Hi Karla, I wouldn't just use the obituaries as the definitive word for information about both Bridget and Thomas or as the vehicle to begin searching for them in Ireland. I wonder if you have the correct ones for each of them since they're so different about what they say about the couple. With the absence of complete records here such as census records for the 1800s, vital records before 1864 and complete church parish records, you need real detail about them in order to find out what records might survive for them and how they can be searched here. As I mentioned the church records for Kilmaine in County Mayo don't go back far enough to include Thomas baptismal information. At the very minimum you need each of their parents names, dates of birth and birthplaces which is the town/townland, civil parish and county. (see http://www.seanruad.com ) As I mentioned, there are three Kilmaines in Ireland so Kilmaine Ireland as a birth location could be any of the three in three different counties. A Bridget Loftus in County Mayo isn't specific enough to find her birth location from this side of the pond in Mayo, you'd need to search her records in the US to find the additional detail you need about her before you can begin searching here. You should look for a marriage record in the US too and search for both the civil marriage record as well as the church marriage record. You can search for the marriage records wherever the first children were born in the US. Also search the US census records for Bridget emigrating as a child and being in the US census records in 1880 in the location where the first children were born. The 1910 and 1900 US census records should help with year of emigration for Bridget and Thomas as well as date of naturalisation, exact birth dates (month/year), number of years married, etc. Oceanstrands --- EverettKA@bak.rr.com wrote: > Thank you all for your interest in Hannigan and > Loftus. Your responses are > much more than I expected. > > This is my first opportunity to do any Irish > research and I'm very excited. > > I have searched for Thomas Hannigan in the 1880 > census, but have not been > able to identify him. With the alternate spellings > you have provided, maybe > I will have more luck. Same with the ships lists. > I will visit the sites > you all suggested this evening. > > I obtained the obituaries via an online newspaper > subscription service. I'm > unclear about copy rights in situations such as > this. I would be happy to > forward the obituaries to anyone who would like to > look at them - or I can > post them to the mailing list if someone can tell me > if this is 'legal.' > > Thank you, again. As soon as the death certificates > arrive, I will post new > information regarding this family. > > Karla in Bakersfield > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Oceanstrands" <oceanstrands@yahoo.com> > To: <irl-mayo@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 7:25 AM > Subject: Re: [IRL-MAYO] Bridget Loftus - Thomas > Hannigan m. abt. 1889 > > > > Hi David, > > > > There were 256 families in the County Mayo 1901 > census > > named Loftus, that's families, not people. Their > > locations were all over County Mayo. > > > > One unnamed Loftus who married an unnamed Joyce > with > > unknown parents names born on onknown dates who > went > > to Maine in the US at some unknown time period > with > > possible connections to a mispelled > Shaunaferaghaun > > really doesn't help find where Bridget Loftus who > > married Thomas Hannigan in the late 1880s was born > in > > County Mayo or her parents names. > > > > Oceanstrands > > > > > > --- David Soule <daithi@maine.rr.com> wrote: > > > >> For what it's worth; > >> > >> My understanding from a woman from Derry Park > Mayo, > >> is that Loftus is a name > >> common to [I'm never going to get this spelling > >> anywhere correct...sorry] > >> Shaunaferaghaun. A loftus married a Joyce and > came > >> to Portland, Maine to be > >> near relatives. > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Oceanstrands" <oceanstrands@yahoo.com> > >> To: <irl-mayo@rootsweb.com> > >> Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 9:22 AM > >> Subject: Re: [IRL-MAYO] Bridget Loftus - Thomas > >> Hannigan m. abt. 1889 > >> > >> > >> > --- Ejljbl@aol.com wrote: > >> > "He went back to Ireland and was probably > living > >> > close to Her in order to meet & Marry Her". > >> > > >> > Probably? Not at all probably!! You need to > keep > >> your > >> > assumptions in check Ed because you can get > lost > >> with > >> > those ideas. He was in the US already, there's > a > >> > question about whether Bridget emigrated to the > US > >> as > >> > a child or as an adult (big difference > there)and > >> > conflicting obituaries for each of them! More > >> research > >> > is needed in their US records. Looking for the > >> > marriage record there?? And for Bridget there > in > >> the > >> > US census? > >> > > >> > It's also questionable whether his US census > >> records > >> > show his income, employment and monetary status > >> there > >> > was sufficient enough for him to have afforded > to > >> come > >> > bsck to Ireland at all (and afford the return > >> journey > >> > for two of them) and left his job there to do > it?. > >> > > >> > There are no Loftus families in Kilmaine in > County > >> > Mayo in the 1901 Census and just one person > there > >> with > >> > the surname Loftus who's the parish priest, > born > >> in > >> > Roscommon! > >> > > >> > And there are three Kilmaines in Ireland where > >> Thomas > >> > could have been born, not just one in County > Mayo. > >> > > >> > You've gotten way ahead of yourself Ed! > >> > > >> > Oceanstrands > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > ------------------------------- > >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an > email > >> to > >> > IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > >> 'unsubscribe' without the > >> > quotes in the subject and the body of the > message > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an > email > >> to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > >> 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject > and > >> the body of the message > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to > > IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message >

