At 04:32 AM 10/19/2008, "Ellen Duffy" <[email protected]> wrote: >Johanna > >I'm not sure I've seen a response. My understanding is that the Marquis of >Bath retains his English estate records at Longlet, "the Bath papers were microfilmed some years ago by Rev. Lorcan Marron and it is said that he donated the film to the County Library in Clones, Co. monaghan " I will email you all the info I have found on Bath.........

It has been some time since I have been researching in County Monaghan. I am now interested in the parent's names or any information re the following person: Samuel S. Shortt, Princess Victoria's Royal Irish Fusillers, 9th Battalion, born Glenbrook, County Monaghan, enlisted Monaghan, residence Three Mile House, County Monaghan, private, number 23589, died 16/08/1917, killed in action, France & Flanders, Casualty type: Commonwealth War Dead, Tyne Cot Memorial, Panel 140 to 141. I have contacted the Royal Irish Fusillers Museum in Armagh but no reply as yet. Also any information re a Samuel Short birth, 1896, County Tyrone. Thanks for any help. Margaret Gordon, London, Ontario

Does anyone know what the process was for conversion from Presbyterianism to Catholicism in the mid-19th century? Family lore has it that my grgrandmother Julia Johnston was a convert. She married my grgrandfather from Co. Cavan at St. Joseph's in Carrickmacross in 1860, so she was likely a Catholic by that time. The filmed CMX records go back only to 1858 and don't show her baptism. I'm wondering if she converted before 1858 or if baptism was not required to convert. (One of her brothers had a Catholic funeral in 1857 in Aug. East and another a Catholic baptism in 1858, followed by many Catholic marriages, so it appears the entire family became Catholic, though I don't know if this happened one by one.) Any light people can shed on this process would be greatly appreciated! Diane ************** New MapQuest Local shows what's happening at your destination. Dining, Movies, Events, News &amp; more. Try it out (http://local.mapquest.com/?ncid=emlcntnew00000002)

Is there anyone who knows if the Marquis of Bath has records of people who were employed by him in possibly the flax/linen industry around 1860 in the Carrickmacross area and are available to search on line? Many thanks. Johanna

My experience with emigrants is that the parents are named on emigration documents if they are still alive. This seems to indicate that Bridget's father was still alive but her mother dead. As to the NP, if it only states Co. Monaghan, you could try the Immigration Deposit Journals on microfiche, available at the Queensland Family History Society or any decent FHS to see if Bridget later nominated anyone else from her family to emigrate. They often did this. Or maybe somebody had nominated Bridget in the first instance. These records are cross-referenced as to the Depositor (who had to deposit a sum of money when they nominated a person for emigration, usually a relative) and the Immigrant. If you find there was an earlier family member who came here you should look for their immigration record which could well show the place in Monaghan. These records are well worth a try. Shirley in Sydney ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob MILLMAN" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 10:34 AM Subject: [IRL-MONAGHAN] Bridget Cassidy father John >I have located the Convict Indent for my Great Grandmother and under > Relative is listed > > F John at N.P. > > This indicates that he resided at the Native Place of his daughter. This > is > recorded as "Co Monaghan" as of September 1849. Her age is recorded as > 19. > No other information can be located > > I have been trying to break down this brick wall for some time and would > appreciate any assistance in further identifying Bridget and her Parents > > > TIA > > Bob Millman > Strathpine QLD > Australia

I have located the Convict Indent for my Great Grandmother and under Relative is listed F John at N.P. This indicates that he resided at the Native Place of his daughter. This is recorded as "Co Monaghan" as of September 1849. Her age is recorded as 19. No other information can be located I have been trying to break down this brick wall for some time and would appreciate any assistance in further identifying Bridget and her Parents TIA Bob Millman Strathpine QLD Australia

The Griffith's index shows a townland of Drum in Currin parish--perhaps that's what's meant. Don't know about the deceased father. Diane

