Yes, "poignant" is just the right word. It's always a real tragedy when a perfectly functional still is pulled down. Sniff. :-) Patrick Casey <pcasey@compuserve.com> wrote: Jim mentions the story that "......Christopher Columbus was really an Irishman named Lynch". This reminds me of the heroic story of Benny O'Hare, a Clare man who emigrated to Rome in the first century AD and became a famous chariot racer: In 1880 a novelist called Lew Wallace picked up the story - presumably on a journey through Clare - but rewrote it. The hero of his book, who was modelled on Benny O'Hare, became a Jewish prince called Ben Hur. Hollywood then compounded the hijacking of the legend by making a series of films entitled "Ben Hur" based on the book. Benny O'Hare's birthplace, a sod cabin in a field near Kilrush, was marked with a bronze plaque until the beginning of the 19th century when the cabin was pulled down by the Revenue police. They were looking for an illicit still which had been handed down through the family and which was still being operated by Benny's direct descendants.The bronze plaque was lost. A poignant story. Pádraig (the Paddy that was) -----Original Message----- From: irl-clare-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:irl-clare-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of jpmcnamara@sbcglobal.net Sent: 11 September 2006 01:44 To: jeanine; y-irl@yahoogroups.com; MK Douglas; Dr. Jane Lyons; irl-clare@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [IRL-CLARE] Young Irelanders : Re: [Y-IRL] Non Gen...The NineConvicts Hi Jane, Am getting confused here, which lot were hanged? Not the 'nine convicts' the 'young Irelanders' ? Or is it just the lot on your site at the referenced URL? I do have an obscure reference, to which some misinformation may have been my fault, as this reference is just the author's writings based on his research. On the IRL-Clare list, someone said they wished they knew who was responsible for this one bit of mis-information on the Internet... ... and were referring to Richard O'Gorman becoming called a Governor of Newfoundland, and then in the next breath vehemently expressing that Richard O'Gorman has never went to Newfoundland. And I do see what seem to be some of my letters reposted as from another person, and I should emphasize the 'seem to be' part, as if one has the same book, then the reference might very well have been just quoted again. Anyway, this little book I refer to, is an old book published in 1979. It seems I caused some great guffaws when I quoted from this book Judge William Hughes Mulligan's St Patrick's Day tongue-in-cheek speech about how Christopher Columbus was really an Irishman named Lynch. It was the opening to his chapter entitled "The Runaround in Rome" and was a bit of payback to what the author considered his poor treatment at the hands of the Vatican archivists. One way to get even so to speak poorly of Italians, a payback for one repository preventing his access to research materials that would confirm that many priests went to Italy from Ireland after Cromwell's arrival. [also note: someone was so impressed with this letter of mine, that without asking they made it into a website. The website was just a reprint of my letter to Ireland-L@rootsweb.com. This site has finally been taken down.] Anyway, this book also has the story of how the Queen was advised that Sir Charles Duffy who was elected prime minister of the province of Victoria was among the men accused of taking part in an armed uprising, the very group she pardoned. (I am paraphrasing here so hope I am not changing the story.) At this bit of information she allegedly asked to investigate what became of the other eight people. At this point the book does a run down on how successful these people were, at how short sighted the English were to let such great people go. One of the people is the one I am sure I am the one guilty of spreading the mis-information, (if it is untrue), but it is what is in this book, I did not make it up, and that is about Richard O'Gorman. So far I have ducked this issue with my silence. Anyway, here is a rundown from this book of the remaining eight: < 1) Thomas Meagher became governor of Montana, and he was a general during the American Civil War, 2) Terrance McManus became a general in the United States Army. 3) Patrick Donahue became a general in the United States Army. 4) Richard O'Gorman became governor of Newfoundland. [This is the one I have heard the discord about.] 5) Michael Ireland became attorney general of Australia 6) Morris Lyene also became attorney general of Australia 7) Thomas McGee became a member of Parliament in Canada and minister if agriculture 8) John Mitchell became a writer and prominent politician in New York, fathering a son who became mayor of New York. This episode is but a microcosm of the past tragedy of Ireland and the gain of the rest of the world during the oppression of Ireland. And what of the future? ... > So will just say what this reference is, its a fun little book about the author's research into a potential ancestor. The author's mother said they were related to the Galloping Hogan. This book is hardly any kind of primary source, like I said, just a fun read. It is: 'The Quest for the Galloping Hogan, A man of Irish parentage seeks the truth about a legendary ancestor and finds the Irish soul' by Matthew J. Culligan-Hogan, ISBN 0-517-53665-X This book also has the famous Thomas Meagher court-side speech that is often quoted just before the above treatment: < The spokesman, Thomas Meagher, said, "My Lord, this is our first offense, but not our last. If you will be easy with us this once, we promise on our word as gentlemen to do better next time. Sure, we won't be fools enough to get caught." > That's all I have to add to this growing controversy. Jeanine seems to have started it here. (LOL) Best regards, Jim McNamara ----- Original Message ----- From: Dr. Jane Lyons To: jeanine ; y-irl@yahoogroups.com ; MK Douglas Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2006 2:25 PM Subject: Young Irelanders : Re: [Y-IRL] Non Gen...The Nine Convicts Being hanged, drrawn and quartered did happen lots and heads re hung on poles and things This lot were hanged........ I'm sure drawing and quartering was part of the deal http://www.from-ireland.net/censussubs/fer/hangings1641.htm Jane ----- Original Message ----- From: "MK Douglas" To: "jeanine" ; Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2006 6:02 PM Subject: Re: [Y-IRL] Non Gen...The Nine Convicts Check message # 28688 by Dan Donahue--there are some errors here. __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (1) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages | Files | Photos | Links | Database | Polls | Members | Calendar Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! 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