Sue, when you say that I will have to find a male descendent of a Kincaid, it would need to be a male descendent from male descendents, correct? i.e. my brother would not be able to do this because he is descended from our mother and grandmother before you get to a male Kincaid. I am understanding this correctly, I hope. It is pretty complicated, since my everyday?vocabularly before now has never included mitrochondrial or mtDNA vs. yDNA (and it's been over 20 years since college biology!!). Here's my problem. I have to go so far back before I find a male Kincaid connection. I was wondering if (within 4-5 generations) a DNA connection could prove a connection between my mom/uncle/or one of us kids and a male Kincaid within only 4-5 generations (maybe 3, depending on how you count them). I want to learn how I fit into this group. I want to learn what I can of my history further back. I'm not interested in 'sketching in' an ancestry, but it seems that some in this group have progressed beyond what most families will accept as likely 'proof' of relationship. One hundred years from now, when someone is looking at old 1990 and 2000 censuses and they see that my husband and I have 8 children living in my house (roughly 2 years apart in age), I hope that it will be 'assumed' that they are mine and my husband's children, unless there is reason to suspect that they are not). I understand that it could be that I've taken in another child, not my own, but normally that wou! ld not be the presumption. I am waiting on circumstances that might allow that someone somewhere might be able to attain a copy of James (of James and Polly Sanders) Kincaid's will or Thomas (of Thomas and Marena Siverly) Kincaid's will, in order to hopefully find my own documentation. I don't live in Illinois or have family there. So much wonderful research has been done, I would think that if these wills (at least James's)?could be found, they would have been published online by now by someone. So I'm concerned they don't even exist. I'm waiting on pins and needles for my gg grandfather's death certificate, although his wife would have been the reporting family member and I'm having to hope that she knew the names of her in-laws that would have been deceased for over 50 years (nearly a decade before she and my gg grandpa were even married and while he was still a minor), if they are the parents that the evidence (and quite a bit of it)?all points toward. If they aren't his parents, then I can only s! urmise that he just popped into existence. I expect that Alice Ann at least knew the name of her father-in-law. Alice Ann's father was named William and I believe George's father was named Thomas, and their oldest son, my g grandfather was named William Thomas (WT). Their second son was named Henry Harrison (Harrison being Alice Ann's maiden name). She seemed like the kind to name her children after people she knew. I only know that their daughter died young and was named M. Effie. No first name (although I do have a poem Alice Ann wrote to Effie after she died). I have begun to wonder if the M is for Marena (in honor of George's deceased mom).?I need to get her death certificate, but something makes me think that I already looked into that a few years back and was told it didn't exist (she died about 1885). I'll probably do that next week. I know the cemetery and city of Nickerson that oversees that cemetery?have no record of her death. Anyway, most in the group have been very supportive, but I feel like unless I tie in genetically I don't tie in. And I don't know how to do that from here. Thanks for explaining things, Sue... Debby . -----Original Message----- From: Sue Liedtke <seleaml@actionnet.net> To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Sent: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 4:14 pm Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report Debby, Your mitrochondrial DNA (mtDNA) comes from a long line of females (your brother has the same mtDNA as you have but his children do not). There is a surname change in every generation so it would not help you with any research on a specific surname. In my instance the surnames as far back as we can figure out are: Meiser, Dorris, Shields, Crowley, McIninch. We do not know the name of my ggg grandmother's mother so I have no idea what the next link is. Doing research using mtDNA is extremally problematic and can do little more than give you a general path to one of the large mtDNA groups. Interesting but not very useful. The closest I've come to any practical research use is a lady whose ancestress was adopted at a time and place that may (or may not) point to a connection with my ancestress born a McIninch. In order to be useful in research, DNA needs to be linked to that surname. This is accomplished by using yDNA which is passed from father to son along with the surname. If you want to further your Kincaid research by using DNA, you will have to find a male descendent of a Kincaid in your line. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: <gregndebbypotter@aol.com> To: <kincaid@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:58 AM Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > Thanks for the info... so doesn't it seem like a good idea (even with the > Kincaid project) to do the dna on women as well? Even if our probabilities > would take us back only half as far, we could still then be linked to some > male descendent, who can then be linked back further. I'm not arguing for > it, since I'm not sure that I would participate at this time anyway. But > it does seem that it would open more doors for those interested in their > Kincaid roots (at least for the 50% or whatever that descend from a > female). > > I've had a couple more Kincaids ask to join the group, but other than you > and Dick, who I have now on my personal facebook, I haven't made a lot of > connections through the group. I have, however, very much enjoyed getting > to know you two a little better!! :) I've thought about opening up a yahoo > e-mail account