joiner is an architectural woodworker A finish carpenter as opposed to rough carpenter. In Victorian times would have done the intricate carpentry on porches and houses or fancy interior carpentry -------Original Message------- From: Christina Hunt Date: 05/22/07 15:16:14 To: LONGFORD-L Subject: [IRL-LONGFORD] Washington County, NY naturalizations - GERATY I was doing some wild goose chasing in Washington County Naturalizations ca. 1830. I didn't find anything for myself, but looked at the counties the Irish were giving. Serveral named Longford. The FHL# is 1031399 The film was very dark so I will do my best with it. John Geraty reports to the Clerk of the county of Washington that he is thirty years of age by profession a Joiner (?) was born in that part of Great Britain called Ireland in the County of Longford that he Embarked from ___ on the 3rd of May 1832 & arrived in Quebec on the 17th of June following and came directly to Sandy Hill in Washington County State of New York, & has resided there & is ____________ Is married & his wifes name is Mary has two children Thomas 2 years & 8 months old James 2 months on the 12th of Dec ___ that he Came to the United States with the intention of becoming a citizen thereof & residing therein Dated Decr 7th 1836 ________________ (He swears loyalty etc in bottom paragraph.) Signed with a mark --------------------------------- No punctuation to speak of so I put the statements on different lines. If this means something to anyone I will send the image. Christina ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.7.6/814 - Release Date: 5/21/2007 2:01 PM .

I was doing some wild goose chasing in Washington County Naturalizations ca. 1830. I didn't find anything for myself, but looked at the counties the Irish were giving. Serveral named Longford. The FHL# is 1031399 The film was very dark so I will do my best with it. John Geraty reports to the Clerk of the county of Washington that he is thirty years of age by profession a Joiner (?) was born in that part of Great Britain called Ireland in the County of Longford that he Embarked from ___ on the 3rd of May 1832 & arrived in Quebec on the 17th of June following and came directly to Sandy Hill in Washington County State of New York, & has resided there & is ____________ Is married & his wifes name is Mary has two children Thomas 2 years & 8 months old James 2 months on the 12th of Dec ___ that he Came to the United States with the intention of becoming a citizen thereof & residing therein Dated Decr 7th 1836 ________________ (He swears loyalty etc in bottom paragraph.) Signed with a mark --------------------------------- No punctuation to speak of so I put the statements on different lines. If this means something to anyone I will send the image. Christina

That's possible. That is about the time--although perhaps up to five years early--that there were new veteran's benefits available. As I recall, their appearance more or less coincided with the end of Reconstruction. My American-born great-grandfather, who seems to have had a bit of the scamp about him, made strenuous efforts to get disability payments as a result of his service at the Battle of Shiloah. However, I think that was about 1880, but maybe the news traveled more slowly then! As to the possibility of veterans' benefits being available only to citizens, that may have been the case, but it would surprise me a little. One of my Irish-born relatives fell at the Battle of Gettysburg, and his Irish-born widow had no difficulty collecting benefits for the rest of her life even though neither she nor her huband were citizens. However, it occurs to me that the rules in this regard (if any) may not have been consistently applied, particularly for those with Civil War service. At least as far as my relatives go, they enlisted in state militias. At a time before federal contralization had yet occurred in any meaningful sense, there may have been a crazy quilt of state regulations in play. Nancy -------------- Original message from Robert Kirk <isobar@bcpl.net>: -------------- > At 07:55 PM 5/11/2007, ngray.phale@att.net wrote: > >They still had to go through the naturalization process. However, a > >sizable percentage just never bothered in the 19th century. In the days > >before social security, medicare, income tax, etc., there just wasn't as > >much incentive. > > > >Nancy > > Hmm, I wonder if there was one incentive? One of my wife's g-grandfathers, > Asa or Anthony McCabe b. ~ 1824 in Nova Scotia came to Pennsylvania > sometime before the late 1850's. There is a record of an Anthony McCabe > serving in the Civil War from his area, and then in 1875 an Anthony McCabe > from Nova Scotia,applied for naturalization in Cameron County, PA. (in > those days County government handled naturalization.) > > The connections are tenuous, but assuming it's all the same person, why > would a 50 year old man apply for naturalization? My only guess is that > there may have been some sort of new veteran's benefit approved that was > only available to citizens. > > Bob Kirk > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