There is a wonderful site done basically for Cleveland Irish but it contains a great deal of data for Mayo and has survey maps which you can zoom in and study. http://www.bernieworld.net He also states that he will soon have CDs available re: Mayo Mary Ellen Chambers

You mentioned during the last week of October last year that you'd be visiting before the holidays. Unfortunate your plans fell through. The exchange rate was alot better then than it is now or is forecast for the future. With recent rocketing gas prices, airline fares will probably be up substantially too. Aer Lingus has cancelled many of its US flights because the cost of fuel is too high. Oceanstrands --- Mary Ellen Chambers <maryln61@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > No, don't do Christmas in Ireland while we have > small grandchildren but definitly do Christmas > shopping the last week of October in Ireland. The > poor Euro exchange put us off but a year without > Ireland is not a doable situation. The mid Oct. > fares no matter the exchange is a must and back to > USA in time for Christmas. Hope to have family over > this summer, > > Oceanstrands <oceanstrands@yahoo.com> wrote: > Thought you mentioned you were coming last Christmas > and also this past spring. > > Mayo library has among its collection all the old > newspapers on microfilm and you can read what was > happening on a weekly basis for all the years you're > interested in. > > Ray Gillespie and Gerard Moran compiled essays on > Mayo > history that was published in 1989 in Westport, > there's a bibliography with that of original > sources, > Gerard Moran has written other books on Mayo history > as has Bernard O'Hara. They're at the library too. > > --- Mary Ellen Chambers > wrote: > > > I agree. Hope to get over in the Fall, Thanks for > > all you input. > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message >

You mentioned during the last week of October last year that you'd be visiting before the holidays. Unfortunate your plans fell through. The exchange rate was alot better then than it is now or is forecast for the future. Oceanstrands --- Mary Ellen Chambers <maryln61@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > No, don't do Christmas in Ireland while we have > small grandchildren but definitly do Christmas > shopping the last week of October in Ireland. The > poor Euro exchange put us off but a year without > Ireland is not a doable situation. The mid Oct. > fares no matter the exchange is a must and back to > USA in time for Christmas. Hope to have family over > this summer, > > Oceanstrands <oceanstrands@yahoo.com> wrote: > Thought you mentioned you were coming last Christmas > and also this past spring. > > Mayo library has among its collection all the old > newspapers on microfilm and you can read what was > happening on a weekly basis for all the years you're > interested in. > > Ray Gillespie and Gerard Moran compiled essays on > Mayo > history that was published in 1989 in Westport, > there's a bibliography with that of original > sources, > Gerard Moran has written other books on Mayo history > as has Bernard O'Hara. They're at the library too. > > --- Mary Ellen Chambers > wrote: > > > I agree. Hope to get over in the Fall, Thanks for > > all you input. > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message >

No, don't do Christmas in Ireland while we have small grandchildren but definitly do Christmas shopping the last week of October in Ireland. The poor Euro exchange put us off but a year without Ireland is not a doable situation. The mid Oct. fares no matter the exchange is a must and back to USA in time for Christmas. Hope to have family over this summer, Oceanstrands <oceanstrands@yahoo.com> wrote: Thought you mentioned you were coming last Christmas and also this past spring. Mayo library has among its collection all the old newspapers on microfilm and you can read what was happening on a weekly basis for all the years you're interested in. Ray Gillespie and Gerard Moran compiled essays on Mayo history that was published in 1989 in Westport, there's a bibliography with that of original sources, Gerard Moran has written other books on Mayo history as has Bernard O'Hara. They're at the library too. --- Mary Ellen Chambers wrote: > I agree. Hope to get over in the Fall, Thanks for > all you input. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: ballynan Surnames: ansbro Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.ireland.may.general/2142.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: I have never heard of "Knot Ireland" Is this Knottown in Ardcavan Parish, Wexford County? or Knock town in Co Clare?? Could you please clarify:the townland, parish, and county you are referring to? I'll try to help. Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

