Sittingbourne Bapts for CROFT; 1727 23-Jul Elizabeth D of Peter Mary CROFT 1793 27-Feb Thomas S of Thomas Mary CROFT 1791 27-Mar Sarah D of Thomas Sarah CROFT Marriage 1788 11/17 Thomas CROFT Tp Sarah BACK B Richard Smith Susan Smith Best regards Lozzie

Hi Listers Can anyone help with a baptism for THOMAS CROFT born about 1795 in Sittingbourne. He married an Elizabeth TUFNAIL in Chatham St Marys in 1820. The family moved to Gravesend by 1841, several children were bapised in Chalk Parish church, a favourite haunt of Charles Dickens. Later children were baptised in Gravesend. In the 1851 and 1861 census ( occ Wheelwright) he gives his place of birth as Sittingbourne. Any help appreciated Lynne

Hi Kevin, This came up a while ago on another List. If I remember correctly, the general concensus was that a lodger paid for a room, but a boarder paid for room and meals. Cheers Trish Nowra NSW > Can any one tell me the difference between a Boarder & Lodger on the > census forms. > Kevin (England)

Hi! I know you have had many replies, but just to add a small aide-memoire: A lodge = a small temporary house A board = a piece of wood that can be used as a table So a lodger has (as his house) a small part of your bigger house. A boarder sits at your board or, in other words, at your table. The difference isn't just applicable to census forms, it still applies today. -- Anne ---- Kevin Poile <kevin.poile@googlemail.com> wrote: > Hi Listers, > > Can any one tell me the difference between a Boarder & Lodger on the > census forms. > <SNIP>

Sue Slater wrote: > Hi Charani > > Just a suggestion but could you have the wrong birth for Edith Ann. I see > one on FreeBMD for an Edith Ann Rogers reg. Mar 1873 Greenwich, ref: 1d 851, > which would be slightly closer agewise and Greenwich is not a million miles > from Deptford. > > Just a thought! Thanks for your thought :)) The Edith Ann registered in Mar 1873 is the same child who was baptised in Aug 1874 with her sister who was born that year. Deptford falls within the Greenwich RD. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton and Greinton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk

Hi Charani Just a suggestion but could you have the wrong birth for Edith Ann. I see one on FreeBMD for an Edith Ann Rogers reg. Mar 1873 Greenwich, ref: 1d 851, which would be slightly closer agewise and Greenwich is not a million miles from Deptford. Just a thought! Sue -----Original Message----- From: kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Charani Sent: 21 January 2010 22:09 To: KENT-ENG@rootsweb.com Subject: [KENT-ENG] ROGERS of Blackheath and Deptford (Apologies for any London list members who've seen this already.) I have a ROGERS family who are causing me a major headache. In 1881 Caroline ROGERS, widow age 30, is listed with William George ROGERS, son age 10, and Edith Ann ROGERS, dau age 8. They were living in Deptford St Nicholas. I found Edith's baptism in August 1874 giving her parents as William George and Caroline ROGERS and a sister, Lydia Caroline who unfortunately died the following year. No trace of William jnr's though. I got the birth certs for William jnr and Edith, plus Lydia's death cert. As expected Edith and Lydia were sisters. Their mother's maiden name was LEWIS. William jnr, however, was NOT their brother. His parents were Henry and Caroline (nee BARBER). I've been able to find them in the 1871 census, nor have I been able to find his baptism which should have been in St Paul's Deptford where the family lived. I'm still looking for the marriage of William George ROGERS and Caroline LEWIS. Without that I'm stuck for the next step back. There's a likely death for William snr in Greenwich in 1880 but the registers are not available on Ancestry as yet. I found a possible match for Caroline LEWIS in Greenwich RD in 1849, dau of George and Hannah LEWIS. She was in the 1851 and 1861 censuses but then seems to disappear. However, without the marriage cert, there's no way of knowing if this is the right person or not. If William George and Edith Ann were not brother and sister, who was the Caroline? Caroline LEWIS or Caroline BARBER? Were Henry and William George brothers? Any help in finding the ROGERS/LEWIS marriage would be much appreciated. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton and Greinton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi All I think Wm F S is enumerated twice in 1871. He is shown once with grandparents (aged 3) as mentioned by Dennis but also with parents Samuel & Lorna at 48 Lloyde? Street, Everton. Samuel B is a Pilot aged 28 b Liverpool, Lorna aged 26 b Liverpool. (Although transcribed as Lorna I think it says Anna on the census record.) William F S aged 3 b Liverpool and Samuel B aged 1. Also present is Ellen E Blundell, Servant, aged 16. Now I am confused. In 1881 Wm F S is shown at 30 Winslow Street, Walton on Hill, Lancs with mother Lucie? Cannell, Widow, aged 36 Annuitant b Liverpool, and siblings Samuel B 11, Thomas 9, Percival 6 and Herbert 4, all born Liverpool. He's not immediately apparent in 1891 or 1901. However, there is a birth registration for a Wm Frederick S Cannell in Sep 1867 West Derby district, ref: 8b 377. Regards Sue -----Original Message----- From: kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of dennis bramble Sent: 21 January 2010 21:07 To: Dave Dixon; kent-eng@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [KENT-ENG] William Frederick Shakespeare CANNELL Hello Dave, On the 1871 census is found, William F.S.CANNELL, grandson of head of house wth his wife and daughter, Mary E.Cannell. The address is, Sackville St, Everton, Liverpool. Birth given as 1871. Regards, Dennis Bramble. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Dixon" <Dave@fadedgenes.co.uk> To: "kent-eng@rootsweb.com" <KENT-ENG@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 8:12 PM Subject: [KENT-ENG] William Frederick Shakespeare CANNELL > Hi All > > William Frederick Shakespeare CANNELL was a Trinity House Pilot in Dover > from about 1911 to 1939. He was born about 1867 in Liverpool. > > I am trying to piece together info on his earlier life and I would > appreciate census info for 1871, 1891 or 1901 if anybody can find him for > me. > > Many thanks > Dave Dixon > BA (hons) - Economic & Social History - University of Kent - Canterbury > 1997 > > www.fadedgenes.co.uk > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ______________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by Netintelligence > http://www.netintelligence.com/email > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks for all the quick replies they make sense and would explain why in some households there are both Lodgers and Boarders. Would I then be right to expect the boarders are paying a bit more given the fact that they are being fed whereas the lodgers are having to fend for themselves. Kevin (England)

(Apologies for any London list members who've seen this already.) I have a ROGERS family who are causing me a major headache. In 1881 Caroline ROGERS, widow age 30, is listed with William George ROGERS, son age 10, and Edith Ann ROGERS, dau age 8. They were living in Deptford St Nicholas. I found Edith's baptism in August 1874 giving her parents as William George and Caroline ROGERS and a sister, Lydia Caroline who unfortunately died the following year. No trace of William jnr's though. I got the birth certs for William jnr and Edith, plus Lydia's death cert. As expected Edith and Lydia were sisters. Their mother's maiden name was LEWIS. William jnr, however, was NOT their brother. His parents were Henry and Caroline (nee BARBER). I've been able to find them in the 1871 census, nor have I been able to find his baptism which should have been in St Paul's Deptford where the family lived. I'm still looking for the marriage of William George ROGERS and Caroline LEWIS. Without that I'm stuck for the next step back. There's a likely death for William snr in Greenwich in 1880 but the registers are not available on Ancestry as yet. I found a possible match for Caroline LEWIS in Greenwich RD in 1849, dau of George and Hannah LEWIS. She was in the 1851 and 1861 censuses but then seems to disappear. However, without the marriage cert, there's no way of knowing if this is the right person or not. If William George and Edith Ann were not brother and sister, who was the Caroline? Caroline LEWIS or Caroline BARBER? Were Henry and William George brothers? Any help in finding the ROGERS/LEWIS marriage would be much appreciated. -- Charani (UK) OPC for Walton and Greinton, SOM Asst OPC for Ashcott and Shapwick, SOM http://wsom-opc.org.uk

