I have an Isaac Butterworth in my tree from Heywood, Lancs who married Charlotte Ashton in Manchester Cathedral in 1831. Is there a connection do you think? Peter

My biggest puzzle is my 4 Great Grandfather, he was Humphrey Briscoe (spelling varies) and married Alice Taylor 14 Dec 1773 at Bolton Parish Church. He is described as a Weaver from Tong. He was buried at the Parish Church 18 Aug 1819. Alice was Christened at the Parish Church 8 Jun 1748 so presume he was born around the same time. I have never found anything about him before his marriage so no idea where he came from. There are Briscoes in Bolton in the early 18th Century with several buried at the Parish Church. They seem to be from around Little Lever. But I cannot make a connection between any of them and my family. Martin Briscoe Fort William Ancestry DNA, FTDNA (B68554), GEDMatch (A374507)

Reminds me, when I first started on the family history I was given copies of some letters from the 19th Century that my brother had. I could see a distant connection to most but there were some that I could not make any real sense of one. One was a small piece of paper with: September 19 1839 Jane Shutt Departed September 19th. Aged 72 years. I think this is her in Lancashire OPC. Marriage: 20 Nov 1814 St Peter, Bolton, Lancashire, England Thomas Shutt - Widower of This parish Jane Butler - widow of This parish My Great Grandmother was an Aspinall and her eldest brother was Thomas Aspinall, he married Parthenia Butler and many of the letters seem associated with the Butlers. I must go back over the letters now there is information online. Martin Briscoe Fort William Ancestry DNA, FTDNA (B68554), GEDMatch (A374507)

Living around Heywood 1890 –1940 Butler Tattersall Thompson nee Partington Cheers Jeff

Hi Teri....we may have corresponded before.....I have HOWARTH as follows: On December 1, 1782 my SAMUEL OGDEN b. 1755 married ELIZABETH HOWARTH.  They had the following children: Mary Ogden bap. 1782 Gradwell  married George ?Samuel Ogden bap. 1784 MiddletonJohn Ogden bap. 1788 Blackley  married Kezia Mitchell Fox in 1824  (this is the line that I descend from). If anything looks familiar, please let me know. mary lou -----Original Message----- From: Teri Cleaveland <bunnypurple51@gmail.com> To: Lancsgen <Lancsgen@rootsweb.com> Sent: Mon, Sep 16, 2019 8:23 pm Subject: [LAN] Surnames I only have two confirmed lines HOWARTH  Worsley/Little Hulton BARBER.  Ashton under Lynn (then Cheshire) Never have confirmed what Betty married my William Howarth. Teri Cleaveland Ontario, Oregon *** Ps 37:4-5 *** _______________________________________________ Be sure mail to the list is in PLAIN TEXT. GENUKI - a virtual reference library of genealogical information.  http://www.genuki.org.uk/ Don't forget to check the Lancashire message board for new queries, links, and information. To UNSUBSCRIBE via email, send a Plain Text email with the single word UNSUBSCRIBE in both the subject and body of the message to lancsgen-leave@rootsweb.com _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/lancsgen@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Hi everyone, My Jonathan MAPES was born 1844 in Norfolk, he eventaully made his way to Lancashire where he married Mary HINDLE on 10 Aug 1868 in Littleborough, their son Hindle MAPES was born JunQ 1869 reg. in Rochdale. There is not a trace of Jonathan after this, Mary & Hindle are with her parents (William & Margaret) on the 1871 C in Blatchworth, Lancs, Mary then married James LORD MarQ 1879 Rochdale reg. On 1901C Mary & James are living in Todmorden, Yks, James died 1910 age 53 yrs and Mary died 1918 age 72 yrs both reg. in Todmorden. Hindle stayed iin Lancs and married Sarah Jane ROWLINSON in 1901 reg. Rochdale, their son Clifford was born 1901 he married Florence TAYLOR in 1929,Hindle died 14 Apr 1927 age 57 yrs. Jonathan MAPES was a Blacksmith in Victoria St, Rochdale,Littleborough, his workshop equipment was put up for auction on Feb 22 1869 by his Landlord Mr W SHEPHERD (from Rochdale, Lancs Observer Newspaper - 20 Feb 1869). I would dearly love to find any trace of Jonathan MAPES brother of my greatgrandfather George MAPES. Hoping someone can suggest how he disappeared or where to, I have of course checked all death records for England, happy hunting, Annette WATSON Lismore 2480 Australia At 12:23 PM 17/09/2019, you wrote: >I only have two confirmed lines > >HOWARTH Worsley/Little Hulton >BARBER. Ashton under Lynn (then Cheshire) > >Never have confirmed what Betty married my William Howarth. > >Teri Cleaveland >Ontario, Oregon > > >*** Ps 37:4-5 *** > >_______________________________________________ >Be sure mail to the list is in PLAIN TEXT. > >GENUKI - a virtual reference library of genealogical >information. http://www.genuki.org.uk/ > >Don't forget to check the Lancashire message board for new queries, >links, and information. > >To UNSUBSCRIBE via email, send a Plain Text email with the single >word UNSUBSCRIBE >in both the subject and body of the message to lancsgen-leave@rootsweb.com >_______________________________________________ >Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref >Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/lancsgen@rootsweb.com >Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: >https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 >Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog >RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal >RootsWeb community

