Emotions on whether Holly and Ivy is a pest I may point out that Holly belongs in the North and where would the animal life be without it - hedges are now not cut to save the Holly and the bird life, and although I saw nothing wrong with the comments about it in Australia - as it is viewed differently down here I can indeed understand those folk sent here not of their own volition bringing with them parts of the old land. So if you prefer roundup to Holly I do wonder which is the more toxic really. But each to his own I believe Ivy to be a right pain but found in the end that containing it when it invaded my garden easier than poison so I also have a thought on both in Australia My thoughts were on Irish Custom and remains the same wish I had some Holly to put in my house this year. Now in regard to reading the current mails I am trying to catch up on I want to add a note to this mail saying, good folk who have never joined a list before will be doing so in the coming days, they will have a new Computer for Christmas, and they will be new at using it, they will ask questions that to you will seem easy, and they will make mistakes that you will see as easy, but remember this, where they are now you were once yourself. So emotions do not show on emails, curtesy and good manners do so when a newbie joins us, lets just show we have those wonderful manners and exercise them at all times. Thats it I am now off back to the couch to rest me ( or as the family says Queen it ) Love to all Cara