In a message dated 6/24/2008 8:32:55 P.M. Central Daylight Time, rkinkead11@comcast.net writes: Someone brought up the topic of Kincaid's Restaurants recently Has someone mentioned Kincaid's in Ft. Worth Texas? It is a famous hamburger place that started in a grocery store. It has been featured in SOUTHERN LIVING magazine. If this has already been mentioned....sorry, oops! Eliza K **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)

James, are you still out there, hey? Deep-fried Mars bars didn't catch up with you, did they? Dick Kinkead 2562

The Joe McGlynn who wrote this message appears to know a lot about the family. "If anyone is researching Samuel Baldwin in Botetourt County, Virginia, during the years 1774-1798, please contact me. Samuel Baldwin married Mary Wills in 1778, and had eight children. Mary Wills Baldwin filed the inventory of Samuel Baldwin's will in Montgomery County, Kentucky in 1805. Thanks Joe McGlynn" Here is a compilation of Samuel Ford/Baldwin's children and their wives---notice that Samuel's children by his wife Grace, when they lived in New Jersey, had the last name of 'Ford'. When Samuel moved to Botetourt Co, VA and changed his name to 'Baldwin', his mother's maiden name, the children born in Virginia with Mary Wills had the last name of Baldwin. See this site for Samuel's children with Ford surname. http://www.morrisswadener.com/notes.html How do these names compare with those in the lawsuit with Thomas Kincaid's heirs? *2nd Wife of [4] Samuel Ford: .+Mary Wills d: Abt. 1811 2 Elizabeth Baldwin b: Abt. 1779 d: Bef. 1869 .+Robert Harrah 2 Sarah Baldwinb: Abt. 1781d: Bef. 1869 .+Richard Collins 2 William Baldwinb: Abt. 1782 d: February 27, 1853 2 Johannah Morris Baldwin b: Abt. 1784 d: Bef. 1869 .+George Kincaid 2 Thomas Lewis Baldwin b: 1785 d: 1872 .+Elizabeth Cobb 2 Mary Jane Baldwin b: June 10, 1789 d: December 27, 1832 .+James Wills 2 Charity Baldwin b: Abt. 1790 d: March 03, 1849 .+Dawson Haggard ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Liedtke" <seleaml@actionnet.net> To: <kincaid@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 2:32 PM Subject: [KINCAID] George C. Kincaid/Johannah Baldwin > Barb has come up with some interesting information that may shed some > light > on the Baldwin family. There are some questions that aren't answered and a > few problems and the infamous Samuel Ford may not be the Samuel Baldwin > referred to in the last couple of items. The will of Samuel Baldwin > evidently notes that his daughter is Hannah Morris. I am wondering if the > 1802 Howe marriage of George Kincaid and Johanna Morris Baldwin should not > have a "nee" between Morris and Baldwin in her name. The names in the will > of Samuel Baldwin do not exactly match the heirs listed in the court case. > One would need to see the actual will as "Annette" seems to editoralize a > bit in her reporting. The date of the land sale on Catawba by Samuel's > heirs > and the date of the original suit are both Nov, 1811. > > Sue Liedtke > >>From Ford-L Archives 23 Jan 2006 > 210 Samuel Ford, b. Hanover, N. J., ca. 1735, will codicil dated 28 Jan. > 1793 and admitted to probate in Botetourt Co., Va. in Sept. 1793 > m. Hanover, N. J., 20 Jan. 1757 > 211 Grace Kitchell, b. about 1741, d. 7 Nov. 1818 > > 420 Samuel Ford, b. Woodbridge, N. J., 11 Oct. 1709, d. Hanover, N. J., 11 > Aug. 1752 > m. Hanover, N. J., ca. 1732 > 421 Sarah Baldwin, b. Newark, N. J., 20 July 1707 (or 22 July 1709), d. > Hanover, N. J., 20 April 1787 (or 22 April 1789) > ___________ > > A follow up to the above. > > Interesting fellow this Samuel Ford. Anybody know more?? > The one blot on the Kitchel family record is that Grace, daughter of > Joseph > Kitchel and Rachel Bates, married Samuel Ford. Samuel Ford was the son of > outstanding > family in Morristown, hosts to George Washington when he spent the winter > in > Morristown. The son was quite a clever forger and did a good job of > disabling > the new Republic by creating the Panic of 1793 with his printed money. > When > he > was found out, he skipped to Ireland and married (without benefit of a > divorce) > and had 3 children. He returned again in the later days of the war and > continued > his currency deals and again was at the point of being caught. So taking > his > mother's maiden name Baldwin, he retired to the wilds of Virginia where he > married > again (without divorce) and became the patriarch of some prominent > families > of > Virginia. Samuel Ford's line is also the line whose descendants include > the > wife > of a president and the mother of the current president of the United > States. > > -2 416 5-1 m 20Jan1757 Hanover NJ Samuel FORD b Abt 1735 > Hanover NJ son Samuel FORD and Sarah BALDWIN, > notorious counterfeiter 1793; d Lewisburg > GreenbrierCo VA, alias Samuel BALDWIN > -2 416 5-1-2 m VA ?