Hi Dave I think do work on that pattern I have John McShane marry Maryann McCann they had a son John i dont know if he had any siblings But my gg granfather was John McShane and he Had John Arthur Hugh Henry. Daniel Patrick Isabella I know where Isabella came from there mother was Isabella Rafferty could then this mean GG grandad could have had brothers by these names My problem is now trying to find them i know gg grand dad was born in Lurgan . One they are in Scotland i am fine . My grand dad was Daniel and he called his sons Daniel John and Henry . Thank you very much Dave . On Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 6:39 PM, David Griffiths <[email protected]> wrote: > Dear Jean Old, > There is a way to establish Irish families parent names. > It does need to be tested, > " Old Irish Naming Patterns" > Sons > 1st son was named after the father's father > 2nd son was named after the mother's father > 3rd son was named after the father > 4th son was named after the father's eldest brother > > Daughters > 1st daughter was named after the mother's mother > 2nd daughter was named after the father's mother > 3rd daughter was named after the mother > 4th daughter was named after the mother's eldest sister > > Once you have checked that your ancestors used the naming pattern, you have > the name of their parents. > Not all families willwork out the same. > Good luck > Dave > > > *************************************** > 1- Only leave in the body of the mail what is relevant to your answer > > 2- Change the SUBJECT LINE to suit the body of your own Mail to List. > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- Kind regards Jean

Hi Jean and David, I've got 'pure' Irish from Wicklow (who more or less seemed to following the traditional Irish naming pattern - but who were sons 3 and 4 named after?) and Irish-English from Tipperary (who didn't). And a g-g-grandmother from Wicklow who falls into the NBI category but whose surname suggests Cornish origins. I was curious about Scottish naming traditions, so Googled it. This rather lengthy explanation is from http://www.halmyre.abel.co.uk/Family/naming.htm First son is named for the Father's Father. Second son is named for the Mother's Father. Third son is named for the Father's Father's Father. Fourth son is named for the Mother's Mother's Father. Fifth son is named for the Father's Mother's Father. Sixth son is named for the Mother's Father's Father. Seventh through Tenth sons are named for the Father's Great-Grandfathers. Tenth through Fourteenth sons for the Mother's Great-Grandfathers. First daughter is named for the Mother's Mother. Second daughter is named for the Father's Mother. Third daughter is named for the Mother's Father's Mother. Fourth daughter is named for the Father's Father's Mother. Fifth daughter is named for the Mother's Mother's Mother. Sixth daughter is named for the Father's Mother's Mother. Seventh through tenth daughters are named for the Mother's Great-Grandmothers. Tenth through fourteenth daughters for the Father's Great-Grandmothers. NOTES: In some cases you will find that the order is reversed with the first and second children, i.e. the first-born son being named after the mother's father and the second-born son after the father's father. If this is the case then the daughters are also usually reversed. You will also find instances where a child is named 'out of pattern', after an aunt or uncle who has died, or after an admired other relative or friend of the parent. If a child dies in infancy, his or her name is often given to a subsequent child - a natural consequence of the high birth rate and infant mortality rates of past times. These are only general guidelines and were certainly not always followed.