09 AM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Using Ancestry at FHC >I don't have problems using my subscription to Ancestry at the FHC, but I > have a terrible time logging off as do others who use their subscription > there. We have 4 computers, and the problem occurs on all the computers. > Last Thursday I logged on, and there was the director's subscription. I > know that she carefully logs out. I finally got her logged out after 3 > attempts. Then I set up my own subscription, but I could not get it to log > off nor could my husband. The consultant who works on Saturday finally > got > my subscription from Thurs. morning to log off Saturday. I don't know why > we have this problem. Any ideas? > Sylvia > > -----Original Message----- > From: lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Joan Raney > Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 8:37 PM > To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Using Ancestry at FHC > > I haven't gotten the error on page message, but I have to log off and > click > refresh 3 times before it will log me off. I don't understand that. I > can > logoff just fine at home. > > Joan in NC > > On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 5:34 PM, Nancy Gibert <nlgibert@ameritech.net> > wrote: > >> >> Does anyone have problems using their own subscription to ancestry at the >> FHC? I am forever getting error on page message. Some things work but >> it >> is very frustrating. >> Thanks >> Nancy >> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Last night I dropped the bombshell on my friend that she is 9th cousin of Barack Obama because I recognized the name in Barack Obama's lines. It is through Barack's maternal grandfather to Pennsylvania. It is well within her rights and obligations to do Temple Work for Barack's parents and grandparents if she have permission from the immediate family since it is less than 95 years. David Samuelsen

I sent this one awhile ago as well, so I hope these aren't duplicated. Paula asked: But wouldn't nfs have prevented them from submitting the ordinance if it wasn't linked into their tree? No, I don't think so. I do a lot of research that is not related to me, and I hate to see it "wasted" when it comes to ordinance work. I go ahead and enter my research into NFS, not related to me, and it always asks if I want to submit the work. I have to tell the program no and hope that someone related finds it someday. I have contacted the Church about this, because if they don't want people submitting work for unrelated people, they should at least stop asking if we want to do it!!!! Jill Crandell

I sent this a little while ago, but it didn't come through. Nancy wrote: I know that non-member FHC librarians are given special sign-ins for New FamilySearch. Are they also given that privilege for the IGI? Yes, I believe they could. However, the Church knows Helen Radkey, and I highly doubt they would give her access to these records. She has been a thorn in their side for many, many years. The only way I can think of that they would intentionally give her access is if it was part of the deal over the Holocaust victims to allow her to keep checking. I just doubt that's the case. Either way, it's a good reminder to us all that anyone using the system needs to have their own log-in. Jill Crandell

Paula wrote: I thought that it was impossible to combine people who we aren't linked to. Nope, I have combined a lot of people from my non-related research as well. Jill Crandell