Hi Kevin My understanding is that a Boarder had his meals provided for him and a Lodger did not. Not sure if this is right Regards Sue -----Original Message----- From: kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Poile Sent: 21 January 2010 21:16 To: KENT-ENG@rootsweb.com Subject: [KENT-ENG] Difference between Lodger & Boarder Hi Listers, Can any one tell me the difference between a Boarder & Lodger on the census forms. I was always of the opinion they were probably one and the same. However, now I'm pretty sure there must be a difference since I have started to come across households where there is a mixture of the two. Looking forward to your thoughts. Kevin (England) Kent Interests include (but is not restricted to): POILE, JENNER, BRYANT, BURDEN, HUMPHREY, HOWARD. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Kevin I always thought that a lodger occupied a seperate room or rooms within the property, whereas a boarder lived as part of the family, sharing meals with them etc. Al the best Dave Dixon BA (hons) - Economic & Social History - University of Kent - Canterbury 1997 www.fadedgenes.co.uk 2010/1/21 Kevin Poile <kevin.poile@googlemail.com> > Hi Listers, > > Can any one tell me the difference between a Boarder & Lodger on the > census forms. > > I was always of the opinion they were probably one and the same. > However, now I'm pretty sure there must be a difference since I have > started to come across households where there is a mixture of the two. > > Looking forward to your thoughts. > > Kevin (England) > > Kent Interests include (but is not restricted to): POILE, JENNER, > BRYANT, BURDEN, HUMPHREY, HOWARD. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi Pam, Stella & John Thanks for your helpful suggestions. For years I thought Amy probably came from Sussex as I noticed the name when I was researching my Sussex ancestors, I have searched the SFHG on-line indexes with no luck. It is only recently I discovered that Amy said she came from Canterbury. If you Google for "Amy Achust" there are 2 hits, my message to one of the Bucks lists in 2004 and an incorrect family tree marrying William & Amy's daughter Mary Ann to the wrong husband! I agree ACHUST seems just Amy's own interpretation of her name. The variety of spellings makes it hard to use search engines and indexes efficiently. Amy didn't marry in Bucks but at St Martin in the Fields and they were both living at the same London Address. I have Bucks ancestors so I am familiar with the Bucks resources and I have read the Great Missenden PRs on film as well as getting searches from the Bucks FHS databases. I hadn't got around to the ONS but I shall certainly do that. I had a look on Ancestry and in 1841 there are ACKHURSTs living in Teynham, AKHURSTs in Faversham and Linstead (Lynsted?) and ARKHURSTs in Graveney, so it looks a good area to investigate further. Thanks again and best wishes from Diana

Hi Listers, Can any one tell me the difference between a Boarder & Lodger on the census forms. I was always of the opinion they were probably one and the same. However, now I'm pretty sure there must be a difference since I have started to come across households where there is a mixture of the two. Looking forward to your thoughts. Kevin (England) Kent Interests include (but is not restricted to): POILE, JENNER, BRYANT, BURDEN, HUMPHREY, HOWARD.

Hello Dave, On the 1871 census is found, William F.S.CANNELL, grandson of head of house wth his wife and daughter, Mary E.Cannell. The address is, Sackville St, Everton, Liverpool. Birth given as 1871. Regards, Dennis Bramble. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Dixon" <Dave@fadedgenes.co.uk> To: "kent-eng@rootsweb.com" <KENT-ENG@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 8:12 PM Subject: [KENT-ENG] William Frederick Shakespeare CANNELL > Hi All > > William Frederick Shakespeare CANNELL was a Trinity House Pilot in Dover > from about 1911 to 1939. He was born about 1867 in Liverpool. > > I am trying to piece together info on his earlier life and I would > appreciate census info for 1871, 1891 or 1901 if anybody can find him for > me. > > Many thanks > Dave Dixon > BA (hons) - Economic & Social History - University of Kent - Canterbury > 1997 > > www.fadedgenes.co.uk > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ______________________________________________ > This email has been scanned by Netintelligence > http://www.netintelligence.com/email >