______ ?______ (bigamous, alias BALDWIN) > > ___________ > >>From a WV usgenweb page for the family of Annette > BALDWIN, Samuel--died ca 1793 Botetourt Co., Virginia, will pro Sept 1793, > married first --- --; > married 2nd Mary WILLS; from Pennsylvania? > by first wife: > unnamed in will, living in Pennsylvania > Charity > by 2nd wife: > Elizabeth > Sarah > William (have sheet) > Joseph (have sheet) > Hannah--married --- MORRIS > Thomas Lewis (have sheet) > Alexander (have sheet) > Botetourt Co., Virginia Wills > ____________________ > > Chancery Court Case 145 Greenbrier Co. WV - Baldwin heirs vs Kincaid &c > Nov. 9, 1816 > ---Robert Harrow and Elizabeth his wife late Elilzabeth Baldwin, George > Kincaid & Johanah his wife late Johannah Baldwin, William Baldwin, Thomas > Baldwin, James Wills and Jane his wife, late Jane Baldwin and Charity > Baldwin, an infant under the age of twenty one years who sues by said > William Baldwin her next friend respectfully represents that on the > ____Day > of November in the year 1811 they filed their original bill in your > honorable court.---- > > This case involves the heirs of Samuel Baldwin vs Thomas Kincaid. The case > is continued after Thomas's death naming the heirs of Thomas. This item > from > the University of Tennessee Special Collection Library gives the most > details as to heirs. The continuance of the court records names the same > heirs plus Hannah, widow of Thomas. > Baldwin heirs vs Kincad, heirs of Thomas Kincaid dcd. > John Kincaid (lives Nicholas) > Samuel Kincaid (lives Greenbr) > Thomas Kincaid (Indiana, Madison Township) > Francis Kincaid (same, ditto) > George Kincaid (is one of the pltffs) > William Kincaid (Greenbr County) > Charles Harra & Margaret his wife (Greenbr) > Elizabeth Harra (widow-Greenbr) > > Have ??? these persons as children & heirs of Thos Kincaid dcd. > > __________________ > > On 26 November 1811 Richard put out a lot of money and bought a lot of > land. > For $2299 he bought from the eight heirs of Samuel Baldwin a 418-acre > tract > on Catawba Creek, a branch of the James River.[9] Neighbors with adjoining > land listed in the plat description were Matthew Harvey,[10] William > Greenwood, Kessler, and Sivert. Twenty years later Richard would buy an > additional 152 acres (one record says 165 acres) adjoining his 1811 > purchase. The 418-acre tract had been owned by Samuel Baldwin since 1779, > and upon Baldwin's death his children had moved to Montgomery County, > Kentucky, and wanted to sell the land they had inherited. > http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/b/u/t/Thomas-K-Butt/FILE/0001page.html > > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Kincaid listers I found this piece of information on Andrew Kinkead, probably son of John Kinkead, Merchant of Carlisle.  This citation goes with the two below it. 1786       Andrew Kinkead [93625] On the thirteenth day of November in the year of our Lord one                 thousand seven hundred & eighty six came the within named Andrew Kincade before me the                 subscriber President of the Court of Common Pleas for the County of Philadelphia and                 acknowledged the within Instrument of Writing to be his act and Deed, and desired the                 same to be recorded.             Edward Shippen   Received November thirteenth one thousand seven hundred and eighty-six of W. John Donnell the sum of ten pounds specie with other Considerations being in full for the within consideration money as witness my hand.             Andre Kinkead             Test.             Edward Keran   Recorded in the Office for Recording of Deeds ye a for the City and County of Philadelphia in deed Book No. 17, page 244.             Witness my hand and seal of Office this 18th November 1786, Mathew Irwin Pennsylvania State Archives, RG-17,Records of the Land Office, DONATION CLAIMANT PAPERS AND MISCELLANEOUS PATENTS, [ca. 1785-1810]. {series #17.168}, KI’s, page 69.1786       Andrew Kincaid [93625] awarded Revolutionary War Bounty Land Grant, Penn.                 November 13, 1786, 200 acres to John   Donnell, assignee. Pennsylvania State Archives 1786       Andrew Kincaid, [93625] Dragoon in the late Army, received from the Supreme                 Executive Council #499, Third District Donation   Lands 200+ acres on November 12, 1786.                 Signed: Charles Biddle. Recorded October 27, 1789. Allegheny County, PA, Abstracts to                 Deed Books I & II. Sincerely Norman Kincaide

