Bud, According to "Aukers, Conley, Rice, Stambaugh & Witten Families" by John Haden Rice Samuel S. Stambaugh married Charlotte Rogers. The book says that Samuel and Charlotte had 9 children (Phillip, Fredrick, Jonathan, Samuel, Betsey, Sarah Ann, Vina, Sarah Jane and Elizabeth) and that Samuel S. married Eliza Hager Nov. 29, 1860. Rice notes this in the book "All that is known about Charlotte Rogers is that she was living in Ohio at the time of her marriage." Hope this is of some help. Sincerely Searching, Marianne Hitchcock Smith At 01:27 AM 12/4/99 EST, you wrote: >February 22, 1852, in Johnson County, KY, Fredrick Stambough, 24, born Floyd >Co, married Martha Lemaster, 18, born Floyd County. Fredrick's father was >Samuel Stambough. Can someone please tell me who Fredrick's mother was? >Martha's father was Lewis Lemaster. I believe the Lewis Lemaster, born 1792, >son of Eleazer. Can someone tell me if I'm right, and if so, who Martha's >mother was? >Bud Caudle >Guthrie, OK > > >==== KYJOHNSO Mailing List ==== >Comments or suggestions pertaining to this list may be sent to the listowner, Ann Lemaster-Applegate >annapplegate@maysvilleky.net >Visit the Johnson County Historical Society homepage: >http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyjchs/johnson.html > > > --My Hitchcock family Genealogy: http://www.netwalk.com/~hitch/ --My Hitchcock homepage on Family Tree Maker web site: http://www.familytreemaker.com/users/s/m/i/Marianne--Smith/ --Owner of the HITCHCOCK family emailing list on Rootsweb! __________________________________________ NetZero - Defenders of the Free World Get your FREE Internet Access and Email at http://www.netzero.net/download/index.html

In the Salyer book is there anything about Sarah Jane Salyers who married Andrew Justice?

Marianne: Thanks so much for your help. This is one of my "sidelines," but I like to get as much info as possible. You've helped a lot. Bud Caudle

Charlotte Rogers was the mother of Frederick Stambough. I found this on FamilySearch.com

Laurie, I'm a WEBB,and also PACKS are in my family line. Good Luck, Kate WEBB Mesner

Jim, I enjoyed the remarks about EASTERN KENTUCKY. When a person has been there, lived there, felt there, and stand taller because of it all, you know you have excelled. Furthermore, I feel sorry for those who didn't have an opportunity for the experience. Bob Kitchen

My mother moved me away from the WV/KY area when I was 4 years old to Orlando Fl. which has turned out to be a pretty big place. We always went back to visit once a year during spring break up until I married in 1977. I can remember comming home from our vacation and would giggle as I told my friends about my grandparents,aunts and uncles homes and land. Such as I remember being a little girl and if I had to go to the bathroom in the middle of the night I was not allowed to walk to the outhouse, instead I had to pee in the pee can (coffee can) Pappaw always said a bear would come out of the mountains and eat me up if I went out after dark! I remember that in order for me to take a bath it had to be a sponge bath because my grandparents had no inside bathroom. I remember my grandmother washing her clothes in a washing machine that had rollers on top, the clothes had to go through those 2 brown wooden bars. I remember wires hanging from her kitchen ceiling that they used for the lighting. I remember comming home from my vacations and my friends teasing me because I had picked up the talk and they would tell me that I was talking like a hillbilly. I remember my uncles comming home from work black from the coal and my aunts would all have an outside shower set up because they werent allowed in the house til they washed the coal off. These things are all funny and fasinating to me however never in a million years had I thought that it would be an insult to be called a hillbilly. I work in the tourisim industry and meet people from all over the world everyday, and I tell them all that I am an adopted Floridian, however I am really a hillbilly. And I say it with pride, as that is how I have always looked at it. My family from E.KY and Wva did not have thier home this way because they were poor, as a matter of fact they were always better off than we were, even though we had modern things much faster. Instead it seemed to me, from the eyes of a child that they choose to stay with this way longer because they werent intrested in changing the way they lived just because someone else did. Sherry

