I just finished reading about a sad bad time in history. A surname newsletter mentioned it and provided a link to it. The rounding up and selling of Irish citizens reduced the population of Ireland dramatically. For those whose lineage comes through Ireland, slavery could be a big detriment to finding records of ancestors. None of the history courses I had in school or university ever mentioned the Irish Slave Trade so it may be news to some of you as well. Don The Irish Slave Trade – The Forgotten “White” Slaves They came as slaves; vast human cargo transported on tall British ships bound for the Americas. They were shipped by the hundreds of thousands and included men, women, and even the youngest of children. Whenever they rebelled or even disobeyed an order, they were punished in the harshest ways. Slave owners would hang their human property by their hands and set their hands or feet on fire as one form of punishment. They were burned alive and had their heads placed on pikes in the marketplace as a warning to other captives. We don’t really need to go through all of the gory details, do we? We know all too well the atrocities of the African slave trade. But, are we talking about African slavery? King James II and Charles I also led a continued effort to enslave the Irish. Britain’s famed Oliver Cromwell furthered this practice of dehumanizing one’s next door neighbor. The Irish slave trade began when James II sold 30,000 Irish prisoners as slaves to the New World. His Proclamation of 1625 required Irish political prisoners be sent overseas and sold to English settlers in the West Indies. By the mid 1600s, the Irish were the main slaves sold to Antigua and Montserrat. At that time, 70% of the total population of Montserrat were Irish slaves. Ireland quickly became the biggest source of human livestock for English merchants. The majority of the early slaves to the New World were actually white. >From 1641 to 1652, over 500,000 Irish were killed by the English and another 300,000 were sold as slaves. Ireland’s population fell from about 1,500,000 to 600,000 in one single decade. Families were ripped apart as the British did not allow Irish dads to take their wives and children with them across the Atlantic. This led to a helpless population of homeless women and children. Britain’s solution was to auction them off as well. During the 1650s, over 100,000 Irish children between the ages of 10 and 14 were taken from their parents and sold as slaves in the West Indies, Virginia and New England. In this decade, 52,000 Irish (mostly women and children) were sold to Barbados and Virginia. Another 30,000 Irish men and women were also transported and sold to the highest bidder. In 1656, Cromwell ordered that 2000 Irish children be taken to Jamaica and sold as slaves to English settlers. Many people today will avoid calling the Irish slaves what they truly were: Slaves. They’ll come up with terms like “Indentured Servants” to describe what occurred to the Irish. However, in most cases from the 17th and 18th centuries, Irish slaves were nothing more than human cattle. As an example, the African slave trade was just beginning during this same period. It is well recorded that African slaves, not tainted with the stain of the hated Catholic theology and more expensive to purchase, were often treated far better than their Irish counterparts. African slaves were very expensive during the late 1600s (50 Sterling). Irish slaves came cheap (no more than 5 Sterling). If a planter whipped or branded or beat an Irish slave to death, it was never a crime. A death was a monetary setback, but far cheaper than killing a more expensive African. The English masters quickly began breeding the Irish women for both their own personal pleasure and for greater profit. Children of slaves were themselves slaves, which increased the size of the master’s free workforce. Even if an Irish woman somehow obtained her freedom, her kids would remain slaves of her master. Thus, Irish moms, even with this new found emancipation, would seldom abandon their kids and would remain in servitude. In time, the English thought of a better way to use these women (in many cases, girls as young as 12) to increase their market share: The settlers began to breed Irish women and girls with African men to produce slaves with a distinct complexion. These new “mulatto” slaves brought a higher price than Irish livestock and, likewise, enabled the settlers to save money rather than purchase new African slaves. This practice of interbreeding Irish females with African men went on for several decades and was so widespread that, in 1681, legislation was passed “forbidding the practice of mating Irish slave women to African slave men for the purpose of producing slaves for sale.” In short, it was stopped only because it interfered with the profits of a large slave transport company. England continued to ship tens of thousands of Irish slaves for more than a century. Records state that, after the 1798 Irish Rebellion, thousands of Irish slaves were sold to both America and Australia. There were horrible abuses of both African and Irish captives. One British ship even dumped 1,302 slaves into the Atlantic Ocean so that the crew would have plenty of food to eat. There is little question that the Irish experienced the horrors of slavery as much (if not more in the 17th Century) as the Africans did. There is, also, very little question that those brown, tanned faces you witness in your travels to the West Indies are very likely a combination of African and Irish ancestry. In 1839, Britain finally decided on it’s own to end it’s participation in Satan’s highway to hell and stopped transporting slaves. While their decision did not stop pirates from doing what they desired, the new law slowly concluded THIS chapter of nightmarish Irish misery. But, if anyone, black or white, believes that slavery was only an African experience, then they’ve got it completely wrong. Irish slavery is a subject worth remembering, not erasing from our memories. But, where are our public (and PRIVATE) schools???? Where are the history books? Why is it so seldom discussed? Do the memories of hundreds of thousands of Irish victims merit more than a mention from an unknown writer? Or is their story to be one that their English pirates intended: To (unlike the African book) have the Irish story utterly and completely disappear as if it never happened. None of the Irish victims ever made it back to their homeland to describe their ordeal. These are the lost slaves; the ones that time and biased history books conveniently forgot.