Yes, Jill, there is. I am a long-time member and past president of the St. Andrew's Society of Detroit. There is a large number of St. Andrew's Societies across the country and I'm sure that there are Kincaid members. Bill Kincaid Ann Arbor, MI

Barb has come up with some interesting information that may shed some light on the Baldwin family. There are some questions that aren't answered and a few problems and the infamous Samuel Ford may not be the Samuel Baldwin referred to in the last couple of items. The will of Samuel Baldwin evidently notes that his daughter is Hannah Morris. I am wondering if the 1802 Howe marriage of George Kincaid and Johanna Morris Baldwin should not have a "nee" between Morris and Baldwin in her name. The names in the will of Samuel Baldwin do not exactly match the heirs listed in the court case. One would need to see the actual will as "Annette" seems to editoralize a bit in her reporting. The date of the land sale on Catawba by Samuel's heirs and the date of the original suit are both Nov, 1811. Sue Liedtke >From Ford-L Archives 23 Jan 2006 210 Samuel Ford, b. Hanover, N. J., ca. 1735, will codicil dated 28 Jan. 1793 and admitted to probate in Botetourt Co., Va. in Sept. 1793 m. Hanover, N. J., 20 Jan. 1757 211 Grace Kitchell, b. about 1741, d. 7 Nov. 1818 420 Samuel Ford, b. Woodbridge, N. J., 11 Oct. 1709, d. Hanover, N. J., 11 Aug. 1752 m. Hanover, N. J., ca. 1732 421 Sarah Baldwin, b. Newark, N. J., 20 July 1707 (or 22 July 1709), d. Hanover, N. J., 20 April 1787 (or 22 April 1789) ___________ A follow up to the above. Interesting fellow this Samuel Ford. Anybody know more?? The one blot on the Kitchel family record is that Grace, daughter of Joseph Kitchel and Rachel Bates, married Samuel Ford. Samuel Ford was the son of outstanding family in Morristown, hosts to George Washington when he spent the winter in Morristown. The son was quite a clever forger and did a good job of disabling the new Republic by creating the Panic of 1793 with his printed money. When he was found out, he skipped to Ireland and married (without benefit of a divorce) and had 3 children. He returned again in the later days of the war and continued his currency deals and again was at the point of being caught. So taking his mother's maiden name Baldwin, he retired to the wilds of Virginia where he married again (without divorce) and became the patriarch of some prominent families of Virginia. Samuel Ford's line is also the line whose descendants include the wife of a president and the mother of the current president of the United States. -2 416 5-1 m 20Jan1757 Hanover NJ Samuel FORD b Abt 1735 Hanover NJ son Samuel FORD and Sarah BALDWIN, notorious counterfeiter 1793; d Lewisburg GreenbrierCo VA, alias Samuel BALDWIN -2 416 5-1-2 m VA ?______ ?______ (bigamous, alias BALDWIN) ___________ >From a WV usgenweb page for the family of Annette BALDWIN, Samuel--died ca 1793 Botetourt Co., Virginia, will pro Sept 1793, married first --- --; married 2nd Mary WILLS; from Pennsylvania? by first wife: unnamed in will, living in Pennsylvania Charity by 2nd wife: Elizabeth Sarah William (have sheet) Joseph (have sheet) Hannah--married --- MORRIS Thomas Lewis (have sheet) Alexander (have sheet) Botetourt Co., Virginia Wills ____________________ Chancery Court Case 145 Greenbrier Co. WV - Baldwin heirs vs Kincaid &c Nov. 9, 1816 ---Robert Harrow and Elizabeth his wife late Elilzabeth Baldwin, George Kincaid & Johanah his wife late Johannah Baldwin, William Baldwin, Thomas Baldwin, James Wills and Jane his wife, late Jane Baldwin and Charity Baldwin, an infant under the age of twenty one years who sues by said William Baldwin her next friend respectfully represents that on the ____Day of November in the year 1811 they filed their original bill in your honorable court.---- This case involves the heirs of Samuel Baldwin vs Thomas Kincaid. The case is continued after Thomas's death naming the heirs of Thomas. This item from the University of Tennessee Special Collection Library gives the most details as to heirs. The continuance of the court records names the same heirs plus Hannah, widow of Thomas. Baldwin heirs vs Kincad, heirs of Thomas Kincaid dcd. John Kincaid (lives Nicholas) Samuel Kincaid (lives Greenbr) Thomas Kincaid (Indiana, Madison Township) Francis Kincaid (same, ditto) George Kincaid (is one of the pltffs) William Kincaid (Greenbr County) Charles Harra & Margaret his wife (Greenbr) Elizabeth Harra (widow-Greenbr) Have ??? these persons as children & heirs of Thos Kincaid dcd. __________________ On 26 November 1811 Richard put out a lot of money and bought a lot of land. For $2299 he bought from the eight heirs of Samuel Baldwin a 418-acre tract on Catawba Creek, a branch of the James River.[9] Neighbors with adjoining land listed in the plat description were Matthew Harvey,[10] William Greenwood, Kessler, and Sivert. Twenty years later Richard would buy an additional 152 acres (one record says 165 acres) adjoining his 1811 purchase. The 418-acre tract had been owned by Samuel Baldwin since 1779, and upon Baldwin's death his children had moved to Montgomery County, Kentucky, and wanted to sell the land they had inherited. http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/b/u/t/Thomas-K-Butt/FILE/0001page.html

In the years I lived in Chicago, in Lincoln Park (DePaul 75-77), I never managed to get off the el at Armitage. Looks like a nice place, though. No parking, naturally, so wherever you're staying, TAKE THE EL to get there. When you do, ask if there really is a Mr. (or Mz.) Kincade. Here's a link to Virtual Earth's birdseye view: http://maps.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&FORM=LMLTCC&cp=41.919592~-87.649879&style=h&lvl=17&tilt=-39.7983772778745&dir=0&alt=1080.62585784588&cam=41.909528~-87.648988&scene=11385146&phx=-0.437407657922973&phy=0.662106986198482&phscl=3.95846353388895&encType=1 . Dick Kinkead DePaul LAS77 (before the school's hard left turn) ----- Original Message ----- From: "J Olk" <thisiwilldefend@msn.com> To: "Kincaid_List" <Kincaid@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 11:40 PM Subject: [KINCAID] Illinois Saint Andrew Society >I just attended the 22nd Annual Highland Games and Scottish Festival in Oak >Brook, IL. It was a fantastic event, I'm not sure how I had never heard of >it before. I was just wondering if any one here is a member of the Saint >Andrew Society. > > Here is a place I found in Chicago but have not visited yet. > > Kincade's Bar & Grill<http://www.kincadesbar.com/kincades/home.asp> > > Jill