Good day fellow-listers, I don't often post to this list, but since we too have found ourselves in the midst of the "American Hollow" issue I must speak up. Although, I didn't watch the HBO presentation(deliberately), I have seen too many of it's type. I find it very sad that anyone would think this kind of trash is in anyway representative of myself and my neighbors. For those of you who have Eastern Kentucky roots, and aren't really sure what that means, I've copied from a Magoffin County site a speech given this past Founder's Day by one of Johnson County's leading and more knowledgeable citizens(speech follows this note). Mr. Wells is an American History professor at Prestonsburg Community College, and a local businessman. He has lived here all his life, and has raised his family here. His roots go to the very depth of Eastern Kentucky, as mine do. And as far as what this has to do with genealogy? Well, if you have roots here read on and you'll see. One last point, which is not to defend Ms. Applegate's use of the term "city suits", but to say that I agree with her. My understanding of this term is to mean "corporate" America, and in NO WAY is meant as a slur toward people who LIVE in bigger cities!!! I wasn't aware that this was a colloquial expression, particular to this area, but if it is -- well IT IS!!! I hope someone will let me know whether or not this expression is used like this in other parts of the country, because I always love to learn new things about my native land. Searching for Ball, Davis, Turner, Waller, Wyatt. Your Gen Friend, Joan Ball Williams MAGOFFIN CO. HISTORICAL SOCIETY SPEECH By John Britton Wells, III The late Harry M. Caudill of Letcher County is credited with writing the best historical overview of our East Kentucky mountains. His book, entitled NIGHT COMES TO THE CUMBERLANDS, stands as the most popular and most widely-read account of our region's settlement, culture, and eventual demise. According to Harry Caudill, our origins are, to say the least, quite modest, and I quote... "In the early days of the American experience, it was to the English orphans and debtor's prisons that labor hungry American planters turned. The English Parliament wanted to get rid of these social outcasts who so proliferated and burdened the respectable classes of England and a series of Parliamentary acts made it possible to transport street orphans, debtors and criminals to the New World, their transportation costs to be paid by the planters. Of course, these wretched outcasts were obliged by law to repay the generous planter with their labor -- usually for seven years. And so for decades there flowed from merry old England a raggle-taggle of humanity -- penniless workmen, pick pockets, thieves, and children of all ages. Not all were brought legally, some had been kidnapped for sale. "It is apparent that much human refuse, dumped on a strange shore was incapable of developing the kind of stable society under construction in the New World. (Most) ran away to the interior, to the rolling Piedmont, and thence to the dark foothills on the fringes of the Blue Ridge. And here we have the people -- few in number, but steadily gaining recruits, living under cliffs or in rude cabins -- who were the first to earn for themselves the title of "Southern Mountaineers." The Southern Mountaineer, his last name marks him indelibly as the son of a penniless laborer whose forebears had been simply serfs." Then, in this book and others, he lists some of the names of this low class HUMAN GARBAGE: Adams, Allen, Arnett, Bailey, Conley, Gullett, Howard, Preston, Shepherd, TO NAME A FEW, and, of course...he included the illustrious family of WELLS!! Caudill goes on to elaborate that our low beginnings explain our modern day lack of ambition, our laziness, our apathy, our violent nature, our ignorance, our isolation, and our poverty. This best selling account of East Kentucky's genesis upsets me greatly ...for two reasons. First, I don't particularly care for anyone calling my family "human refuse". Secondly, ...SECONDLY, with all due respect, Harry M. Caudill's entire thesis is one very large odoriferous pile of EQUINE EXCREMENT (HORSE MANURE). In my humble opinion Caudill's work is a demeaning attempt to explain away the modern social and economic conditions in Appalachia. I do not share his low opinion of us, but the problem he discusses IS very real. We as a people HAVE lost our identity, we HAVE lost our place in history! Somewhere along the line we have become convinced, by people such as Harry Caudill and many, many others, that we have no history, we have LITTLE to be proud of, nothing to recommend us...We have played no significant role in the formation of this wonderful country. And Caudill is not the only one. We hear it from almost every possible source. Any time we venture out of the mountains, the vicious hillbilly stereotype follows us. Sociologists contend that an individual's background is a very important part of his self-image. Who you are, your attitudes, your outlook, are affected deeply by where you've come from and those who came before you. In part, it