I have obtained the 1881 marriage registration of a relative. The marriage occured in the C of I church in the Parish of Drum, Co Monaghan. It lists the grooms fathers name and surname: Bob Smith. Rank or profession of father: Farmer. I have two questions. Would it be a safe bet to say that the grooms father was still living at the time of the marriage, since he was not identified as "late Bob Smith" and under the column heading rank or profession, "deceased"? I am wandering what the protocol would have been back then for the ministers/registrars if the grooms father were deceased at the time of the marriage. My second question is, where is the parish of Drum??? I have found a few online references to the parish of Drum, but there is no such parish on my parish map of Co Monaghan. I believe the village of Drum is in Currin parish, but where is Drum parish?? Dale _________________________________________________________________

I'd be very grateful if someone could look for the graves of the Thomas F. Johnston family in the Middle Chapel graveyard, near Cootehill. Several in the family were schoolteachers. Thomas was reportedly buried there in 1926 and was predeceased by several of his children, including two Thomases (first died before 1894, second died in 1913), Patrick (died in 1909), Elizabeth (died before 1904), Margaret (died in 1906), and maybe Edward (apparently died between 1906 and 1908). I'm particularly interested in learning when Edward died. If anyone is planning a trip to the area in the future, a lookup would be much appreciated. Diane

To Richard for your addresses of the Moncrieffs and to Ann for sending all of the Griffith's Valuations and the other sites of the lands held by the Moncrieffs, I want to thank you so very much. I should have thank you many days ago, but in the meantime I wrote to 4 of the names, asking about my 2nd great-grandmother, Catherine Moncrieff Spotten, I included her siblings, marriages and dates. Have not heard one word as of today. I will chose 4 more to sent tomorrow. Many THANKS to both of you. I will sent any results if I receive any........................Virginia **************Psssst...Have you heard the news? There's a new fashion blog, plus the latest fall trends and hair styles at StyleList.com. (http://www.stylelist.com/trends?ncid=aolsty00050000000014)

It is my pleasure to announce that the complete 1864 Ireland Birth Index is now online at the Ireland GenWeb website at: http://www.irelandgenweb.com/ We had much help with this project which enabled us to complete it in a record four months. Here are the good people who took time out of their busy lives to help others by transcribing pages: Rosemary Cairns, Bill Roberge, Jan MacMillan, Joy Burgos, Bob McConihe, Ronnie Lorentz, Ellen Ahrens, Eileen Redman, Diane Culhane, Kathy Snowberger, Jim Cox, Jim Buckley, Patricia McGill, Colleen McNamara, Rita Meistrel, Bill King, Margaret Minoughan, Eileen Sullivan, James Sullivan, MaryPat Carey, Candi Zizek, Maggie Lambert, Mary Devlin, Kelly Anne Binari, Judie Mason, Mary Mizzi, Dan Doherty, Nora Fitzgerald and David Collins. The volunteers came from all over the world, many from Australia and Canada, some from England, one from Croatia and many from the USA. It was great talking to all of you. Other new updates on the site include the Surname Registries and DataBank plus new Special Projects. Wanted: We need coordinators for the following counties: Carlow, Longford, Laois, Meath, Westmeath and Waterford. If you have knowledge of how to make webpages plus an interest in the county, contact me off list. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com

Have rented an FHC 1911 Census film that contains several Monaghan county townlands. Went through and wrote all 29 names. Can do lookups if you know a townland, can't go through all 29 blindly. Here are the townland names : District 25 6- Croughan 7- Drumhall 8- Glassbramman East 9- Latnakelly 10- Lemgane 11- Lisdrumgormleg 12- Lisnagreeve 13- Tassan 14- Tattyreagh North 15- Tonagh District 26 1- Aghadreenan 2- Agheeshal 3- Aghnafarcan 4- Ardkirk 5- Brackagh 6- Coolskeagh 7- Cornagall 8- Cornahowla 9- Corrygarry or Sruell 10- Corrateean 11- Corravoo 12- Corinary 13- Drumavady 14- Drumganus Lower 15- Drumganus Upper 16- Drumgoose 17- Drumgristen Lower 18- Drumhariff North 19- Drumlandrick end Send the NAME you wish to find and the TOWNLAND of interest. The film is a full one with over a thousand images. Meg Greenwood / Oklahoma USA =============================