Here is a link for Kincaid's Hamburgers in Fort Worth. We've said for years that we were going to try one, but never seem to carry through on the thought. They've been in business since 1946. I've read that it's SRO at lunchtime since the hamburgers are so good. http://www.fwculture.com/kincaids.htm Claire KinKaid Charles KinKaid #1494

I just attended the 22nd Annual Highland Games and Scottish Festival in Oak Brook, IL. It was a fantastic event, I'm not sure how I had never heard of it before. I was just wondering if any one here is a member of the Saint Andrew Society. Here is a place I found in Chicago but have not visited yet. Kincade's Bar & Grill<http://www.kincadesbar.com/kincades/home.asp> Jill

I first heard of Kincaid's Hamburgers from the Pilot and crew of American Airlines when we landed in Dallas around 1970 and they was talking about heading to Kincaid's as soon as possible. Fort Worth is 30 miles away and they had been there before so they thought it was excellent. We have been several times since then and always good. In doing a Google search I see there are lots of Kinkead, Kincade, Kinkade and Kincaid restaurants around the country. Don ----- Original Message ----- From: Claire KinKaid To: Richard Kinkead ; kincaid@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2008 9:11 PM Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Kincaid's Restaurants Here is a link for Kincaid's Hamburgers in Fort Worth. We've said for years that we were going to try one, but never seem to carry through on the thought. They've been in business since 1946. I've read that it's SRO at lunchtime since the hamburgers are so good. http://www.fwculture.com/kincaids.htm Claire KinKaid Charles KinKaid #1494 To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Someone brought up the topic of Kincaid's Restaurants recently (as opposed to Kinkead's Restaurant in DC). I keep seeing these on Ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com:80/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=370063226434&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:US:1123 Dick Kinkead Lantana, FL

The markers 26-37 panel for #119921 has been returned. He has a 12 at marker 26 (DYS 460). This places him in Group A-1b. The only other variance from Group A Apparent Ancestral Value is at marker 13 (DYS 458). This is a rare value within group A with only one other occurance (in A-2b). Unless someone else shows up with this variance within A-1b, it can be considered as a recent mutation. His 48-60 marker panel results have not been posted as yet. Chuck is presently working on a vetting post. He is quite confident back to Samuel b. 1736 in Sadbury Township, Chester Co., PA d. Oct 1810 in Fawn Township, York Co. PA. and there is probable cause to believe Samuel is son of John of Sadsbury. The probable linkage from Samuel to John got stronger with the return of this panel as #37382 (Group A-1b), who is vetted to David of Bourbon Co. KY d 1795, also has probable cause to believe that David is son of John of Sadsbury. Each of these 2 participants has another variance from the Group A AAV. The above mentioned marker 13 variance for #119921 and a marker 33 (DYS 570) variance for #37382. The later again is a rare mutation within the project . One other participant ( in A-1a) also has this value but there is not a clear connecting pathway between the 2 incidences without showing a parallel mutation at marker 26. As it is so expensive to isolate each of these mutations to the originating individual, I would think a good paper trail to John of Sadsbury would in effect isolate each of their mutations downline from John. Sue Liedtke