explains why orphans and adoptees search for their biological roots...to help discover who they are and why they are the way they are. One prominent historian went so far as to speculate that "a people who do not understand their past...have no future". Fellow East Kentuckians, in many respects we are orphaned children. We have lost our past...and we are being told that there is nothing to re-discover. Our past is either very bad...or not there at all. That is why groups like the Magoffin County Historical Society, the Muzzleloaders and the Sons of the Confederate Veterans are so very, very important for the people of Magoffin County. WE ARE JUST AS GOOD...OR BETTER...THAN PEOPLE FROM ANYWHERE ELSE IN THIS COUNTRY. I remember vividly my first, hesitant ventures out of the mountains. I played football for Paintsville High School and eventually our success took us to Mt. Sterling and Covington and points west. The verbal insults we suffered are burned in my memory forever! "Hey, hillbilly, does the sunshine hurt your eyes?" "Got any moonshine with you? "Did you cash your welfare check to buy those shoes?" Just a few years ago, Paintsville won the State High School Basketball Championship. The Lexington crowd shouted insults, asking how things were up in "Mayberry" and "Aintsville." The hillbilly stereotype has been around since before the Civil War and it has been reinforced through embarrassing "hillbilly" jokes, movies like NEXT OF KIN, cartoons such as Snuffy Smith and Little Abner, and television shows MUDDY GUT and the BEVERLY HILLBILLIES. It has become so pervasive that many of us believe it ourselves. Isn't it a tad peculiar that we continue to be the only American minority that it is still politically correct to ridicule? Can you imagine a television show like the Beverly Hillbillies about any other American minority? Can you imagine for one second a show called the "Los Angeles Negroes? About poor, ignorant Blacks named Rufus, Rastus, and Jerome eating chittlins on the billiard table? NOT FOR ONE SECOND! Then, why is it O. K. to do it about us? Heck, we even do it to ourselves! We hold hillbilly festivals that ridicule ourselves! LET'S LOOK AT THE TRUTH ABOUT OUR HISTORY! The most of early settlers of East Kentucky were yeomen farmers who moved into these beautiful mountains after the Revolutionary War. The reason why so many came after the Revolutionary War is that most HAD HELPED WIN OUR AMERICAN INDEPENDENCE BY FIGHTING FOR IT!! They were soldiers and freedom fighters! In lieu of military pay hundreds of veterans accepted warrants for land "in the west", ...in the Kentucky mountains. These men were not thieves. They were not beggars. These men were warriors, ...heroes! They were at Valley Forge with George Washington. They fought at Saratoga, at King's Mountain, and Yorktown. They watched proudly as the British Gen. Cornwallis surrendered and our new nation was born. THEY WERE THERE. THEY MADE THIS COUNTRY! THEY WERE OUR ANCESTORS -- OUR HUMAN REFUSE! The 1840 U. S. Census reveals that the East Kentucky mountains contained one of the highest per capita percentages of Revolutionary veterans in the entire country. I think that bears repeating: In 1840 the population of East Kentucky contained more Revolutionary War veterans per capita than almost any other section of the country. These veterans represented good, honorable families of Europe...No, they were not noblemen (very few of the nobles ever came to America -- they had no reason to come). They were farmers and blacksmiths and artisans and ministers and millers. They were proud Scotsmen such as the Arnetts and Baileys who resisted English domination and were forced to leave their verdant glens and lochs. They were Northern Irish Protestants such as the Connelleys and Patricks who fled the sectarian violence that still plagues Belfast and Londonderry today. They were English and Welsh Quakers such as the Howards and Williams families, unable to worship freely in their mother country. They were German speaking Protestants such as the Wiremans fleeing religious persecution, many of whom Americanized their names to assimilate, such as the BUTCHERS of Butcher Holler, immortalized by Loretta Lynn, who were originally known as "Metzgers" or "butcher" in German. After arriving in East Kentucky they settled on scattered grants of land, often consisting of several hundred acres -- they developed good farms, in river bottoms, at the mouths of hollows, in wide valleys. The topography did not allow for dense population and therefore no large towns developed. But these people were NOT poverty-stricken and they were not ignorant as later writers would have you believe. The 1860 censuses of Magoffin, Johnson, and Floyd counties show that over 75% of the adult males could read and write. And they participated in every aspect of our nation's history. Fully 80% of the eligible voters voted....and when our nation went to war, our people fought for their beliefs in higher numbers than anywhere else in the nation. We sent two full companies of volunteers to fight in the War of 1812. The East Kentucky boys were feared by the