Margaret~ Thanks so much for taking the time to record this excellent data! I had thoughts of putting together a piece this weekend. No need. I think listers who have not really read too much can see how horrible and complex this was. The books you and Ocean mentioned are tremendous resource material for people who want to know the total story. Anyone going to Mayo should take the drive from Louisburgh where 300 (amount varies) had come for help after being turned away at Westport House and told to go to the English Officer at Louisburgh. Take the road out toward Leenane. This is where the authorities at Louisburgh told them to go to Delphi House for assistance. It was winter, raining and they were starving sick. On the way to Leenane is a cross LEFT side of the road. This was placed by Bishop Desmond Tutu several years ago. He was accompanied by members of the American Indian Tribe who sent assistance to the starving people. At Delphi House they were again refused aid and forced to return to Louisburgh. Mary Ellen Chambers conaught2 <conaught2@charter.net> wrote: All four of my grandparents came from Ireland. One grandmother came from County Down where the Famine supposedly was not severe but my Great Great Grandparents Edward Rice and Brigid Brannigan Rice, died from TB as a result of the Famine. They left two small orphaned daughters. With Famine came disease, the following is a partial list of the diseases that contributed to the estimated one million people who died as a result of the the Great Hunger (An Gorta Mor). Typhus Relapsing Fever Dysentery Bacillary Dysentery Hunger Oedema Scurvy Ophthalmia Cholera TB As mentioned in other posts there are many excellent books about The Great Hunger, along with Cecil Woodam-Smith, a few others are: This Great Calamity The Irish Famine 1845-1852 by Christine Kineally -Excellent The Darkest Years - A Famine Story- Michael Mullen, native of Castlebar, County Mayo (the book is based on the records of the Connaught Telegraph). Irish Famine Facts by John Keathing The Irish Famine by Peter Gray Famine Diary Jouney to a New World by Gerald Keegan The 1851 Census reflects the great cost of human life lost to the Great Hunger and immigration, mostly caused to escape the desperate conditions in Ireland. After calculating for the natural growth of a population it was determined that more than a quarter of the population was lost during the Great Hunger, more than 1,100,000 starved to death or died from diseases caused by An Gorta Mor. 1846-1851 ( does not include 1845 or 1852, both Famine years) Average annual excess mortality by county. The following death statistics per county is taken from "The Irish Famine" by Peter Gray Yearly deaths per thousand: 50,000-60,000 Counties: Mayo Sligo Western Leitrim 40,000-50,000 Leitrim Cavan Roscommon Galway 30,000-40,000 Clare Cork 20,000-30,000 Fermanagh Monaghan Longford Westmeath Tipperary Kerry Waterford Laois 10,000-20,000 Donegal Antrim Tyrone Armagh Offaly Limerick Kilkenny Meath Wicklow 0-10,000 Derry Down Louth Kildare Carlow Wexford Dublin The following information is taken from "Irish Famine Facts" by John Keating: Decline of the population between 1841-1841 More than 25% Counties: Fermanagh -26% Monaghan -29% Cavan -28% Sligo -29% Mayo - 29% Roscommon -32% Longford -29% Leitrim -28% Galway - 27% Laois -27% Clare -26% 20-25% Counties: Limerick -21% Tipperary -24% Cork -24% Westmeath - 21% Meath - 23% Offaly- 23% Wicklow - 22% Carlow - 21% Kilkenny - 22% 15-20% Counties: Tyrone 18% Armagh - 16% Louth - 16% Kildare-16% Waterford - 16% Kerry - 19% 10 - 15% Counties: Donegal- 14% Derry - 14% Down - 11% Wexford - 11% Less than 10% Counties: Antrim 9% *no stats for Dublin Michael Davitt a native of Straid, County Mayo was a small child during An Gorta Mor when he and his family were evicted from their home. The family left for England where Micahel lost his arm due to a manufacturing accident while working in a factory, he was about 12 years old. The victims of eviction were not allowed to seek shelter from relatives or friends and many lay on the road near their home dying from starvation and disease. Two years of the Great Hunger are missing from the following statistics. Taken from Irish Famine Facts by John Keating. Evictions: 1846 - 4,000 Families 1847- 6,000 Families 1848 - 9,500 Families 1849 - 16,500 Families 1850 - 20,000 Families 1851 - 13,000 Families I've included this information to give you a glimpse of what was happening in Ireland. There are a lot of sites on the internet that provide a lot of detail including newspaper accounts during An Gorta Mor. >From a book about Michael Davitt I learned about a Famine Grave in Swinford. My cousin who knows most details about our parish of Kilconduff was unaware of this Famine Grave. Close to 600 Famine victims were thrown unceremoniously in a large grave up behind the Fever hospital, no religious ceremony was allowed at the time of the burial. The Famine Grave is up behind the Fever Hospital on the Dublin Road. Hidden behind a vale of drooping branches is a most incredible monument dedicated to the victims of An Gorta Mor. In 1994 Arun Gandhi and his wife Sunanda Gandhi dedicated the monument in memory of all the souls who lost their lives to An Gorta Mor. There is a carved picture of Michael