At 07:55 PM 5/11/2007, ngray.phale@att.net wrote: >They still had to go through the naturalization process. However, a >sizable percentage just never bothered in the 19th century. In the days >before social security, medicare, income tax, etc., there just wasn't as >much incentive. > >Nancy Hmm, I wonder if there was one incentive? One of my wife's g-grandfathers, Asa or Anthony McCabe b. ~ 1824 in Nova Scotia came to Pennsylvania sometime before the late 1850's. There is a record of an Anthony McCabe serving in the Civil War from his area, and then in 1875 an Anthony McCabe from Nova Scotia,applied for naturalization in Cameron County, PA. (in those days County government handled naturalization.) The connections are tenuous, but assuming it's all the same person, why would a 50 year old man apply for naturalization? My only guess is that there may have been some sort of new veteran's benefit approved that was only available to citizens. Bob Kirk

They still had to go through the naturalization process. However, a sizable percentage just never bothered in the 19th century. In the days before social security, medicare, income tax, etc., there just wasn't as much incentive. Nancy -------------- Original message from "Verlaine Bennett" <verlaine52@msn.com>: -------------- > Dear List, When an immigrant joined the army during the Civil War were they > given citizenship after they fulfilled their duty? > Verlaine in So. California > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

http://149.101.23.2/graphics/aboutus/history/articles/oview.htm Dept of homeland security site on history of INS It does not seem that there was any great issue about immigration or citizanship untill well after the civil war other than for black slaves It would appear that the entry into US and the naturalization process were pretty loose up until about the 1880's, enter the country - go to a court and swear alegiance Then it became as it is today, an invented difficult process driven by race and ethnicity exclussion issues more than anything. Elis Island etc. are basicly late 19th and 20th century inventions -------Original Message------- From: ngray.phale@att.net Date: 05/11/07 19:56:02 To: irl-longford@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [IRL-LONGFORD] Civil War They still had to go through the naturalization process. However, a sizable percentage just never bothered in the 19th century. In the days before social security, medicare, income tax, etc., there just wasn't as much incentive. Nancy -------------- Original message from "Verlaine Bennett" <verlaine52@msn com>: -------------- > Dear List, When an immigrant joined the army during the Civil War were they > given citizenship after they fulfilled their duty? > Verlaine in So. California > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.8/797 - Release Date: 5/10/2007 5:10 PM

Dear List, When an immigrant joined the army during the Civil War were they given citizenship after they fulfilled their duty? Verlaine in So. California

Thank you, Gail. Ursuka ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

I live in RI and have never heard of Donough St. It is not listed in my street directory. Large areas of Providence, especially in the "Fox Point" area where the Irish immigrants lived are gone now because of highway construction. Some of the addresses I have for my Irish ancestors are no there If you have an old census record for your Donough family, you might be able to find names of surrounding streets and you might be able to pinpoint about where in Providence they settled. There were two or three neighborhoods not far from each other. Providence is a small city compared to some. If you find any more clues (street names etc.) I'll be happy to help you find the area you are looking for. Gail O'Brien Moran

I don't know about a Donough Street in Providence. I live in California, and I have only been in Providence twice in my life, once when I was only eight years old. However, I think that there are several Rhode Island residents who subscribe to the Longford list; one of them may be more helpful than I am able to be on about Providence streets. Nancy -------------- Original message from uwals931@aol.com: -------------- > Hi Nancy, > Thank you so much for your response. > One other question, was there a Donough Street in Providence,RI? It is not > listed on old or new RI maps. > Ursula > > > > ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks again,Nancy. Have a wonderful day! Ursula ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

Hi Nancy, Thank you so much for your response. One other question, was there a Donough Street in Providence,RI? It is not listed on old or new RI maps. Ursula ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