It is possible to submit ANYONE (related to you or not) through nFS. After he died, I entered Sir Edmund Hillary (the first man to climb Mt Everest) into nFS. No.. I am not related, and NO I will never submit his name for ordinance work. But I have verified that we do not have to be linked to those for whom we submit work. With nFS we can see who submitted the work and Church authorities can give corrections to things done incorrectly. Since the work was done for Obama's mother in TempleReady.. it's all a guessing game as to the motives behind this submission. Alan W. On 5/7/09, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> wrote: > > I'm wondering about the submitter. I'm guessing that it went through > the Temple Ready since it was done in Provo. But wouldn't nfs have > prevented them from submitting the ordinance if it wasn't linked into > their tree? I suppose they could have created a fake connection > somewhere, but that seems pretty far-fetched. Paula > On May 7, 2009, at 12:18 PM, Jill N. Crandell wrote: > > > I'd like to make a point that some may not have thought of with this > > situation. We don't know whether it was done appropriately or > > inappropriately, but we all suspect that the rules of contacting the > > nearest > > living relative were probably not followed. > > > > However, there is another disobedience that has also occurred. Helen > > Radkey > > gives the Church a lot of grief over these ordinances, and her > > ability to do > > that is because she has access to the ordinance information in the > > IGI. > > Notice that she knew the dates the work was done for Obama's mother. > > There > > is a member of the Church somewhere who is giving her access, which > > gives > > her the ability to create these news reports. Either someone has > > given her > > their sign-in and password to use as she pleases, or she is able to > > get > > someone at an FHC or the FHL to "help" her by signing in for her-- > > possibly > > not knowing who she is. As consultants, we all need to remember that > > the > > rules are in place for a reason, and if someone is unable to sign > > in, we > > should "help" them contact their ward clerk--not sign in for them. > > > > Jill Crandell > > > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com > > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > > the body of the message > > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I just left another presentation on AQ here at the Family History Library. One feature I had not paid any attention to.. but would be very useful (one time) is the ability to upload all your data to nFS. I know people that have uploaded their GEDCOMs through the nFS website only to get the data all screwed up. When uploading through the website.. it does not check for existing records, which caused a mess for several FHC Directors and others when nFS came out in Spain. I would like to hear if any other program does that. Alan W. digging through the microfilms.. finding ancestors, problems, and making new friends. On 5/6/09, Helle Thor Hirschmann <helle@hirschmann.dk> wrote: > > Kathy is right! > > > > Find someone in the ward/your family who knows computers and has the > patience to let YOU sit at the computer and let you work your way around. > > > > One learns absolutely nothing from seeing someone work at the computer. And > what you do has to interest you. > > > > Which ever program you choose has to work properly. So from the ones > mentioned here there is actually no difference in that respect. They work > ok. And which to choose is a matter of preference. > > > > I was at a computer course once; the teacher suggested we tried on our own > as far as we could go, when a problem surfaced consult the manual. If it > did > not work after extensive trying – “-call the nearest 14-year-old and watch > closely!”. > > > > You may have genealogy knowledge and the other person computer knowledge – > swap. > > > > Helle > > > > > > -----Oprindelig meddelelse----- > Fra: lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:lds-ward-consultant-bounces@rootsweb.com] På vegne af Kathy Scott > Sendt: 6. maj 2009 22:55 > Til: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com > Emne: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? > > > > To all especially Harry, > > > > I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding it > > difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many of > > us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then > > teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not because > > the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has to > > be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to others. > > > > I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs but > I > > > know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those whom > > I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the ground. I > > enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the > 'friend' > > > of most members over in England; those not using it or not comfortable > > with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they will > > get hooked into the work. > > > > Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is > > concerned You can't be older than I am! > > Kathy > > > > > > E-mail checket af Spyware Doctor(6.0.1.441) > Databaseversion: 6.12330 > http://www.pctools.com/dk/spyware-doctor-antivirus/ > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

By the time I had a chance to look at NFS, the ordinance information was removed and in its place was "This individual needs temple ordinances, but they can't be completed right now. " and in the fields it said "Not available". I assumed it was a relative that requested the work to be done, and a perhaps missionary in Kenya had helped her to submit the information. I feel bad for those sisters whose names are on the contributor list. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt. It is a good lesson for all of us to be more careful! Marianne "Life is too short not to be doing the things you love" On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 9:26 PM, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> wrote: > I thought some of you might be interested in this story that's hitting > the news tonight: > > http://www.deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,705301616,00.html > > ABC news has reported on it, and there are also some pretty mean blog > posts about it. All the more reason to make sure we follow the rules > when submit names. Stanley Dunham's name does appear in the IGI, with > ordinances, but at newfamilysearch, it's not clear that the ordinances > were actually done. (Yes her name was Stanley. Born Kansas 1942 if you > want to look for her.) > > You can also see the names of the submitters at newfamilysearch. I > imagine they've been contacted already by the church, from the sound > of the Deseret News article. Paula > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- Marianne "Yesterday is history, Tomorrow is a mystery, You have to live for Today"

Absolutely! Thanks for being on my wave length. We are short of manpower with the ability to lead in this area that is why these emails are so helpful to me. Kathy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jorge Todeschini" <jorgetodeschini@hotmail.com> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 11:43 AM Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > The leader should have said "we no longer need PAF > _for_temple_submission_." We still need a tool to research genealogy -- > mostly for recording information and sources. nFS is a tool for temple > submitting, only. It can help a bit with research as you search for > duplicates, but that's it. You know, I have even told some people who do > not want to "keep two databases" and "learn two computer systems" that > they can submit with nFS and research/record info on paper sheets with > pedigree charts and family group records. > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Kathy Scott" <kathyscott1@ntlworld.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 8:32 PM > To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> > Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] Gaylon/ What genealogy program do I select? > >> Thank you Gaylon for such a helpful answer. I think I will move onto >> Ancestral Quest myself as a starter. My sensitivity about PAF comes from >> a >> careless leader's remark " We no longer need PAF". and that, after my >> spending years teaching how to use it for data gathering and Temple >> work!!! >> >> God bless us in our efforts to be helpful to each other. >> Kathy >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Gaylon Findlay" <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 9:43 PM >> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >> >> >>> Kathy and others: >>> >>> As you say, "PAF is my 'friend' and ... it is the 'friend' of most >>> members ...". Ever since we gave the Ancestral Quest code to the Church >>> over 10 years ago, we have recognized this friendship relationship >>> between PAF and the members. And we know that if "most members" will >>> just take a look at Ancestral Quest, they will feel like they are still >>> in the house of a friend. It will be a comfortable adjustment to use the >>> new tools, like NFS syncing, for most members, as AQ and PAF are so much >>> alike, except for the newer features, which aren't in PAF. >>> >>> One of the other cool things about AQ's relationship with PAF is that >>> you can use most PAF add-on utilities with it. For example, you should >>> be able to use FamilyInsight and PAF Companion with it. (AQ can let you >>> use either of two database types: PAF and its own. If you will use the >>> .paf database, then you can continue to use PAF, FamilyInsight, PAF >>> Companion and other PAF add-ons with AQ.) >>> >>> Gaylon >>> >>> >>> Kathy Scott wrote: >>>> To all especially Harry, >>>> >>>> I am learning so much from what is being said, but I am also finding >>>> it >>>> difficult. Some of you guys are in a different place than I am and many >>>> of >>>> us, who are just getting our teeth into learning for ourselves and then >>>> teaching others. I so understand where Harry is coming from, not >>>> because >>>> the learning curve I am on is too difficult for me but it certainly has >>>> to >>>> be approached carefully when introducing and teaching nFS etc. to >>>> others. >>>> >>>> I am personally very interested in looking at other genealogy programs >>>> but I >>>> know, as a professional teacher, that it would blow the minds of those >>>> whom >>>> I teach at this point of time and I would never get them off the >>>> ground. >>>> I >>>> enjoy my PAF; it is my 'friend' and most important of all it is the >>>> 'friend' >>>> of most members over in England; those not using it or not >>>> comfortable >>>> with the computer I go along with what best suits them so that they >>>> will >>>> get hooked into the work. >>>> >>>> Harry you need a good teacher! Don't give up.And as far as 'age' is >>>> concerned You can't be older than I am! >>>> Kathy >>>> >>>> I ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Harry Laughman" <h85730@yahoo.com> >>>> To: <lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 12:11 AM >>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>> >>>> >>>> So Gaylon are you and all the discussion in the past 24 hours on here >>>> saying >>>> get rid of PAF and get another program? I don't like NFS as a working >>>> program and at my age will most likely never process another name with >>>> it. >>>> >>>> Reason I like PAF and had so many people get it I , a computer dummy, >>>> could >>>> put my data into it and knew where it was and what I had and explain it >>>> when >>>> I was teaching it. >>>> >>>> Harry >>>> >>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who >>>> we >>>> are when we learn our past >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 11:05 AM >>>> >>>> >>>> Harry: >>>> >>>> Personal Ancestral File (PAF) is the trademarked name of the LDS >>>> Church's desktop database manager. >>>> >>>> PAF versions 4 and 5 (with the latest subversion being 5.2) are derived >>>> from Ancestral Quest 3.0. These are the Windows versions of PAF. >>>> >>>> Earlier versions of PAF (3.0 and earlier) were DOS programs, and were >>>> not derived from Ancestral Quest. >>>> >>>> Gaylon >>>> >>>> >>>> Harry Laughman wrote: >>>> >>>>> Ok now I am confuse, I have been useing Personal Ancestral File 5.0 >>>>> Gaylon is this what your refering to or are you refering to something >>>>> all >>>>> together different? >>>>> >>>>> Harry >>>>> >>>>> WE should all be thankful for what we have. We can only truly know who >>>>> we >>>>> are when we learn our past >>>>> >>>>> --- On Tue, 5/5/09, Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: Gaylon Findlay <gfindlay@ancquest.com> >>>>> Subject: Re: [LDS-WC] What genealogy program do I select? >>>>> To: lds-ward-consultant@rootsweb.com >>>>> Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009, 10:21 AM >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Peter: >>>>> >>>>> I suspect that you mean, "Personal Ancestral File" rather than >>>>> "Personal >>>>> Ancestry File". Affectionately known as "PAF". >>>>> >>>>> A little known fact is that the Windows versions of PAF were created >>>>> from an older version of Ancestral Quest, by Incline Software. >>>>> (Incline >>>>> Software donated a copy of the AQ code to the LDS Church in 1999, and >>>>> thus most members of the Church are using a slightly modified copy of >>>>> Ancestral Quest, but with the name changed to "Personal Ancestral >>>>> File".) You might want to look at the current version of Ancestral >>>>> Quest >>>>> (you can download a free trial of the program at www.ancquest.com). >>>>> You >>>>> will find that it looks and acts an awful lot like PAF, because it is >>>>> mostly the same as PAF, but with many major enhancements -- like the >>>>> ability to sync your PAF data with New FamilySearch. >>>>> >>>>> Gaylon Findlay >>>>> Incline Software >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Peter F. Thorne wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Hi! >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I have been using Personal Ancestry File published by the Church. >>>>>> With >>>>>> the >>>>>> announcement that this program will no longer be supported, I have >>>>>> been >>>>>> considering selecting a commercial program. While NFS is great for >>>>>> recording >>>>>> information, I felt that research for new information might be >>>>>> enhanced >>>>>> by >>>>>> subscribing to Ancestry, RootsMagic or similar program. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I realize that I have no knowledge about commercial programs and what >>>>>> they >>>>>> offer. Consequently, I felt some of you might share some of your >>>>>> insights >>>>>> and experiences that would help me in this decision. I am also >>>>>> looking >>>>>> for >>>>>> other programs for personal history, family atlas or any other >>>>>> programs >>>>>> you >>>>>> might recommend. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Peter F. Thorne >>>>>> >>>>>> Toms River, NJ >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>>> ------------------------------- >>>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without >>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without >>>> the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>>> ------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >>>> >>>> >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >>> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hmm, I tried it once and it didn't work. But maybe it was just a glitch at that time. Paula On May 7, 2009, at 1:56 PM, Jill N. Crandell wrote: > Paula wrote: > I thought that it was impossible to combine people who we aren't > linked to. > > Nope, I have combined a lot of people from my non-related research > as well. > > Jill Crandell > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

Paula asked: But wouldn't nfs have prevented them from submitting the ordinance if it wasn't linked into their tree? No, I don't think so. I do a lot of research that is not related to me, and I hate to see it "wasted" when it comes to ordinance work. I go ahead and enter my research into NFS, not related to me, and it always asks if I want to submit the work. I have to tell the program no and hope that someone related finds it someday. I have contacted the Church about this, because if they don't want people submitting work for unrelated people, they should at least stop asking if we want to do it!!!! Jill Crandell

Nancy wrote: I know that non-member FHC librarians are given special sign-ins for New FamilySearch. Are they also given that privilege for the IGI? Yes, I believe they could. However, the Church knows Helen Radkey, and I highly doubt they would give her access to these records. She has been a thorn in their side for many, many years. The only way I can think of that they would intentionally give her access is if it was part of the deal over the Holocaust victims to allow her to keep checking. I just doubt that's the case. Either way, it's a good reminder to us all that anyone using the system needs to have their own log-in. Jill Crandell

I checked, the submitter that showed up in nFS does not match at all to the ones that show up in Pedigree Resource File (PRF). Stanley Ann Durham is listed there. PRFs do not necessarily have dates listed. David Samuelsen Paula Goodfellow wrote: > I'm wondering about the submitter. I'm guessing that it went through > the Temple Ready since it was done in Provo. But wouldn't nfs have > prevented them from submitting the ordinance if it wasn't linked into > their tree? I suppose they could have created a fake connection > somewhere, but that seems pretty far-fetched. Paula