Thank you, Don, for sending me the letters and transcripts. It appears to me, based on the few names in the letter, that James Kincaid was possibly married to Martha Patton, a sister of James Patton. More records for the Patton family of Alexandria, Virginia can be found here. Some owned land in Boston and New York. Deed #3 - Deed Book W-1, pages 261-271 - Indenture dated April 16, 1793, between Valentine and Eleanor Peers of Loudon, VA , of the one part, and Thomas Patten and Joseph May of Boston MA in the other part, whereby Joseph May and Thomas Patten bought for the sum of 360 pounds a parcel of land on the south side of King Street and west side of Union Street in Alexandria, VA, (Thomas Patten and Joseph May were partners in the firm Thomas Patten & Company in Alexandria, VA) Fairfax DB S2- 246 et seq. 16 Oct 1820 between Robert Patton Jr of Co of Fairfax, Va of one part and James Patton the elder of the same county and state, of the second part, WITNESSETH the whereas Ann Clifton Patton, wife of the said Robert Patton Jun has this day ... relinquished her right of dower in the lands held by her husband Robert P Jr in the City of New York and the County of Ulster in the State of New York, Now this indenture witnesseth that Robert Patton, for $1 paid by James Patton, grants unto James Patton .. in trust for to and for the sole and separate use and behoof of the said Ann Clifton Patton and her heirs the following seven slaves (named) plus various named goods. Wit: Signed- Rob. Patton Jr James Patton James Patton Junior et al http://genforum.genealogy.com/cgi-bin/pageload.cgi?Kincaid::patton::4593.html ********************** I descend from a Patton line - my oldest known ancestor Robert Patton, Jr. b. abt. 1776 was the son of a Robert Patton, Sr. and Helen DOUGLAS. In Robert Patton, Jr.'s will dated 1813, Fairfax Co., VA, he mentions his mother Helen Douglas Patton of "the George Douglas family of Roaring Head, Kilmarnock Scotland (Ayr)." Helen would have been born about 1750. Robert Patton, Jr.'s brother James and he were merchants in the Alexandria, Fairfax Co., VA, area - one of the letters received by James was from a Hugh Douglas of Belvedere dated 1793, possibly Helen's relative. There were Douglasses in Fairfax Co., VA, during that same time period - one of them was a Hugh Douglas who married Elizabeth Mercer. This might have been the "Hugh Douglas of Belvedere." *************************** "I am particularly interested in focusing on the descendants of MATTHEW "the martyr" Patoun/Patton, b. Rosehall, Kilmarnock, Scotland, d. 1666, Glasgow. Matthew was a Christian martyr who was beheaded in the square along with other Christians. His son was JOHN PATTON, who married Charity. John came to America in 1705, settling in Cumberland Co, PA. -----Original Message----- From: Don W Kincaid Sent: Monday, February 24, 2014 10:27 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: [KINCAID] James Kincaid of Boston Kincaid Listers, Below is the letter from the Debra who sent us the letters from James Kincaid. I think you will find her report interesting! We are glad that she was interested in history when a teenager! Don Hello again, I still have the letters. I have only transcribed two - the third letter is so damaged it is almost unreadable, but I'll send it along anyway. I don't know if you know the story behind the letters - I grew up in Alexandria and my father worked in and on many of the old townhouses back in the 50s, 60s and 70s. One owner was cleaning out his building to sell it. The building had not been lived in or renovated for a long, long time and it contained many historical artifacts. My father emptied the contents of an old desk into a paper bag and brought them home to me - a teenager at the time, but very interested in history. Until the advent of the internet it was very time consuming to find out anything about the authors of the invoices, letters etc. or their descendants. But that has all changed. So I have two binders of old stuff - mostly invoices and letters from various folks who lived or worked in the Alexandria, Washington D.C., Georgetown areas from the late 1790s to about 1820. When I'm not working on my genealogy - I see what I can find out about these folks. I am not related to James Kincaid at all. I have been doing my own genealogy for about 30 years - but not a professional. I've assisted many people in their searches, though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: "Robert or Debra Miller" <fortlong@embarqmail.com> Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:45:31 PM Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston If I had checked my mail a few seconds earlier I would not have sent my 2nd email! Thanks! Don From: Robert or Debra Miller Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 2:37 PM To: Don W Kincaid Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston I just tried to access the letters - and the links have been broken - I'll look around and see if I still have them - maybe not until next week though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: fortlong@embarqmail.com Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:21:53 PM Subject: James Kincaid of Boston Debra, In 2,000 you posted on Gen Forum that you had 3 letters from James Kincaid of Boston to James Patton of Alexandria. We have seen what one letter said but not the other 2. If possible please send copies of the other 2 letters. Thanks, Don W Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Project Administrator donwkincaid@cox. net Gilbert, AZ Cell 254 631-5684 PS: If you are interested in Kincaid lineages you might go to our website at www.kincaiddna.org and view the lineages of our dna participants. For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks mighty much! We look forward to your books. Don -----Original Message----- From: edkiii75 Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2014 10:07 AM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Success on James Kincaid letters dear don, thanks for keeping me in the loop- the books should be in the mail [waiting on re-printing] by the end of the week. cheers, edkiii On Monday, February 24, 2014 6:42 PM, Don W Kincaid <donwkincaid@cox.net> wrote: Our source for the James Kincaid of Boston letters to James Patton in Alexandria, VA has found the original letters and told me the story behind the letters. I have asked permission to copy the very interesting story of how she came to be in possession of the letters and where they came from. It is amazing they have survived over 211 years! I will send copies of the scans to anyone who is interested. Just send an email to me off list to donwkincaid@cox.et One letter is not very readable and part of it is gone but a small amount is readable. Unfortunately the one that is transcribed is addressed to My Dear Sir but expect it was to James Patton. Don For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

dear don, thanks for keeping me in the loop- the books should be in the mail [waiting on re-printing] by the end of the week. cheers, edkiii On Monday, February 24, 2014 6:42 PM, Don W Kincaid <donwkincaid@cox.net> wrote: Our source for the James Kincaid of Boston letters to James Patton in Alexandria, VA has found the original letters and told me the story behind the letters. I have asked permission to copy the very interesting story of how she came to be in possession of the letters and where they came from. It is amazing they have survived over 211 years! I will send copies of the scans to anyone who is interested. Just send an email to me off list to donwkincaid@cox.et  One letter is not very readable and part of it is gone but a small amount is readable. Unfortunately the one that is transcribed is addressed to My Dear Sir but expect it was to James Patton. Don For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Kincaid Listers, Below is the letter from the Debra who sent us the letters from James Kincaid. I think you will find her report interesting! We are glad that she was interested in history when a teenager! Don Hello again, I still have the letters. I have only transcribed two - the third letter is so damaged it is almost unreadable, but I'll send it along anyway. I don't know if you know the story behind the letters - I grew up in Alexandria and my father worked in and on many of the old townhouses back in the 50s, 60s and 70s. One owner was cleaning out his building to sell it. The building had not been lived in or renovated for a long, long time and it contained many historical artifacts. My father emptied the contents of an old desk into a paper bag and brought them home to me - a teenager at the time, but very interested in history. Until the advent of the internet it was very time consuming to find out anything about the authors of the invoices, letters etc. or their descendants. But that has all changed. So I have two binders of old stuff - mostly invoices and letters from various folks who lived or worked in the Alexandria, Washington D.C., Georgetown areas from the late 1790s to about 1820. When I'm not working on my genealogy - I see what I can find out about these folks. I am not related to James Kincaid at all. I have been doing my own genealogy for about 30 years - but not a professional. I've assisted many people in their searches, though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: "Robert or Debra Miller" <fortlong@embarqmail.com> Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:45:31 PM Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston If I had checked my mail a few seconds earlier I would not have sent my 2nd email! Thanks! Don From: Robert or Debra Miller Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 2:37 PM To: Don W Kincaid Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston I just tried to access the letters - and the links have been broken - I'll look around and see if I still have them - maybe not until next week though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: fortlong@embarqmail.com Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:21:53 PM Subject: James Kincaid of Boston Debra, In 2,000 you posted on Gen Forum that you had 3 letters from James Kincaid of Boston to James Patton of Alexandria. We have seen what one letter said but not the other 2. If possible please send copies of the other 2 letters. Thanks, Don W Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Project Administrator donwkincaid@cox. net Gilbert, AZ Cell 254 631-5684 PS: If you are interested in Kincaid lineages you might go to our website at www.kincaiddna.org and view the lineages of our dna participants.