Hi All William Frederick Shakespeare CANNELL was a Trinity House Pilot in Dover from about 1911 to 1939. He was born about 1867 in Liverpool. I am trying to piece together info on his earlier life and I would appreciate census info for 1871, 1891 or 1901 if anybody can find him for me. Many thanks Dave Dixon BA (hons) - Economic & Social History - University of Kent - Canterbury 1997 www.fadedgenes.co.uk

Dear List My first post to this list and hoping for help with a brickwall aka Joseph GARRETT. This what I have at the moment: Joseph GARRETT Mariner Medway area Belinda wife born c.1804 Chatham, Kent d. 26 September 1886, Wapping, Middlesex Jane Elizabeth GARRETT daughter born 1833 Chatham, Kent died 3 March 1895 (wife to Joseph William MORRILL) Joseph Garrett does not appear in the 1841 census, either at sea or deceased - Belinda later remarries in 1846. Any thoughts or information would be most welcome! Best wishes Pam Morrill

P.S. to my previous In 1851 Stephen is in Blean with parents Thomas & Elizabeth, and siblings Henry & Sarah A and grandmother Elizabeth Saffery, aged 79, a Pauper, b Sturry. In 1861 he is a Carter, lodging with the Best family in Pean Hill, Whitstable (Joseph Best - Carter). Sue -----Original Message----- From: kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of gloria Sent: 21 January 2010 12:16 To: kent-eng@rootsweb.com Subject: [KENT-ENG] FW: GLADDISH I have looked further into this and it appears that William Wilfred Gladdish started life as William Wilfred Cladish. His marriage to my grandfathers sister has him as Gladdish and that agrees with his military records. But cant find a birth for Gladdish. There is a Stepehn Cladish 1901 England Census about Stephen Cladish on 1901 which would appear to be the correct family. Name: Stephen Cladish Age: 54 Estimated birth year: abt 1847 Relation: Head Spouse's name: Harriett Gender: Male Where born: Whitstable, Kent, England Civil parish: Northfleet Ecclesiastical parish: St Botolph County/Island: Kent Country: England Street Address: Registration district: Strood Sub-registration district: Northfleet ED, institution, or vessel: 5 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 130 Household Members: Name Age Stephen Cladish 54 Harriett Cladish 50 Edward H Cladish 16 Horace A Cladish 14 Sidney J Cladish 9 William W Cladish 2 Found a baptism for Edward Charly Claddish. How can you just change the first letter of your surname? GLoria -----Original Message----- From: Lynne Berntsson [mailto:54berntsson@telia.com] Sent: 21 January 2010 11:07 To: gloria Subject: Re: [KENT-ENG] GLADDISH Hi Gloria I have a Stephen Gladish on my tree but I have no other details other than he was a Labourer and he had a daughter called Sarah Ann (B) 1870 married to Albert Henry Lipscombe 21 Apr 1889 St Botolph Northfleet Kent Lynne ----- Original Message ----- From: "gloria" <zgloryerm2@ntlworld.com> To: <kent-eng@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2010 10:01 PM Subject: [KENT-ENG] GLADDISH > Has anybody got a connection to WILLIAM WILFRED GLADDISH c 1896 son of > STEPHEN GLADDISH? > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I see a birth for William Wilfred Cladish on FreeBMD. William Wilfred CLADISH Dec Qtr. 1894 Strood district Ref: 2a 517. This does make him rather older than shown in the 1901 census. You would think it would be easy to tell whether your child was 2 or 6 and it certainly looks like 2 on the census record. There are lots of Cladish births in Kent - no Gladish or Gladdish. I see Stephen, Harriet and family in 1891 still called Cladish although Stephen's place of birth has now moved from Whitstable to Canterbury (although I couldn't find one of the right age on FreeBMD and he doesn't appear in Canterbury baptisms). So who knows, perhaps William thought Gladdish sounded a bit classier! I