Can anyone tell me if there are records kept of passengers travelling from Monaghan to North Shields UK? Also what would have been the route a family would have taken from Carrickmacross to get to North Shields between 1865-1874. Many thanks. Johanna

9th Jan 1822 Susanna Forsythe dau of John Forsythe of 1st Monaghan Church congregation married Robert McCracken son of John McCracken.Witnesses; John Forsythe, John McCracken performed by Rev John Bleckley 15th June 1829 Eliza Forsythe dau, John Forsythe, Cortolvin, Monaghan, married Robert Longmoore son, William Longmoore, Ballinode, Tedavnet witnesses were John Forsythe + Thomas Longmoore at First Monaghan Presbyterian Church.. Cortolvin townland only contains 98 acres. These are the only two records for actual B/D/M's for Forsythes at 1st Monaghan Pres Church there probably are some as witnesses at other marriages. I am looking for a particular Longmoore record but have only done a little research as I know someone who can fill in the blanks, they can also fill me in on the Moores who also connect to mine, they MIGHT possibly be your Moores/Forsythes too as they are in same area. As there are no births or burials for Forsythes they don't seem to have stayed long! Could the father/mother have travelled to Oz with them?

Hi Phil, not sure if this is of any use. ? On the 20th May1899. A 21 year old Jane Gunn of Newtownbutler, sailed from Liverpool to New York to visit her brother James Gunn. Sean ----- Original Message ----- From: "P. A. McDonnell" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Cc: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 4:21 PM Subject: [IRL-MONAGHAN] Interloper > I've been party from time to time to the recent email exchanges of the > above addressees, and decided to seek your counsel. > > This email is coming from the San Francisco area. My maternal Irish > ancestors, both McAvineys and Gunns, were originally from both Monaghan > and Fermanagh, and specifically Clones and Newtownbutler. > > On my last visit to Ireland, I took some wonderful pictures inside the > small cemetery on Galloon Island near Newtownbutler. A dozen McAviney > tombstone names were quite visable, some dating back before the 1800s. I > also made note of some of my ancestors' tombstones in the Clones Sacred > Heart Cemetery. > > I have a published obituary news account of those who attended the large > funeral of my Clones' ancestor, James McAviney, in the year 1900, which > I'll be pleased to share with anyone who may be interested. > > The purpose of this email is to make contact with anyone who might like to > have a snail mail copy of the above Clones list, and who may have any > suggestions on how I may update my searching in Clones and/or > Newtownbutler. > > Does anyone know if records are now available of Sacred Heart Church > deceased parishioners from the 1800s? When I visited Sacred Heart Church > years ago, I was told such records were not available to the public. I > assume LDS never obtained them either. Has that changed? > > I apologize for the rambling aspects of this email, but I'd appreciate any > suggestions anyone can give me on the above. > > Phil McDonnell < [email protected]>. This email has been scanned for potential computer viruses using Messagelabs technology.

Re: John Forsyth- Cortolvin Co. Monaghan. (Dave Hall) > Was it an assisted or unassisted voyage? If unassisted then it would > give an idea of wealth, possible land ownership etc Thanks for your message Dave. My John Forsyth (1812-1890) was the son of John Forsyth, linen draper and Mary Moore. He came on a assisted passage to NSW in 1839. He listed his occupation on various records as a servant, farmer or a cook. He could read and write. Elizabeth Gillies was the daughter of John Gillies and Mary Stephenson of Horsleydown, London. It is not known if John and Elizabeth met in London or when they both travelled to NSW on the ship "Amelia Thompson" in 1839. What's on his death certificate? Four children were listed, two sons and two daughters. Son, Joseph who died aged two years, the other son's name unknown. Daughters Mary Ann and Ann. His parents names were unknown to his daughter Ann, the informant on his death certificate and his place of marriage was incorrect.....no other helpful information. It's a long shot but I'll keep plugging away!! Thanks again Dave, Carole (for husband Rob.)