Our source for the James Kincaid of Boston letters to James Patton in Alexandria, VA has found the original letters and told me the story behind the letters. I have asked permission to copy the very interesting story of how she came to be in possession of the letters and where they came from. It is amazing they have survived over 211 years! I will send copies of the scans to anyone who is interested. Just send an email to me off list to donwkincaid@cox.et One letter is not very readable and part of it is gone but a small amount is readable. Unfortunately the one that is transcribed is addressed to My Dear Sir but expect it was to James Patton. Don

Well it looks like Surgeon Denniston might be Edward E. Denniston, a physician. He and wife Jane appear in the 1855 census of Northampton, Massachusetts at: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11105-169740-6?cc=1459985&wc=M93W-726:n1824892701 and in the 1865 census of the same place at: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11863-149477-30?cc=1410399&wc=M99Y-1Q4:1040016687 He seems to have remarried to Mary Storer in 1883. http://books.google.ca/books?id=satGAAAAMAAJ&q=%22evans+denniston%22+northampton&dq=%22evans+denniston%22+northampton&hl=en&sa=X&ei=ZnEJU9HcE-ehsAS2p4CoCQ&redir_esc=y Edward E. Denniston died on 10 May 1890 in Northampton. https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11849-115593-52?cc=1463156&wc=M9HZ-YVG:n263989725 A bio of his grandson of the same name is at: http://files.usgwarchives.net/pa/philadelphia/bios/history/denniston-ee.txt Some tidbits to start. Whether or not Jane (Kinkead) Denniston's father was the James who wrote the letter to James Patton, at least it looks like we might have another of Rev. Joseph Kinkead's grandchildren located. Best wishes! Peter -----Original Message----- From: Kincaid Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2014 4:43 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Thanks for your interest in this Barb. I don't know how long James Kincaid was of Boston, but he wrote the letter to James Patton from Boston. Given the scope of the letter James was then living there. He received items from James Patton. I found an interesting tidbit today that may help solve this mystery James. There was a Jane Denniston who died in Northampton, Massachusetts on 6 April 1873 at the given age of 81 years and 2 months. She was born in Ireland to James and Mary Kinkead of Ireland [see Massachusetts Town and Vital Records 1620-1988]. She matches up as the daughter of James Kinkead, eldest son of Rev. Joseph Kinkead (of Stranorlar and Killinchy, Co. Down), by his second wife (name unknown). This was given in the family history done by his nephew, Joseph Kinkead, land agent of Dublin. He states that Jane (Kinkead) Denniston married a Mr. Denniston of Strabane and settled in America. I see from the Strababe Morning Post that Jane Kinkead, daughter of Mr James Kinkead married Surgeon Denniston on 23 January 1828. Matching up Jane Denniston of Massachusetts to a Surgeon Denniston (name or occupation?) will certainly prove her to be a grand daughter of Rev. Joseph Kinkead. The family history of Joseph Kinkead, the land agent, also states that his uncle James Kinkead first married Fanny Cochrane and had 2 sons, who died without issue, and 4 daughters (Anne married David Brown of Ballyarnett; Fanny married Andrew Crawford of Donegal; Mary who married James Thompson of Londonderry; and Eliza who married Rev. Houston, Presbyterian minister of Donegal). Now Burke's Irish Family Records has a write-up on the Browns of Ballyarnett and says Ann's father James Kincaid was a doctor, but I believe that they mistook him for his brother. I think his nephew is a more credible source. What is interesting is that Burke's has it that David Brown and Ann Kincaid had a daughter Frances who married Bartholomew McCorkell of the family of famous Londonderry shipping company of that name. So with have a thread of families in the shipping or shipbuilding industries. -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2014 1:35 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Where is the record that James Kincaid was from Boston? For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The James Patton of Alexandria that I am interested in was stated as being married to Mollie Kinkead. Mollie is a pet form of Mary so the 1809 indenture could relate to to her. Peter -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2014 1:48 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Here is more information about the Robert and James Patton family of Alexandria, Virginia, who have a relationship with James Kincaid in 1814. James Patton's wife was Mary Seymour Slaughter, which matches this record: "Indenture dated 11/9/1809 between James Patton and wife Mary (1st part) AND Robert J Taylor (2nd part). Patton transfers stock shares, house, lot, and boat to Taylor to protect note endorsers Ferdinand Marsteller and John Young, merchants. Wit- James Kincaid, John Kincaid, Jacob Hoffman, Cuthbert Powell. Rec. 7/18/1810. T: 10." Generation No. 1 1. Robert1 Patton, Sr. He married Helen Douglas, daughter of George Douglas. She was born in Scotland. Notes for Helen Douglas: Helen Douglas Patton, wife of Robert Patton, Sr.., is mentioned in the will of her son, Robert Patton, Jr., dated 1813, Fairfax Co., VA, as "now or lately of the George Douglas family of Roaring Head near Kilmarnock, Scotland." Children of Robert Patton and Helen Douglas are: 2 i. James2 Patton, born Abt. 1775. He married Mary Seymour Slaughter in Fairfax Co., VA. Notes for James Patton: In the 1820 Fairfax, VA census, James Patton is shown in the 45 and over age bracket. 3 ii. Robert Patton, Jr., born Abt. 1775 in Alexandria, VA. He married Ann Clifton "Nancy" Reeder September 02, 1805 in Alexandria, VA; born Abt. 1785 in Alexandria, VA. Notes for Robert Patton, Jr.: Robert Patton, Jr. was a member of the Alexandria-Washington Masonic Lodge #22, Alexandria, Fairfax Co., VA, from 1799-1819 when he was suspended for non-payment of dues. The lodge returns show this information. There are no surviving returns from this Lodge before 1799. Robert attended George Washington's funeral in 1799 - while at the funeral, he wore a watch fob that had been passed down and continues to be passed down in the Patton family since 50 years before the Revolutionary War. http://genforum.genealogy.com/slaughter/messages/865.html