Mary-Ellen, It's just a long shot (and my excuses to those already aware) but : Try "The McCabe's List", a book by Dr. Bruce Elliott, for the Irish immigrants working on the Rideau Canal - it's the canal that joins the Ottawa River in what is now Ottawa,Canada through the Rideau Lakes to Lake Ontario/St Lawrence River at Kingston. Construction started in 1826 and ended 1832. It would seem logical that at least some of those building one canal would go to work on another afterwards. After the War of 1812, Irish immigrants arrived in Canada initially on boats used to freight British troops back to the UK. They were offered passage and land. In 1829, more than 630 Irish immigrants signed a petition saying they were fine and indicating names and places of relatives still in Ireland. The list was discoverd in the Archives in London, England around 1985. Its purpose was to encourage more immigants and to dispell rumors that the immigrants were starving. -- email: PVMeistrel@aol.com to Rita Meistrel who(if asked nicely) is willing do lookups. It's a long shot, but if it works could take you back to the townland he came from and put names on some of his relatives. Thomas Moffatt thomas.moffatt@free.fr ----- Original Message ----- From: <PSUmom901@aol.com> To: <irl-longford@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 8:03 PM Subject: Re: [IRL-LONGFORD] Irish Immigrants to Rhode Island > Hi Nancy, Thanks for the information. > > My GG Grandfather (David Williams) came to this country 1828 and it is > thought from articles that I have read, he came to Quebec. I have no idea > where or > how he would have made entrance. He also worked on > canals and navigated to PA. I have no dates on this. I should also > indicate > that he was from Tipperary, Ireland. My question is how would I look up > information pertaining to arriving into this country? > > My GG Grandfather (James Doran) came to this country around 1832, with his > wife Mary Kennedy Doran. Both were from Longford County. According to > information that I have, he made entrance into the United States at New > York City. > He found employment on the Hudson-Delaware Canal for a short period of > time > until the cholera epidemic of 1832 began to spread. James decided to left > before the city was quarantined and boarded the last boat to PA. > > Do you think that there is anyway that I can find their names listed on > the > ships that brought them to the US. Obviously, I do not have months and > years, > but sufficient information that perhaps I can come up with something. > Please > let me know, how I should proceed. I am not sure on how to research this > type > of information. > > Sincerely, Mary Ellen > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Famine-era arrivals through New York are pretty well indexed by now, so if you are not finding anything there (including looking for possible deviant spellings), I would look at other US ports. If you think the date of arrival could have been as early as 1847, I would certainly check the quarantine records at Grosse Ile, Quebec, where a large majority of the "coffin" ships of this worse year of the Famine--known as Black '47--arrived. I did this a few years ago looking for a family member and did find that she had died there in quarantine. (The persons that you are actually seeking presumably survived and went on to settle in this country, but they may have had family members who were not so lucky. These records could prove important establishing where your primary targets were at a given point in time.) It's been several years since I did this, so I no longer remember the source, but I think it was the database of the National Archives of Canada. Perhaps some of the Canadian members of the list could be of assistance in steering you in the right direction. Nancy -------------- Original message from MinersofMourne <mourneminers@optonline.net>: -------------- > Lots of links/advice here: > > http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/Emigration.htm > > > Fiona. > -----Original Message----- > From: irl-longford-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:irl-longford-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of uwals931@aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 1:26 PM > To: irl-longford@rootsweb.com > Subject: [IRL-LONGFORD] REQUETS HELP.PLEASE > > Hi Nancy, > My Great-Grandparents came from Ireland and settled in Providence,Rhode > Island. On their voyage to America, they lost their infant son passed away. > I searched the New York passenger list for 1848 to 1850, but did not find > their names on any list. > Their names were Michael Lyons and Ann Lyons. Ann's maiden name was > Donohue or Donough. Their infant was named James Lyons. > When my grandfather, Joseph Lyons was born, they lived on Donough Street > in Providence,Rhode Island. > I am trying to trace their roots back to Ireland, but am having a problem > with my research. > Their first daughter, Bridget Lyons was born in 1850, Providence, RI. This > makes me believe they arrived between 1848 and 1850. > I will be most grateful for any advice given. > Thank you, > Ursula > > > > > ************************************** See what's free at > http://www.aol.com. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