British and their Indian allies. The commander of the American forces noted that "the mountaineers shoot quick...and they hit what they aim at. I'm glad to have them by my side in the fight". In the War Between the States, our area provided well over 4,000 soldiers to both sides. There were at least two hundred skirmishes and battles in the region, part of a vicious partisan warfare unequaled anywhere else in our nation! Slavery was not the major issue here. These were proud Americans who had different interpretations of our country's Constitution. DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS!! ...HILLBILLIES?? Wow! We dumb, ignorant mountain folk actually had interpretations!!! The 39th KY U. S. Infantry was formed largely of Big Sandy residents. The 14th KY U. S. Infantry, mountain boys all, served under Gen. Sherman in his "March to the Sea." The 10th KY Confederate Cavalry was in Gen. John Hunt Morgan's famous cavalry command, the unit in which Governor Patton's great-great grandfather served, ...and the 5th Kentucky Confederate Infantry in the famous Orphan Brigade were almost completely composed of Mountain boys, all willing to sacrifice all for their concept of "American freedom!" There were battles fought in Magoffin County. Can you name them? Do you know where they fought...or are they lost to history? In World War I, East Kentucky was the ONLY SECTION of the country where in some counties the military DRAFT was not needed. Why? Because our young men VOLUNTEERED in record numbers. We also experienced the highest casualty rates per capita in THE NATION...in WWI, WWII, and VIETNAM! Why this monument dedication today? Because mountain boys won American freedom for ALL Americans and have continued to protect it for over 200 years. It is high time that these heroes receive the honor they are due. That's why!! And we need to shout it from the hilltops! Our section of the country has produced a disproportionate number of military heroes, business leaders, movie stars, musicians, novelists, and artists. Butch Cassidy of "Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kids" traced his roots to Martin County. Francis Gary Powers, the U-2 pilot downed by the Russians, was born in Jenkins. And Heavyweight champ Jack Dempsey was from the Williamson area. Rosemary Clooney, John Boy (Richard Thomas) of the Waltons, Tommy Kirk of Old Yeller, Patricia Neal of my favorite movie "HUD", Ashley Judd, Johnny Depp are all East Kentuckians. Homer Robinson of Pike County was on the U. S. S. Oklahoma at Pearl Harbor. Heber Ward won the Congressional Medal of Honor after capturing 23 Germans single-handedly -- after being wounded in both hips. Frank Sousley, a marine from the Morehead area raised the American flag over Iwo Jima in World War II! Matthew Sellars of Carter County is documented as having accomplished the manned airplane flight over a year before the Wright Brothers. John Paul Riddle, the founder of American Airlines, was a Pike Countian. And then there's the myriad of music stars: Loretta Lynn, Tom T. Hall, Ricky Skaggs, Billy Ray Cyrus, Dwight Yocum, Crystal Gayle, the Judds, etc., etc., etc. We should be proud...but, the fact is that many are not!!! Primarily because most of our people do not know our own history. Our children know about Fort Harrod, My Old Kentucky Home, the Kentucky Derby, and the Bluegrass Horse Farms. But, folks, those places are NOT OUR Kentucky. The Bluegrass history is NOT our history. And if we wait until outsiders treat us fairly in published histories, we'll be waiting until "you know what" freezes over. How many of you are aware of your county's role in American history? How many of you are aware of your own family's role in our nation's history? How many of you even care? How many of you have passed on a pride of being from Magoffin County to your children? ... or have you told them to get out as fast as they can? It is time to rediscover what it means to be an East Kentuckian and groups like the Magoffin County Historical Society, the Muzzleloaders and the Sons of Confederate Veterans are leading us in the right direction, ...not for outsiders, but for US. With their help you will learn your REAL East Kentucky heritage...and Little Abner isn't here. Jed Clampett isn't here...but, YOUR ancestors and mine ARE here, and their stories are infinitely more interesting. Their military exploits are far more courageous than Hollywood's movies. As you study records, as you interview older residents, as you collect artifacts, books, and tall tales, you will come to know and love these special people ... and be proud ... perhaps for the first time. Let's crush the negative stereotype of our people ONCE AND FOR ALL and replace it with a NEW IMAGE---of a TOUGH, INDEPENDENT, PROUD MOUNTAIN PEOPLE -- GOD'S BEST HANDIWORK, who have continually volunteered to defend our country against all enemies. It is an awesome responsibility folks. You have in your hands the self-esteem of our people. Build it and share it with all of Magoffin County so they, too, can know ... and be proud. We can do no less for our children and our children's children.