I think 1778/1787 as a birthdate for Thomas is a reversal of numbers, but I am not sure Sallye considered the date an error when she wrote Deep Roots. She is aware she has Thomas marrying at age 15 as she twice mentions his young age. It would appear Sallye did not check her DAR application for the date. A 1787 birth year would make Thomas younger than his wife Abigail who was born in 1785.   In the 1810 Montgomery Co, KY census, Thomas' age is listed as 26-45 (1765-1784). Abigail's age is listed as 16-26, correct for a birthdate of 1785.   Thomas and Abigail's son William was living with John, son of Archibald, in 1850. In 1830 William is not with his mother Abigail and step-father. He may have been the extra male in John's 1830 household. When William gave the information for John's death certificate in 1853, he did not know the parents names. He simply recorded them as Kincaid. Thomas and Abigail's son Andrew was not with his mother and step-father in 1830. I think he may have been in the extra male in the household of the surviving Thomas Kincaid. The surviving Thomas states in 1850 that he was b1772. The will of Thomas d1817 was witnessed by Thomas Kincaid, Sr.  In the record of Thomas and Abigail, it is stated their son Samuel never married and moved to IL in 1836. Samuel married Lucy Smith and lived in Bath County until about 1865.They both died in IL. His brother Andrew moved to IL in 1836. Jane, who married Frank Knox did have children. William, b1813, married Jane Fletcher in 1832 and Berillian Hill in 1837. William, son of Archibald, was the man who married Polly Small in 1815. He married Barbara Neal in 1829. In the record of Archibald and Janet, Sallye states Martin and John Townsley Kincaid are children of James Kincaid 1782-1872. Census records seem to indicate they were children of Thomas Kincaid b 1772. I haven't seen any records for James Kincaid.    Sallye gives some information about Archibald's Revolutionary War service. She says Andrew also served but gives no record. I am guessing someone previous to her had filed a DAR application giving Archibald's service record--probably someone from the family of Archibald's son Andrew m Ann Caldwell.  She says she has no records for Andrew and Martha's family but they undoubtedly lived somewhere in central Kentucky (they moved to IL).     Did Rebecca Kincaid Coyle b1815, in fact, state in her bible her grandparents were Archibald and Janet? (I only have the Kincaid section of Hines work and have not seen the Coyle section). If so, could Rebecca have assumed her grandparents were Archibald and Janet since Andrew and Martha and their children had moved to IL before 1820? If Hines work did not exist, would I be a minority of one thinking Thomas m Abigail was the son of Andrew and Martha, and Thomas m Mary Bracken was the son of Archibald and Janet? I think I will stop thinking and just beg Janet and Martha for enlightenment.

We have several who have upgraded taking advantage of the current special promotion. Brenda Kincaid Beatty #31493 in Group A, Set 1a has upgraded to 67 markers. Treasa Brookman Sample 4323, also Group A, Set 1a has upgraded to 67. Raymond L. Kincade Kit Number 5806, also Group A, Set 1a has upgraded to 67 markers. We have had notes from some in other Groups contact us and believe there will be additional upgrades. I think Sue's message might help to identify those whose upgrades to 37 markers will be most beneficial so copying it here: I do urge any who have not upgraded to 37 markers to take advantage of the discount before the end of the month. There are 4 members of Group A, 1 in Group C-1, 3 in C-2 who are not recorded for 37 markers. A 5th member of Group A is unable to upgrade to 37 due to death of the donor and problems with upgrading using the previous samples. There are also 11 others from scattered, smaller groups or ungrouped who might benefit at some point in time from expansion to 37 markers. Sue Liedtke The Kincaid Surname DNA Project currently has $296.50 in funds so if there are Kincaid DNA participants who would like to upgrade but want help on the cost and your results will benefit several others, please contact us privately and the committee will review and consider contributing to the cost of an upgrade if it is indeed beneficial to more than just yourself. With the current 25% discount your funds and the Kincaid DNA funds will go much further while the promotional discount of approximately 25% is on. The promotion ends June 30! Money from the fund can also be used to help with the cost of a new participant if their paper trail is good and their results would benefit several. Thanks to all who have contributed funds! Don W. Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Admin. donwkincaid@cox.net 254 631-5684