Thanks for your interest in this Barb. I don't know how long James Kincaid was of Boston, but he wrote the letter to James Patton from Boston. Given the scope of the letter James was then living there. He received items from James Patton. I found an interesting tidbit today that may help solve this mystery James. There was a Jane Denniston who died in Northampton, Massachusetts on 6 April 1873 at the given age of 81 years and 2 months. She was born in Ireland to James and Mary Kinkead of Ireland [see Massachusetts Town and Vital Records 1620-1988]. She matches up as the daughter of James Kinkead, eldest son of Rev. Joseph Kinkead (of Stranorlar and Killinchy, Co. Down), by his second wife (name unknown). This was given in the family history done by his nephew, Joseph Kinkead, land agent of Dublin. He states that Jane (Kinkead) Denniston married a Mr. Denniston of Strabane and settled in America. I see from the Strababe Morning Post that Jane Kinkead, daughter of Mr James Kinkead married Surgeon Denniston on 23 January 1828. Matching up Jane Denniston of Massachusetts to a Surgeon Denniston (name or occupation?) will certainly prove her to be a grand daughter of Rev. Joseph Kinkead. The family history of Joseph Kinkead, the land agent, also states that his uncle James Kinkead first married Fanny Cochrane and had 2 sons, who died without issue, and 4 daughters (Anne married David Brown of Ballyarnett; Fanny married Andrew Crawford of Donegal; Mary who married James Thompson of Londonderry; and Eliza who married Rev. Houston, Presbyterian minister of Donegal). Now Burke's Irish Family Records has a write-up on the Browns of Ballyarnett and says Ann's father James Kincaid was a doctor, but I believe that they mistook him for his brother. I think his nephew is a more credible source. What is interesting is that Burke's has it that David Brown and Ann Kincaid had a daughter Frances who married Bartholomew McCorkell of the family of famous Londonderry shipping company of that name. So with have a thread of families in the shipping or shipbuilding industries. -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2014 1:35 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Where is the record that James Kincaid was from Boston?

These two letters are from Mrs. Patton, the wife of James Patton, the English consul at Alexandria, Virginia. Very interesting....who was this James Patton in Alexandria during the War of 1812? These letters are from the archives of Notre Dame University in South Bend, Indiana. Many old records have been preserved at this Catholic University. http://archives.nd.edu/search/calendar-search.htm 1812 Oct. 27 Grassi, S.J., Father John Georgetown, (District of Columbia) to Father (Simon Gabriel) Bruté Emmitsburg, Maryland Mrs. Patton, wife of James Patton, the English consul at Alexandria, wants to send her daughter aged 12 or 13 to the religious house near Bruté's college. She applied to Grassi and he writes to Bruté whom Father (Francis) Malève informs him now lives at Emmitsburg. He takes the occasion to thank Bruté for the handsome picture he gave him last summer. The hope of writing and sickness delayed the acknowledgement. Father Cary has also suffered attacks of biliousness but is now better. Grassi asks that Bruté visit Georgetown and also Cary at St. Thomas Manor. The proximity to the capital makes it possible to invite Bruté. Father Malève will be glad to see Bruté at Frederick. From there the stage goes every week to Georgetown. II-3-n A.L.S.. 2pp. 4to. 4 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 1812 Nov. 17 Grassi, S.J., Father John George Town, Dist(ric)t of Columbia to Father (Simon Gabriel) Bruté, Mount St. Mary's Sem(inar)y Emmitsburg, (Maryland) Grassi is sorry that he did not mention that James Patton is not a Catholic, although his wife and family are good Catholics. He asks that Bruté tell him everything concerning the education given at St. Joseph or have it done by one of the ladies. Mrs. Patton is the mother of 5 other girls who will all probably be sent to St. Joseph. If the daughter Mary is admitted Mrs. Patton intends to come with her. To lose no time she asks if she can come immediately if the terms are acceptable. Nothing would be more agreeable than Bruté's promise to come and see them. The presence of Father (A. Pierre) Ladavière (S.J.) late from France and Bruté's old acquaintance is a new motif. He has persuaded him to write a few lines on the next page. He asks prayers for their brethren in Russia whose colleges with one exception are in the hands of vandals. P.S. He sends his respects to Father (Jean) Dubois and (Benjamin) Duhamel. A.L.S. Father Ladavière adds in French on the next page that since Father Grassi has insisted that he add a few words he wants to call to memory. Although not a particular friend in the past yet since they are to work in the same country it is fitting that they remember each other in their prayers and Masses. A. Note. S. 3pp. 4to. 3

Here is more information about the Robert and James Patton family of Alexandria, Virginia, who have a relationship with James Kincaid in 1814. James Patton's wife was Mary Seymour Slaughter, which matches this record: "Indenture dated 11/9/1809 between James Patton and wife Mary (1st part) AND Robert J Taylor (2nd part). Patton transfers stock shares, house, lot, and boat to Taylor to protect note endorsers Ferdinand Marsteller and John Young, merchants. Wit- James Kincaid, John Kincaid, Jacob Hoffman, Cuthbert Powell. Rec. 7/18/1810. T: 10." Generation No. 1 1. Robert1 Patton, Sr. He married Helen Douglas, daughter of George Douglas. She was born in Scotland. Notes for Helen Douglas: Helen Douglas Patton, wife of Robert Patton, Sr.., is mentioned in the will of her son, Robert Patton, Jr., dated 1813, Fairfax Co., VA, as "now or lately of the George Douglas family of Roaring Head near Kilmarnock, Scotland." Children of Robert Patton and Helen Douglas are: 2 i. James2 Patton, born Abt. 1775. He married Mary Seymour Slaughter in Fairfax Co., VA. Notes for James Patton: In the 1820 Fairfax, VA census, James Patton is shown in the 45 and over age bracket. 