February 22, 1852, in Johnson County, KY, Fredrick Stambough, 24, born Floyd Co, married Martha Lemaster, 18, born Floyd County. Fredrick's father was Samuel Stambough. Can someone please tell me who Fredrick's mother was? Martha's father was Lewis Lemaster. I believe the Lewis Lemaster, born 1792, son of Eleazer. Can someone tell me if I'm right, and if so, who Martha's mother was? Bud Caudle Guthrie, OK

BRAVO , Jim!!!!! Ann

I grew up being told that Ohio and Indiana sucked and the proof was without them Kentucky would fall down:/ Because of this I have always been thankful that the two were there. Having been in the hospitality industry in Kentucky where folks would come down from the North to enjoy our lakes and rivers, I can tell you that most respected our way of life and our lands. We are a more simple and directed people when compared to persons from other areas of this country. Drive down almost any road in any neighborhood or country lane and you will see clean ditches and mowed lawns. Our people can still laugh at the silly things we do without the useless posturing found elsewhere. I once had someone tell me they could tell by looking when they are in Kentucky. I asked how? The fellow from Indiana said: "When you see a $2,000.00 single wide trailer with a $600.00 pickup truck parked out front, a $21,000.00 bass boat on a trailer connected to that $600.00 truck and a 12 foot satellite dish in the front yard your in Kentucky." I thought about what he said for a moment, smiled and replied: "At least we have our priority's right!" We are taught an important lesson in life from our parents who learned the same lesson from our grandparents: Respect ourselves and others. From this we learned to respect each person for who they were and not for what they had. This is something that has been mostly lost elsewhere and tears at the very fabric of our country. When a people or persons try to attack what we don't have its only because they can no longer recognize what they themselves have lost, the ability to respect. I am not angry but rather feel sorry for those who can not see past a feeble attempt at journalism bordering on sensationalism. My family took out their first land grant in Kentucky when they arrived from VA in 1784. Like so many other families, they remained in KY for a little less than 100 years and then migrated to many other areas of America. I have been in contact with literally hundreds of my distant cousins since I began my genealogical studies into my family. The one common trait I recognizing is the respect I received from each of them. Each of them like myself are bred from a better people who had their beginnings in that beautiful sometimes rugged place called Eastern Kentucky. With Regards and Holiday Season Cheer, Jim Hawes SMcKenzi@aol.com wrote: > Alright, I can't stand it any longer without adding my 2 cents worth. I agree > with Bill that this discussion really is appropriate on a genealogy site. He > had a lot of good things to say. > > I completed a family book a couple of years ago for my mother's family (from > Nebraska). The poem below is on the first page of that book. I found it on a > website. The author is unknown. I still feel it is very appropriate: > > Our Ancestors > > If you could see your ancestors > All standing in a row, > > Would you be proud of them or not > Or don't you really know? > > Some strange discoveries are made > In climbing family trees, > > And some of them you know, do not > Particularly please. > > If you could see your ancestors > All standing in a row, > > There might be some of them perhaps > You wouldn't care to know. > > But there's another question, which > Requires a different view, > > If you could meet your ancestors > Would they be proud of YOU? > > Best wishes to all of you. > Sharon McKenzie > Born & raised in California > > ==== KYJOHNSO Mailing List ==== > Comments or suggestions pertaining to this list may be sent to the listowner, Ann Lemaster-Applegate > annapplegate@maysvilleky.net > Visit the Johnson County Historical Society homepage: > http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyjchs/johnson.html

Sharon, No one said that this subject was inappropriate for the list. It has everything to do with genealogy. I am simply tired of Eastern Kentuckians being degraded. And Bill, "city suits" was in reference to the executives and directors that scheme up these dreary little pieces. I said that in my earlier posting. No one said anything about the white collar workers. Read what I have written and do not look for hidden meanings or phrases between the lines. Again, I ask (as I asked earlier) , that comments be made by private e-mail. Ann