Davitt and Mahatma Gandhi and a carving of a St. Brigid's Cross. The following is what appears on the monument. "Here lie the remains of hundreds of poor people who died during Ireland's so called Great Famine In 1879 Michael Davitt visited this grave before founding the National Land League. Their memory challenges us to continue the struggle for a more just and equitable world." Quote by Davitt - "To Ireland I leave the undying prayer for absolute freedom and independence which it was my life's ambition to try and obtain for her". Quote by Mahatma Gandhi - "The earth has enough for everyone's needs But not enough for everyone's greed". Unveiled by Arun Gandhi grandson of Mahatma Gandhi and Sundanda Gandhi on Sunday, May 8, 1994. I have been in correspondence with Arun Gandhi and he continues his grandfather's work toward peace. He walked with others on a ten mile walk beyond Pontoon, in honor of a group of Famine victims who were told they could not receive any food unless they showed up at the workhouse first thing in the morning. They walked in snow all night to arrive in time at the workhouse, but sadly many died during the walk. For any of you who have the opportunity to visit Swinford, a visit to the Famine Grave is a powerful experience. Beannachtai, Margaret ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you all for your interest in Hannigan and Loftus. Your responses are much more than I expected. This is my first opportunity to do any Irish research and I'm very excited. I have searched for Thomas Hannigan in the 1880 census, but have not been able to identify him. With the alternate spellings you have provided, maybe I will have more luck. Same with the ships lists. I will visit the sites you all suggested this evening. I obtained the obituaries via an online newspaper subscription service. I'm unclear about copy rights in situations such as this. I would be happy to forward the obituaries to anyone who would like to look at them - or I can post them to the mailing list if someone can tell me if this is 'legal.' Thank you, again. As soon as the death certificates arrive, I will post new information regarding this family. Karla in Bakersfield ----- Original Message ----- From: "Oceanstrands" <oceanstrands@yahoo.com> To: <irl-mayo@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 7:25 AM Subject: Re: [IRL-MAYO] Bridget Loftus - Thomas Hannigan m. abt. 1889 > Hi David, > > There were 256 families in the County Mayo 1901 census > named Loftus, that's families, not people. Their > locations were all over County Mayo. > > One unnamed Loftus who married an unnamed Joyce with > unknown parents names born on onknown dates who went > to Maine in the US at some unknown time period with > possible connections to a mispelled Shaunaferaghaun > really doesn't help find where Bridget Loftus who > married Thomas Hannigan in the late 1880s was born in > County Mayo or her parents names. > > Oceanstrands > > > --- David Soule <daithi@maine.rr.com> wrote: > >> For what it's worth; >> >> My understanding from a woman from Derry Park Mayo, >> is that Loftus is a name >> common to [I'm never going to get this spelling >> anywhere correct...sorry] >> Shaunaferaghaun. A loftus married a Joyce and came >> to Portland, Maine to be >> near relatives. >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Oceanstrands" <oceanstrands@yahoo.com> >> To: <irl-mayo@rootsweb.com> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 9:22 AM >> Subject: Re: [IRL-MAYO] Bridget Loftus - Thomas >> Hannigan m. abt. 1889 >> >> >> > --- Ejljbl@aol.com wrote: >> > "He went back to Ireland and was probably living >> > close to Her in order to meet & Marry Her". >> > >> > Probably? Not at all probably!! You need to keep >> your >> > assumptions in check Ed because you can get lost >> with >> > those ideas. He was in the US already, there's a >> > question about whether Bridget emigrated to the US >> as >> > a child or as an adult (big difference there)and >> > conflicting obituaries for each of them! More >> research >> > is needed in their US records. Looking for the >> > marriage record there?? And for Bridget there in >> the >> > US census? >> > >> > It's also questionable whether his US census >> records >> > show his income, employment and monetary status >> there >> > was sufficient enough for him to have afforded to >> come >> > bsck to Ireland at all (and afford the return >> journey >> > for two of them) and left his job there to do it?. >> > >> > There are no Loftus families in Kilmaine in County >> > Mayo in the 1901 Census and just one person there >> with >> > the surname Loftus who's the parish priest, born >> in >> > Roscommon! >> > >> > And there are three Kilmaines in Ireland where >> Thomas >> > could have been born, not just one in County Mayo. >> > >> > You've gotten way ahead of yourself Ed! >> > >> > Oceanstrands >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email >> to >> > IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word >> 'unsubscribe' without the >> > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email >> to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word >> 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and >> the body of the message >> > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