3 ii. Robert Patton, Jr., born Abt. 1775 in Alexandria, VA. He married Ann Clifton "Nancy" Reeder September 02, 1805 in Alexandria, VA; born Abt. 1785 in Alexandria, VA. Notes for Robert Patton, Jr.: Robert Patton, Jr. was a member of the Alexandria-Washington Masonic Lodge #22, Alexandria, Fairfax Co., VA, from 1799-1819 when he was suspended for non-payment of dues. The lodge returns show this information. There are no surviving returns from this Lodge before 1799. Robert attended George Washington's funeral in 1799 - while at the funeral, he wore a watch fob that had been passed down and continues to be passed down in the Patton family since 50 years before the Revolutionary War. http://genforum.genealogy.com/slaughter/messages/865.html -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 8:04 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Here is a record for James Kincaid and James Patton in 1814, in Fairfax County, Virginia. Deed of Trust James Patton Jr. to James Kincaid - Fairfax Co. - 1814 Defendants George Mason; Mary Mason; FNU Jenifer; Helen Jenifer; Eleanor Patton; James Patton; Martha Patton; Catharine Patton; FNU Baker; Robert Patton Jr.; John M. Patton; Jacob Morgan; Campbell & Ritchie; John Murphy; FNU McGuire (exor.); FNU Nicholson (decd.); FNU Beckham Marriage: FNU Jenifer -mr- Helen Patton George Mason -mr- Mary Patton (My note: I found another message that says George Mason married Eleanor Patton). Family Helen Patton, Mary Patton, Eleanor Patton, James Patton, Martha Patton & Catharine Patton, children of Robert Patton Plaintiff James Ross (surviving partner of Colin & James Ross) http://www.historiccourtrecords.org/courtrecord.asp?ID=55270&myName=Kincaid, James+&mycontext=Deed of Trust Barbara -----Original Message----- From: Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:47 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Don, you are quite the sleuth. I tried to get her with the original address, but it bounced. Tried another I found and got no reply. Great that you came up with a working one. Hopefully, she can find the letters. I would love a scan of them. Does James appear in the early census records? I have no sign of him in the 1850 one. A good clue is that he had a daughter in 1803. I wonder if he went back to Ireland and is the James Kincaid of Ballykelly (which is just west of Limavady). Peter -----Original Message----- From: Don W Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:49 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter I had a little time so contacted Debra and below are her responses. From: Robert or Debra Miller Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 2:37 PM To: Don W Kincaid Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston I just tried to access the letters - and the links have been broken - I'll look around and see if I still have them - maybe not until next week though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: fortlong@embarqmail.com Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:21:53 PM Subject: James Kincaid of Boston Debra, In 2,000 you posted on Gen Forum that you had 3 letters from James Kincaid of Boston to James Patton of Alexandria. We have seen what one letter said but not the other 2. If possible please send copies of the other 2 letters. Thanks, Don W Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Project Administrator donwkincaid@cox. net Gilbert, AZ Cell 254 631-5684 PS: If you are interested in Kincaid lineages you might go to our website at www.kincaiddna.org and view the lineages of our dna participants. For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Where is the record that James Kincaid was from Boston? Here is what Joan wrote, which includes a James Patton who married Mollie Kincaid. The Robert Patton, Sr. who married Helen Douglas of Scotland were the parents of Robert Patton, Jr. and James Patton of Alexandria, Virginia. From: <Joanjmm@aol.com> Subject: James Patton, b.abt.1734,Ireland,m. Mary Newell, d/o Robert Newell Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2000 19:17:24 EST Does anyone on the list have the children's names for a James Patton b. abt. 1834, Ireland, son of Matthew Patton and Elizabeth, who married Mary Newell, daughter of Robert Newell. James died in 1821, Loudon, PA, and was a captain in the Revolutionary War. The information I received shows the following children for James and Mary: l. Margaret Patton b. March 30, 1772, Cumberland Co., PA, married John White on May 9, 1797, Westmoreland Co., PA 2. Rebecca Patton, b. abt. 1760 3. Mary Patton b. abt. 1762, married a McKinstry before 1815 4. Elizabeth Patton b. abt. 1764, married a McCall before 1815 5. Grizzel (female) Patton b. abt. 1769 6. Matthew Patton b. April 12, 1776, died June 25, 1845 The information I received shows my two Pattons also as children of Mary Newell and James Patton, as follows: 7. Robert Patton, Sr., b. abt. 1755, died in Alexandria, VA, married Helen Douglas of the George Douglas family near Roaring Head, Kilmarnock, Ayr, Scotland, (Robert was a merchant and shipbuilder) - their son Robert Patton, Jr., resided at Spring Bank, Alexandria, VA, and married Ann Clifton Reeder in 1805, Alexandria, Fairfax Co., VA. Robert and Ann's daughter Eleanor Ann married George Mason VI of Gunston Hall. 8. James Patton, Esquire, b. abt. 1755, d. Alexandria, VA, married Mary "Mollie" Kincaid, daughter of James Kincaid (James was also a merchant and shipbuilder) If anyone can help me with these Pattons, please contact me so I can find out for sure if my Robert Patton, Sr., and James Patton, Esquire were the sons of this James Patton and Mary Newell of Pennsylvania. Joan -----Original Message----- From: Kincaid Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 2:36 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Hi Barb. What makes you believe that Mollie was a daughter of James Kincaid of Boston? What links the James and John witnesses to James Kincaid of Boston? Best wishes! Peter -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 3:06 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter This is a long page of records for the various Patton families in Virginia. Notice that there was a John Kincaid who was a witness with James Kincaid. Possibly brothers? James Kincaid is believed to have been the father of Mary Ann, or Mollie, the wife of James Patton. For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