and setting up a secondary 'personal facebook' account that > would allow me to post comments and write on walls for other members that > do the same thing. Then I would just open up another tab on my internet > explorer and keep that e-mail open as well (since it's the e-mail that > tells you most of the activity that goes on in your facebook). It would > still be secure in that I would only post on that facebook pics and info > that I don't mind sharing with a crowd. :) > >>From my experience with my high school class group, which is doing very >>well, the group site itself is rarely used (it's the connections you make >>through it). I think facebook has a long way to go to make their group >>experiences more practical. I'll keep the group available, however, and >>hopefully some people are using it to make more personal connections. I'm >>a people person, so knowing someone is a probably 5th cousin, however many >>times removed, is not nearly as interesting to me as knowing the person. > > Later! > Debby > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Don W. Kincaid <donwkincaid@cox.net> > To: kincaid@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 12:35 pm > Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > > > Debby and others, > > There are many dna tests available however the Y dna paternal test is the > only > one that gets results that tell you within a few generations who you are > kin to > or at least the line. The next most popular test is the mt DNA maternal > test > which both guys and gals can take, however at best you only get a 50% > probability of a common ancestor at 50 generations back whereas with a 37 > of 37 > Y dna test you can get over 90% likelihood of a common ancestor in 12 or > less > generations. The best way to find and understand all the various dna tests > is to > go to Family Tree DNA's website and read the descriptions. If yo u or > anyone in > your family decides to do a dna test, be sure to do it through a group > like the > Kincaid Surname DNA Project instead of an individual test because there is > a > large differential in pricing. > > How is your Face book project going? > > Don > ----- Original Message ----- > From: gregndebbypotter@aol.com > To: kincaid@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 9:26 AM > Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > > Don, I was visiting with an ancestry.com customer service rep about my > ancestry membership and saw an advertisement for the dna testing. I asked > him if > only men were able to participate in those, and he told me that women > could too > (they just don't have as many markers to compare). I had understood from > our > group that only Kincaid men could participate in the dna project, so our > family > would have to go back to a gg grandfather in order to have participated. > Is that > by choice,?because you are going back so far? I still don't know that I > would be > interested in participating, but I would like to know what my options are. > > Thanks, Don.... > > Debby Potter > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Don W. Kincaid <donwkincaid@cox.net> > To: Kincaid Rootsweb List <kincaid@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 11:34 pm > Subject: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > > > 2008 involved lots of progress in the Kincaid DNA Project with 17 new Y > dna > participa > nts and a slew of upgrades plus several mt DNA tests and a variety of > > other advanced tests. We now have 9 different spellings of Kincaid > represented > > in the project, several countries and 8 non related Groups identified to > date. > > Sue has carried the big load of work for the administrative team and > deserves > many thanks for the considerable time she spent on the charts and vetting > process and lineage work in general.Ruth has provided invaluable advice > and > did > a fair share of the work while also serving as the Kincaid List > administrator. > > The many contributions by list members have been invaluable over the > years to > helping with lineage of our DNA participants. > > For the history buffs, I cajoled a time line out of Peter A. Kincaid who > started > off the Kincaid Surname DNA Project and served as the single > administrator for > > several years. It is as follows: > > Peter A. Kincaid timeline of Kincaid Surname DNA Project: > Heard of technology from a genealogy friend named Gertrude Urquhart > Sent message June 4, 2001 to Kincaid list and got great interest > Set web page on June 30, 2001 outlining project and addressing main > issue; > privacy > Had 13 people who initially agreed to participate. Put out call for > money > July > 15, 2001 > Ordered kits August 8, 2001 for nine participants as we had > stragglers/dropouts. > Sent 6 kits to Family Tree DNA on August 29, 2001 > Ordered three more September 3, 2001 > Ordered two more kits October 4, 2001 > Sent three kits to Family Tree DNA on October 5, 2001 > First 6 kits sent to lab by Family Tree DNA on October 13, 2001 > Sent 2 kits to Family Tree DNA on October 16, 2001 > Sent one kit to Family Tree DNA on November 5, 2001 > Results back for first 10 participants on November 22, 2001 > > We thank Peter for his foresight, time and expertise on the project and > appreciate his willingness to contribute valuable material and guidance. > > A while back I wrote to let you know about a reporter from the L.A. Times > who > wanted to d > o a story on > the Kincaid DNA project. The story appeared Sunday in > the L.A. Times. The link is: > > > http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-dnasurprise18-2009jan18,0,5045230.story > > The article is pretty good over all, but as a typical reporter, Alan > Zarembo > took a few liberties with his story. I am quoted as saying things I did > not > say > as he twisted some of my words. Some stories told to him by others > probably > should not have appeared in his article, but he included them for shock > value/interest. The headlines were atrocious! On a positive note, this > story > will hopefully