I suspect you're right about Meraylar being Monaghan. If the handwriting is tight, it's easy to misread o as e, n as r, and gh as yl. You might post your information on the Scotch-Irish list, as many subscribers know a good bit about Scots who went back and forth to Ireland and then to Canada and the States. Many were involved in the textile mills. There may also be a Wallace list, if you haven't already tried that. Diane

Hello, I am researching my maternal grandfather's roots. His mother's mother was from Scotland. Her parents apparently were of Scottish ancestry, as she used to talk about being related (somehow--this is family history passed down from a number of relatives) to the line of Sir William Wallace. I've found on ancestry.com, her father was Robert Wallace, born about 1803 - 1806 in County "Meraylar," Ireland. Her mother was Ann Hill, born about 1809-1813 in County "Monaghar" Ireland. I'm assuming this is County Monaghan. I am wondering if Robert also was from County Monaghan. The 1841 and 1851 Scotland census finds them in Angus County at Lochee, where they are both employed in the large textile industry that was located outside of Dundee. From the listing of other people that live at the same address that they did, it appears that a number of people from Ireland came to Lochee for employment in the huge textile industry. Their first child that I know of (as listed in the 1841 census) was David, born in Lochee in 1839. So, they had to have come to Scotland in the 1830s. I have no idea if they were both from Co. Monaghan, if they married in Ireland, or met in Scotland and married there. The Wallace family came to the Canada approximately 1855-56, as family history passed down states that they came when my grandpa's grandmother (Margaret Wallace) was 9 years of age. Apparently they lived in Montreal first then moved to the London/Bothwell/Hamilton area of Ontario. I have yet to find them for sure in Ontario (there are a number of Wallaces). I am not sure of their religion. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thank you! Judy in Michigan Judith L. Lessard Editorial Assistant Publications and Media Relations College of Veterinary Medicine Michigan State University F-130 Veterinary Medical Center East Lansing, MI 48824 Telephone: 517-355-0001 CVM website: http://cvm.msu.edu

I have a suspicion that my great-grandfather Thompson BROWN[E] (1837-1915) born in Ednafirkin, Co. Monaghan may be related to Daniel Gunn BROWNE (1808-1892) who was an uncle by marriage of Thompson BROWN's wife, Elizabeth JACKSON. By following the trail back, I hope to either prove or disprove this notion. All help will be appreciated. SEE: http://www.thesilverbowl.com/history/BROWNE-Thompson-Ednafirkin.html I have also updated files from Freeduff Presbyterian Church, Parish of Creggan, Co. Armagh - a church which has many links to Monaghan families. SEE: http://www.thesilverbowl.com/documents/TABLES/FreeduffBMD.html Many other files have also been updated and can be viewed through "What's New" SEE: http://www.thesilverbowl.com/misc/whatsnew.htm Sharon Oddie Brown Roberts Creek, BC, Canada History Project: http://www.thesilverbowl.com/ Family Tree: http://wc.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?db=silverbowl