There was a James Kincaid in Boston in 1829 according to a city directory. I don't know if he is the same James or a relative of his or another line. James Kincaid Dates: 1826-1850 Location: Town: Boston; County/Colonial: Massachusetts baltimore Occupation(s): grocer Gender: Male Address(es): 114, north High; Town: Boston; County/Colonial: Massachusetts Source Date: 1829 Source Info: Listed in, [Baltimore, 1829] Matchett’s Baltimore Director, corrected up to June 1829. Containing an engraved plan of the city with references to the public buildings, The Names and Occupations of the Householders, a list of the Streets, Lanes, Alleys, Wharves, Churches, &c. a Plan of the Wards, a list of the Banks, Insurance and other Companies, Notaries, Foreign Consuls, Officers of the Corporation, Masonic Lodges, Sessions of the Maryland Courts, Hours of Departure of Steam-Boats, Packets and Stages, etc. etc., 1829, MATCHETT, R. J., Baltimore There was a James Kincaid who arrived in NY 1798 but don't see where he went after arrival nor where he came from. James Kincaid Arrival Year: 1798 Arrival Place: New York, New York Source Publication Code: 8222 Primary Immigrant: Kincaid, James Annotation: In colonial New York, aliens needed letters of denization from the King of England or in New York from the Governor, or had to be naturalized before they could hold or dispose of real property. Don -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Saturday, February 22, 2014 10:48 AM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Here is more information about the Robert and James Patton family of Alexandria, Virginia, who have a relationship with James Kincaid in 1814. James Patton's wife was Mary Seymour Slaughter, which matches this record: "Indenture dated 11/9/1809 between James Patton and wife Mary (1st part) AND Robert J Taylor (2nd part). Patton transfers stock shares, house, lot, and boat to Taylor to protect note endorsers Ferdinand Marsteller and John Young, merchants. Wit- James Kincaid, John Kincaid, Jacob Hoffman, Cuthbert Powell. Rec. 7/18/1810. T: 10." Generation No. 1 1. Robert1 Patton, Sr. He married Helen Douglas, daughter of George Douglas. She was born in Scotland. Notes for Helen Douglas: Helen Douglas Patton, wife of Robert Patton, Sr.., is mentioned in the will of her son, Robert Patton, Jr., dated 1813, Fairfax Co., VA, as "now or lately of the George Douglas family of Roaring Head near Kilmarnock, Scotland." Children of Robert Patton and Helen Douglas are: 2 i. James2 Patton, born Abt. 1775. He married Mary Seymour Slaughter in Fairfax Co., VA. Notes for James Patton: In the 1820 Fairfax, VA census, James Patton is shown in the 45 and over age bracket. 3 ii. Robert Patton, Jr., born Abt. 1775 in Alexandria, VA. He married Ann Clifton "Nancy" Reeder September 02, 1805 in Alexandria, VA; born Abt. 1785 in Alexandria, VA. Notes for Robert Patton, Jr.: Robert Patton, Jr. was a member of the Alexandria-Washington Masonic Lodge #22, Alexandria, Fairfax Co., VA, from 1799-1819 when he was suspended for non-payment of dues. The lodge returns show this information. There are no surviving returns from this Lodge before 1799. Robert attended George Washington's funeral in 1799 - while at the funeral, he wore a watch fob that had been passed down and continues to be passed down in the Patton family since 50 years before the Revolutionary War. http://genforum.genealogy.com/slaughter/messages/865.html -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 8:04 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Here is a record for James Kincaid and James Patton in 1814, in Fairfax County, Virginia. Deed of Trust James Patton Jr. to James Kincaid - Fairfax Co. - 1814 Defendants George Mason; Mary Mason; FNU Jenifer; Helen Jenifer; Eleanor Patton; James Patton; Martha Patton; Catharine Patton; FNU Baker; Robert Patton Jr.; John M. Patton; Jacob Morgan; Campbell & Ritchie; John Murphy; FNU McGuire (exor.); FNU Nicholson (decd.); FNU Beckham Marriage: FNU Jenifer -mr- Helen Patton George Mason -mr- Mary Patton (My note: I found another message that says George Mason married Eleanor Patton). Family Helen Patton, Mary Patton, Eleanor Patton, James Patton, Martha Patton & Catharine Patton, children of Robert Patton Plaintiff James Ross (surviving partner of Colin & James Ross) http://www.historiccourtrecords.org/courtrecord.asp?ID=55270&myName=Kincaid, James+&mycontext=Deed of Trust Barbara -----Original Message----- From: Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:47 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Don, you are quite the sleuth. I tried to get her with the original address, but it bounced. Tried another I found and got no reply. Great that you came up with a working one. Hopefully, she can find the letters. I would love a scan of them. Does James appear in the early census records? I have no sign of him in the 1850 one. A good clue is that he had a daughter in 1803. I wonder if he went back to Ireland and is the James Kincaid of Ballykelly (which is just west of Limavady). Peter -----Original Message----- From: Don W Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:49 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter I had a little time so contacted Debra and below are her responses. From: Robert or Debra Miller Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 2:37 PM To: Don W Kincaid Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston I just tried to access the letters - and the links have been broken - I'll look around and see if I still have them - maybe not until next week though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: fortlong@embarqmail.com Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:21:53 PM Subject: James Kincaid of Boston Debra, In 2,000 you posted on Gen Forum that you had 3 letters from James Kincaid of Boston to James Patton of Alexandria. We have seen what one letter said but not the other 2. If possible please send copies of the other 2 letters. Thanks, Don W Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Project Administrator donwkincaid@cox. net Gilbert, AZ Cell 254 631-5684 PS: If you are interested in Kincaid lineages you might go to our website at www.kincaiddna.org and view the lineages of our dna participants. For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The person with the letters was one Debra Miller. This James Kincaid is a real interesting mystery. Peter -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 6:55 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Is Joan the lady who has the letters? This is what she wrote, but it is over 10 years ago: "Please contact me at Joanjmm@aol.com if you have a connection or any information regarding the following: Robert Patton, Jr., merchant and