I am searching for records in the area of Castleblaney for Elizabeth Julia Lawlor,(circa 1815-16) definitely RC who was headed for the convent to be a nun and escaped to Canada circa late 1830 or early 1840. I have no idea of the townland etc. Family rumour has it that she had a benefactor who may have helped her. Jan

Hello, I see that Ciaran has answered regarding Sacred Heart records, and I have no advice regarding Newtownbutler searches. I don't know if Sacred Heart records are available at LDS. I would be interested in any information you might have on Gunns from Clones and from the general Newtownbutler area. The Gunns I'm researching lived both in Clones and in the townlands of Cloncorr and Kilridd in Fermanagh. James ----- Original Message ----- From: "P. A. McDonnell" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Cc: <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 4:21 PM Subject: [IRL-MONAGHAN] Interloper > I've been party from time to time to the recent email exchanges of the > above addressees, and decided to seek your counsel. > > This email is coming from the San Francisco area. My maternal Irish > ancestors, both McAvineys and Gunns, were originally from both Monaghan > and Fermanagh, and specifically Clones and Newtownbutler. > > On my last visit to Ireland, I took some wonderful pictures inside the > small cemetery on Galloon Island near Newtownbutler. A dozen McAviney > tombstone names were quite visable, some dating back before the 1800s. I > also made note of some of my ancestors' tombstones in the Clones Sacred > Heart Cemetery. > > I have a published obituary news account of those who attended the large > funeral of my Clones' ancestor, James McAviney, in the year 1900, which > I'll be pleased to share with anyone who may be interested. > > The purpose of this email is to make contact with anyone who might like to > have a snail mail copy of the above Clones list, and who may have any > suggestions on how I may update my searching in Clones and/or > Newtownbutler. > > Does anyone know if records are now available of Sacred Heart Church > deceased parishioners from the 1800s? When I visited Sacred Heart Church > years ago, I was told such records were not available to the public. I > assume LDS never obtained them either. Has that changed? > > I apologize for the rambling aspects of this email, but I'd appreciate any > suggestions anyone can give me on the above. > > Phil McDonnell < [email protected]>.

I am searching for my ancestor John Forsyth(e) b.C.1812, the s/of John Forsyth and Mary Moore. John immigrated from London to NSW in 1839 on the ship "Amelia Thompson". On John's immigration papers he stated he was from Monaghan, Ireland. At his wedding to Elizabeth Gillies in 1841 at the Sydney Town, Scots Church, he declared he was a member of the Presbyterian Church of Scotland. He named his son Joseph Forsyth. I have just discovered a John Forsyth on the Parish of Monaghan Cortolvin Tithe in 1826.....could he be my ancestor's father? No other John Forsyths have been found so far at this time. Is anyone on the list researching Forsyths in Monaghan, especially the Cortolvin townland John?? Thank you, Rob.

Was it an assisted or unassisted voyage? If unassisted then it would give an idea of wealth, possible land ownership etc...Where was Elizabeth from, as Gillies is found in Monaghan too? Did he travel alone? What's on his death cert? Strangely enough, some of mine were born in Indonesia, returned to Cortolvin to be baptized then went to Oz (not Forsythes). If it was unassisted then it's a good indicator as to the John in Tithes! On 19:59, BobG wrote: > I am searching for my ancestor John Forsyth(e) > b.C.1812, the s/of John Forsyth and Mary Moore. > John immigrated from London to NSW in 1839 on the ship > "Amelia Thompson". On John's immigration papers he stated > he was from Monaghan, Ireland. > At his wedding to Elizabeth Gillies in 1841 at the Sydney > Town, Scots Church, he declared he was a member of the > Presbyterian Church of Scotland. He named his son Joseph Forsyth. > I have just discovered a John Forsyth on the Parish of Monaghan > Cortolvin Tithe in 1826.....could he be my ancestor's father? > No other John Forsyths have been found so far at this time. > Is anyone on the list researching Forsyths in Monaghan, especially > the Cortolvin townland John?? > Thank you, > Rob. > > > >

I have read the Killeevan parish Registers for Church of Ireland people. There are Baptisms, marriages and deaths recorded. The only place I found my GG grandparents burials was in this Parish Register when John and Arabella Corbett died in 1889 and 1890. They are not listed on the Civil Registration records, which I asked the Registrar in Dublin to find some years ago. I already had the date from the Parish Register. Many people did not have headstones. My Corbetts did not. Thank you the the people who have sent information on the Ulster Transplantation. There is a lot to learn in Irish History and hence a lot to digest. HTH Lyn Brown in Griffith

What religion were they? Came across a g/yard with a pile of Johnstons last Sat... (C of Ireland). Names? Dates? On 19:59, [email protected] wrote: > Phil, the NLI has films of the Newtownbutler (part of Drumully) and Clones > Rc parish records--Drumully baptisms from 1845, marriages from 1864, Clones > baptisms from 1848, marriages from 1821. You'd have to hire a researcher or > go back yourself. > > It's a very long shot, but I'd be interested in any mention of Johnstons in > the obituary. My Johnstons were in south Monaghan by the 1840s or so, but > there's a rumor suggesting they may have come from the Clones area. If so, > they may have kept in touch with relatives there. > > Diane > >