In a message dated 6/10/2008 6:17:24 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, oceanstrands@yahoo.com writes: Not really - marriages were in the bride's church and that could be where she was born or where she lived or her family lived when she married. Not necessarily at all where the groom was born. Oceanstrands: Acknowledged ! I mention / stated it this way because He went back to Ireland and was probably living close to Her in order to meet & Marry Her. But, You are absolutely correct ! Ed (Pat) Logan of Philly **************Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg00050000000102)

Hi David, There were 256 families in the County Mayo 1901 census named Loftus, that's families, not people. Their locations were all over County Mayo. One unnamed Loftus who married an unnamed Joyce with unknown parents names born on onknown dates who went to Maine in the US at some unknown time period with possible connections to a mispelled Shaunaferaghaun really doesn't help find where Bridget Loftus who married Thomas Hannigan in the late 1880s was born in County Mayo or her parents names. Oceanstrands --- David Soule <daithi@maine.rr.com> wrote: > For what it's worth; > > My understanding from a woman from Derry Park Mayo, > is that Loftus is a name > common to [I'm never going to get this spelling > anywhere correct...sorry] > Shaunaferaghaun. A loftus married a Joyce and came > to Portland, Maine to be > near relatives. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Oceanstrands" <oceanstrands@yahoo.com> > To: <irl-mayo@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 9:22 AM > Subject: Re: [IRL-MAYO] Bridget Loftus - Thomas > Hannigan m. abt. 1889 > > > > --- Ejljbl@aol.com wrote: > > "He went back to Ireland and was probably living > > close to Her in order to meet & Marry Her". > > > > Probably? Not at all probably!! You need to keep > your > > assumptions in check Ed because you can get lost > with > > those ideas. He was in the US already, there's a > > question about whether Bridget emigrated to the US > as > > a child or as an adult (big difference there)and > > conflicting obituaries for each of them! More > research > > is needed in their US records. Looking for the > > marriage record there?? And for Bridget there in > the > > US census? > > > > It's also questionable whether his US census > records > > show his income, employment and monetary status > there > > was sufficient enough for him to have afforded to > come > > bsck to Ireland at all (and afford the return > journey > > for two of them) and left his job there to do it?. > > > > There are no Loftus families in Kilmaine in County > > Mayo in the 1901 Census and just one person there > with > > the surname Loftus who's the parish priest, born > in > > Roscommon! > > > > And there are three Kilmaines in Ireland where > Thomas > > could have been born, not just one in County Mayo. > > > > You've gotten way ahead of yourself Ed! > > > > Oceanstrands > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to > > IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message >