increase the interest in DNA as it applies to a surname > project. > > One of the positive things is that Sunday afternoon a radio show producer > from > > New Zealand called asking for me to be interviewed on New Zealand radio > on > Sunday night so we did and are hoping to get at least one dna participant > from > > new Zealand. The producer did a phone search and found there were 17 > Kincaid's > > listed in New Zealand. We have also received emails from several folks > who > read > the story asking for further information so we gladly sent them a copy of > the > Kincaid DNA results chart done by Sue and gave the the link for the > Kincaid > DNA > Project. Several genealogy websites have put the story on their websites > with > the first I saw being Pasco County in Florida. Today I saw that is was > posted > on > a website for China! I also noticed it was posted on a MIT science weblog > and > with a comment that the headlines were bad. Thanks to those who talked to > the > reporter and helped do the story! > > We look forward to an even better 09! We welcome suggestions on ways to > improve > the Kincaid of all Spellings DNA Project. I will be attending the Family > Tree > DNA Conference in March in Houston, TX. We will also attend and display > the > Kincaid DNA results chart at The Gathering of the Clans in Scotland this > Summer > and look forward to the Kincaid Tour planned by Clan Kincaid in > cooperation > with > Arabella Kincaid of Kincaid who will > be our host and lead the 100 or so > Kincaid's on th > e march down the Royal Mile at the festivities. Joan Kincaid, > Dick Kinkead and others will also display the results chart at Highland > Games > in > Canada and the USA. Thanks to Dick Kinkead for printing another large DNA > chart > to be used for display in 2009! > > Yours aye, > > Don Kincaid > for the admin team > > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA c hart in Excel: > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the > body of > the message > > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > the message > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > the message > > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Debbie, is the James Kincaid your James? 1816       James Kincaid (born April 18, 1788) married Polly Sanders May 1, 1816 in Kentucky. Daughters of the American Revolution Research Library,    Washington D.C., Andrew Kinkead file. 1821       George W. Kincaid [1263] born to James Kincaid [1263] & Polly Sanders on Dec. 23, 1821 near Belleville, St. Clair County, IL. Geneseo Republic, Geneseo, Henry County, IL, March 21, 1902, p. 2.   Sincerely Norman Kincaide ----- Original Message ---- From: "gregndebbypotter@aol.com" <gregndebbypotter@aol.com> To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 4:54:45 PM Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report Sue, when you say that I will have to find a male descendent of a Kincaid, it would need to be a male descendent from male descendents, correct? i.e. my brother would not be able to do this because he is descended from our mother and grandmother before you get to a male Kincaid. I am understanding this correctly, I hope. It is pretty complicated, since my everyday?vocabularly before now has never included mitrochondrial or mtDNA vs. yDNA (and it's been over 20 years since college biology!!). Here's my problem. I have to go so far back before I find a male Kincaid connection. I was wondering if (within 4-5 generations) a DNA connection could prove a connection between my mom/uncle/or one of us kids and a male Kincaid within only 4-5 generations (maybe 3, depending on how you count them). I want to learn how I fit into this group. I want to learn what I can of my history further back. I'm not interested in 'sketching in' an ancestry, but it seems that some in this group have progressed beyond what most families will accept as likely 'proof' of relationship. One hundred years from now, when someone is looking at old 1990 and 2000 censuses and they see that my husband and I have 8 children living in my house (roughly 2 years apart in age), I hope that it will be 'assumed' that they are mine and my husband's children, unless there is reason to suspect that they are not). I understand that it could be that I've taken in another child, not my own, but normally that wou! ld not be the presumption. I am waiting on circumstances that might allow that someone somewhere might be able to attain a copy of James (of James and Polly Sanders) Kincaid's will or Thomas (of Thomas and Marena Siverly) Kincaid's will, in order to hopefully find my own documentation. I don't live in Illinois or have family there. So much wonderful research has been done, I would think that if these wills (at least James's)?could be found, they would have been published online by now by someone. So I'm concerned they don't even exist. I'm waiting on pins and needles for my gg grandfather's death certificate, although his wife would have been the reporting family member and I'm having to hope that she knew the names of her in-laws that would have been deceased for over 50 years (nearly a decade before she and my gg grandpa were even married and while he was still a minor), if they are the parents that the evidence (and quite a bit of it)?all points toward. If they aren't his parents, then I can only s! urmise that he just popped into existence. I expect that Alice Ann at least knew the name of her father-in-law. Alice Ann's father was named William and I believe George's father was named Thomas, and their oldest son, my g grandfather was named William Thomas (WT). Their second son was named Henry Harrison (Harrison being Alice Ann's maiden name). She seemed like the kind to name her children after people she knew. I only know that their daughter died young and was named M. Effie. No first name (although I do have a poem Alice Ann wrote to Effie after she died). I have begun to wonder if the M is for Marena (in honor of George's deceased mom).?I need to get her death certificate, but something