> There is a list of names of Plantation settlers, English and Scotch, > in the various parts of the 6 counties on my web page. > http://www.angelfire.com/my/tray/index.html > Also Plantation info, The Penal Laws, and names of the "Adventurers > for Land in Ireland" . Pat, it is great hearing from you. Monaghan research is new to me and I have now been re-united with your website. I hadn't been there in years and now I can connect to it. I am trying to figure out my McEntees. My head tells me they originated in Monaghan and now I am checking out the history of the county and your website is so helpful. Thank you for taking the time to answer my questions. To us oldsters from Rootsweb back to when they started and we had to pay to be a 'list owner', you are a voice of wisdom. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com

Dear Phil, As far as I known, the churchs didn´t record deaths of the people, just the births and marriages. You can only get death records really from gravestones or the General Registration Office of Ireland (Civil Records). I have transcribed some records for the parish of Clones which are available to view on the following website of a good friend of mine, Claire Mc Convilles. http://www.claires-rosleaancestry.co.uk/records.htm I would be interested in the obituary you mention and further information about your Gunnes. Regards, Ciaran ________________________________ From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> To: [email protected]; [email protected] Cc: [email protected] Sent: Sun, 21 March, 2010 21:54:46 Subject: Re: [IRL-MONAGHAN] Interloper Phil, the NLI has films of the Newtownbutler (part of Drumully) and Clones Rc parish records--Drumully baptisms from 1845, marriages from 1864, Clones baptisms from 1848, marriages from 1821. You'd have to hire a researcher or go back yourself. It's a very long shot, but I'd be interested in any mention of Johnstons in the obituary. My Johnstons were in south Monaghan by the 1840s or so, but there's a rumor suggesting they may have come from the Clones area. If so, they may have kept in touch with relatives there. Diane ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Lyn Brown <[email protected]>wrote: >Hello, Pat, >What exactly do you mean by Cromwells Transportation Scheme. > >Do you mean people who Cromwell brought to IRELAND or something else? >I have only read of the ones he brought to Ireland. >Thank you in reply. > >Lyn Brown in Griffith =========================== >On 21/03/2010, at 7:55 AM, Pat Connors wrote: > > > I have just put my transcription online for this parish on the > > Monaghan > > section of my website. It is quite large and includes over 750 names. > > Please read my transcription notes carefully to see what kind of > > problems I encountered with this transcription.> > > > > From my reading, I have read that Monaghan was quite effected by > > Cromwell's transportation scheme. I > > -- > > Pat Connors, Sacramento CA ------------------------------------------------------ From reading "The Monaghan Story", by Livingstone, it seems that Monaghan was not part of the 6 counties included in the Plantation Scheme. The Irish there were not forced to go to Connaught. But even before the 1641 rebellion they had sold, left their lands, or their land was taken from them. In the county census of 1659 there were 4,084 heads of households, of which only 434 were English and 3,649 were Irish. That doesn't mean the Irish owned the house. They were probably renters of the land they once owned. The heads of household figure might equate to a population of 20,000. There were never enough settlers in Monaghan to enforce the Penal Laws to any great extent. When the Catholic King James II reigned around the 1680,s? The Irish mostly quit paying rents, or paid very little. Even a Franciscan Monastery was re-opened in 1688 in Monaghan. 1685 found many Irish still on their old lands, even though they were only renters. That short era of small freedoms ended with the Battle of the Boyne in 1689. James II left England for France. Although the Monaghan landlords were not bound to bring in British tenants as were those in the 6 counties of the Ulster Plantation, they tried to displace the Irish with the British. But leasing lands in Monaghan was not very attractive for the settlers since there was a cattle disease and England was not buying Irish raised cattle, and living among a strong population of Irish, which included tories and rapparees, was somewhat dangerous. A large number came in the early 1700, s but many areas were untouched by settlers. There is a list of names of Plantation settlers, English and Scotch, in the various parts of the 6 counties on my web page. http://www.angelfire.com/my/tray/index.html Also Plantation info, The Penal Laws, and names of the "Adventurers for Land in Ireland" .

