Beautifull photos Peggy. Now I wish I was a bird fancier but Im afraid my knowledge of the flying creature is limited. I can see that the long beak would sugest an Oyster catcher though. Well done, keep up the good work. Maggie the Dub On 6 Nov 2010, at 17:27, Peggy K-B <[email protected]> wrote: Hi Margaret, Thanks for the suggestion. I've never before posted to Flicker, but I did post the image to my blog . . . http://ofthewing.blogspot.com/ Sending you to this web site, however, may "taint" the waters since my intent was to withhold commentary while gathering consensus. Even so, I guess birders will spot any errors in my analysis of the photo and set me straight. Thanks again for your help! Peggy -----Original Message----- From: Margaret Doyle <[email protected]> Sent: Nov 6, 2010 10:39 AM To: Peggy K-B <[email protected]>, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Cc: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [IRL-LIMERICK] While in Ireland... Hi Peggy, I suggest you put the photo on flikr + send us the link. Maggie the Dub On 6 Nov 2010, at 13:57, Peggy K-B <[email protected]> wrote: Hi! Recently on my first trip to Ireland (I visited Counties Clare, Kerry, and Limerick), I took this image, from some distance, of a bird. I spotted him in the Shannon estuary nearby the airport. Could anyone identify the bird for me? I'm not providing much to go on and do have my own interpretation but will withhold that, for now, so as not to influence any views. I realize this isn't a birding listserv, but I'm hoping someone can help. Thanks! Peggy ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Peggy, I suggest you put the photo on flikr + send us the link. Maggie the Dub On 6 Nov 2010, at 13:57, Peggy K-B <[email protected]> wrote: Hi! Recently on my first trip to Ireland (I visited Counties Clare, Kerry, and Limerick), I took this image, from some distance, of a bird. I spotted him in the Shannon estuary nearby the airport. Could anyone identify the bird for me? I'm not providing much to go on and do have my own interpretation but will withhold that, for now, so as not to influence any views. I realize this isn't a birding listserv, but I'm hoping someone can help. Thanks! Peggy ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hi Margaret, Thanks for the suggestion. I've never before posted to Flicker, but I did post the image to my blog . . . http://ofthewing.blogspot.com/ Sending you to this web site, however, may "taint" the waters since my intent was to withhold commentary while gathering consensus. Even so, I guess birders will spot any errors in my analysis of the photo and set me straight. Thanks again for your help! Peggy -----Original Message----- >From: Margaret Doyle <[email protected]> >Sent: Nov 6, 2010 10:39 AM >To: Peggy K-B <[email protected]>, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> >Cc: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> >Subject: Re: [IRL-LIMERICK] While in Ireland... > >Hi Peggy, I suggest you put the photo on flikr + send us the link. >Maggie the Dub > >On 6 Nov 2010, at 13:57, Peggy K-B <[email protected]> wrote: > >Hi! > >Recently on my first trip to Ireland (I visited Counties Clare, Kerry, and Limerick), I took this image, from some distance, of a bird. I spotted him in the Shannon estuary nearby the airport. > >Could anyone identify the bird for me? I'm not providing much to go on and do have my own interpretation but will withhold that, for now, so as not to influence any views. > >I realize this isn't a birding listserv, but I'm hoping someone can help. > >Thanks! > >Peggy > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi! Recently on my first trip to Ireland (I visited Counties Clare, Kerry, and Limerick), I took this image, from some distance, of a bird. I spotted him in the Shannon estuary nearby the airport. Could anyone identify the bird for me? I'm not providing much to go on and do have my own interpretation but will withhold that, for now, so as not to influence any views. I realize this isn't a birding listserv, but I'm hoping someone can help. Thanks! Peggy

Surnames mentioned in this post: Barry, O'Donnell, Sheahan [Sheehan], Blake, Hennessy, Quaid, Graham, Shelton, Mahoney, Fitzgibbon. More examples of house and tenure books. Ah, Jane - your reply is very interesting for two different reasons... (1) The Barrys of Cloncagh - I know them well. Or at least I feel like I do, thanks to an unpublished manuscript handwritten in the early 1900s by an Australian descendant named Nicholas O'Donnell, a well known physician living in Melbourne, Victoria. His manuscript reveals much about the Barrys of Cloncagh, who were his mother's people. [See a short biography of Nicholas O'Donnell, and also one of his brother David (a famous Australian detective), in the online version of the Australian Dictionary of National Biography at http://adbonline.anu.edu.au/biogs/A110065b.htm .] Nicholas O'Donnell was also a Gaelic scholar and staunch supporter of Irish nationalism, although he never set foot in Ireland himself. He had a great desire to preserve the oral traditions and culture of Irish families of the diaspora. That seems to be why he began to compile his own family history, before the knowledge of living family members