Kincaid Listers, Below is a copy of an email we sent to all the Kincaid Surname DNA Project participants and thought you might like to know about the special offer also. Don Kincaid DNA participants, You should have received an email from Family Tree DNA telling you about their special discount offer on upgrades. I checked the price for the 37 marker to 67 marker test and it is $69 on the special offer versus $89 regular price which is about 25% off, so if you want to upgrade, now is the time. The offer expires June 30th. I believe those who have only 12 markers or 25 markers will benefit the most if you upgrade to 37 markers so that Sue can place you on the Kincaid DNA results chart. Some of you at 37 markers currently will benefit with a 67 marker test to further define your lineage but we do not recommend all to upgrade unless you want to put on record your 67 marker results for posterity. DNA results are good for identifying your biological line but cannot identify your particular ancestor so documentation is still critical to go along with DNA. Below is a copy of the letter we received from Bennett Greenspan of FTDNA: Don W. Kincaid Kincaid Surname DNA Admin. donwkincaid@cox.net 254 631-5684 Dear Kincaid Administrator, Family Tree DNA has been an industry leader in helping families find lost connections. As a result, the size of our database is unmatched and has achieved critical mass, allowing more and more family members and even adoptees or descendants of adoptees to find their biological paternal lines, including the surname of the original family. Are there missing Kincaid's among these adoptees looking for their connection to this direct paternal line? In an effort to help answer that question Family Tree DNA is offering, for the first time ever, a discount on all Y DNA upgrades! We will be notifying each participant in the database who qualifies for this offer by email, and will provide them a direct link they may use to take advantage of this upgrade. There will be no need for participants to contact us directly in order to receive the reduced price; our prices will be adjusted in the system accordingly. The offer will be from June 20th to June 30th. During this time, Family Tree DNA will reduce all of our Y-DNA upgrade prices. On average, the reduced prices will be 25% lower than the original upgrade price. This is a great opportunity to increase the data in your surname project. Are there members who have been hesitant to upgrade due to price? This rare discount is an opportunity for them to upgrade and help both their group and potential lost relatives at the same time. When encouraging members to upgrade, you may wish to note that genetic matches allow people to find their biological lines rather than a specific individual. This promotion is for upgrades only and does not apply to new kit orders. It’s our way to thank past customers for their patronage. As always, we appreciate your continued support. Family Tree DNA If at any time you want to stop receiving e-mails from your DNA Project Administrator, please go to the "Setup Preferences" section of your personal page and change the corresponding setting.

Absolutely no harm done to repeat a record, if it is indeed a repeat. Sometimes a record which gets lost in the shuffle is not found and when given again can be just the thing needed to be a breakthrough for someone. Thank you for posting. I'm at the tail end of a week-long reunion with children and grandchildren and go home tomorrow. It's a mixed feeling ending - I'll be thankful for peace and quiet again, but at the same time I will miss all of them. Ruth Cherecwich In a message dated 6/20/2008 4:38:48 PM Mountain Daylight Time, thelmamarie55@earthlink.net writes: Due to the fact until someone matches Ted I have nothing I can add to help the list. I ran across this Ohio death record and thought if you all know it no harm done and maybe it will be new info. It is for Charles White b. abt. 1872, single, d. 20 Jan 1933 in Zanesville, Muskingum Co. Ohio birth place Zanesville. Father Oscar White b. Zanesville Mother Sarah Kinkade b. Zanesville All this info was given for the death certificate by Margaret ??? I ran across this due to the fact my Mom's maiden name was White. Hope I am not retracking old steps. Tootsie **************Gas prices getting you down? Search AOL Autos for fuel-efficient used cars. (http://autos.aol.com/used?ncid=aolaut00050000000007)

Due to the fact until someone matches Ted I have nothing I can add to help the list. I ran across this Ohio death record and thought if you all know it no harm done and maybe it will be new info. It is for Charles White b. abt. 1872, single, d. 20 Jan 1933 in Zanesville, Muskingum Co. Ohio birth place Zanesville. Father Oscar White b. Zanesville Mother Sarah Kinkade b. Zanesville All this info was given for the death certificate by Margaret ??? I ran across this due to the fact my Mom's maiden name was White. Hope I am not retracking old steps. Tootsie Then ................... when it seems we will never smile again, life comes back.