Phil, the NLI has films of the Newtownbutler (part of Drumully) and Clones Rc parish records--Drumully baptisms from 1845, marriages from 1864, Clones baptisms from 1848, marriages from 1821. You'd have to hire a researcher or go back yourself. It's a very long shot, but I'd be interested in any mention of Johnstons in the obituary. My Johnstons were in south Monaghan by the 1840s or so, but there's a rumor suggesting they may have come from the Clones area. If so, they may have kept in touch with relatives there. Diane

I am interested in the mention of Cromwell - my Hanna ancestors are quoted in From the Boyne to Brampton: or John the Orangeman at home and abroad, Toronto: The Perkins Bull Foundation, George J. McLeod Ltd., 1936. "The Protestant spirit of this family is no more than might be expected, considering their traditional claim to descent from Latimer and Oliver Cromwell." I have read the genealogy of Cromwell and cannot find a link except that my Hanna(h) - Teel line perhaps did originate in Yorkshire. They were in Canada by 1830. The entire Bull collection has been digitized and can be read online - http://www.pinet.on.ca/peeldiglib/Documents.asp Jane Hemlin

I've been party from time to time to the recent email exchanges of the above addressees, and decided to seek your counsel. This email is coming from the San Francisco area. My maternal Irish ancestors, both McAvineys and Gunns, were originally from both Monaghan and Fermanagh, and specifically Clones and Newtownbutler. On my last visit to Ireland, I took some wonderful pictures inside the small cemetery on Galloon Island near Newtownbutler. A dozen McAviney tombstone names were quite visable, some dating back before the 1800s. I also made note of some of my ancestors' tombstones in the Clones Sacred Heart Cemetery. I have a published obituary news account of those who attended the large funeral of my Clones' ancestor, James McAviney, in the year 1900, which I'll be pleased to share with anyone who may be interested. The purpose of this email is to make contact with anyone who might like to have a snail mail copy of the above Clones list, and who may have any suggestions on how I may update my searching in Clones and/or Newtownbutler. Does anyone know if records are now available of Sacred Heart Church deceased parishioners from the 1800s? When I visited Sacred Heart Church years ago, I was told such records were not available to the public. I assume LDS never obtained them either. Has that changed? I apologize for the rambling aspects of this email, but I'd appreciate any suggestions anyone can give me on the above. Phil McDonnell < [email protected]>.

Regarding Cromwell and his deporting a great deal of the Irish abroad, I have also recently read this as well, whilst looking at some Irish History, in fact I wonder if there any lists to study? Regards Julie Perry WOODS.MURPHY,DUFFY county Monaghan

Hello, Pat, What exactly do you mean by Cromwells Transportation Scheme. Do you mean people who Cromwell brought to IRELAND or something else? I have only read of the ones he brought to Ireland. Thank you in reply. Lyn Brown in Griffith On 21/03/2010, at 7:55 AM, Pat Connors wrote: > I have just put my transcription online for this parish on the > Monaghan > section of my website. It is quite large and includes over 750 names. > Please read my transcription notes carefully to see what kind of > problems I encountered with this transcription. > > > From my reading, I have read that Monaghan was quite effected by > Cromwell's transportation scheme. I > -- > Pat Connors, Sacramento CA > http://www.connorsgenealogy.com > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

> What exactly do you mean by Cromwells Transportation Scheme. > > Do you mean people who Cromwell brought to IRELAND or something else? > I have only read of the ones he brought to Ireland. After the 1641 Irish uprising against the English invaders, Cromwell wanted retribution. With 17,000 troups, he re-invaded Ireland killing 1/3 of all the Catholic Irish. In 1852 England passed the 'Cromwellian Act of Settlement' which forced Irish landowners to relocate from the very fertile land of the the country to the land west of the River Shannon which was not very conducive to planting (mostly covered with rock), hence the saying, 'To Hell or Conacht'. I know I left out a lot but I am not an Ireland history expert and I am sure many can fill in my generalities. So back to my genealogy. My babybook says my McEntees emigrated to NY from 'Connaught'. The only place I can find McEntees there is in County Mayo but I am beginning to think they originated in County Monaghan, hence my question to those in the know, how did the Cromwell transplantation scheme effect the county? Were there certain areas where they moved? County Mayo? -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com

I have just put my transcription online for this parish on the Monaghan section of my website. It is quite large and includes over 750 names. Please read my transcription notes carefully to see what kind of problems I encountered with this transcription. On a personal note, found some McEntees in it and got quite excited! From my reading, I have read that Monaghan was quite effected by Cromwell's transportation scheme. I am wondering if there were any particular areas where some of the Irish may have ended up in Connaught. I am thinking my McEntees were in County Mayo before emigrating to New York State. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com