was lost. In the early 1900s, O'Donnell interviewed his Barry relatives, many of whom lived in Australia by that time. He also corresponded with his aunt Honora Hickey (nee Barry) and various distant cousins who still lived in Ireland. The information from those interviews and correspondence forms the basis of the manuscript. At one point O'Donnell suggests that research should be done on the families in repositories in Ireland, but he never followed up on that himself - which is a shame, given the later destruction of the Four Courts in Dublin. He also mentions writing to the parish priest of Ballingarry, who informed him of the same unfortunate gap in Ballingarry parish records (in the 1830s and 1840s) with which I am only too familiar! Nicholas O'Donnell's mother was Johanna nee Barry. Her particular branch of the Barrys had left the Cloncagh area after the death of her grandfather (David Barry, the progenitor in this manuscript) and settled in the townland of Graigacurragh, Ballingarry civil parish (east of Ballingarry Town). There, Johanna's father George Barry, at a young age, had married the older "Widow Sheahan" [Honora nee Blake] on 23 July 1829 [extraction by my husband from Microfilm P 2421, Ballingarry Catholic parish register, at National Library in Dublin, in July 2006]. After his marriage, George Barry settled on his wife's farm in the neighboring townland of Liskennett, also in Ballingarry civil parish. At least eight children were born to them, including a daughter Johanna Barry. She emigrated to Australia, where in 1858 she married Michael O'Donnell of Camas (near Bruff), a fellow emigrant from Limerick. They were the parents of the manuscript author Nicholas O'Donnell. Johanna's sister Ellen Barry married Nicholas O'Donnell (brother of Michael) in 1866, also in Australia. I had already traced many of the Barrys in the areas around Cloncagh, Rathkeale, Liskennett / Graigacurragh / Kilmacow, etc. and suspected some connection between them. This manuscript, which someone in Australia shared with me earlier this summer, has made many of those connections very concrete. It has also introduced a few new mysteries - but isn't that always the case in genealogy research? The earliest Barry in the line is David Barry "of Ballymorrisheen" (on the N21 between Newcastle West and Rathkeale), the progenitor of the Barrys who are the subject of the manuscript. David Barry is described as a substantial farmer "milking 60 cows". His first wife was said to be a "Miss Hennessy", and his second was Ellen "Muddy" Quaid of Ardagh. It was David Barry's second wife who moved the family from Cloncagh to Graigacurragh after her husband's death - in time to be listed there in 1827 as "Widow Barry" paying tithes on 3 parcels of land totaling over 50 acres . When "Muddy" died about 1854, she was buried at Cloncagh, the Barry family's traditional burial place. Jane, have you ever visited the old graveyard at Cloncagh? Do you know if your family members were buried there? Unfortunately I see no mention of a Hanora Barry who married a Fitzgibbon in the manuscript. And no Hanora Barry is mentioned as a daughter of David Barry by either wife. Would that be about the right generation for your Hanora Fitzgibbon, nee Barry? The children by the first wife were born roughly 1790-1800, while those by Ellen "Muddy" Quaid were born beginning sometime between 1795 and 1805. The manuscript does not give exact dates of birth for this early generation, and later records (if they exist) for these people give conflicting ages, a common problem in Irish research. Jane, do you know about when your Honora Barry was born? What were some of the first names used in naming the children of Hanora Barry and J. [James? John?] Fitzgibbon? Did any Barrys serve as baptismal sponsors or marriage witnesses for your family? Perhaps I can identify them in the manuscript. All but one of the siblings of O'Donnell's mother Johanna Barry eventually ended up in Australia. The only one who remained behind in Ireland and died there was Honora Barry (b. abt 1838-1842), who married James Hickey of Kilmacow (Ballingarry civil parish). An interesting twist to the story: Hickey's mother was also a Barry - but "not related" in the Barry line, according to the manuscript. The Cloncagh-Liskennett-Graigacurragh Barrys were said to be from West Limerick (family burial place at Cloncagh), while the Kilmacow Barrys had come there from East Limerick. Several Barrys are buried in the graveyard at Kilmacow. [Honora Barry and James Hickey were, however, related through the Quaids, with Johanna Barry's paternal grandmother "Muddy" Quaid being a first cousin of James Hickey's maternal grandmother, who married a Barry.] The manuscript mentions only a little about the Kilmacow Barrys, who intrigue me. The implication is that they might have been related to some Barrys who lived in the same area as the family of Nicholas O'Donnell's father - near Camas, Bruff. I have traced Barrys in that area also, some of whom later went to Chicago, Illinois. The connection probably predates parish registers, so discovering it will be a challenge. (Of course, if male descendants from these Barry lines would consent to a yDNA test for genealogical purposes, that could provide an