shipbuilder, b. 1775 or before, probably in Ireland, married Ann Clifton Reeder b. abt. 1781, daughter of Benjamin Reeder and Eleanor Clifton Slaughter (Eleanor daughter of Thomas Slaughter and Ann Clifton), in 1805, Alexandria, Fairfax Co., VA, at the Clifton Lodge, the residence of his brother James Patton, also a merchant and shipbuilder. Robert and his brother James worked closely with a James Kincaid who handled their business affairs." http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/VAFAIRFA/2000-02/0949940959 I will look up the reference to Mollie. My ancestor Robert/Mary of Hardin named his wife as Molly in his 1820 RW pension application. Barbara -----Original Message----- From: Kincaid Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 2:36 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Hi Barb. What makes you believe that Mollie was a daughter of James Kincaid of Boston? What links the James and John witnesses to James Kincaid of Boston? Best wishes! Peter -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 3:06 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter This is a long page of records for the various Patton families in Virginia. Notice that there was a John Kincaid who was a witness with James Kincaid. Possibly brothers? James Kincaid is believed to have been the father of Mary Ann, or Mollie, the wife of James Patton. For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Here is a record for James Kincaid and James Patton in 1814, in Fairfax County, Virginia. Deed of Trust James Patton Jr. to James Kincaid - Fairfax Co. - 1814 Defendants George Mason; Mary Mason; FNU Jenifer; Helen Jenifer; Eleanor Patton; James Patton; Martha Patton; Catharine Patton; FNU Baker; Robert Patton Jr.; John M. Patton; Jacob Morgan; Campbell & Ritchie; John Murphy; FNU McGuire (exor.); FNU Nicholson (decd.); FNU Beckham Marriage: FNU Jenifer -mr- Helen Patton George Mason -mr- Mary Patton (My note: I found another message that says George Mason married Eleanor Patton). Family Helen Patton, Mary Patton, Eleanor Patton, James Patton, Martha Patton & Catharine Patton, children of Robert Patton Plaintiff James Ross (surviving partner of Colin & James Ross) http://www.historiccourtrecords.org/courtrecord.asp?ID=55270&myName=Kincaid, James+&mycontext=Deed of Trust Barbara -----Original Message----- From: Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:47 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Don, you are quite the sleuth. I tried to get her with the original address, but it bounced. Tried another I found and got no reply. Great that you came up with a working one. Hopefully, she can find the letters. I would love a scan of them. Does James appear in the early census records? I have no sign of him in the 1850 one. A good clue is that he had a daughter in 1803. I wonder if he went back to Ireland and is the James Kincaid of Ballykelly (which is just west of Limavady). Peter -----Original Message----- From: Don W Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:49 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter I had a little time so contacted Debra and below are her responses. From: Robert or Debra Miller Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 2:37 PM To: Don W Kincaid Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston I just tried to access the letters - and the links have been broken - I'll look around and see if I still have them - maybe not until next week though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: fortlong@embarqmail.com Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:21:53 PM Subject: James Kincaid of Boston Debra, In 2,000 you posted on Gen Forum that you had 3 letters from James Kincaid of Boston to James Patton of Alexandria. We have seen what one letter said but not the other 2. If possible please send copies of the other 2 letters. Thanks, Don W Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Project Administrator donwkincaid@cox. net Gilbert, AZ Cell 254 631-5684 PS: If you are interested in Kincaid lineages you might go to our website at www.kincaiddna.org and view the lineages of our dna participants. For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Is Joan the lady who has the letters? This is what she wrote, but it is over 10 years ago: "Please contact me at Joanjmm@aol.com if you have a connection or any information regarding the following: Robert Patton, Jr., merchant and shipbuilder, b. 1775 or before, probably in Ireland, married Ann Clifton Reeder b. abt. 1781, daughter of Benjamin Reeder and Eleanor Clifton Slaughter (Eleanor daughter of Thomas Slaughter and Ann Clifton), in 1805, Alexandria, Fairfax Co., VA, at the Clifton Lodge, the residence of his brother James Patton, also a merchant and shipbuilder. Robert and his brother James worked closely with a James Kincaid who handled their business affairs." http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/VAFAIRFA/2000-02/0949940959 I will look up the reference to Mollie. My ancestor Robert/Mary of Hardin named his wife as Molly in his 1820 RW pension application. Barbara -----Original Message----- From: Kincaid Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 2:36 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Hi Barb. What makes you believe that Mollie was a daughter of James Kincaid of Boston? What links the James and John witnesses to James Kincaid of Boston? Best wishes! Peter -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 3:06 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter This is a long page of records for the various Patton families in Virginia. Notice that there was a John Kincaid who was a witness with James Kincaid. Possibly brothers? James Kincaid is believed to have been the father of Mary Ann, or Mollie, the wife of James Patton. For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Barb. What makes you believe that Mollie was a daughter of James Kincaid of Boston? What links the James and John witnesses to James Kincaid of Boston? Best wishes! Peter -----Original Message----- From: Barbara Van Hout Sent: Friday, February 21, 2014 3:06 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter This is a long page of records for the various Patton families in Virginia. Notice that there was a John Kincaid who was a witness with James Kincaid. Possibly brothers? James Kincaid is believed to have been the father of Mary Ann, or Mollie, the wife of James Patton.