--- Ejljbl@aol.com wrote: "He went back to Ireland and was probably living close to Her in order to meet & Marry Her". Probably? Not at all probably!! You need to keep your assumptions in check Ed because you can get lost with those ideas. He was in the US already, there's a question about whether Bridget emigrated to the US as a child or as an adult (big difference there)and conflicting obituaries for each of them! More research is needed in their US records. Looking for the marriage record there?? And for Bridget there in the US census? It's also questionable whether his US census records show his income, employment and monetary status there was sufficient enough for him to have afforded to come bsck to Ireland at all (and afford the return journey for two of them) and left his job there to do it?. There are no Loftus families in Kilmaine in County Mayo in the 1901 Census and just one person there with the surname Loftus who's the parish priest, born in Roscommon! And there are three Kilmaines in Ireland where Thomas could have been born, not just one in County Mayo. You've gotten way ahead of yourself Ed! Oceanstrands

This is a Message Board Post that is gatewayed to this mailing list. Author: jeanbarrynella Surnames: O Malley Classification: queries Message Board URL: http://boards.rootsweb.com/localities.britisles.ireland.may.general/1732.1.1.1/mb.ashx Message Board Post: Hi Sorry can i ask who this reply to as i am not sure if was an answer to my family Regards Jean Important Note: The author of this message may not be subscribed to this list. If you would like to reply to them, please click on the Message Board URL link above and respond on the board.

--- Ejljbl@aol.com wrote: "He went back to Ireland and was probably living close to Her in order to meet & Marry Her". Probably? Not at all probably!! You need to keep your assumptions in check Ed because you can get lost with those ideas. He was in the US already, there's a question about whether Bridget emigrated to the US as a child or as an adult (big difference there)and conflicting obituaries for each of them! More research is needed in their US records. Looking for the marriage record there?? And for Bridget there in the US census? It's also questionable whether his US census records show his income, employment and monetary status there was sufficient enough for him to have afforded to come bsck to Ireland at all (and afford the return journey for two of them) and left his job there to do it?. There are no Loftus families in Kilmaine in County Mayo in the 1901 Census and just one person there with the surname Loftus who's the parish priest, born in Roscommon! And there are three Kilmaines in Ireland where Thomas could have been born, not just one in County Mayo. You've gotten way ahead of yourself Ed! Oceanstrands

Everett: A quick check of the IFHF Site ( _http://ifhf.brsgenealogy.com/_ (http://ifhf.brsgenealogy.com/) ) shows the following: Thomas Heneghan / Hannigan -- Born 1845-1853 (6) with none b in '49 and none born in Kilmaine. -- Marriage 1883-1889 (11) Bridget Loftus -- Born 1862 (1). -- Marriage 1883 - 1889 (17) Marriage records for both Names in 1883, 1884, 1885, 1887, & 1889. This is a free search site, just register and search immediately. Click on the Map and search Co. Mayo, by Parish, for the Marriages, and then Births. The chances are good that the Marriage Location will be the same for the Birth. In order to buy the records, You have to buy 40 Euros minimum ($63.00 US), that will allow you to get 8 Records. Good Luck Ed (Pat) Logan of Philly **************Vote for your city's best dining and nightlife. City's Best 2008. (http://citysbest.aol.com?ncid=aolacg00050000000102)

Please excuse this post, I want to see if it apears in my inbox. Yesterday I wrote a long post about the above topic and it did not appear in my inbox and wonder if anyone received it on the list. Go raibh maith agat, Margaret (Máiread)

Hello Everett, There isn't just one Kilmaine in Ireland. There's the town (it's really a village) in Mayo as well as Kilmaine townlands in County Westmeath and County Offaly (formerly Kings County). Oceanstrands --- EverettKA@bak.rr.com wrote: > New to the list. Just learned birth places for two > people I have been researching for some time. > > According to their obituaries: > > Thomas Hannigan, > born 08/20/1849 in Kilmaine, Ireland. > Came to American in 1871. > Returned to Ireland and married Bridget Loftus. > Bridget came to America with Thomas in June, 1889. > Thomas died 04/16/1928 in either Cherrytree, Venango > County, Pennsylvania or Titusville, Crawford County, > Pennsylvania. > His 1928 obituary says that he has a brother and > sister living in Ireland and a sister, Ann Duffy, > living in New Jersey. > > Bridget Loftus, born about 1862 in County Mayo, > Ireland. > Died 11/02/1946 in Titusville, Crawford County, > Pennsylvania. > No mention is made of her family in Ireland. > Bridget's obituary contradicts that of her husband. > It says that she came to America as a girl. I tend > to believe that Thomas's obituary is correct because > Bridget probably provided the information. > > I'm sending for obituaries and will update the > mailing list when the information is received. > > In the meantime, just wanted to get my names out > there. I would be happy to hear any suggestions for > research in County Mayo - other than actually > visiting. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > to IRL-MAYO-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message >