I only have two confirmed lines HOWARTH Worsley/Little Hulton BARBER. Ashton under Lynn (then Cheshire) Never have confirmed what Betty married my William Howarth. Teri Cleaveland Ontario, Oregon *** Ps 37:4-5 ***

Thanks June, but I’ve been trying to make that connection for a long time. My grandchildren are sure I have the ‘powers’ ! Regards, Sue

Hi List Just an update on the above. I had a bit of a look on family search and it seems JAMES BELFIELD was 28 when he married FANNY BUTTERWORTH who was 22, so this gives me a birth date for James of 1775 not 1785. On the “Intended Marriage” record it looks like there maybe a JOHN?? BELFIELD as a possible witness. Also FANNY BELFIELD died looks like “Brickfield” 1836 buried in Smallbridge, wife of JAMES BELFIELD. So maybe no connection to BUTTERWORTH HALL Sarah!! Would like to find more on JAMES BELFIELD though. Regards Dianna

Hi List I thought I would try and follow up on my Belfield (possible Butterworth) family as well. HANNAH BELFIELD baptised 28th of December 1806 St. CHAD Father JAMES BELFIELD and FANNY abode SMALLBRIDGE ROCHDALE JAMES BELFIELD married FANNY BUTTERWORTH 4th December 1803 St. CHAD ROCHDALE. Other children to this couple JAMES, BETTY ,MARY, SARAH, ALICE all from/born SMALLBRIDGE. Possibly James Belfield babtised 8th May 1785 to a Widow Sarah Belfield..abode BUTTERWORTH HALL Is (or has?) anyone else done research on this BELFIELD (Sarah) from BUTTERWORTH HALL?? Would like to find out more and perhaps make a connection between my HANNAH BELFIELD/BRIERCLIFFE and Sarah BELFIELD as possible Grandmother!! Kind regards Dianna

Hi Hugh, Are you related to David Stott, founder of Bennet Street Sunday School in Manchester? Regards, Howard -----Original Message----- From: stottfsi@comcast.net <stottfsi@comcast.net> Sent: 16 September 2019 15:39 To: lancsgen@rootsweb.com Subject: [LAN] Quiet list I'll add my family name, STOTT to the quiet list, if you please. Hugh Stott _______________________________________________ Be sure mail to the list is in PLAIN TEXT. GENUKI - a virtual reference library of genealogical information. http://www.genuki.org.uk/ Don't forget to check the Lancashire message board for new queries, links, and information. To UNSUBSCRIBE via email, send a Plain Text email with the single word UNSUBSCRIBE in both the subject and body of the message to lancsgen-leave@rootsweb.com _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/lancsgen@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Good Morning List I thought I would have another go at finding out what happened to my ancestor JOHN BRITCLIFFE/BRIERCLIFFE:- What other records can be looked at possibly to find out what happened to JOHN. I don’t imagine there would be probate records!! Emigration records! Tax records! There was one JOHN BRITCLIFFE that killed his wife Sarah and was sentenced to transportation BUT I think served his sentence on one of the hulks. Could it be that JOHN’S name was spelt in some strange way and that is why he cannot be found re death record or 1841 Census!! Or did he die between 1833 and 1854 and his death/burial was not recorded OR did he die in another part of the UK/OVERSEAS??? Anyway thought I would add to the QUIET LIST. Kindest regards Dianna from Aus John Briercliffe in the Lancashire, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1936 Name: John Briercliffe=HANNAH BELFIELD from Smallbridge Gender: Male Event Type: Marriage Event Date: 6 Oct 1825 Parish: Rochdale, Lancashire, This couple children:- Mary Britcliffe (CONVICT SENT TO TASMANIA) Daughter 1826 in Rochdale, Lancashire, England James Britcliffe= ALICE COTTAM Son 1828 in Rochdale, Lancashire, Betty Britcliffe/ ELIZABETH= WILLIAM LOWE Daughter 1831 in Rochdale, Lancashire, Charlotte Britcliffe (DIED IN INFANCY) Daughter 1833 in Rochdale, Lancashire, JOHN’S wife Hannah Briercliffe (spelt Bricliffe on 1841 Census) is living with one of their daughters Elizabeth in the Deansgate/Salford area in Cumberland St. John is not at this residence though. On Hannahs death 1854 certificate it states that she is the widow of John BRIERCLIFFE. Name: Hannah Briercliffe Birth Year: abt 1806 Age: 48 Burial Date: 10 Dec 1854 Parish: Salford, St Stephen Parish as it Appears: St Stephen, Salford # JOHN BRITCLIFFE/BRIERCLIFFE IS NOT BURIED IN THE SAME CEMETERY WITH HANNAH