This is a long page of records for the various Patton families in Virginia. Notice that there was a John Kincaid who was a witness with James Kincaid. Possibly brothers? James Kincaid is believed to have been the father of Mary Ann, or Mollie, the wife of James Patton. James Patton Indenture dated 11/9/1809 between James Patton and wife Mary (1st part) AND Robert J Taylor (2nd part). Patton transfers stock shares, house, lot, and boat to Taylor to protect note endorsers Ferdinand Marsteller and John Young, merchants. Wit- James Kincaid, John Kincaid, Jacob Hoffman, Cuthbert Powell. Rec. 7/18/1810. T: 10. Ind. 11/9/1809 betw Ferdinand Marsteller and wf Margaret, John Young and Mary, AND Robert J Taylor. James Patton endorsed note of firm of Marsteller and Young to Bank of Potomac. Firm conveyed land, house, & shares in Washington Bridge Co, Alexandria Theatre, Little River Turnpike Co., & land purch. from Jas Card, and slaves (14, plus children), and houses, to Taylor, to protect endorser. Wit Geo Coleman, Wm H Parry, John Kincaid. T:238. 2407 1810. Jas P endorsed note. 2460 1811. Deed- land now occup by Jas Patton transferred. 2498 1810. Jas P named as one of many debtors to some person. 2746 11/14.1811. Saml Murray (Betsey) to Robt J Taylor and Jas Patton, .. release of dower. ___ p 317. 2747 2/24/1812. Alexander S Hooe and wf Eliz. of King Geo Co Va to R J Taylor, land origin leased to James P in 1797..... 2752 2/21/1812. Similar to 2727. 2856 Ind. dated 10/9/1811 bet James Patton and wf Mary Ann, AND Robert J Taylor AND Ferdinand Marsteller and John Young, merchant partners, AND William Fowle. Patton by ind. 11/9/1810 trs land to Taylor to protect note endorsers.... Wit- W Hewitt, John Kincaid, Lawrence Berry, Wm Newton et al. http://genforum.genealogy.com/cgi-bin/pageload.cgi?Kincaid::patton::4593.html -----Original Message----- From: Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:47 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter Don, you are quite the sleuth. I tried to get her with the original address, but it bounced. Tried another I found and got no reply. Great that you came up with a working one. Hopefully, she can find the letters. I would love a scan of them. Does James appear in the early census records? I have no sign of him in the 1850 one. A good clue is that he had a daughter in 1803. I wonder if he went back to Ireland and is the James Kincaid of Ballykelly (which is just west of Limavady). Peter -----Original Message----- From: Don W Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:49 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter I had a little time so contacted Debra and below are her responses. From: Robert or Debra Miller Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 2:37 PM To: Don W Kincaid Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston I just tried to access the letters - and the links have been broken - I'll look around and see if I still have them - maybe not until next week though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: fortlong@embarqmail.com Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:21:53 PM Subject: James Kincaid of Boston Debra, In 2,000 you posted on Gen Forum that you had 3 letters from James Kincaid of Boston to James Patton of Alexandria. We have seen what one letter said but not the other 2. If possible please send copies of the other 2 letters. Thanks, Don W Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Project Administrator donwkincaid@cox. net Gilbert, AZ Cell 254 631-5684 PS: If you are interested in Kincaid lineages you might go to our website at www.kincaiddna.org and view the lineages of our dna participants. For complete information about the Kincaid of all spellings DNA project, including a chart, lineages, and how to participate, go to: www.kincaiddna.org ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Don, you are quite the sleuth. I tried to get her with the original address, but it bounced. Tried another I found and got no reply. Great that you came up with a working one. Hopefully, she can find the letters. I would love a scan of them. Does James appear in the early census records? I have no sign of him in the 1850 one. A good clue is that he had a daughter in 1803. I wonder if he went back to Ireland and is the James Kincaid of Ballykelly (which is just west of Limavady). Peter -----Original Message----- From: Don W Kincaid Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 5:49 PM To: kincaid@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Overlooked James Kincaid - James Patton letter I had a little time so contacted Debra and below are her responses. From: Robert or Debra Miller Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 2:37 PM To: Don W Kincaid Subject: Re: James Kincaid of Boston I just tried to access the letters - and the links have been broken - I'll look around and see if I still have them - maybe not until next week though. Deb -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Don W Kincaid" <donwkincaid@cox.net> To: fortlong@embarqmail.com Sent: Thursday, February 20, 2014 4:21:53 PM Subject: James Kincaid of Boston Debra, In 2,000 you posted on Gen Forum that you had 3 letters from James Kincaid of Boston to James Patton of Alexandria. We have seen what one letter said but not the other 2. If possible please send copies of the other 2 letters. Thanks, Don W Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Project Administrator donwkincaid@cox. net Gilbert, AZ Cell 254 631-5684 PS: If you are interested in Kincaid lineages you might go to our website at www.kincaiddna.org and view the lineages of our dna participants.

There was a letter from James Kincaid of Boston to James Patton of Alexandria, Virginia dated 5 May 1803. It is at: http://files.usgwarchives.net/va/cityofalexandria/history/letters/kincaid8.txt This was noted years ago by Barb Van Hout, but I did not pick up on it much. What is interesting is that James Patton was married to a Mollie Kincaid. James Kincaid of Boston must have been a relative of his wife. Now James Patton is said to have been born in Newtown-Limavady (now called just Limavady), County Londonderry, Ireland. I wonder if Mollie and James were from there as well. From the letter I get the impression that James's wife was Martha. Did anyone follow-up on this James Kincaid of Boston? Peter