Hi Terry I am NO expert either....but since I have been reading up on a lot of books in ref to N Ireland....something I highly recommend to anyone researching.....My family lines were in the counties of Monaghan, Fermanagh and Tyrone. Some of them came from Scotland in the time during or after the Ulster Plantation, when lands were given to the Scots. This was in the 1640s. Then there was the Rebellion and a lot of bloodshed followed this time. Then you have religion as a reason. My family were becoming and following Methodism....in the early to mid 1700s. An exert I found in a book in ref to my Hendersons (from Monaghan) said that the children were following the preaching of Methodism and their parents were so mad that they would...not feed them, lock them in their rooms and beat them. This didn't deter them BUT you can imagine then the feelings at that time. By the 1840s or could've been sooner came the famine where people died on the streets. I posted on Fermanagh-gold list a story where a man went to his neighbors house and found the whole family dead of starvation...mother, father and 7 children. Or where a young boy came to their home begging for food, they fed him but as he left he fell dead not feet from their door. Or how poorhouses were so full they turned people away. It is a very heart wrenching time to read about. People were dying on the roads , whole families, and many times just buried right there, with nothing to mark who they were. To ask this simple question unfortunately isn't THAT simple. It depends very much on the status of your ancestors, where they lived, their religion, etc. I see by your address you live in the US (I assume) if so email me off list and I will send you the "google book" site. There you can read incredible stories and histories....that at times will make you "cry". BUT you will have a much better understanding of "why" your relatives risked everything. Remember too....if others had gone before...they wrote back praising a new and free life. So many took the chance. This was part of a reason for my relatives leaving.....also....a relative of mine besides hearing from his brother already in Ohio, the richness of the land, he had a son who was severely asthmatic and they were told that in America it would be better for him. So they left! See...it could've been ANY reason! Sue in NY **************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047)

I'm a descendant of immigrants myself (1890s) so Irish-born can correct me, but I think life in Ireland was fairly hard for all but the upper classes in the 1830s. Those who emigrated before the famine of the 1840s tended to be Protestant because they could better afford the fare, while once the famine set in, landlords were happy to help their tenants, Catholic and Protestant alike, to emigrate rather than feed them in poorhouses. So it was tough for most in the 1830s, with a great chasm between rich and poor and a relatively small middle class, but even the poor could generally feed themselves and emigration was generally a choice at that point. Knowing your ancestors' class and religion would tell you more about what their lives were like and why they probably left. Diane Diane

Hi, My g. g. g. grandfather, John Taggart immigrated from County Monaghan in 1832 to Indiana. Can any of you tell me what life must have been like in those days in Ireland? What might have been some of the compelling reasons that he and so many others decided to immigrate to the USA. Sincerely Terry in New Mexico [email protected]_ (mailto:[email protected]) **************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047)

This is a bit late for your family, however most families did not move round from the original home place unless immigrating. Index to Griffith's Valuation of Ireland 1858-1860 in Monaghan Spotten, William County : Monaghan Parish : Aghnamullen Location : Moyle More Timlin, James County : Monaghan Parish : Aghnamullen Location : Corsilloga No Moncrief or variation in Monaghan. Moncreith, Robert County : Tyrone Parish : Derryloran Location : Tullwiggan Moncrief, Alexander County : Down Parish : Killaney Location : Carricknaveagh Moncrief, David County : Down Parish : Saintfield Location : Drumalig Moncrief, Robert County : Londonderry/Derry Parish : Clondermot Location : Altnagelvin Moncrief, Robert County : Londonderry/Derry Parish : Clondermot Location : Ardlough Index to Griffith's Valuation of Ireland, 1848-1864 Moncrieff, David County : Antrim Parish : Shankill Location : Ballymurphy Moncrieff, David County : Antrim Parish : Shankill Location : Smithfield Townparks Dayton Street Moncrieff, James County : Down Parish : Knockbreda Location : Cromac Ballymacarret Mount Pottinger Moncrieff, James W. County : Antrim Parish : Shankill Location : St. Ann's Ward Townparks Waring Street Moncrieff, Maryanne County : Tyrone Parish : Ballyclog Location : Legmurn Moncrieff, Robert County : Londonderry/Derry Parish : Clondermot Location : T/Derry/Clooney Terrace Road Moncrieff, Robert County : Londonderry/Derry Parish : Clondermot Location : T/Derry/Waterside Moncrieff, Wm. County : Antrim Parish : Shankill Location : St. Ann's Ward Townparks Union Street Comment : and Others Moncriff, Alexander County : Longford Parish : Forgney Location : Pallas Beg Moncriff, Ambrose County : Longford Parish : Forgney Location : Pallas Beg Moncriff, William County : Longford Parish : Forgney Location : Cloghan Index to Tithe Applotment Books, 1823-1838 Moncrief, James County : Londonderry/Derry Parish : Clondermot Townland : Maydown Year : 1834 Moncrief, Robert County : Londonderry/Derry Parish : Clondermot Townland : Maydown Year : 1834 Moncrief, Robert County : Tyrone Parish : Ballyclog Townland : Legmourn Year : 1826 Moncrief, Robt. County : Tyrone Parish : Ballyclog Townland : Lynyglass Year : 1826 Looks like the ladies may have been from Monaghan. __ Index to Tithe Applotment Books, 1823-1838 Moncrief, James County : Londonderry/Derry Parish : Clondermot Townland : Maydown Year : 1834 Moncrief, Robert County : Londonderry/Derry Parish : Clondermot Townland : Maydown Year : 1834 Moncrief, Robert County : Tyrone Parish : Ballyclog Townland : Legmourn Year : 1826 Moncrief, Robt. County : Tyrone Parish : Ballyclog Townland : Lynyglass Year : 1826 Timlin, Mr. ??? County : Fermanagh Parish : Drumkeeran Townland : Aughahanagh Year : 1832 No Spotten or variation in the Tithe Applotment. I have long thought that many men followed the wife's family..... HTH, Ann -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Monday, August 25, 2008 3:12 AM To: [email protected] Subject: IRL-MONAGHAN Digest, Vol 3, Issue 110