Lots of links/advice here: http://www.rootsweb.com/~nirdow2/Emigration.htm Fiona. -----Original Message----- From: irl-longford-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:irl-longford-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of uwals931@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 1:26 PM To: irl-longford@rootsweb.com Subject: [IRL-LONGFORD] REQUETS HELP.PLEASE Hi Nancy, My Great-Grandparents came from Ireland and settled in Providence,Rhode Island. On their voyage to America, they lost their infant son passed away. I searched the New York passenger list for 1848 to 1850, but did not find their names on any list. Their names were Michael Lyons and Ann Lyons. Ann's maiden name was Donohue or Donough. Their infant was named James Lyons. When my grandfather, Joseph Lyons was born, they lived on Donough Street in Providence,Rhode Island. I am trying to trace their roots back to Ireland, but am having a problem with my research. Their first daughter, Bridget Lyons was born in 1850, Providence, RI. This makes me believe they arrived between 1848 and 1850. I will be most grateful for any advice given. Thank you, Ursula ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Alicia, The Canadian route was very much in use by 1833. In particular, it seems to have been the main conduit into the Irish enclave in Utica, to which Irish workers on the Erie Canal gravitated. A look at the map will show why a Canadian route was more than likely. One has to think in terms of the realities facing immigrants before the railroads were built. Perhaps the majority of Irish immigrants had had to scrape together every bit of money they had just to afford passage to North America. If they arrived in New York City and stayed there or in New Jersey, their cash outlay for tranportation was at an end, although they still had live from day to day. However, the further they were bound into upstate New York or in other areas without regular commercial transportation, the more difficult (and potentially costly) the journey would have been and the less likely such immigrants would have been to have made it at all soon after immigration unless they had (possibly traceable) relatives already in place to help with the costs. It's true that moving away from the coast could have been accomplished in stages over a number of years, and probably was in many cases. However, if so, you should be able to locate the individuals you are seeking somewhere along the route to their eventual destination. As for the Canadian route, uniform passenger manifests on domestic routes from the British Isles were not required and, for the most part, do not seem to exist today. It is therefore often difficult to prove that one's family members did in fact use the Canadian channel, even when circumstantial evidence points strongly in that direction. However, one can get lucky upon occasion. I had been looking for some of my Conefrey family whom the family in Ireland said had emigrated during the Famine but who had not turned up on any shiplists or census records that I had examined. Of course, they could have died at sea or missed the boat in Liverpool (the highest-volume port of departure), but somehow it seemed that someone would have known something if that were the case. As it worked out, this very family proved the Canadian hypothesis. I found one of the sons on the 1870 census in Maine, where I hadn't found any others in the extended family previously. Lo and behold, there were three children listed in the household, and all of them had been born in Canada. Nancy -------------- Original message from Alicia Filley <afilley@houston.rr.com>: -------------- > Hi Nancy, > What about an earlier time period? My ancestors "emigrating to this > country in 1833 and settling in Williamsburg, NY." Was the main > entry at that time NY city or was there a flow from Canada even then? > > Alicia Filley, PT, MS, PCS > Eubiotics: The Science of Healthy Living > 832-721-6030 > www.eubiotics.net > > > On May 8, 2007, at 5:31 PM, ngray.phale@att.net wrote: > > > There certainly is a good chance that he came through Boston within > > that time frame, especially into northern Rhode Island; the > > corridor from Boston down to Brockton was literally crammed with > > Irish immigrants. However, there was a still higher volume of > > shipping headed for New York from the British Isles (including > > Ireland) than to other Atlantic ports throughout the 19th century, > > so New York cannot be ruled out either. > > > > The intention of my comment was to suggest that the odds that an > > immigrant used a specific point of entry varied over time > > throughout the 19th century clear to the shutting off of easy > > immigration in 1924. It therefore pays to explore all reasonable > > possibilities ports of arrival. By checking only one port, one > > could look fruitlessly for a very long time, if the passenger > > actually arrived elsewhere. > > > > Incidentally, arrivals circa 1850 in both New York and Boston have > > become increasingly well indexed, so the search has become somewhat > > quicker and easier in many cases. > > > > Nancy > > -------------- Original message from "king133@juno.com" > > : -------------- > > > > > >> Hi Nancy, > >> I had an ancestor (William Bowe) that came to northern Rhode Island > >> (North Smithfield, about 1850. So your guess is that there is a good > >> chance that he came through Boston rather that New York. > >> Question: Did I understand you correctly? > >> > >> Thanks for the help, > >> Charlie King > >> gg grandson of William Bowe of Unk. County in Ire. > >> and James Hughes of Co. Longford > >> > >> Nancy wrote: > >> ......As for Massachusetts arrivals, the first key variable was > >> whether your family members came to the Boston area and southward to > >> the Rhode Island line (which often does suggest a Boston arrival, > >> particularly in the 1840's and after, although it does not positively > >> confirm that) or to Western Massachusetts. In the latter ..... > >> > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------- > >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > >> IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > >> without the quotes > >> in the subject and the body of the message > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-LONGFORD- > > request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > > in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message