makes me think that I already looked into that a few years back and was told it didn't exist (she died about 1885). I'll probably do that next week. I know the cemetery and city of Nickerson that oversees that cemetery?have no record of her death. Anyway, most in the group have been very supportive, but I feel like unless I tie in genetically I don't tie in. And I don't know how to do that from here. Thanks for explaining things, Sue... Debby . -----Original Message----- From: Sue Liedtke <seleaml@actionnet.net> To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Sent: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 4:14 pm Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report Debby, Your mitrochondrial DNA (mtDNA) comes from a long line of females (your brother has the same mtDNA as you have but his children do not). There is a surname change in every generation so it would not help you with any research on a specific surname. In my instance the surnames as far back as we can figure out are: Meiser, Dorris, Shields, Crowley, McIninch. We do not know the name of my ggg grandmother's mother so I have no idea what the next link is. Doing research using mtDNA is extremally problematic and can do little more than give you a general path to one of the large mtDNA groups. Interesting but not very useful. The closest I've come to any practical research use is a lady whose ancestress was adopted at a time and place that may (or may not) point to a connection with my ancestress born a McIninch. In order to be useful in research, DNA needs to be linked to that surname. This is accomplished by using yDNA which is passed from father to son along with the surname. If you want to further your Kincaid research by using DNA, you will have to find a male descendent of a Kincaid in your line. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: <gregndebbypotter@aol.com> To: <kincaid@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:58 AM Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > Thanks for the info... so doesn't it seem like a good idea (even with the > Kincaid project) to do the dna on women as well? Even if our probabilities > would take us back only half as far, we could still then be linked to some > male descendent, who can then be linked back further. I'm not arguing for > it, since I'm not sure that I would participate at this time anyway. But > it does seem that it would open more doors for those interested in their > Kincaid roots (at least for the 50% or whatever that descend from a > female). > > I've had a couple more Kincaids ask to join the group, but other than you > and Dick, who I have now on my personal facebook, I haven't made a lot of > connections through the group. I have, however, very much enjoyed getting > to know you two a little better!! :) I've thought about opening up a yahoo > e-mail account and setting up a secondary 'personal facebook' account that > would allow me to post comments and write on walls for other members that > do the same thing. Then I would just open up another tab on my internet > explorer and keep that e-mail open as well (since it's the e-mail that > tells you most of the activity that goes on in your facebook). It would > still be secure in that I would only post on that facebook pics and info > that I don't mind sharing with a crowd. :) > >>From my experience with my high school class group, which is doing very >>well, the group site itself is rarely used (it's the connections you make >>through it). I think facebook has a long way to go to make their group >>experiences more practical. I'll keep the group available, however, and >>hopefully some people are using it to make more personal connections. I'm >>a people person, so knowing someone is a probably 5th cousin, however many >>times removed, is not nearly as interesting to me as knowing the person. > > Later! > Debby > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Don W. Kincaid <donwkincaid@cox.net> > To: kincaid@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 12:35 pm > Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > > > Debby and others, > > There are many dna tests available however the Y dna paternal test is the > only > one that gets results that tell you within a few generations who you are > kin to > or at least the line. The next most popular test is the mt DNA maternal > test > which both guys and gals can take, however at best you only get a 50% > probability of a common ancestor at 50 generations back whereas with a 37 > of 37 > Y dna test you can get over 90% likelihood of a common ancestor in 12 or > less > generations. The best way to find and understand all the various dna tests > is to > go to Family Tree DNA's website and read the descriptions. If yo u or > anyone in > your family decides to do a dna test, be sure to do it through a group > like the > Kincaid Surname DNA Project instead of an individual test because there is > a > large differential in pricing. > > How is your Face book project going? > > Don >  ----- Original Message ----- >  From: gregndebbypotter@aol.com >  To: kincaid@rootsweb.com >  Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 9:26 AM >  Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > >  Don, I was visiting with an ancestry.com customer service rep about my > ancestry membership and saw an advertisement for the dna testing. I asked > him if > only men were able to participate in those, and he told me that women > could too > (they just don't have as many markers to compare). I had understood from > our > group that only Kincaid men could participate in the dna project, so our > family > would have to go back to a gg grandfather in order to have participated. > Is that > by choice,?because you are going back so far? I still don't know that I > would be > interested in participating, but I would like to know what my options are. > >  Thanks, Don.... > >  Debby Potter > > >  -----Original Message----- >  From: Don W. Kincaid <donwkincaid@cox.net> >  To: Kincaid Rootsweb List <kincaid@rootsweb.com> >  Sent: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 11:34 pm >  Subject: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > > >  2008 involved lots of progress in the Kincaid DNA Project with 17 new Y > dna >  participa > nts and a slew of upgrades plus several mt DNA tests and a variety of > >  other advanced tests. We now have 9 different spellings of Kincaid > represented > >  in the project, several countries and 8 non related Groups identified to > date. > >  Sue has carried the big load of work for the administrative team and > deserves >  many thanks for the considerable time she spent on the charts and vetting >  process and lineage work in general.Ruth has provided invaluable advice > and > did >  a fair share of the work while also serving as the Kincaid List > administrator. > >  The many contributions by list members have been invaluable over the > years to >  helping with lineage of our DNA participants. > >  For the history buffs, I cajoled a time line out of Peter A. Kincaid who > started >  off the Kincaid Surname DNA Project and served as the single > administrator for > >  several years. It is as follows: > >  Peter A. Kincaid timeline of Kincaid Surname DNA Project: >  Heard of technology from a genealogy friend named Gertrude Urquhart >  Sent message June 4, 2001 to Kincaid list and got great interest >  Set web page on June 30, 2001 outlining project and addressing main > issue; >  privacy >  Had 13 people who initially agreed to participate.  Put out call for > money > July >  15, 2001 >  Ordered kits August 8, 2001 for nine participants as we had > stragglers/dropouts. >  Sent 6 kits to Family Tree DNA on August 29, 2001 >  Ordered three more September 3, 2001 >  Ordered two more kits October 4, 2001 >  Sent three kits to Family Tree DNA on October 5, 2001 >  First 6 kits sent to lab by Family Tree DNA on October 13, 2001 >  Sent 2 kits to Family Tree DNA on October 16, 2001 >  Sent one kit to Family Tree DNA on November 5, 2001 >  Results back for first 10 participants on November 22, 2001 > >  We thank Peter for his foresight, time and expertise on the project and >  appreciate his willingness to contribute valuable material and guidance. > >  A while back I wrote to let you know about a reporter from the L.A. Times > who >  wanted to d >  o a story on > the Kincaid DNA project. The story appeared Sunday in >  the L.A. Times. The link is: > > > http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-dnasurprise18-2009jan18,0,5045230.story > >  The article is pretty good over all, but as a typical reporter, Alan > Zarembo >  took a few liberties with his story. I am quoted as saying things I did > not > say >  as he twisted some of my words. Some stories told to him by others > probably >  should not have appeared in his article, but he included them for shock >   value/interest. The headlines were atrocious! On a positive note, this > story >  will hopefully increase the interest in DNA as it applies to a surname > project. > >  One of the positive things is that Sunday afternoon a radio show producer > from > >  New Zealand called asking for me to be interviewed on New Zealand radio > on >  Sunday night so we did and are hoping to get at least one dna participant > from > >  new Zealand. The producer did a phone search and found there were 17 > Kincaid's > >  listed in New Zealand. We have also received emails from several folks > who > read >  the story asking for further information so we gladly sent them a copy of > the >  Kincaid DNA results chart done by Sue and gave the the link for the > Kincaid > DNA >  Project. Several genealogy websites have put the story on their websites > with >  the first I saw being Pasco County in Florida. Today I saw that is was > posted > on >  a website for China! I also noticed it was posted on a MIT science weblog > and >  with a comment that the headlines were bad. Thanks to those who talked to > the >  reporter and helped do the story! > >  We look forward to an even better 09! We welcome suggestions on ways to > improve >  the Kincaid of all Spellings DNA Project. I will be attending the Family > Tree >  DNA Conference in March in Houston, TX. We will also attend and display > the >  Kincaid DNA results chart at The Gathering of the Clans in Scotland this > Summer >  and look forward to the Kincaid Tour planned by Clan Kincaid in > cooperation > with >  Arabella Kincaid of Kincaid who will > be our host and lead the 100 or so >  Kincaid's on th >  e march down the Royal Mile at the festivities. Joan Kincaid, >  Dick Kinkead and others will also display the results chart at Highland > Games > in >  Canada and the USA. Thanks to Dick Kinkead for printing another large DNA > chart >  to be used for display in 2009! > >  Yours aye, > >  Don Kincaid >  for the admin team > >  To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA c hart in Excel: > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > >  ------------------------------- >  To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > >  with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the > body of >  the message > >  To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > >  ------------------------------- >  To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > the message > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > the message > > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Norman, I'm working on the documentation. I researched back to Thomas and Marena. Short of a will written by Thomas or DNA evidence, I am convinced I have very good documentation tying George F. Kincaid to Thomas and Marena Kincaid (1850, 1860, 1880, 1910, 1920 federal censuses, 1865 Illinois State census, and the1875 Kansas State census). I'm waiting on George's death certificate. Thomas, I believe, is the eldest son of James and Polly Kincaid. To support this, I have the?Illinois land purchase by James Kincaid (Mercer county, Richland Township) and subsequent 2 land purchases by Thomas S. Kincaid in 1852/53 "across the street"?