Dear Vldg, Since Montcrief seems to be a rare name I searched for it at Castlegarden.org which shows immigrants coming in through New York. The results, from 1820-1913 showed 2 young ladies, probably sisters, arriving on the same ship on the same day. MARGARET _MONTCRIEF_ (http://www.castlegarden.org/quick_search_detail.php?p_id=9731148) SERVANT, GENTLEMAN'S SERVANT 16 F 28 Jul 1880 IRELAND DEVONIA MARY _MONTCRIEF_ (http://www.castlegarden.org/quick_search_detail.php?p_id=9731149) SERVANT, GENTLEMAN'S SERVANT 18 F 28 Jul 1880 IRELAND DEVONIA Hope this gives you a place to start. Perhaps are ancestors of the ones you are searching for. Janet In a message dated 8/19/2008 3:16:00 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, [email protected] writes: Today's Topics: 1. Re: IRL-MONAGHAN Digest, Vol 3, Issue 105 ([email protected]) 2. Re: IRL-MONAGHAN Digest, Vol 3, Issue 105 ([email protected]) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 18 Aug 2008 16:28:00 EDT From: [email protected] Subject: Re: [IRL-MONAGHAN] IRL-MONAGHAN Digest, Vol 3, Issue 105 To: [email protected] Message-ID: <[email protected]> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" I can't get the email that is sent - so I am taking a chance that this goes through to the Archives. For some time now I have been a member of the County Monaghan email list. After reading many of the Archives, have decided to ask for some help. I do know that the name Moncrief is rather unusual but also know that my direct family was from Cremone, Aughamullen Parish, Co. of Monaghan. (I have a copy of a civil marriage record for my gg uncle John Moncrief to Elizabeth Timlin - 4, 1, 1847. (also have had many professionals finding them on Griffin's Valuation.) My family all came into Philadelphia, PA, USA between 1852-59 and all settled in Phoenixville, PA. John's father's name was CHARLES MONCRIEF - no mother's name How can I find out whether the following are siblings? 1 - KATHERINE - my 2nd great-grandmother b. c. 1819 - m. bef. 1844 -JOHN SPOTTEN (another name I can't find except on the GriffinsVal,) 2 - CHARLES MONCRIEF - b.6 -?- 1821/22 3 - HUGH MONCRIEF - b. c. 1825 m.Susan Jefferies 12, 27, 49 in USA 4 - JOHN MONCRIEF - b. 1828 - m. Eliz. Timlin 1847. have record ARE THERE ANY MONCRIEFs or SPOTT*Ns LEFT IN IRELAND? I have so much information about each of the above persons (generations up to the present) I would like to share.............................vldg ******************************************** **************It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here. (http://information.travel.aol.com/deals?ncid=aoltrv00050000000047)