assume they didn't check birth registration records for the marriage. Sue -----Original Message----- From: kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:kent-eng-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of gloria Sent: 21 January 2010 12:16 To: kent-eng@rootsweb.com Subject: [KENT-ENG] FW: GLADDISH I have looked further into this and it appears that William Wilfred Gladdish started life as William Wilfred Cladish. His marriage to my grandfathers sister has him as Gladdish and that agrees with his military records. But cant find a birth for Gladdish. There is a Stepehn Cladish 1901 England Census about Stephen Cladish on 1901 which would appear to be the correct family. Name: Stephen Cladish Age: 54 Estimated birth year: abt 1847 Relation: Head Spouse's name: Harriett Gender: Male Where born: Whitstable, Kent, England Civil parish: Northfleet Ecclesiastical parish: St Botolph County/Island: Kent Country: England Street Address: Registration district: Strood Sub-registration district: Northfleet ED, institution, or vessel: 5 Neighbors: View others on page Household schedule number: 130 Household Members: Name Age Stephen Cladish 54 Harriett Cladish 50 Edward H Cladish 16 Horace A Cladish 14 Sidney J Cladish 9 William W Cladish 2 Found a baptism for Edward Charly Claddish. How can you just change the first letter of your surname? GLoria -----Original Message----- From: Lynne Berntsson [mailto:54berntsson@telia.com] Sent: 21 January 2010 11:07 To: gloria Subject: Re: [KENT-ENG] GLADDISH Hi Gloria I have a Stephen Gladish on my tree but I have no other details other than he was a Labourer and he had a daughter called Sarah Ann (B) 1870 married to Albert Henry Lipscombe 21 Apr 1889 St Botolph Northfleet Kent Lynne ----- Original Message ----- From: "gloria" <zgloryerm2@ntlworld.com> To: <kent-eng@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2010 10:01 PM Subject: [KENT-ENG] GLADDISH > Has anybody got a connection to WILLIAM WILFRED GLADDISH c 1896 son of > STEPHEN GLADDISH? > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Kevin , The Lodger would only pay for the place to live/sleep - they would go out to eat. *though when my mother had lodgers - she had a hot plate that they could use - were not charged for same [they were also invited to eat with the family on special occassions -or bad weather etc] Boarders - paid for the room/s that they lived/ slept in - also paid usually a set amount for the food that was served. [a set fee per month] There were Rooming Houses - with no cooking facilities. There were also Boarding Houses - only - persons were expected to attend meals - at a set time. Cheers, Stella At 02:19 PM 21/01/2010, Kevin Poile wrote: >Thanks for all the quick replies they make sense and would explain why >in some households there are both Lodgers and Boarders. > >Would I then be right to expect the boarders are paying a bit more >given the fact that they are being fed whereas the lodgers are having >to fend for themselves. > >Kevin (England) > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

In the 1961, 1963 and 1969 Kelly's a Frederick J Mankelow is at 7 Ursuline Drive. ----- Original Message ---- From: Chris Page <chris@g4bue.com> To: KENT-ENG-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Thursday, 21 January, 2010 14:31:47 Subject: [KENT-ENG] MANKELOW Family of Westgate/Margate, Kent Does anybody have access to a Street Directory or other record for the Westgate and Margate area of Kent that may be able to tell me anything (especially the christian name(s) or even initial(s)) of a Mr and Mrs MANKELOW who were residing at 7 Ursuline Drive, Westgate, Kent on 2 March 1964, please? Thanks for any help Chris Page ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to KENT-ENG-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message