(after showing up 'next door' to James on 1850 census, prior to his personal land purchase, implying he came with James, although technically it just shows that he lives in the same township and section "next door," which I guess could be a neighboring farm or the land that he planned to purchase in 2-3 years, but I don't think that rules out a close relationship between Thomas and James and heavily suspected father/son relationship). I also have the 1830 federal census for Greene County Ill.?showing a James Kincaid that is correctly matched to Polly by age and does not conflict with known children, including Thomas S.?(although I do have 'unnamed tally marks"). There is another James Kincaid that lands in Menard County that ha! s a family very similar to James and Polly Kincaid, but they are somewhat easily discerned by the difference in age of the Jameses. The wives are in the same age group. The James Kincaid shows up in the 1840 federal census for Mercer County, Ill. Again, these tally marks line up with the 1830 tally marks (named and unnamed). Also this ties together with James Kincaid's land purchase there in Nov. 1841 to "James Kincaid of Mercer County." Also, James and Polly are buried along with Thomas S. and Marena Kincaid at Glennwood cemetery. All this said, it appears that a number of Kincaids already believe there is sufficient documentation to tie these two together as father and son, but I lack further documentation than this. I have one unnamed tally mark that would correlate to your George W. Kincaid. Your information on him may help me research that family more closely. Do you have a birth or death certificate that ties George to James. Thomas and Marena (and Eliza) all die within 10 years of James and Polly, leaving a few minor aged orphans. Would you have any indication where these children might have gone? I would think they would be moved to live with aunts and uncles. Did George W. have any children show up on the 1870 census that weren't there prior? Here's what I would have come up with from my research on James and Polly's children (keeping in mind James and Polly were married in 1816, I wouldn't think any children came before 1817): Thomas b. 1818 (Aug. according to cemetery records) one female b. about 1815-1820 one female and one male b. between 1821 to 1825 one female b. 1825-1828 Oliver b. ~1828 Franklin b. ~1830 If your George is the other boy b. between 1821 and 1825?(which fits), then Thomas and George would have been brothers. Do you have documentation to disprove this, because I would be interested in what it is. Thank you, Debby -----Original Message----- From: Norman Kincaide <norman.kincaide@yahoo.com> To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Sent: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 6:01 pm Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report Dear Debbie, is the James Kincaid your James? I don't know....I don't know why not either... 1816?????? James Kincaid (born April 18, 1788) married Polly Sanders May 1, 1816 in Kentucky. Daughters of the American Revolution Research Library, ?? Washington D.C., Andrew Kinkead file. 1821?????? George W. Kincaid [1263] born to James Kincaid [1263] & Polly Sanders on Dec. 23, 1821 near Belleville, St. Clair County, IL.?Geneseo Republic, Geneseo, Henry County, IL, March 21, 1902, p. 2. ? Sincerely Norman Kincaide ----- Original Message ---- From: "gregndebbypotter@aol.com" <gregndebbypotter@aol.com> To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 4:54:45 PM Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report Sue, when you say that I will have to find a male descendent of a Kincaid, it would need to be a male descendent from male descendents, correct? i.e. my brother would not be able to do this because he is descended from our mother and grandmother before you get to a male Kincaid. I am understanding this correctly, I hope. It is pretty complicated, since my everyday?vocabularly before now has never included mitrochondrial or mtDNA vs. yDNA (and it's been over 20 years since college biology!!). Here's my problem. I have to go so far back before I find a male Kincaid connection. I was wondering if (within 4-5 generations) a DNA connection could prove a connection between my mom/uncle/or one of us kids and a male Kincaid within only 4-5 generations (maybe 3, depending on how you count them). I want to learn how I fit into this group. I want to learn what I can of my history further back. I'm not interested in 'sketching in' an ancestry, but it seems that some in this group have progressed beyond what most families will accept as likely 'proof' of relationship. One hundred years from now, when someone is looking at old 1990 and 2000 censuses and they see that my husband and I have 8 children living in my house (roughly 2 years apart in age), I hope that it will be 'assumed' that th ey are mine and my husband's children, unless there is reason to suspect that they are not). I understand that it could be that I've taken in another child, not my own, but normally that wou! ld not be the presumption. I am waiting on circumstances that might allow that someone somewhere might be able to attain a copy of James (of James and Polly Sanders) Kincaid's will or Thomas (of Thomas and Marena Siverly) Kincaid's will, in order to hopefully find my own documentation. I don't live in Illinois or have family there. So much wonderful research has been done, I would think that if these wills (at least James's)?could be found, they would have been published online by now by someone. So I'm concerned they don't even exist. I'm waiting on pins and needles for my gg grandfather's death certificate, although his wife would have been the reporting family member and I'm having to hope that she knew the names of her in-laws that would have been deceased for over 50 years (nearly a decade before she and my gg grandpa were even married and while he was still a minor), if they are the parents that the evidence (and quite a bit of it)?all points toward. If they aren't his parents, then