canal workers http://xroads.virginia.edu/~Hyper/DETOC/transport/workers.html pennsylvania canal at Johnstown http://www.westsylvania.com/cfm/ccc.cfm?mode=story&id=14 1826 February The Pennsylvania legislature authorizes a Main Line Canal, between Philadelphia and Pittsburgh. ** A tunnel for the is completed on the Main Line Canal west of Lebanon, Pennsylvania. Jul 4 Construction begins at Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, on the Main Line Canal. 1834 The Portage Railroad opens, using canal and railroad, between Pittsburgh and Philadelphia. Improvements on the Pennsylvania Main Line Canal are completed. E. H. Gill becomes chief engineer of the Sandy and Beaver Canal, connecting the Ohio River (in Pennsylvania) with the Ohio and Erie Canal at Bolivar, Ohio. http://www.lowermerionhistory.org/texts/schmidtd/irish_cemetery.html irish workers railroad and canal http://www.explorepahistory.com/story.php?storyId=10&chapter=4 state history site http://www.jaha.org/edu/discovery_center/work/industry01.html johnstown history

Hi Nancy, My Great-Grandparents came from Ireland and settled in Providence,Rhode Island. On their voyage to America, they lost their infant son passed away. I searched the New York passenger list for 1848 to 1850, but did not find their names on any list. Their names were Michael Lyons and Ann Lyons. Ann's maiden name was Donohue or Donough. Their infant was named James Lyons. When my grandfather, Joseph Lyons was born, they lived on Donough Street in Providence,Rhode Island. I am trying to trace their roots back to Ireland, but am having a problem with my research. Their first daughter, Bridget Lyons was born in 1850, Providence, RI. This makes me believe they arrived between 1848 and 1850. I will be most grateful for any advice given. Thank you, Ursula ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

Hi Nancy, Thanks for the information. My GG Grandfather (David Williams) came to this country 1828 and it is thought from articles that I have read, he came to Quebec. I have no idea where or how he would have made entrance. He also worked on canals and navigated to PA. I have no dates on this. I should also indicate that he was from Tipperary, Ireland. My question is how would I look up information pertaining to arriving into this country? My GG Grandfather (James Doran) came to this country around 1832, with his wife Mary Kennedy Doran. Both were from Longford County. According to information that I have, he made entrance into the United States at New York City. He found employment on the Hudson-Delaware Canal for a short period of time until the cholera epidemic of 1832 began to spread. James decided to left before the city was quarantined and boarded the last boat to PA. Do you think that there is anyway that I can find their names listed on the ships that brought them to the US. Obviously, I do not have months and years, but sufficient information that perhaps I can come up with something. Please let me know, how I should proceed. I am not sure on how to research this type of information. Sincerely, Mary Ellen ************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

There certainly is a good chance that he came through Boston within that time frame, especially into northern Rhode Island; the corridor from Boston down to Brockton was literally crammed with Irish immigrants. However, there was a still higher volume of shipping headed for New York from the British Isles (including Ireland) than to other Atlantic ports throughout the 19th century, so New York cannot be ruled out either. The intention of my comment was to suggest that the odds that an immigrant used a specific point of entry varied over time throughout the 19th century clear to the shutting off of easy immigration in 1924. It therefore pays to explore all reasonable possibilities ports of arrival. By checking only one port, one could look fruitlessly for a very long time, if the passenger actually arrived elsewhere. Incidentally, arrivals circa 1850 in both New York and Boston have become increasingly well indexed, so the search has become somewhat quicker and easier in many cases. Nancy -------------- Original message from "king133@juno.com" <king133@juno.com>: -------------- > Hi Nancy, > I had an ancestor (William Bowe) that came to northern Rhode Island > (North Smithfield, about 1850. So your guess is that there is a good > chance that he came through Boston rather that New York. > Question: Did I understand you correctly? > > Thanks for the help, > Charlie King > gg grandson of William Bowe of Unk. County in Ire. > and James Hughes of Co. Longford > > Nancy wrote: > ......As for Massachusetts arrivals, the first key variable was > whether your family members came to the Boston area and southward to > the Rhode Island line (which often does suggest a Boston arrival, > particularly in the 1840's and after, although it does not positively > confirm that) or to Western Massachusetts. In the latter ..... > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-LONGFORD-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message