Hi Everett, Vital records/birth records don't start in Ireland until 1864 so there won't be a civil birth record for Thomas. Kilmaine Catholic church parish records don't begin until 1855 so there won't be a baptismal record for him either if he was born in Kilmaine. Here is the link to the Catholic parish maps in Mayo, click on each parish for the years covered in the records and where the records can be searched: http://www.ireland.com/ancestor/browse/counties/rcmaps/mayorc.htm If you look at Kilmaine parish on the map in the southeastern part of the county, click on it, then when you're in that window scroll down to the link on the left to click on the civil parishes included in the Catholic parish you'll see the civil parishes include Kilmainebeg, Kilmainemore and Moorgagagh. Click on each of those to see the names of the towns and townlands in each of those civil parishes. Emigrants could have referred to their Catholic parish as their birthplaces and not necessarily to the town or townland where they were born. Most of the Catholic parish records for Mayo are available on microfilm through your nearest LDS (Latter Day Saints) Family History Centre in the US. Do you have Thomas Hannigan's parents names from his US records? His surname in the US of Hannigan was probably a phonetic spelling of his real surname which would have several spelling variations in Mayo. The spelling variations would include Heneghan, Hennigan, just to name a few. You can see the various surname variations in Ireland if you search the surname search on the Irish Times website using Heneghan as your search surname: http://www.ireland.com/ancestor/surname/index.cfm?fuseaction=Go.&UserID= The first available census in Ireland is 1901 and 1911 has been released early. No census records are available after 1911 and that census isn't online. No census records in Ireland before 1901. The 1901 census was organised by town or townland and civil parish. Here's a map of the civil parishes in Mayo: http://www.ireland.com/ancestor/fuses/civilparish/index.cfm?fuseaction=GetMap&CityCounty=Mayo The 1901 online County Mayo census is online to search: http://www.leitrim-roscommon.com/1901census/census.shtml Pick Mayo as your search county. If you search just the surname Heneghan you'll find 111 entries for families with that surname in Mayo. There are none listed in the Town of Kilmaine. Searching Kilmainebeg civil parish for the surname shows none there either. One is listed in the civil parish of Kilmainemore in the townland of Clyard, Bridget age 60 who's a widow. She's too young to have been Thomas mother. There are no Heneghans listed in Moorgagagh civil parish either in the 1901 online census. The Heneghans could have moved anywhere in Mayo or elsewhere in Ireland. The Ireland wide Irish census records for 1901 and 1911 aren't online as yet either. Do you have Bridget Loftus parents names and birthplace in Mayo from her civil and church US records? The Loftus surname is common everywhere in the county. Since she was born before civil registration/vital records started in Ireland for births in 1864 surviving church parish records for her birthplace in Mayo would be the possible source for a baptismal record for her. Since all the Catholic parish records in Mayo don't survive for her possible birth year, there may or may not be a record of her baptism depending on where she was born in Mayo. There's a list of all the towns and townlands in Mayo at http://www.seanruad.com and pick Mayo as your search county. If you search the online 1901 Mayo census for just Loftus surname in Mayo there are 256 families with that surname listed. You should be able to verify easily enough when Bridget Loftus went to the US from the online census records there which are available every ten years beginning in 1790 to 1930. Their marriage year should be included as well as when she emigrated. The census records should also include when Thomas was naturalised and if Bridget was naturalised also. As far as the marriage record in Ireland is concerned, civil registration of marriages began in Ireland in 1864 for Catholics, there may be a civil marriage record for them but you'd need to know their fathers' names and where they were married either in County Mayo or elsewhere in Ireland to order the cert from the General Register Office http://www.groireland.ie Many marriages weren't registered in the civil registration records. You can order the Irish civil registration marriage indexes microfilms through your nearest LDS Family History Centre in the US and search for the marriage entry in the index for the marriage date they provided in the US census records. The Indexes are in chronological order for all of Ireland. There are no records in Ireland about who emigrated, when or where they went. Ships passenger records that survived were given in at the arrival ports. Oceanstrands --- EverettKA@bak.rr.com wrote: > New to the list. Just learned birth places for two > people I have been researching for some time. > > According to their obituaries: > > Thomas Hannigan, > born 08/20/1849 in Kilmaine, Ireland. > Came to American in 1871. > Returned to Ireland and married Bridget Loftus. > Bridget came to America with Thomas in June, 1889. > Thomas died 04/16/1928 in either Cherrytree, Venango > County, Pennsylvania or Titusville, Crawford County, > Pennsylvania. > His 1928 obituary says that he has a brother and > sister living in Ireland and a sister, Ann Duffy, > living in New Jersey. > > Bridget Loftus, born about 1862 in County Mayo, > Ireland. > Died 11/02/1946 in Titusville, Crawford County, > Pennsylvania. > No mention is made of her family in Ireland. > Bridget's obituary contradicts that of her husband. > It says that she came to America as a girl. I tend > to believe that Thomas's obituary is correct because > Bridget probably provided the information. > > I'm sending for obituaries and will update the > mailing list when the information is received. > > In the meantime, just wanted to get my names out > there. I would be happy to hear any suggestions for > research in County Mayo - other than actually > visiting.