answer! We would love to compare those results to my husband's... who has some interesting yDNA matches to descendants of Berrys who lived in Kentucky in the 1700s - obviously an earlier wave of emigration from my husband's family.) The Barrys seem to have been at Kilmacow House from the mid-1700s until James Hickey's father bought the lease on the property about 1850 (as shown in the tenure books - I can provide details to those who are interested). In the case of Kilmacow (Ballingarry civil parish), the tenure books were compiled in 24 Nov 1848 and revised 24-25 Sept 1850, while Griffith's Valuation for Kilmacow was printed 10 February 1852. So we see the evolution in tenure over a 4-year period during the height of the Famine. Very revealing... many names crossed out and either eliminated or replaced by other names. But apparently the Barrys of Kilmacow had to sell out to Hickey due to financial problems rather than death from famine or disease. At least that is what the manuscript implies. Here is a quote from the O'Donnell manuscript (p. 121), attributed to James Joyce of Kilmallock, who was a grandson of Johanna Barry (daughter of David Barry and Ellen Quaid). Johanna Barry married Michael Wallace of the parish of Adare. The couple first lived in Rathkeale, but in about 1878, went to live in Kilmallock. Their daughter was the mother of James Joyce of Kilmallock, who wrote to Nicholas O'Donnell (in 1909?): "All the Barry family (our relatives) of former generations had their origin between here and Newcastle. The Barrys of Knockaderry (all dead except Michael) Liskinnett Graiguecurrah and Coolanoran are all one and their burial place is Clouncagh." There is much more. If you think you might be related to this group of Barrys, please contact me. (2) You also mentioned Ballyhahil, Jane. That is only about 2 miles WNW of the townland of Rossmore, where Martin Barry, the brother of my husband's ancestor Edward Barry, lived in 1849 -1850. We know he was there those two years because that was his residence as listed on the record of his marriage to Lydia Graham (a member of the Church of Ireland) and on the record of the christening of their daughter Jane (also in the COI). We suspect that Martin worked as a woodranger (occupation from marriage record) at Rossmore House, the estate of Rev. Grantley Shelton, the local Church of Ireland minister who married them. Despite the fact that Martin Barry lived at Rossmore during the period when the house books, etc. were compiled, his name does not appear in those records. Just last month, however, I found mention of Lydia's father John Graham occupying the gate house on the Shelton estate (again in the house books). Grantley Shelton was paying the tax on this property, and it is very unusual for a tenant to be listed by name if he was not responsible for the tax. Usually in the house books, there is just some comment like herd's house or gate house, with no mention of the person living there if it is part of an estate or larger farm, since the valuators were really only interested in who was responsible for the tax. So in this case, I was very lucky to find John Graham mentioned. That is the only evidence I have for John Graham in the area other than in the marriage record of his daughter Lydia Graham, where John is listed as her father and also appears as a witness to the marriage (Lydia was underage). Martin Barry's family left Ireland for the US in the Fall of 1850, settling first in Oswego, New York, before moving west to Chicago, where Lydia died in 1858 and Martin quickly married his second wife (a Catholic) Hanora Mahoney. The children of the first marriage were baptized as Catholics one month after Lydia's death and one month before Martin's second marriage [records from Old St. Pat's in Chicago, on microfilm from the FHL]. The family then moved south of Chicago to Livingston County, and later to Grundy County, Illinois (with a brief sojourn in Chase County, Kansas in between). Geralyn Wood Barry in Oregon On 11/3/2010 7:33 PM, Jane McDonnell wrote: > I found your post about the house and tenure books fascinating. I > never knew about them! > > I am a Limerick Barry descendent, also. In 1818 0ur family was just > down the road from Kilfinny in Cloncagh parish (Fitzgibbon in > Ballyhahil townland). I believe they were there the remainder of their > stay in Limerick. My ggggrandmother was Hanora Barry, married to J. > Fitzgibbon. She died (1846) just before the family began to emmigrate > to America (1847 - 1850). Her daughter Hanora lived in PA and then > Minnesota. And HER daughter Hanora married a McDonnell. > > Jane McDonnell > Fascinated with this section of Ireland! >

DANAHEY, Cornelius married Hannah MADIGAN in Limerick County, Ireland about 1818, I believe. Need birth date and birth place for both. Their children: Ann, Cornelius, Denis, Honora, Michael, and Mary. Danahey, Denis born about 1827 in Limerick County, Ireland. Parents Cornelius and Hannah Madigan. Looking for his birth date and birth place.

CARROLL, Matthew, born in Ireland, married Catherine Neville. Children: Margaret, Catherine and some boys. Looking for any information on the parents or the boys. They were from Kerikyle, Rathronan, Limerick, Ireland. Parents both born around 1822.

