Thank you Mary, I did not know about another daughter Ann,  the rest of the children were all baptised at The Union House of Wickhambreaux so they seem to have had quite an attachment to the workhouse both Bridge and Wickhambreaux. I can confirm that the Sophia in the workhouse at Shoreditch is not the one from this family,  I have found the owner. I am also pretty sure that the Charles 1861 is the right one at this stage. With thanks,  Sylvia. ________________________________ From: Helen Whapshott <helen.whapshott@ntlworld.com> To: sylvia thomas <boxstaffy@yahoo.com.au> Sent: Tue, 19 January, 2010 5:50:35 PM Subject: RE: [KENT-ENG] HOLNESS death. Hi Sylvia Had a quick look at the Wickhambreaux PRs - Looks as if the Thomas who died at Bridge Union is the right one - he was buried at Wickhambreaux on 20th October 1867 aged 77 and described as being of Wickhambreaux.  Ann is also there buried 24th August 1885 aged 77.  I also found another Ann, daughter of Thomas and Ann, baptised at Wickhambreaux on 5th July 1835.  She died 1840, buried Wickhambreaux 9th March 1840 aged 4. I have found Sophia in the 1881 census in the district workhouse, Shoreditch, laundress and unmarried with a baby aged 1 month, Maggie born in Shoreditch. Charles is in Bridge union in 1861 census Like you, can't find any more at the moment but can send pages if you do not have Ancestry. Hope this helps Helen -----Original Message----- From: kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of sylvia thomas Sent: 19 January 2010 00:15 To: KENT-ENG@rootsweb.com Subject: [KENT-ENG] HOLNESS death. Hi Everyone, This may sound stupid,  but how do you know when you have the right death? This family is the bane of my life and may or may not be mine. The family 1851 is at Wickhambreaux consisting of Thomas HOLNESS father, mother Ann, sons Thomas, William, Charles and daughter Sophia. Thomas snr birthplace is said to be Whitchurch, Hants. Ann, Canterbury. This had me stumped fo some time as I could find neither 1861. In the end I decided the birthplaces were swapped. Ann appears 1861 birthplace, Hants.says she is a widow. Thomas along with the rest of the family vaporise. No show for Ann 1871,  1881 she is at Bridge as a Nurse pauper, born, Hants. Ann died at Bridge Union Workhouse.1885 age 77 widow of Thomas HOLNESS .  So far this looks promising. There are 4 Thomas Holness deaths between 1851 and 1861. One of them a 3 week old, 1854.. That leaves 3. An email way back on the Holness list (not to me) said that the  Thomas Holness death 1867 was the husband of Ann. and they were both buried at Bridge. (This person is not on the list now) So, I ordered this cert.,  it says Thomas Holness age 77 farm labourer, died Bridge Union Workhouse. the age fits with 1851 census. I'm still not totally convinced that this is the right one. So,  other than ordering the other three, bearing in mind that this family do not seem to know where they were born,  if they were born or where they were at any time other than the 1851 census. I still have no proof that they are mine, but keep plugging along just in case something comes up. I realise the obvious is to just order ther othere three certs.,  but are thy going to tell me any more than the 1867 one. Unlike a female death cert that tells you if she was a widdow and who her husband was. Any ideas anyone? Regards Sylvia in Aus. ____________________________________________________________________________ ______ See what's on at the movies in your area. Find out now: http://au.movies.yahoo.com/session-times/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message __________________________________________________________________________________ See what's on at the movies in your area. Find out now: http://au..movies.yahoo.com/session-times/