I used to find bastardy orders on the A2A (Access to Archives) site but that has been changed, so I'm not sure where they might be, but they are out there somewhere. I found one for two of my relatives in Adlington & Whittle le Woods.  Jane Houghton Noble's father could be Houghton as the mother sometimes used the real father's name if he wasn't willing to acknowledge the child.  Also the bastard child often took the new father's name if the mother remarried making it hard to find them at later times, but you said you have him on the census, so that wouldn't apply. On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 20:52:11 +0100, Adrian Bruce <abruce6155@gmail.com> wrote: OK - not a surname but a request for inspiration. Does anyone know where I can find details about bastardy orders issued in the Oldham area in the 1840s? I've searched the online catalogue for Lancashire Record Office on the two possible names of the parties, but without success. Longer version: This is one of those interesting diversions / challenges. My relative, Agnes Woodhead, nee Bates, married John Handforth Noble in 1886 in London. It was a 2nd marriage for both. John was a valuer / loss assessor / machine broker from the Oldham area who had actually overcome a fairly poor start in life, I think. He'd been born 11 August 1842 in Oldham, baptised 2 June 1844 at St. Peter's, Oldham. His baptism simply refers to him as John Noble (no middle name), son of Ann Noble, spinster of Duke St. He had an elder sister, Jane Houghton Noble, similarly illegitimate. Ann's parents were Godfrey Noble, a hatter of Oldham, and his wife Sally. John's first marriage in 1867 gives his father as Stephen Scott, a rope-maker. His 1886 marriage is a bit more respectable as he changes his father's name to Stephen Noble. Now, I'd quite like to confirm just who Stephen Scott was. It's not a common name and the only candidate in Lancashire in the 1841 is a rope maker living in Oldham with William and Mary Scott. (1820 baptism in Bury confirms these are his parents). I can follow Stephen Scott through the censuses - he's born in Bacup abt 1820, is in Bury in the 1851 (married in 1844 to Mary Ann Howarth), then in Chorlton upon Medlock in 1861 and 1881 - in the last two he's a Professor of Astro Phrenology (nope, me neither!) This last makes it obvious from newspaper reports that he is the astrologer known as Alphonso Gazelle, who was on at least one occasion charged with getting money under false pretences or something similar, thru practising astrology. So - is Alphonso Gazelle really the Stephen Scott who is John Handforth Noble's father? While it all *seems* to fit, I'd like more proof just in case JHN's mother strayed geographically as well as metaphorically. Well, in the Salford Hundred Quarter Sessions of both Easter 1843 and Easter 1844 ("England & Wales, Criminal Registers, 1791-1892"), a Stephen Scott of the right age is charged with "Disobeying an order in bastardy" for which he got 3 months then 4 months respectively. Seems to me that my best bet is to locate that original bastardy order but while I've seen some mentioned in the Lancs RO index and then visible on Quarter Sessions microfilms at Preston, I can't find this one. But I don't know whether I'm even looking in the right place - what happens if the order were done at the Petty Sessions? Or if they're in a bit of the Quarter Sessions not in the online catalogue? Or just lost! Grateful if anyone can offer Oldham based advice on where to look... Adrian _______________________________________________ Be sure mail to the list is in PLAIN TEXT. GENUKI - a virtual reference library of genealogical information. http://www.genuki.org.uk/ Don't forget to check the Lancashire message board for new queries, links, and information. To UNSUBSCRIBE via email, send a Plain Text email with the single word UNSUBSCRIBE in both the subject and body of the message to lancsgen-leave@rootsweb.com _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/lancsgen@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community  