I can only s! urmise that he just popped into existence. I expect that Alice Ann at least knew the name of her father-in-law. Alice Ann's father was named William and I believe George's father was named Thomas, and their oldest son, my g grandfather was named William Thomas (WT). Their second son was named Henry Harrison (Harrison being Alice Ann's maiden name). She seemed like the kind to name her children after people she knew. I only know that their daughter died young and was named M. Effie. No first name (although I do have a poem Alice Ann wrote to Effie after she died). I have begun to wonder if the M is for Marena (in honor of George's deceased mom).?I need to get her death certificate, but something makes me think that I already looked into that a few years back and was told it didn't exist (she died abo ut 1885). I'll probably do that next week. I know the cemetery and city of Nickerson that oversees that cemetery?have no record of her death. Anyway, most in the group have been very supportive, but I feel like unless I tie in genetically I don't tie in. And I don't know how to do that from here. Thanks for explaining things, Sue... Debby . -----Original Message----- From: Sue Liedtke <seleaml@actionnet.net> To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Sent: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 4:14 pm Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report Debby, Your mitrochondrial DNA (mtDNA) comes from a long line of females (your brother has the same mtDNA as you have but his children do not). There is a surname change in every generation so it would not help you with any research on a specific surname. In my instance the surnames as far back as we can figure out are: Meiser, Dorris, Shields, Crowley, McIninch. We do not know the name of my ggg grandmother's mother so I have no idea what the next link is. Doing research using mtDNA is extremally problematic and can do little more than give you a general path to one of the large mtDNA groups. Interesting but not very useful. The closest I've come to any practical research use is a lady whose ancestress was adopted at a time and place that may (or may not) point to a connection with my ancestress born a McIninch. In order to be useful in research, DNA needs to be linked to that surname. This is accomplished by using yDNA which is passed from father to son along with the surname. If you want to further your Kincaid research by using DNA, you will have to find a male descendent of a Kincaid in your line. Sue ----- Original Message ----- From: <gregndebbypotter@aol.com> To: <kincaid@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 10:58 AM Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > Thanks for the info... so doesn't it seem like a good idea (even with the > Kincaid project) to do the dna on women as well? Even if our probabilities > would take us back only half as far, we could still then be linked to some > male descendent, who can then be linked back further. I'm not arguing for > it, since I'm not sure that I would participate at this time anyway. But > it does seem that it would open more doors for those interested in their > Kincaid roots (at least for the 50% or whatever that descend from a > female). > > I've had a couple more Kincaids ask to join the group, but other than you > and Dick, who I have now on my personal facebook, I haven't made a lot of > connections through the group. I have, however, very much enjoyed getting > to know you two a little better!! :) I've thought about opening up a yahoo > e-mail account and setting up a secondary 'personal facebook' account that > would allow me to post comments and write on walls for other members that > do the same thing. Then I would just open up another tab on my internet > explorer and keep that e-mail open as well (since it's the e-mail that > tells you most of the activity that goes on in your facebook). It would > still be secure in that I would only post on that facebook pics and info > that I don't mind sharing with a crowd. :) > >>From my experience with my high school class group, which is doing very >>well, the group site itself is rarely used (it's the connections you make >>through it). I think facebook has a long way to go to make their group >>experiences more practical. I'll keep the group available, however, and >>hopefully some people are using it to make more personal connections. I'm >>a people person, so knowing someone is a probably 5th cousin, however many >>times removed, is not nearly as interesting to me as knowing the person. > > Later! > Debby > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Don W. Kincaid <donwkincaid@cox.net> > To: kincaid@rootsweb.com > Sent: Thu, 22 Jan 2009 12:35 pm > Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > > > Debby and others, > > There are many dna tests available however the Y dna paternal test is the > only > one that gets results that tell you within a few generations who you are > kin to > or at least the line. The next most popular test is the mt DNA maternal > test > which both guys and gals can take, however at best you only get a 50% > probability of a common ancestor at 50 generations back whereas with a 37 > of 37 > Y dna test you can get over 90% likelihood of a common ancestor in 12 or > less > generations. The best way to find and understand all the various dna tests > is to > go to Family Tree DNA's website and read the descriptions. If yo u or > anyone in > your family decides to do a dna test, be sure to do it through a group > like the > Kincaid Surname DNA Project instead of an individual test because there is > a > large differential in pricing. > > How is your Face book project going? > > Don >? ----- Original Message ----- >? From: gregndebbypotter@aol.com >? To: kincaid@rootsweb.com >? Sent: Thursday, January 22, 2009 9:26 AM >? Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > >? Don, I was visiting with an ancestry.com customer service rep about my > ancestry membership and saw an advertisement for the dna testing. I asked > him if > only men were able to participate in those, and he told me that women > could too > (they just don't have as many markers to compare). I had understood from > our > group that only Kincaid men could participate in the dna project, so our > family > would have to go back to a gg grandfather in order to have participated. > Is that > by choice,?because you are going back so far? I still don't know that I > would be > interested in participating, but I would like to know what my options are. > >? Thanks, Don.... > >? Debby Potter > > >? -----Original Message----- >? From: Don W. Kincaid <donwkincaid@cox.net> >? To: Kincaid Rootsweb List <kincaid@rootsweb.com> >? Sent: Wed, 21 Jan 2009 11:34 pm >? Subject: [KINCAID] Kincaid DNA Project report > > > >? 2008 involved lots of progress in the Kincaid DNA Project with 17 new Y > dna >? participa > nts and a slew of upgrades plus se veral mt DNA tests and a variety of > >? other advanced tests. We now have 9 different spellings of Kincaid > represented > >? in the project, several countries and 8 non related Groups identified to > date. > >? Sue has carried the big load of work for the administrative team and > deserves >? many thanks for the considerable time she spent on the charts and vetting >? process and lineage work in general.Ruth has provided invaluable advice > and > did >? a fair share of the work while also serving as the Kincaid List > administrator. > >? The many contributions by list members have been invaluable over the > years to >? helping with lineage of our DNA participants. > >? For the history buffs, I cajoled a time line out of Peter A. Kincaid who > started >? off the Kincaid Surname DNA Project and served as the single > administrator for > >? several years. It is as follows: > >? Peter A. Kincaid timeline of Kincaid Surname DNA Project: >? Heard of technology from a genealogy friend named Gertrude Urquhart >? Sent message June 4, 2001 to Kincaid list and got great interest >? Set web page on June 30, 2001 outlining project and addressing main > issue; >? privacy >? Had 13 people who initially agreed to participate.? Put out call for > money > July >? 15, 2001 >? Ordered kits August 8, 2001 for nine participants as we had > stragglers/dropouts. >? Sent 6 kits to Family Tree DNA on August 29, 2001 >? Ordered three more September 3, 2001 >? Ordered two more kits October 4, 2001 >? Sent three kits to Family Tree DNA on October 5, 2001 >? First 6 kits sent to lab by Family Tree DNA on October 13, 2001 >? Sent 2 kits to Family Tree DNA on October 16, 2001 >? Sent one kit to Family Tree DNA on November 5, 2001 >? Results back for first 10 participants on November 22, 2001 > >? We thank Peter for his foresight, time and expertise on the project and >? appreciate his willingness to contribute valuable material and guidance. > >? A while back I wrote to let you know about a reporter from the L.A. Times > who >? wa nted to d >? o a story on > the Kincaid DNA project. The story appeared Sunday in >? the L.A. Times. The link is: > > > http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-dnasurprise18-2009jan18,0,5045230.story > >? The article is pretty good over all, but as a typical reporter, Alan > Zarembo >? took a few liberties with his story. I am quoted as saying things I did > not > say >? as he twisted some of my words. Some stories told to him by others > probably >? should not have appeared in his article, but he included them for shock > ? value/interest. The headlines were atrocious! On a positive note, this > story >? will hopefully increase the interest in DNA as it applies to a surname > project. > >? One of the positive things is that Sunday afternoon a radio show producer > from > >? New Zealand called asking for me to be interviewed on New Zealand radio > on >? Sunday night so we did and are hoping to get at least one dna participant > from > >? new Zealand. The producer did a phone search and found there were 17 > Kincaid's > >? listed in New Zealand. We have also received emails from several folks > who > read >? the story asking for further information so we gladly sent them a copy of > the >? Kincaid DNA results chart done by Sue and gave the the link for the > Kincaid > DNA >? Project. Several genealogy websites have put the story on their websites > with >? the first I saw being Pasco County in Florida. Today I saw that is was > posted > on >? a website for China! I also noticed it was posted on a MIT science weblog > and >? with a comment that the headlines were bad. Thanks to those who talked to > the >? reporter and helped do the story! > >? We look forward to an even better 09! We welcome suggestions on ways to > improve >? the Kincaid of all Spellings DNA Project. I will be attending the Family > Tree >? DNA Conference in March in Houston, TX. We will also attend and display > the >? Kincaid DNA results chart at The Gathering of the Clans in Scotland this > Summer >? and look forward to the Kincaid Tour planned by Clan Kincaid in > cooperation > with >? Arabella Kincaid of Kincaid who will > be our host and lead the 100 or so >? Kincaid's on th >? e march down the Royal Mile at the festivities. Joan Kincaid, >? Dick Kinkead and others will also display the results chart at Highland > Games > in >? Canada and the USA. Thanks to Dick Kinkead for printing another large DNA > chart >? to be used for display in 2009! > >? Yours aye, > >? Don Kincaid >? for the admin team > >? To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA c hart in Excel: > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > >? ------------------------------- >? To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > >? with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the > body of >? the message > >? To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > >? ------------------------------- >? To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > the message > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > the message > > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message