Tom, you are correct, but show me any Church in any religion of which the same is true. Churches are political and hierarchical organizations of great wealth and power - not one has clean hands. In that sense they are like other organizations with a veneer of good intent - adhered to by the followers and often used to other purposes by the people at the top. An organization, country or alliance is only human nature writ large - and human beings are fatally flawed creatures. When all is said and done, it all comes back to individuals - especially the elites - that is what make the study of genealogy - which requires an equal grounding in history - so fascinating. I have seen the problem and it is us - because of what we are, history is as it is as are organizations, countries and alliances. When (and if) the human race evolves, our institutions may improve. If not, we will simply see history repeat and repeat and repeat - as it always has - and our organizational, countries and alliances will reflect that change or lack of it. I have learned a lot more from the study of genealogy and history than I ever imagined - because it taught me about human beings - and myself. They have proven a very valuable educational resource and the time spent in these pursuits has been well worthwhile Tom Sutton wrote: Jim; You are correct, there is no harsher war than that between brothers or countrymen. Look at the US Civil War. In 70 years I have studied much. I am no longer Catholic or Protestant. But allow me to tell you this; after years of research into both religion and politics, the catholic church has much to answer for. I have no axes to grind, that is a simple statement of fact. Thom Sutton