I found your post about the house and tenure books fascinating. I never knew about them! I am a Limerick Barry descendent, also. In 1818 0ur family was just down the road from Kilfinny in Cloncagh parish (Fitzgibbon in Ballyhahil townland). I believe they were there the remainder of their stay in Limerick. My ggggrandmother was Hanora Barry, married to J. Fitzgibbon. She died (1846) just before the family began to emmigrate to America (1847 - 1850). Her daughter Hanora lived in PA and then Minnesota. And HER daughter Hanora married a McDonnell. Jane McDonnell Fascinated with this section of Ireland! On Nov 3, 2010, at 5:29 PM, Geralyn Barry wrote: > Surnames mentioned in this post - Barry, Mulcahy, Pigott, Scully. > > Pat, thanks for putting your extractions of tithes for Kilfinny > civil parish online at http://www.connorsgenealogy.com/LIM/KilfinnyTithes.htm > . > > I am on the trail of Barrys who lived in County Limerick - tracing > many different families with that surname, not necessarily all > related to one another or to my husband's Barrys who in County > Limerick. > > There were some interesting Barrys (to me anyway) living in Kilfinny > parish, in townlands just north of the townland of Kilmacow (which > is in Ballingarry civil parish). Pat's tithe extractions show two > Barrys (by name) that were there in 1834: James at "Ballyfolin" and > "Wm & bros" at Ballynakill (just northeast of Ballyfoleen and > Kilfinny village). > > There were Barry families still living in the same area just before > Griffith's Valuation was done, at Ballyfoleen and Kilfinny. But > their names were struck off in the house and tenure books in 1850 > (pre-Griffith's). No Barrys appear in the civil parish of Kilfinny > in Griffith's Valuation (printed in February 1852). > > Listed in the house books (1850) were James Barry, Thos Barry and > Michl Barry, each with 1/3 share of a house in the townland of > Ballyfoleen North, Kilfinny civil parish. All 3 names were struck > out. The tenure books show them as tenants "at will", with their > names also struck out and "down" written beside the entry (meaning > the house was torn down). The property was "added to Daniel Scully's > farm" according to a margin note. Daniel Scully appears in > Griffith's Valuation, but not the Barrys. Scully is shown with > house, offices (outbuildings) and over 90 acres of land in > Ballyfoleen North; he was also immediate lessor of a "vacant" house. > > This is just one of many cases I've seen where a family was present > in a townland just before Griffith's Valuation (as shown by the > house, field or tenure books that were compiled in preparation for > the printed version of Griffith's), but gone by the time the revised > valuation information was printed in what we call Griffith's > Valuation. > > Also in the house books (1850) in Commons townland, Kilfinny > village, the name William Barry was struck out, and "Thos." [Barry] > written to replace him and then also struck out. The tenure books > show that William Barry had held his property (house & yard) "in > fee", "free forever" by lease dated 1830, but the entry for him was > struck out and "Down" written beside it. Again, the Barry surname > was not present there in Griffith's. > > James Barry and Ellen Mulcahy had children born in the 1870s at > nearby Ballymacamore (Ballymakeamore), also in Kilfinny civil > parish. They had married in Ellen's home parish of Monagea / > Monagay (Catholic parish) in 1868. The civil marriage record says > James Barry was of "Ballymakemore" and lists his father as David > Barry, farmer. I am not sure which David Barry this was - there were > several in the area nearby. The marriage record also states that > Ellen was of Ballinahown [SW of the town of Newcastlewest] and that > her father was Denis Mulcahy, farmer. > > In this case, there were also no Barrys in Ballymakeamore at the > time of the tithes or Griffith's, and they were gone by the time the > 1901 census was taken. The Valuation Revision lists (aka Canceled > Books) show that James Barry replaced Catherine Barry on about 75 > acres of land (with house) in1866, and Patrick Pigott replaced James > Barry as occupier on the same property in 1884. Catherine Barry had > earlier (1862) replaced James Mulcahy on part of this property and > John Pigott on another part, so the Barry family was not present in > the townland at the time of Griffith's. Where were they before that? > Was Catherine the widow of David Barry and the mother of James? > > I have a few other records for these people if anyone is interested. > If you know anything more about these families, like what happened > to them and their descendants after they disappeared from these > records, please contact me. In the case of Ellen Barry (nee Mulcahy) > and her children, I have recently managed to trace them forward to > the US, where they lived in Chicago, Illinois. This family is of > great interest to me, since my husband's Barrys from a nearby area > in Limerick also lived in Chicago (albeit much earlier - late 1850s). > > Thanks for reading this far. > Geralyn Wood Barry in Oregon > > On 10/30/2010 4:25 PM, Pat Connors wrote: >> I have added the following civil parish tithes to the Limerick >> section >> of my website: >> Kilquane >> Ardpatrick >> Kilfinny >> Kilfrush >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and > the body of the message