OK - not a surname but a request for inspiration. Does anyone know where I can find details about bastardy orders issued in the Oldham area in the 1840s? I've searched the online catalogue for Lancashire Record Office on the two possible names of the parties, but without success. Longer version: This is one of those interesting diversions / challenges. My relative, Agnes Woodhead, nee Bates, married John Handforth Noble in 1886 in London. It was a 2nd marriage for both. John was a valuer / loss assessor / machine broker from the Oldham area who had actually overcome a fairly poor start in life, I think. He'd been born 11 August 1842 in Oldham, baptised 2 June 1844 at St. Peter's, Oldham. His baptism simply refers to him as John Noble (no middle name), son of Ann Noble, spinster of Duke St. He had an elder sister, Jane Houghton Noble, similarly illegitimate. Ann's parents were Godfrey Noble, a hatter of Oldham, and his wife Sally. John's first marriage in 1867 gives his father as Stephen Scott, a rope-maker. His 1886 marriage is a bit more respectable as he changes his father's name to Stephen Noble. Now, I'd quite like to confirm just who Stephen Scott was. It's not a common name and the only candidate in Lancashire in the 1841 is a rope maker living in Oldham with William and Mary Scott. (1820 baptism in Bury confirms these are his parents). I can follow Stephen Scott through the censuses - he's born in Bacup abt 1820, is in Bury in the 1851 (married in 1844 to Mary Ann Howarth), then in Chorlton upon Medlock in 1861 and 1881 - in the last two he's a Professor of Astro Phrenology (nope, me neither!) This last makes it obvious from newspaper reports that he is the astrologer known as Alphonso Gazelle, who was on at least one occasion charged with getting money under false pretences or something similar, thru practising astrology. So - is Alphonso Gazelle really the Stephen Scott who is John Handforth Noble's father? While it all *seems* to fit, I'd like more proof just in case JHN's mother strayed geographically as well as metaphorically. Well, in the Salford Hundred Quarter Sessions of both Easter 1843 and Easter 1844 ("England & Wales, Criminal Registers, 1791-1892"), a Stephen Scott of the right age is charged with "Disobeying an order in bastardy" for which he got 3 months then 4 months respectively. Seems to me that my best bet is to locate that original bastardy order but while I've seen some mentioned in the Lancs RO index and then visible on Quarter Sessions microfilms at Preston, I can't find this one. But I don't know whether I'm even looking in the right place - what happens if the order were done at the Petty Sessions? Or if they're in a bit of the Quarter Sessions not in the online catalogue? Or just lost! Grateful if anyone can offer Oldham based advice on where to look... Adrian

I have been on the list for many years but confess to not posting recently. Here are my Lancashire surnames. I am particularly interested in the GARNER line from St Helen's who worked in glass works. James Garner b ca 1791, son John 1818-1867, and grandson James b 1840 for whom I’ve never been able to find a death certificate. Last positive location was in 1861 at Peasley Cross Lane, Sutton, St Helens age 20. He had left his wife and children by 1871 but I don’t know where he went. He was a house painter. GARNER - St Helen's, Blackburn BERGIN - Blackburn (also Ireland) ROBINSON - Ashton-in-Makerfield, St Helen's WOODS - Ashton-in-Makerfield? NUNN - Bacup, Church, Clayton le Moors (originally from Little Downham, Cambs) BARBER - Clayton le Moors, Altham, Accrington (originally from Ely, Cambs) LIVERSIDGE - Haslingden (later Australia) VICKERS - Preston, Burscough, Clayton le Moors HEYS - Accrington SHAW - Lancaster ADDISON - Lancaster LAWSON - Lancaster (Warton) HARRISON - Cockerham, Kendal (Crook) PROCTER - Wyresdale, Kendal Thanks, Jane Hansen