1900 Census Johnson County Kentuky Dist #2 household 21 Kestner, Merchant (H) July 1846 53M 22 Ky Va va Mahala (W) Sept 1854 46M Ky Ky Ky Thomas (S) Nov 1881 18S Ky Ky Ky Leward (S) Fen 1883 17S Ky Ky Ky Nora (D) May 1885 15S Ky Ky Ky Samuel (S) Feb 1887 13S Ky KY KY Morris (S) Feb 1889 11S Ky Ky Ky Myrtle (D) Feb 1891 9S Ky Ky Ky Carl (S) Mar 1892 8S Ky Ky Ky Oddie (D) Mar 1894 6S Ky Ky Ky Johnson County Marriages 10 Nov 1880 Merchant Kistner 34 2nd marriage to Mahala A Wheeler 26 September 2 1895 Walter Scott Kestner 20 to Ora Eta (Viers) Short adopted by Isaac & Manerva Jane (Cunningham) Short household 77 Butcher, Hiram H May 1877 23M 3 Ky Ky Ky Emma (W) May 1879 21M 3 1 1 Ky Ky Ky Virgie (D) Je 1898 1S Ky Ky Ky Househod 76 Butcher, Lewis (H) Mar 1847 53m 29 Ky Ky Ky Sarah (W) May 1858 42 M 29 6 5 Ky Ky Ky Leona (D) Oct 1884 15S Ky Ky Ky Mary (D) May 1890 10S Ky Ky Ky Laura (D) May 1891 9S KY Ky Ky Johnson Co Vital Statistics 17 May 1875 Hiram B Butcher son of Lewis Butcher and Sarah Hyden. Both parents born in Johnson County. 1880 Census Johnson Co Greasy Creek Precinct # 8 household 174 Kesner, Christopher 60 Va Va Va Louisa 30 wife Ky Va Va Melissa 6 Dau Ky Walter Scott 5 son Ky Samuel JT 3 son Ky Emma 1 dau ky 27 Apr 1872 Christopher C Kestner 51 2d marriage teacher Louisa Short 24 1st marriage Johnson co Vital Statistics 18 Oct Emma Kistner dau of C.C. Kistner and Mandy Short. Father was born in Va 1 Jan 1875 Walter S. Kestner son of Christopher Kestner, bon in Virginia and Louisa Short born in Johson Co Ky 28 Dec1876 Samuel J.T. Kestner son of Christopher Kestner born in Virginia and Louisa Short born in Johnson co Kentucky This was what I was able to find with the records that I have on hand. Hope that it helps Kayleene Lowe

I am new to this forum. I did not get to see the program, didn't need to. Have lived in a house with no bathroom. No hot water. No inside john. So what. With the y2k thing, they may have it over us "city folk" yet. I don't think the town I live in will let me dig a hole in the back yard, what do you think? Bonnie Williams, Spears, Carter, Salyers, and Wells Researcher (new to them, too)