Ed, --- Ejljbl@aol.com wrote: " Thomas Heneghan / Hannigan -- Born 1845-1853 (6) > with none b in '49 and none born in Kilmaine". No baptism records for Thomas if he was born in Kilmaine because Kilmaine church records don't go back to 1849 to have one. No vital records for his birth because vital records for births don't begin until 1864. --- Ejljbl@aol.com wrote: "The chances are good that the Marriage Location will be the same for the birth." Not really - marriages were in the bride's church and that could be where she was born or where she lived or her family lived when she married. Not necessarily at all where the groom was born. Both Loftus and Hannigan are both common surnames here in Mayo. Bridget could have been born anywhere in the county. There were Loftus everywhere Oceanstrands --- Ejljbl@aol.com wrote: > Everett: > > A quick check of the IFHF Site ( > _http://ifhf.brsgenealogy.com/_ > (http://ifhf.brsgenealogy.com/) ) shows the > following: > Thomas Heneghan / Hannigan -- Born 1845-1853 (6) > with none b in '49 and none > born in Kilmaine. > -- > Marriage 1883-1889 (11) > Bridget Loftus -- Born 1862 > (1). > -- > Marriage 1883 - 1889 (17) > Marriage records for both Names in 1883, 1884, 1885, > 1887, & 1889. > > This is a free search site, just register and search > immediately. Click on > the Map and search Co. Mayo, by Parish, for the > Marriages, and then Births. > The chances are good that the Marriage Location > will be the same for the > Birth. In order to buy the records, You have to > buy 40 Euros minimum > ($63.00 US), that will allow you to get 8 Records. > > Good Luck > > Ed (Pat) Logan of Philly

Thought you mentioned you were coming last Christmas and also this past spring. Mayo library has among its collection all the old newspapers on microfilm and you can read what was happening on a weekly basis for all the years you're interested in. Ray Gillespie and Gerard Moran compiled essays on Mayo history that was published in 1989 in Westport, there's a bibliography with that of original sources, Gerard Moran has written other books on Mayo history as has Bernard O'Hara. They're at the library too. --- Mary Ellen Chambers <maryln61@sbcglobal.net> wrote: > I agree. Hope to get over in the Fall, Thanks for > all you input.

New to the list. Just learned birth places for two people I have been researching for some time. According to their obituaries: Thomas Hannigan, born 08/20/1849 in Kilmaine, Ireland. Came to American in 1871. Returned to Ireland and married Bridget Loftus. Bridget came to America with Thomas in June, 1889. Thomas died 04/16/1928 in either Cherrytree, Venango County, Pennsylvania or Titusville, Crawford County, Pennsylvania. His 1928 obituary says that he has a brother and sister living in Ireland and a sister, Ann Duffy, living in New Jersey. Bridget Loftus, born about 1862 in County Mayo, Ireland. Died 11/02/1946 in Titusville, Crawford County, Pennsylvania. No mention is made of her family in Ireland. Bridget's obituary contradicts that of her husband. It says that she came to America as a girl. I tend to believe that Thomas's obituary is correct because Bridget probably provided the information. I'm sending for obituaries and will update the mailing list when the information is received. In the meantime, just wanted to get my names out there. I would be happy to hear any suggestions for research in County Mayo - other than actually visiting.