A slightly less illustrious Lancashire railway accident occurred a year later, involving my 1st cousin 5X removed : “Another accident attended with more extensively fatal results, occurred on the Bolton and Leigh railway, on Monday week. The Dreadnought engine which is employed on the line to convey goods was on its way to the Union Foundry, in order to be repaired and, the multitude not having been dispersed, the tender was literally covered by men and boys, so that the engineer could not see his way. On passing the mill of Messrs. Ormerod and Hardcastle, at Bolton, some person had removed the plug which secured the turning table, and the rails were not parallel, consequently the tender, upon reaching the table, was thrown off the line with considerable shock, and ran for twelve yards along the road until it came in contact with a stone wall and two men were so closely jammed against it that it was necessary to take down part of the wall before they could be extricated. They were both severely crushed. A young man, Henry Phethean, son of Mrs Phethean of the Blue Boar Public House, at the first notice of danger, in attempting to slip off the tender, was struck down by it and received so severe a contusion on the stomach as to occasion his death in half an hour. The other two persons have since died in consequence of the injuries they received. One of them, Wm. Wood who has left a wife and two children and was a smith at the Union Foundry; the other, Joseph Joule, aged 18 was apprentice at the same place.” Chester Chronicle - Friday 24 June 1831 Stuart Phethean Hampshire UK > On 15 Sep 2019, at 15:02, Lynne <lklein@mindspring.com> wrote: > > From the blog for the Borthwick Institute for Archives: > > "On this day in 1830 Liverpool MP William Huskisson was fatally injured by the 'Rocket' locomotive at the opening of the Liverpool & Manchester Railway - but did you know of the part played in the aftermath by Emma Blackburne, Vicaress of Eccles?" > > "The death of Liverpool MP William Huskisson at the opening of the Liverpool to Manchester Railway in September 1830 has become a notorious event in early railway history. Less well known however is the part played in the events of that day by Emma Anne Blackburne, the Vicaress of Eccles, who features heavily in the correspondence of Annabel Crewe, part of the Milnes Coates Archive at the Borthwick Institute." > > Read this interesting story at <https://tinyurl.com/y2cer284>. > > Do you have a connection to anyone mentioned in this blog? > > Lynne > >

I'll add my family name, STOTT to the quiet list, if you please. Hugh Stott

My family was in the Chatburn, Downham, Clitheroe, Worston , Pendle areas. Names: Wilson Green Hayes Hayhurst Robinson Ward My widowed James Wilson (1802-1881) and his 3 children immigrated to Philadelphia in 1842. His brother Richard and a sister, Candace also immigrated to Philadelphia. Candace had a son, Jesse Wilson (1845-1919) who went back and stayed in Chatburn area. Brenda Antal

Hi John they don't delete to mine I did them years ago Regards Jim Higson Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/ghei36> ________________________________ From: Jimmy Higson <jimmyhigson@hotmail.com> Sent: Monday, September 16, 2019 7:27:06 AM To: lancsgen@rootsweb.com <lancsgen@rootsweb.com> Cc: John The Genes <john_the_genes@btinternet.com> Subject: [LAN] Re: Quiet list Mine are Higson around Little Hilton Jim Higson Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/ghei36> ________________________________ From: John The Genes via LANCSGEN <lancsgen@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, September 16, 2019 7:10:22 AM To: lancsgen@rootsweb.com <lancsgen@rootsweb.com> Cc: John The Genes <john_the_genes@btinternet.com> Subject: [LAN] Re: Quiet list My main Lancashire names: Higson/Hickson Livesey Marsh Williams Predominantly around Wigan, particularly Blackrod. -- John Lynch _______________________________________________ Be sure mail to the list is in PLAIN TEXT. GENUKI - a virtual reference library of genealogical information. http://www.genuki.org.uk/ Don't forget to check the Lancashire message board for new queries, links, and information. To UNSUBSCRIBE via email, send a Plain Text email with the single word UNSUBSCRIBE in both the subject and body of the message to lancsgen-leave@rootsweb.com _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/lancsgen@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community _______________________________________________ Be sure mail to the list is in PLAIN TEXT. GENUKI - a virtual reference library of genealogical information. http://www.genuki.org.uk/ Don't forget to check the Lancashire message board for new queries, links, and information. To UNSUBSCRIBE via email, send a Plain Text email with the single word UNSUBSCRIBE in both the subject and body of the message to lancsgen-leave@rootsweb.com _______________________________________________ Email preferences: http://bit.ly/rootswebpref Unsubscribe https://lists.rootsweb.com/postorius/lists/lancsgen@rootsweb.com Privacy Statement: https://ancstry.me/2JWBOdY Terms and Conditions: https://ancstry.me/2HDBym9 Rootsweb Blog: http://rootsweb.blog RootsWeb is funded and supported by Ancestry.com and our loyal RootsWeb community

Sue -- you do know that an Alice Nutter was supposedly a Pendle Witch don't you? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_Nutter_(alleged_witch) Now that would bring a bit of 'colour' to your ancestry - having a witch in your tree! Regards June On Monday, 16 September 2019, 12:40:19 BST, Sue mann <suemann@homemail.com.au> wrote: