Hi Beryl >>In my mind if a clark miss spells or transcribes a name in a record it than becomes the correct title for the person being recorded. Or even a clerk ;-) Good illustration of how names get spelled incorrectly. Jon Baker -----Original Message----- From: Beryl [mailto:unjera@swiftdsl.com.au] Sent: 13 March 2004 10:06 To: ISLE-OF-WIGHT-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [IoW] Advice with a problem PLEASE Martin, Like Lainee I enter surnames as they were spelt when registered or recorded no matter what the correct spelling should be. In my mind if a clark miss spells or transcribes a name in a record it than becomes the correct title for the person being recorded. Some people never seem to get their name spelt the same twice! For such people it's a good idea to make notes as to where and what record you found the name spelling change. I have an ancestors marriage certificate where the Minister spells the grooms surname three different ways on the same certificate! I also have a German MAY ancestor who's surname I have found spelt 26 different ways. YES 26 ways. If that can happen with a simple name like MAY what fun we're all going to have with our longer names :-( Beryl ______________________________

Well said Angela! The name question does get ridiculous sometimes and people often fail to realize that literacy has only become widespread in the last century or so. Consequently names were often written down by struggling clerics just as they sounded. A rather proud cleric might well have been tempted to add a little flourish of academic flair by adding a subtle, and suitably silent 'e'. The Scots and the Americans pronounce my family name URRY as in 'fury', the English pronounce the name as in 'hurry', the Irish pronounce it as in 'gory' and these different pronunciations have naturally led to different spelling of the same name. One of my more illustrious ancestors of the 17th century, signed his name differently on several very official documents. I guess he just couldn't spell! Thank you Angela, for your frequent and interesting contributions to the list and for keeping the more passive listers such as myself, so well informed. Mark URRY Marans, France. URRY Family History at http://www.marcireau.fr/urry/ -----Original Message----- From: Angela McMurtry [mailto:palmtreeqld@optusnet.com.au] Sent: 13 March 2004 03:54 To: ISLE-OF-WIGHT-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [IoW] Name Changes Martin The million dollar question Brown or Browne / Clarke or Clark / Cowan or McCowan or Coan. I have this problem all the time. For myself , I use the most common form in the family but always make a note in the file somwhere to tell me another spelling has been used . What I do get frustrated with are some people who contact me re Clarke and I have their family in my database but they reject the details because ' mine were CLARK without the E ' .. lost count of the number of times Ive been frustrated with people ! Any name I research I always check for spelling variations particulary in Census. More puzzling are those families who decide to have a complete name change . One of my IOW LALLOW families decided to adopt the surname LAWRENCE and use LALLOW as a middle name . I have kept them as Lallow but made a note they opted for Lawrence . All gets a bit confusing Angela ______________________________

Hello all, I have been following the change of name spellings with interest. Derek's email was of particular interest. A great-uncle of mine changed his name from Parcell to Purcell. He was the only sibling to do this and it seemes that he made the change when he was around 20 years old. He has led me on quite a search to prove that the Purcells and Parcells were one and the same family. It never occurred to me that he might have had something to hide! John -- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 7.0.211 / Virus Database: 262.4.4 - Release Date: 13/03/2004

Dear Friends & Cousins, It seems as though many of you have not found the fabulous documetnsonline site yet. Go to: http://www.documentsonline.pro.gov.uk/default.asp and scroll down till you find the blue writing which says "Search the Wills", click on that and away you go. When you find one you want, pop it into your shopping basket. Then when you go to checkout, you will pay UK Pounds 3 for each Will. Then as soon as you've entered your Card details the files are available for download as Adobe pdf files. THese are scans in the original handwriting, so be warned :) Just a magic service. David in Ballarat

Hi everyone I don't often post with requests for lookups, but I wonder if anyone can help me out. In an effort to make progress with identifying the origins of my 4*Great Grandfather Edward Pittis, I sent away for a Death Certificate in the hope that it might contain details which might show that it was the correct certificate for him. Sadly it posed more questions than answers because the Informant was given as Catherine SALTER, and not, as hoped, Edward's wife (Mary PITTIS nee NEWBURY) or even one of his children (Edward and Mary had 14 children but none known called Catherine). Mary is known to have died in 1868. The Certificate gives Edward's age as 63, and the date 26 October 1842. So, my question, does anyone have access to the 1841 census, or at least an index, for Gatcombe. Although the 41 does not give relationships, I would like to know who else (if anyone) was in the same household. I'm reasonably certain that this Death Cert is for the right Edward PITTIS but could do with some corroborating evidence. As a separate question does anyone have Catherine Salter in their family tree, and might be able to explain why she was the informant? Thanks Jon Baker Calne, UK www.vectis10w.freeserve.co.uk

Martin, Like Lainee I enter surnames as they were spelt when registered or recorded no matter what the correct spelling should be. In my mind if a clark miss spells or transcribes a name in a record it than becomes the correct title for the person being recorded. Some people never seem to get their name spelt the same twice! For such people it's a good idea to make notes as to where and what record you found the name spelling change. I have an ancestors marriage certificate where the Minister spells the grooms surname three different ways on the same certificate! I also have a German MAY ancestor who's surname I have found spelt 26 different ways. YES 26 ways. If that can happen with a simple name like MAY what fun we're all going to have with our longer names :-( Beryl

Hi Listers, Thank you all who replied to the above question think. I know were I am going now. Thank you again. Regards Martin Brace Owner of CHIVINGTON surname board @rootsweb.com other names: BERTRAND--BETHNAL GREEN, LONDON & FRANCE. BRACE--BRISTOL, HEREFORD & LONDON. COLLINS--BETHNAL GREEN. CHANNELL--EWELL, EPSOM, ANYWHERE. CHIVINGTON--EWELL, SURREY, LONDON, ANY WHERE. FOX--LONDON. MCNAMARA--LONDON, I.O.W. READING--OTFORD SEVENOAKS. SUMMERS--BERMONDSEY, BELLINGHAM, LONDON. STRANGEWAY--LONDON. Owner of RootTracing@uk.msnusers.com

Martin The million dollar question Brown or Browne / Clarke or Clark / Cowan or McCowan or Coan. I have this problem all the time. For myself , I use the most common form in the family but always make a note in the file somwhere to tell me another spelling has been used . What I do get frustrated with are some people who contact me re Clarke and I have their family in my database but they reject the details because ' mine were CLARK without the E ' .. lost count of the number of times Ive been frustrated with people ! Any name I research I always check for spelling variations particulary in Census. More puzzling are those families who decide to have a complete name change . One of my IOW LALLOW families decided to adopt the surname LAWRENCE and use LALLOW as a middle name . I have kept them as Lallow but made a note they opted for Lawrence . All gets a bit confusing Angela

Just for good measure . . . I have a g-grandfather who, in the 1901 Census said he was born in Cornwall, whilst living in Kent. He was born in Stratford, London . . . but his father and his ancestors were from Cornwall, so I can see how he was thinking, I think! Cheers Suzanne (Maitland-Wood)

I am trying to fill in some "gap years" for a very elusive lady Mabel Moss DANES was born on 24/10/1891, daughter of Eleanor (nee MOSS) & Arthur DANES. Arthur DANES was born in Essex but living on the Isle of Wight when his daughter was born, Eleanor was born on the Isle of Wight. Arthur was a coachman who may have been employed at Barton House; he died at Rogate Sussex on 3/8/1900. Eleanor & Mabel were living with her father Cornelius MOSS at Norris Castle Farm at the time of the 1901 census. I then have a gap until Mabel turns up as Maisie Moss JACOBS, mother of Stanley Bernard JACOBS in London in 1921. The father is listed on Stanley's birth certificate as Henry JACOBS, traveller for a firm of stationers in London. On other family documents he is known as Michael Arthur Jacobs or Michael Henry Jacobs. The marriage indexes have been searched from 1903-1925 under Moss, Danes & variant spellings to no avail. I have also tried the electoral rolls for the London addresses her daughter recalls. Mabel cum Maisie claimed she changed her first name by deedpoll but was insistant that she had married Henry Jacobs who she said was Jewish. I am eager to try and find any information on Mabel/Maisie from 1901-1921, she worked as a hairdresser, wigmaker & hawker apparently. Anita _________________________________________________________________ You could be a genius! Find out by taking the IQ Test 2003. $5.50 (incl GST). Click here: http://sites.ninemsn.com.au/minisite/testaustralia/

I am seeking information on the following people or their descendants: Alice MOSS baptised 1864 married Fred COOPER 1886 Georgina MOSS baptised 1865 married George Owen GRAY 1889 I have the 1881 census information on Alice & Georgina Eva Eleanor GRAY married Percy W HAZELL 1917 Cynthia GRAY Mavis Juliet Eleanor HAZELL married Eric H BAILLIE 1954 Arthur John MOSS c1886 son of Cornelius MOSS & his second wife Mary (nee ARNOLD) Dorothy MOSS (possibly wife of Arthur John) Cryril & Ronald (sons of Arthur John) I have information on Cornelius MOSS & Eliza (his first wife) who were both born in Essex but moved to the Isle of Wight before Alice & Georgina were born which I am willing to give to anyone else researching the family. Anita in humid Queensland, Australia _________________________________________________________________ Personalise your phone with chart ringtones and polyphonics. Go to http://ringtones.com.au/ninemsn/control?page=/ninemsn/main.jsp

Dear Friends and Cousins, No doubt by now most of you will have discovered that fabulous service called "documentsonline" and are madly buying up Wills for only 3 pounds each. I know have quite a number and am madly transcribing the 16th and 17th century handwriting. It occurred to me that many of these Wills belong to your forebears as well, and as such, it might be a good idea to write here on the List, those Wills we have purchased and could perhaps share. So herebelow (God I'm into legal jargon all right :) are those I already have:- - Barnabie LYE (Barnaby LEIGH) d. 1650 - Richard BARCOMBE (BARKHAM) d. 1554 - Mrs. Julian (nee NEWLAND) BARTON d. 1648 - Mrs. Julian HOBBES (formerly Mrs. NEWMAN) d. 1581 - Thomas JOLLIFFE, d. 1693 - Thomas WESTMORE, d. 1705 and the 3 TRICKETT brothers:- - Abraham TICKETT, d. 1659 - Richard TRICKETT, d. 1655 - John TRICKETT, d. 1657 David in Ballarat

Don , Have you been drinking ? Angela LOL

--=======7F7A7C3D======= Content-Type: text/plain; x-avg-checked=avg-ok-33251560; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Martin, In my tree, you will parents and children with different surnames. I enter the surname as they themselves used it the most and put a note in the notes section. Hope this help you some, Lainee At 05:21 AM 3/12/04, Tinbra1@aol.com wrote: >Hi Listers, >I wondered if someone could give me some advice with a problem. I have been >imputing the data I have, all in the names CHIVINGTON then I received some >information over the weekend and the name has changed to CHEVINGTON, Do I >impute >the name CHEVINGTON in my family tree or do I change it to Chivington. The >Fathers name is CHIVINGTON but the Children are CHEVINGTON. >Thank you for reading my e-mail. >Your help is appreciated. > >Regards >Martin Brace --=======7F7A7C3D=======--

Hi Listers, I wondered if someone could give me some advice with a problem. I have been imputing the data I have, all in the names CHIVINGTON then I received some information over the weekend and the name has changed to CHEVINGTON, Do I impute the name CHEVINGTON in my family tree or do I change it to Chivington. The Fathers name is CHIVINGTON but the Children are CHEVINGTON. Thank you for reading my e-mail. Your help is appreciated. Regards Martin Brace Owner of CHIVINGTON surname board @rootsweb.com other names: BERTRAND--BETHNAL GREEN, LONDON & FRANCE. BRACE--BRISTOL, HEREFORD & LONDON. COLLINS--BETHNAL GREEN. CHANNELL--EWELL, EPSOM, ANYWHERE. CHIVINGTON--EWELL, SURREY, LONDON, ANY WHERE. FOX--LONDON. MCNAMARA--LONDON, I.O.W. READING--OTFORD SEVENOAKS. SUMMERS--BERMONDSEY, BELLINGHAM, LONDON. STRANGEWAY--LONDON. Owner of RootTracing@uk.msnusers.com

The homepage is at http://www.nwon.com/pauline/Travellers.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris & Caroline" <chris@chayles.freeserve.co.uk> To: <ISLE-OF-WIGHT-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 11:57 PM Subject: [IoW] Showmen & Other travellers (1891) Sent in by Jo at Hedge End, We thought it might be useful for others http://www.nwon.com/pauline/1891.html Chris and Caroline

My experience of census birth locations leads me to believe that the name of the place you were born in is reported, dependant on how far away you are from your place of birth. To give an example. A person born in Hackney London, will give, if London is the area they are in at the time of the census, Hackney as their place of birth. If they are in Manchester they will give London as there place of birth and if out of the country might only give England. So it might be that the people living close to where they were born will give a hamlet of village name, but the other side of the island will give the parish name. Ian -----Original Message----- From: Don Hayward [mailto:Don@wendon.demon.co.uk] Sent: 11 March 2004 08:07 To: ISLE-OF-WIGHT-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [IoW] Birth Place Question On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:20:30 +1000, you wrote: >I have a question re people born in Shalfleet / Calbourne . For some >reason all those I have born in either of these two places can't make >up their mind where they were born . Some appear as Calbourne , others >Shalfleet , some Freshwater , some Brooke , some Ningwood some >Hamstead. Some are different in every census ! I don't have problems >with those ancestors born Cowes ! If they said West Cowes they meant >West Cowes ! Anyone else have this problem ? I know the areas were very >close together just seems odd that everyone on this particular branch >has an identity problem ! > >Angela > > Angela No identity problem. 1. Did it matter ...... THEY knew where they lived! 2. Depended on which church was in favour at the time of the Wedding/baptism/burial 3. Father kept moving from farm to farm to stay in work and we went with him. 4. Theys all the zame aint they giv er tak a bit. 5. Cayz is a big tain an you knows where yu is at. So's simple. Tain't the zame in the cuntry. You'me gotta live yer to know it. Don --- Incoming mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.618 / Virus Database: 397 - Release Date: 09/03/2004 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.618 / Virus Database: 397 - Release Date: 09/03/2004

Hi Angela > I have a question re people born in Shalfleet / Calbourne . For some > reason all those I have born in either of these two places can't make up > their mind where they were born. Some appear as Calbourne , others > Shalfleet , some Freshwater , some Brooke , some Ningwood some > Hamstead... I've had this trouble too! I've largely put it down to several towns/villages having the same name as parishes. So when somebody says "Shalfleet" do they mean the village or the parish (particularly on official documents as opposed to casual conversation)? For example, I have people whose records say they were born in Shalfleet, but who actually were born in Brook which is the other side of the Island from Shalfleet *village*, but Shalfleet *parish* extended from shore to shore including Brook Green. Similarly Calbourne, Freshwater, Newchurch, Arreton, etc. were big parishes as well as towns/villages. Whereas Cowes, as far as I know, did not have a large parish named after it. Paul Cutmore

On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 20:20:30 +1000, you wrote: >I have a question re people born in Shalfleet / Calbourne . For some reason >all those I have born in either of these two places can't make up their mind >where they were born . Some appear as Calbourne , others Shalfleet , some >Freshwater , some Brooke , some Ningwood some Hamstead. Some are different >in every census ! I don't have problems with those ancestors born Cowes ! If >they said West Cowes they meant West Cowes ! Anyone else have this problem ? >I know the areas were very close together just seems odd that everyone on >this particular branch has an identity problem ! > >Angela > > Angela No identity problem. 1. Did it matter ...... THEY knew where they lived! 2. Depended on which church was in favour at the time of the Wedding/baptism/burial 3. Father kept moving from farm to farm to stay in work and we went with him. 4. Theys all the zame aint they giv er tak a bit. 5. Cayz is a big tain an you knows where yu is at. So's simple. Tain't the zame in the cuntry. You'me gotta live yer to know it. Don

I have a question re people born in Shalfleet / Calbourne . For some reason all those I have born in either of these two places can't make up their mind where they were born . Some appear as Calbourne , others Shalfleet , some Freshwater , some Brooke , some Ningwood some Hamstead. Some are different in every census ! I don't have problems with those ancestors born Cowes ! If they said West Cowes they meant West Cowes ! Anyone else have this problem ? I know the areas were very close together just seems odd that everyone on this particular branch has an identity problem ! Angela