The plea for more James men to take the test is to HELP everyone. I will give one example. Three men match who have traced their line back to David James 1669-1739 using traditional genealogical research methods. The DNA testing basically proved scientifically that these men all share a common ancestor--most likely David James, since they all independently traced their lineage back to him. Now, a fourth man came along and matched those three men. He has not yet traced his line back as far as David James, yet obviously because of his perfect DNA match, he comes from the same line of James. How WONDERFUL FOR HIM THAT HE HAS THREE MATCHES!!!! Now he has a direction to go in his research--he was "stuck" before- -now he has ideas about where to search for the "missing links". The whole concept of the DNA project is to find matches. It's worthless if you don't match anyone. I've already discussed before on this List the FUN of finding new cousins and SHARING your information with each other. The FTDNA project is yet another way to do that. Genealogy is supposed to be FUN, it's a HOBBY. If you don't enjoy it, don't do it!!! As Linda mentioned, the JAMES name is very common and has many origins. I would expect a wide variety of origins to show up via the DNA project, just as it does in standard research methods. Many surnames should have a variety of DNA results. Even Luter/Lewter, an uncommon name except in the Southern United States, should have several different origins, since many black slaves took the name Lewter after they were freed. The Luter/Lewter name has several different origins in Europe as well. And that is just ONE example. We won't even go into Smith or Jones!! If you MATCH someone with a JAMES Welsh origin, and you have not yet traced your line back to Wales, then you have now benefited from MATCHING someone's DNA results. You can now confirm through your own research that your line came from Wales. Eric, you asked "Why is there such a wide variety? Is the wide variety of results for the James surname appearing in the tests of one company only, or in results of other testing companies as well? How many more varieties of James dna exist?" Why don't you share the results of the testing company you use, and then we would all know the answers to some of the questions you ask. Sorry, but I've heard your side about "commercialism" many times in the past, and I just don't buy it. Let us have our fun with our FTDNA project, and you can have your fun with your project. Maybe we should all stop attacking each other; it's not getting us anywhere. IT'S A HOBBY, IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE FUN!!! Susan --- Original Message --- From: "Eric James" <ericjames@ericjames.org> To: JAMES-L@rootsweb.com Subject: DNA results & the Need to Produce Matches >I truly question the repeated postings such as this: "We need to recruit >some more James men to have the test so that we can find more matches." The >appeal appears more as commercial hucksterism than as bone fide interest in >addressing the dna results being generated. > >If there is a wide variety of results being generated for the James surname, >the more important appeals might be, Why is there such a wide variety? Do >results for other surnames evidence the same wide variety? Is the wide >variety of results for the James surname appearing in the tests of one >company only, or in results of other testing companies as well? How many >more varieties of James dna exist? If the wide variety of results applies to >the James surname only, why is this so? > >Stating more test subjects are needed solely for the purpose of making >matches is like the erroneous genealogical attempts to produce a "fit" or a >"link" simply because the subject name or individual is known to exist. Bone >fide genealogy research starts with the name and follows where it leads. >Evidently, the test results of one dna testing company indicates there is a >wide variety of James dna that exists. Where do those results lead? >The answer is not to the production of more dna test candidates alone.

Certainly genealogy should be fun. However, when one plunks down $200-$500 for dna testing it's reasonable to assume an individual does so with a different expectation other than just having fun. Without breaching any confidentiality in our own James dna test study, it repeatedly has shown that where the genealogy exists the dna has proven consistent. Where the genealogy doesn't exist, the dna is proved not to be consistent with the results of others. Then again, our study is more narrowly focused on specific objectives. It is not broad based, shot gun approach of dna collection by the commercial testing companies. The biggest disappointment in any dna test is not to match with anyone at all. All of a sudden one is defined publicly as being alone in the world. An outsider. At least until someone else can come along with matching dna. I wonder, how does that makes one feel? How demoralizing it that for the individual? Is it like becoming an orphan? Does it inhibit or erase the desire to research further to establish one's authentic genealogy? How stigmatized does when become when one doesn't match anyone else? I imagine the result is akin to the old days when one was found to be orphan and no one talked further about it. In dna testing, when one is found to be an orphan, no one addresses the issue of why or how, except to make an effort to find other prospective orphans to join in. When there follows no explanation or no further investigation or no further research as to why one stands alone or with very few others, then it's easy to become cynical in ascribing other motives to the testing program, be it defined for fun or profit. That's when dna testing ceases to serve the purposes of genealogy. Since dna is one's most personal identifier, it seems the subject would deserve more respect, more analysis, more reporting, and more investigation. Instead, promoters simply move on to getting the next test subject to sign up. -----Original Message----- From: Susan Rosine [mailto:S.JAMES.CLARK@prodigy.net] Sent: Thursday, June 08, 2006 1:01 PM To: JAMES-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [JAMES-L] Re: DNA results & the Need to Produce Matches The plea for more James men to take the test is to HELP everyone. I will give one example. Three men match who have traced their line back to David James 1669-1739 using traditional genealogical research methods. The DNA testing basically proved scientifically that these men all share a common ancestor--most likely David James, since they all independently traced their lineage back to him. Now, a fourth man came along and matched those three men. He has not yet traced his line back as far as David James, yet obviously because of his perfect DNA match, he comes from the same line of James. How WONDERFUL FOR HIM THAT HE HAS THREE MATCHES!!!! Now he has a direction to go in his research--he was "stuck" before- -now he has ideas about where to search for the "missing links". The whole concept of the DNA project is to find matches. It's worthless if you don't match anyone. I've already discussed before on this List the FUN of finding new cousins and SHARING your information with each other. The FTDNA project is yet another way to do that. Genealogy is supposed to be FUN, it's a HOBBY. If you don't enjoy it, don't do it!!! As Linda mentioned, the JAMES name is very common and has many origins. I would expect a wide variety of origins to show up via the DNA project, just as it does in standard research methods. Many surnames should have a variety of DNA results. Even Luter/Lewter, an uncommon name except in the Southern United States, should have several different origins, since many black slaves took the name Lewter after they were freed. The Luter/Lewter name has several different origins in Europe as well. And that is just ONE example. We won't even go into Smith or Jones!! If you MATCH someone with a JAMES Welsh origin, and you have not yet traced your line back to Wales, then you have now benefited from MATCHING someone's DNA results. You can now confirm through your own research that your line came from Wales. Eric, you asked "Why is there such a wide variety? Is the wide variety of results for the James surname appearing in the tests of one company only, or in results of other testing companies as well? How many more varieties of James dna exist?" Why don't you share the results of the testing company you use, and then we would all know the answers to some of the questions you ask. Sorry, but I've heard your side about "commercialism" many times in the past, and I just don't buy it. Let us have our fun with our FTDNA project, and you can have your fun with your project. Maybe we should all stop attacking each other; it's not getting us anywhere. IT'S A HOBBY, IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE FUN!!! Susan