This record says that Rebecca Kincaid married a James Coyle. Bath County News-Outlook Thursday, May 5, 1938 Old Citizen Passes Mrs. Martha Ellen Bailey, 87, widow of the late John S. Bailey, died at the home of her son, Tom Horseman, near Harpers Monday, May 2. Mrs. Bailey, one of bath's oldest citizens, was a native of this county, a daughter of the late James and Rebecca Kincaid Coyle. http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~warner/bath-paper-obits.htm#K ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Liedtke" <seleaml@actionnet.net> To: "Randall Kincaid" <rkincaid@sprynet.com>; <kincaid@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, June 20, 2008 12:13 PM Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Fw: Thomas Kincaid and Abigail Hirons > That last two numbers in the dates 1787 and 1778 are reversals. I catch > reversal typos frequently in what I enter, but then I am a lousy typist > and > my mind frequently jumps ahead of what I am typing. The 1778 date works > out > much better for Thomas/Abrigail Hirons. It looks like this couple had a > son > Andrew but not a son Archibald. I wonder why Rebecca Coyle thought that > her > grandfather was Archibald? People usually know their grandparents? > > Sue Liedtke > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Randall Kincaid" <rkincaid@sprynet.com> > To: <kincaid@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2008 11:34 AM > Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Fw: Thomas Kincaid and Abigail Hirons > > >> But then again, Deep Roots has the date of April 21, 1787 for Archibald's >> Thomas while Hines submitted Testimonial from Coyle for her DAR >> application has the date of April 21, 1778. Why the discrepancy between >> Deep Roots and Hines' earlier DAR application? Who knows. We do know from >> census, marriage and children's birthdates that 1787 is an unlikely >> birthyear for the Thomas who married Abigail Hirons (Irons). >> To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: >> http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Liedtke" <seleaml@actionnet.net> To: "Randall Kincaid" <rkincaid@sprynet.com>; <kincaid@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, June 20, 2008 12:13 PM Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Fw: Thomas Kincaid and Abigail Hirons > That last two numbers in the dates 1787 and 1778 are reversals. I catch > reversal typos frequently in what I enter, but then I am a lousy typist > and > my mind frequently jumps ahead of what I am typing. The 1778 date works > out > much better for Thomas/Abrigail Hirons. It looks like this couple had a > son > Andrew but not a son Archibald. I wonder why Rebecca Coyle thought that > her > grandfather was Archibald? People usually know their grandparents? > > Sue Liedtke > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Randall Kincaid" <rkincaid@sprynet.com> > To: <kincaid@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Thursday, June 19, 2008 11:34 AM > Subject: Re: [KINCAID] Fw: Thomas Kincaid and Abigail Hirons > > >> But then again, Deep Roots has the date of April 21, 1787 for Archibald's >> Thomas while Hines submitted Testimonial from Coyle for her DAR >> application has the date of April 21, 1778. Why the discrepancy between >> Deep Roots and Hines' earlier DAR application? Who knows. We do know from >> census, marriage and children's birthdates that 1787 is an unlikely >> birthyear for the Thomas who married Abigail Hirons (Irons). >> To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: >> http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > To see the Kincaid of all spellings DNA chart in Excel: > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~adgedge/Research/April%202004/Kincaid%20%20DNA.xls > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KINCAID-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Transposed characters is the easy answer. I'm just careful to not jump too quickly to that, especially since the traditional listing of Archibald's children has a sequence of birthyears into which 1787 for Thomas fits. However, analysis of census, birth records and marriage records has strong indications that the traditional listings' birthyears for Archibald children may not be correct.