>From a city "suit". Although I understand that the term "suit" is used perjoratively to identify those white collar persons of authority who can't poor piss out of a boot, I think that there are some of us who know what is really valuable in life. I believe I saw the documentary at issue (about coal miners and their families fighting for the basic elements of human dignity that we are entitled to as Americans), and it sent a message of courage, honor and pride to me. I, for one, am aware that "ignorance" is in the mind of the beholder who is conditioned to believe that those who dress, act or talk differently are than he are somehow lesser beings. People with true life experience who have weathered hardship and adversity and overcome them jus know the only ignorant people are those who fail to respect other human beings. I met my first Eastern Kentuckian when I was in the Army. He certainly fit the vision I had of a "hill billy." He was big, strong, tough, talked funny and, thank God, courageous. Now, he wasn't very good at reedin', and writin' and calculatin' weren't really his things either, but let me tell you, he was one of the guys I wanted at my backside in a fight. He not only was courageous, but had great common sense and was a natural soldier and leader. I value no person in my life greater than him. Nothing teaches real democracy and human decency and caring faster than a little foxhole time with your buddies - - ask anyone who has been there. I think one of the greates compliments I ever received is when he told me "You shot as good as most Kentucky boys. Hell, you shoot most good as me." (He was convinced that shooting straight was the most important things one could do, and was rightfully proud of his skill. I agree) Since those days of my youth I have found over and over that courage and dignity are not functions of how you dress, talk, eat, etc. They are places in your heart. I saw that kind of courage and dignity in the people shown in that HBO movie. I think they people repesent the values that make America great. I know that is what I fought for - - the right to live with dignity. How does this relate to genealogy? Well, you just don't know your roots till you know your roots. I discovered two years ago that I wasn't just a descendent of some Ozark hill billys, but Kentucky hill people, and Virginia hill people as well. When I first saw the facts, I thought back on that foxhole buddy of mine, and knew why I was a straight shooter - - and was and am darn proud of it. And thats all I have to say about that! Bill -----Original Message----- From: Ann Lemaster- Applegate [mailto:annapplegate@maysvilleky.net] Sent: Friday, December 03, 1999 11:19 AM To: KYJOHNSO-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: EASTERN KENTUCKY This list isn't country Vs. city. HBO aired documentaries on Eastern Ky that apparently made all of us Kentuckians look like we are too ignorant to work, live in shacks and survive on welfare and foodstamps. The "city suits" I referred to are the executives and directors that dream up these crazy documentaries in order to boost their ratings and make a buck or two at the expense of we Kentuckians. Please do not twist my words to make it appear I said something that I did not. If you have a reply to this, do so by private e-mail Ann Lemaster-Applegate annapplegate@maysvilleky.net ==== KYJOHNSO Mailing List ==== Comments or suggestions pertaining to this list may be sent to: annapplegate@maysvilleky.net Visit the Johnson County Historical Society homepage: http://www.rootsweb.com/~kyjchs/johnson.html

Leander Williams, b. 1870 Spanish Amer War Vet m. Agatha(Althaga?) Spears Child:Evert Wms.b. 1898 m. Cecile Quinn c.1922 Fought WWI(?) children:James E. and Frances Here is what I have been told and what I have found out. Leander went to the Spanish Amer. War. He married Agatha Spear. They resided in Morgan(?) Co. KY and then Pa. I know that in Pa. the Williams' have connnections to the following families, by their marriage to Quinns. Wells, Carters, Salyers Since I have looked in some of the Johnson country records, it became obvious to me that Johnson Co. might be a better place to look. I found an Althaga Spears who married a minister in 1854. I would be very interested in learning more about the Spears, Williams, Carters, Salyers in this county. The given name for a man in the Salyers line might be Purl, yes, Purl. For a man. There has been at least one in Pa. Wondering if someone made a mistake that carried on and that should have been Burl. Desperate for info, Bonnie Wms.

Ann, I couldn't have said it any better.I feel the same way.I think it is very degrading and if the truth be known they are probably from some holler too!!! Donna

Alright, I can't stand it any longer without adding my 2 cents worth. I agree with Bill that this discussion really is appropriate on a genealogy site. He had a lot of good things to say. I completed a family book a couple of years ago for my mother's family (from Nebraska). The poem below is on the first page of that book. I found it on a website. The author is unknown. I still feel it is very appropriate: Our Ancestors If you could see your ancestors All standing in a row, Would you be proud of them or not Or don't you really know? Some strange discoveries are made In climbing family trees, And some of them you know, do not Particularly please. If you could see your ancestors All standing in a row, There might be some of them perhaps You wouldn't care to know. But there's another question, which Requires a different view, If you could meet your ancestors Would they be proud of YOU? Best wishes to all of you. Sharon McKenzie Born & raised in California

Isn't that the saddest thing,that certain people lump all many of the Kentuckians the same. My WEBB family came from a line of Farmers,as was my dad in his younger days.Coal miners a few Uncles were killed in the 30's and 40's doing a dangerous job. Shall we mention our GG and Grandparents that had no running water or inside bathrooms,washed clothes after heating water on fire they had built,or the meat they had to slaughter to eat,and can to get by in the harsh winters.I have so much respect for my relatives and so many of the folks down through the years,and for all the hard working folks of today. God Bless America, Katw

try http://www.rootsweb.com/~kymagoff/ SassyMan