Where can I get a copy of this house books for 1850? thank you. -----Original Message----- From: Geralyn Barry <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Wed, Nov 3, 2010 5:29 pm Subject: [IRL-LIMERICK] BARRY family, was Re: new tithe applotments added Surnames mentioned in this post - Barry, Mulcahy, Pigott, Scully. Pat, thanks for putting your extractions of tithes for Kilfinny civil parish nline at http://www.connorsgenealogy.com/LIM/KilfinnyTithes.htm . I am on the trail of Barrys who lived in County Limerick - tracing many ifferent families with that surname, not necessarily all related to one another r to my husband's Barrys who in County Limerick. There were some interesting Barrys (to me anyway) living in Kilfinny parish, in ownlands just north of the townland of Kilmacow (which is in Ballingarry civil arish). Pat's tithe extractions show two Barrys (by name) that were there in 834: James at "Ballyfolin" and "Wm & bros" at Ballynakill (just northeast of allyfoleen and Kilfinny village). There were Barry families still living in the same area just before Griffith's aluation was done, at Ballyfoleen and Kilfinny. But their names were struck off n the house and tenure books in 1850 (pre-Griffith's). No Barrys appear in the ivil parish of Kilfinny in Griffith's Valuation (printed in February 1852). Listed in the house books (1850) were James Barry, Thos Barry and Michl Barry, ach with 1/3 share of a house in the townland of Ballyfoleen North, Kilfinny ivil parish. All 3 names were struck out. The tenure books show them as tenants at will", with their names also struck out and "down" written beside the entry meaning the house was torn down). The property was "added to Daniel Scully's arm" according to a margin note. Daniel Scully appears in Griffith's aluation, but not the Barrys. Scully is shown with house, offices outbuildings) and over 90 acres of land in Ballyfoleen North; he was also mmediate lessor of a "vacant" house. This is just one of many cases I've seen where a family was present in a ownland just before Griffith's Valuation (as shown by the house, field or enure books that were compiled in preparation for the printed version of riffith's), but gone by the time the revised valuation information was printed n what we call Griffith's Valuation. Also in the house books (1850) in Commons townland, Kilfinny village, the name illiam Barry was struck out, and "Thos." [Barry] written to replace him and hen also struck out. The tenure books show that William Barry had held his roperty (house & yard) "in fee", "free forever" by lease dated 1830, but the ntry for him was struck out and "Down" written beside it. Again, the Barry urname was not present there in Griffith's. James Barry and Ellen Mulcahy had children born in the 1870s at nearby allymacamore (Ballymakeamore), also in Kilfinny civil parish. They had married n Ellen's home parish of Monagea / Monagay (Catholic parish) in 1868. The civil arriage record says James Barry was of "Ballymakemore" and lists his father as avid Barry, farmer. I am not sure which David Barry this was - there were everal in the area nearby. The marriage record also states that Ellen was of allinahown [SW of the town of Newcastlewest] and that her father was Denis ulcahy, farmer. In this case, there were also no Barrys in Ballymakeamore at the time of the ithes or Griffith's, and they were gone by the time the 1901 census was taken. he Valuation Revision lists (aka Canceled Books) show that James Barry replaced atherine Barry on about 75 acres of land (with house) in1866, and Patrick igott replaced James Barry as occupier on the same property in 1884. Catherine arry had earlier (1862) replaced James Mulcahy on part of this property and ohn Pigott on another part, so the Barry family was not present in the townland t the time of Griffith's. Where were they before that? Was Catherine the widow f David Barry and the mother of James? I have a few other records for these people if anyone is interested. If you know nything more about these families, like what happened to them and their escendants after they disappeared from these records, please contact me. In the ase of Ellen Barry (nee Mulcahy) and her children, I have recently managed to race them forward to the US, where they lived in Chicago, Illinois. This family s of great interest to me, since my husband's Barrys from a nearby area in imerick also lived in Chicago (albeit much earlier - late 1850s). Thanks for reading this far. eralyn Wood Barry in Oregon On 10/30/2010 4:25 PM, Pat Connors wrote: I have added the following civil parish tithes to the Limerick section of my website: Kilquane Ardpatrick Kilfinny Kilfrush ------------------------------ o unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] ith the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of he message

On 11/3/2010 3:32 PM, [email protected] wrote: > Where can I get a copy of this house books for 1850? thank you. > These pre-Griffith's books differ from place to place within Ireland both in content and in date. Are you specifically interested in the house books for Kilfinny civil parish, Barony of Connello Upper, County Limerick? If so, they are available on FHL microfilm 2299685, in item 31 on that film. However, there are 352 microfilms of *manuscript* valuation books - *not* Griffith's Valuation and not the so-called "Canceled Books" - in the collection of the Family History LIbrary. They include tenure books, house books, field books and quarto books. You must figure out which ones apply to the area of interest to you. You can look at them in Salt Lake City or order a copy for viewing at a Family History Center near you. There are in addition, Cancelled Valuation books - another set of records entirely, also available through the Family History Library. I suggest you read the following post I made about this topic one year ago, available in the list archives: http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/irl-limerick/2009-11/1257445736 Regards, Geralyn Wood Barry in Oregon

Surnames mentioned in this post - Barry, Mulcahy, Pigott, Scully. Pat, thanks for putting your extractions of tithes for Kilfinny civil parish online at http://www.connorsgenealogy.com/LIM/KilfinnyTithes.htm . I am on the trail of Barrys who lived in County Limerick - tracing many different families with that surname, not necessarily all related to one another or to my husband's Barrys who in County Limerick. There were some interesting Barrys (to me anyway) living in Kilfinny parish, in townlands just north of the townland of Kilmacow (which is in Ballingarry civil parish). Pat's tithe extractions show two Barrys (by name) that were there in 1834: James at "Ballyfolin" and "Wm & bros" at Ballynakill (just northeast of Ballyfoleen and Kilfinny village). There were Barry families still living in the same area just before Griffith's Valuation was done, at Ballyfoleen and Kilfinny. But their names were struck off in the house and tenure books in 1850 (pre-Griffith's). No Barrys appear in the civil parish of Kilfinny in Griffith's Valuation (printed in February 1852). Listed in the house books (1850) were James Barry, Thos Barry and Michl Barry, each with 1/3 share of a house in the townland of Ballyfoleen North, Kilfinny civil parish. All 3 names were struck out. The tenure books show them as tenants "at will", with their names also struck out and "down" written beside the entry (meaning the house was torn down). The property was "added to Daniel Scully's farm" according to a margin note. Daniel Scully appears in Griffith's Valuation, but not the Barrys. Scully is shown with house, offices (outbuildings) and over 90 acres of land in Ballyfoleen North; he was also immediate lessor of a "vacant" house. This is just one of many cases I've seen where a family was present in a townland just before Griffith's Valuation (as shown by the house, field or tenure books that were compiled in preparation for the printed version of Griffith's), but gone by the time the revised valuation information was printed in what we call Griffith's Valuation. Also in the house books (1850) in Commons townland, Kilfinny village, the name William Barry was struck out, and "Thos." [Barry] written to replace him and then also struck out. The tenure books show that William Barry had held his property (house & yard) "in fee", "free forever" by lease dated 1830, but the entry for him was struck out and "Down" written beside it. Again, the Barry surname was not present there in Griffith's. James Barry and Ellen Mulcahy had children born in the 1870s at nearby Ballymacamore (Ballymakeamore), also in Kilfinny civil parish. They had married in Ellen's home parish of Monagea / Monagay (Catholic parish) in 1868. The civil marriage record says James Barry was of "Ballymakemore" and lists his father as David Barry, farmer. I am not sure which David Barry this was - there were several in the area nearby. The marriage record also states that Ellen was of Ballinahown [SW of the town of Newcastlewest] and that her father was Denis Mulcahy, farmer. In this case, there were also no Barrys in Ballymakeamore at the time of the tithes or Griffith's, and they were gone by the time the 1901 census was taken. The Valuation Revision lists (aka Canceled Books) show that James Barry replaced Catherine Barry on about 75 acres of land (with house) in1866, and Patrick Pigott replaced James Barry as occupier on the same property in 1884. Catherine Barry had earlier (1862) replaced James Mulcahy on part of this property and John Pigott on another part, so the Barry family was not present in the townland at the time of Griffith's. Where were they before that? Was Catherine the widow of David Barry and the mother of James? I have a few other records for these people if anyone is interested. If you know anything more about these families, like what happened to them and their descendants after they disappeared from these records, please contact me. In the case of Ellen Barry (nee Mulcahy) and her children, I have recently managed to trace them forward to the US, where they lived in Chicago, Illinois. This family is of great interest to me, since my husband's Barrys from a nearby area in Limerick also lived in Chicago (albeit much earlier - late 1850s). Thanks for reading this far. Geralyn Wood Barry in Oregon On 10/30/2010 4:25 PM, Pat Connors wrote: > I have added the following civil parish tithes to the Limerick section > of my website: > Kilquane > Ardpatrick > Kilfinny > Kilfrush >

Does anyone have a copy of this book by Elizabeth Bentley? Page 432 lists a Patrick Fraly arriving in 1825 at the age of 25....this could be my gg grandfather and I would appreciate any additional info it gives. I am looking for Patrick Frawley, his brother Cornelius Frawley, any other Frawleys (Fraly) and any Hussey family that may have come on the same ship. Chris Hunt

I have added the following civil parish tithes to the Limerick section of my website: Kilquane Ardpatrick Kilfinny Kilfrush -- Pat Connors, Sacramento, CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com

Ann, Doon records start in 1824, so if you need records from before that date, they no longer exist. As far as I know neither research service allows nor facilitates sharing. Janet On Fri, Oct 29, 2010 at 7:04 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > I am looking for some advice about research help. > > I have been researching the ROWLES families of Cloonteen in the parish of > Doon.  Family members were baptised and married in the Cappamore church > (which is now in the parish of Cappamore). > > There were two separate families of that name in the Griffith Valuation and >  previously in the Tithe Applotments of 1828.  Although the name is rare in >  Ireland, most are concentrated in this one small townland,  I have not > been  able to determine the relationship between the two heads of  household: > George, who emigrated with his whole family to the Midwest of  the US. (WI > and MN) and Michael who emigrated with his whole family  to Australia (NSW), > although they were sponsors of each others'  children.  However I have > researched both families' descendants in  hope of finally solving this puzzle. > > Years ago (1995)  I got help on baptisms and marriages from THU (now  TFHR) > and a report from the Limerick Archives (now Limerick Genealogy) which > confirmed information I had already gathered from family members and added a > little more. > > Could anyone could tell me whether it would be worth my time and  money to > repeat my research request to these new organizations as there are  still > some unanswered questions? > > Also, do they maintain files of prior research on same families in order to >  share, with permission, researchers' contact info with each  other? > > Thank you, > > Ann Lamb > Issaquah, WA > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

On 10/23/2010 9:14 AM, [email protected] wrote: > In the 1911 census, the Enumerator in County Limerick sequentially > assigned numbers to each home as he took data. Does anyone know how to > determine > where "House # XX" in that 1911 census would be today? i.e. a map! > I am researching Connell/OConnell in Doon and have found some in > numbered houses in that 1911 census. Can anyone help direct me to > determine > where a specific house # would be today in Doon from that census? > Dave OConnell > Dave, I know of no maps that directly show where houses were, based on the numbering scheme from the 1911 census. Valuation maps are your best bet for showing houses, but the numbering scheme for lots is not the same as the numbering scheme used in the census. You probably wanted an easy answer to your question... I only have 2 answers for you that might be somewhat difficult to implement. First, you could ask a local person there who might still know where these Connells lived in Doon in 1911. If that is not an option, you can trace the property in the Valuation Revision Lists (aka Canceled Books), beginning with 1911 and going forward and backward in time. The Canceled Books are valuation records (for tax purposes) that take the valuation of property forward in time from Griffith's Valuation (the Primary Valuation). Properties were sometimes renumbered over the years, as lots were split or consolidated, but you can trace all that in the Canceled Books, from Griffith's down to quite recent times (usually up to the 1930s - 1960s) - all available on microfilm from the Family History Library in Salt Lake City. By about 1920, many people owned the property on which they lived, thanks to a series of Land Purchase Acts (designated In Fee LAP in valuation records). If you find the property on which the Connells lived in 1911 (from the Canceled Books), you can then follow that forward in time using the area (size) of the lot. You can then compare the information on that lot (from the most recent canceled book on microfilm) to the *current* valuation records that appear online at http://www.valoff.ie/search/search.asp To access current records, go to the website above, select the county and put in the townland (Doon?) and nothing else. You will need to choose the correct Doon from the list returned - Doon or perhaps Doon North or Doon South. You can sometimes even match current properties with Griffith's Valuation (bypassing the Canceled Books) by carefully comparing area (acres, roods, perches) even if the lot number has changed. (Some lot numbers might still be the same today as in Griffith's, but most are probably not.) Click on "Details" once you reach a page that has the listings for the correct townland. There might still be Connells there... Try it. Once you have the lot number for a certain date, you can locate the same properties on a Valuation map from the correct era. It is possible to purchase such maps from the Valuation Office. Also, some maps showing the lot numbers are online in conjunction with the version of Griffith's Valuation that appears at http://www.origins.net/ under the Irish Origins part of the website. This is a subscription service that links Griffith's to the corresponding maps (showing the lot numbers if they could find such a map for an area, and there are often several versions for the same area at Origins). Sometimes the maps date to the time of Griffith's Valuation and sometimes they correspond to one of the valuation revisions. You can determine an approximate date by comparing the maps with the various valuations. Warning: This second answer might be difficult to understand if you don't have much experience with Irish valuation records (many of which are available on microfilm from the Family History Library)! I hope I have made it at least somewhat clear. Regards, Geralyn Wood Barry in Oregon