Interesting. I thought that it was impossible to combine people who we aren't linked to. SO I was assuming that we'd need to be linked to do submit also. Thanks, Paula On May 7, 2009, at 1:48 PM, Whitcomb wrote: > It is possible to submit ANYONE (related to you or not) through > nFS. After > he died, I entered Sir Edmund Hillary (the first man to climb Mt > Everest) > into nFS. No.. I am not related, and NO I will never submit his > name for > ordinance work. But I have verified that we do not have to be > linked to > those for whom we submit work. > > With nFS we can see who submitted the work and Church authorities > can give > corrections to things done incorrectly. Since the work was done for > Obama's > mother in TempleReady.. it's all a guessing game as to the motives > behind > this submission. > > Alan W. > > > > > > On 5/7/09, Paula Goodfellow <sootica@mac.com> wrote: >> >> I'm wondering about the submitter. I'm guessing that it went through >> the Temple Ready since it was done in Provo. But wouldn't nfs have >> prevented them from submitting the ordinance if it wasn't linked into >> their tree? I suppose they could have created a fake connection >> somewhere, but that seems pretty far-fetched. Paula >> On May 7, 2009, at 12:18 PM, Jill N. Crandell wrote: >> >>> I'd like to make a point that some may not have thought of with this >>> situation. We don't know whether it was done appropriately or >>> inappropriately, but we all suspect that the rules of contacting the >>> nearest >>> living relative were probably not followed. >>> >>> However, there is another disobedience that has also occurred. Helen >>> Radkey >>> gives the Church a lot of grief over these ordinances, and her >>> ability to do >>> that is because she has access to the ordinance information in the >>> IGI. >>> Notice that she knew the dates the work was done for Obama's mother. >>> There >>> is a member of the Church somewhere who is giving her access, which >>> gives >>> her the ability to create these news reports. Either someone has >>> given her >>> their sign-in and password to use as she pleases, or she is able to >>> get >>> someone at an FHC or the FHL to "help" her by signing in for her-- >>> possibly >>> not knowing who she is. As consultants, we all need to remember that >>> the >>> rules are in place for a reason, and if someone is unable to sign >>> in, we >>> should "help" them contact their ward clerk--not sign in for them. >>> >>> Jill Crandell >>> >>> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com >>> with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and >>> the body of the message >> >> >> Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' >> without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

On second thought, any name that show up in IGI, it is already done in Temples. His grandparents are still shown in IGI. (a chck in nFS shows same submitter for Stanley Ann Dunham) David Samuelsen W. David Samuelsen wrote: > That's a possibility! > > I know who to contact to let them know about this possibility. > > David > > Jill N. Crandell wrote: >> I'd like to make a point that some may not have thought of with this >> situation. We don't know whether it was done appropriately or >> inappropriately, but we all suspect that the rules of contacting the nearest >> living relative were probably not followed.

That's a possibility! I know who to contact to let them know about this possibility. David Jill N. Crandell wrote: > I'd like to make a point that some may not have thought of with this > situation. We don't know whether it was done appropriately or > inappropriately, but we all suspect that the rules of contacting the nearest > living relative were probably not followed. > > However, there is another disobedience that has also occurred. Helen Radkey > gives the Church a lot of grief over these ordinances, and her ability to do > that is because she has access to the ordinance information in the IGI. > Notice that she knew the dates the work was done for Obama's mother. There > is a member of the Church somewhere who is giving her access, which gives > her the ability to create these news reports. Either someone has given her > their sign-in and password to use as she pleases, or she is able to get > someone at an FHC or the FHL to "help" her by signing in for her--possibly > not knowing who she is. As consultants, we all need to remember that the > rules are in place for a reason, and if someone is unable to sign in, we > should "help" them contact their ward clerk--not sign in for them. > > Jill Crandell > > Please send the one word message SUBSCRIBE or UNSUBSCRIBE to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-L-REQUEST@ROOTSWEB.COM > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to LDS-WARD-CONSULTANT-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

Paula Goodfellow wrote: > Thanks to everyone who's responded so far. We certainly have it easier > now. > > I've seen entries in old temple records that say "friend" for > relationship as someone else mentioned, and thought that that was odd. > > So would someone in SLC have been checking these against the Temple > Index Bureau to get them approved? Thanks, Paula that was the procedure until 1988. Then things went wild when a lot sent in for ordinances direct to Temples, resulting in large scale duplications. The entire TIB is converted and is in nFS now. David Samuelsen

I'd like to make a point that some may not have thought of with this situation. We don't know whether it was done appropriately or inappropriately, but we all suspect that the rules of contacting the nearest living relative were probably not followed. However, there is another disobedience that has also occurred. Helen Radkey gives the Church a lot of grief over these ordinances, and her ability to do that is because she has access to the ordinance information in the IGI. Notice that she knew the dates the work was done for Obama's mother. There is a member of the Church somewhere who is giving her access, which gives her the ability to create these news reports. Either someone has given her their sign-in and password to use as she pleases, or she is able to get someone at an FHC or the FHL to "help" her by signing in for her--possibly not knowing who she is. As consultants, we all need to remember that the rules are in place for a reason, and if someone is unable to sign in, we should "help" them contact their ward clerk--not sign in for them. Jill Crandell