Ann, List, I can answer one of your questions. They do share the information between researchers if you give them permission. I'm getting ready to take the leap and have Limerick Genealogy do a family search. On the form is a check box to be put in contact with another researcher if your family overlaps with their family. Helen -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 2:05 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [IRL-LIMERICK] Rowles of Cappamore/Doon I am looking for some advice about research help. I have been researching the ROWLES families of Cloonteen in the parish of Doon. Family members were baptised and married in the Cappamore church (which is now in the parish of Cappamore). There were two separate families of that name in the Griffith Valuation and previously in the Tithe Applotments of 1828. Although the name is rare in Ireland, most are concentrated in this one small townland, I have not been able to determine the relationship between the two heads of household: George, who emigrated with his whole family to the Midwest of the US. (WI and MN) and Michael who emigrated with his whole family to Australia (NSW), although they were sponsors of each others' children. However I have researched both families' descendants in hope of finally solving this puzzle. Years ago (1995) I got help on baptisms and marriages from THU (now TFHR) and a report from the Limerick Archives (now Limerick Genealogy) which confirmed information I had already gathered from family members and added a little more. Could anyone could tell me whether it would be worth my time and money to repeat my research request to these new organizations as there are still some unanswered questions? Also, do they maintain files of prior research on same families in order to share, with permission, researchers' contact info with each other? Thank you, Ann Lamb Issaquah, WA ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I am looking for some advice about research help. I have been researching the ROWLES families of Cloonteen in the parish of Doon. Family members were baptised and married in the Cappamore church (which is now in the parish of Cappamore). There were two separate families of that name in the Griffith Valuation and previously in the Tithe Applotments of 1828. Although the name is rare in Ireland, most are concentrated in this one small townland, I have not been able to determine the relationship between the two heads of household: George, who emigrated with his whole family to the Midwest of the US. (WI and MN) and Michael who emigrated with his whole family to Australia (NSW), although they were sponsors of each others' children. However I have researched both families' descendants in hope of finally solving this puzzle. Years ago (1995) I got help on baptisms and marriages from THU (now TFHR) and a report from the Limerick Archives (now Limerick Genealogy) which confirmed information I had already gathered from family members and added a little more. Could anyone could tell me whether it would be worth my time and money to repeat my research request to these new organizations as there are still some unanswered questions? Also, do they maintain files of prior research on same families in order to share, with permission, researchers' contact info with each other? Thank you, Ann Lamb Issaquah, WA

Hello list My O'Reilly family came from Ballyglass, Ardnacrusha, County Clare. Felix O'Reilly was married to Bridget O'Dea in Saint Munchins Parish Limerick ( which took in the parish of Parteen and Meelick at the time i think ) in 1825. He had several children after that, but i am looking for where he may have been born. Family lore says that his family came from Cavan, but i have nothing to back this up. his wife was Bridget O'Dea and i think she may have come from the Ardnacrusha area, although i have nothing to back this up either. The Reilly/O'Reilly family lived in Ballyglass for at least 4 generations. I have the records for the family that lived in Ballyglass from about 1840 but i would love to know where Felix and his wife Bridget were born. The Cavan connection could well have been earlier. Bridget O'Dea was i suspect was from the locality or nearby. Any help appreciated. Margaret

Thanks, Jan. Sandy is delving into the Tipp ones and posting the placenames and surnames within each of the Depositions on the CoTipperary list. Hopefully some of you can do the Limerick ones as there is more information to be had from each of the depositions. Janet On Tue, Oct 26, 2010 at 10:57 PM, Jan Melville <[email protected]> wrote: > Cool stuff, Janet.......thank you for posting. > > Jan, nyc. > > On Sun, Oct 24, 2010 at 2:46 PM, Janet Crawford <[email protected]> wrote: > >> President Mary McAleese and Ian Paisley launch transcripts of 1641 >> horrors... >> >> The article can be found here: >> >> >> http://www.independent.ie/national-news/mcaleese-and-paisley-launch-transcripts-of-1641-horrors-2391611.html >> >> The Depositions can be found here: >> >> http://1641.tcd.ie >> >> There are 188 depositions for Tipperary >> >> 267 for Waterford >> >> 197 for Limerick >> >> Lots of our favorite names in there, but maybe not spelled as you might >> think. >> >> You have to register to read the Depositions, but it is free. >> >> Janet >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > > -- > > ~Jan ~ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Cool stuff, Janet.......thank you for posting. Jan, nyc. On Sun, Oct 24, 2010 at 2:46 PM, Janet Crawford <[email protected]> wrote: > President Mary McAleese and Ian Paisley launch transcripts of 1641 > horrors... > > The article can be found here: > > > http://www.independent.ie/national-news/mcaleese-and-paisley-launch-transcripts-of-1641-horrors-2391611.html > > The Depositions can be found here: > > http://1641.tcd.ie > > There are 188 depositions for Tipperary > > 267 for Waterford > > 197 for Limerick > > Lots of our favorite names in there, but maybe not spelled as you might > think. > > You have to register to read the Depositions, but it is free. > > Janet > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- ~Jan ~