Well hearty congrats to Mr Gorman. How long did he serve, and what records were kept of his inquests? > From: irl-carlow-request@rootsweb.com > Subject: IRL-CARLOW Digest, Vol 8, Issue 209 > To: irl-carlow@rootsweb.com > Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2013 05:55:37 -0600 > > > > Before you send an email to this List you must first of all subscribe to the List. > > Today's Topics: > > 1. 1834,Edward Gorman elected Coroner. (Michael Purcell) > 2. Re: 1834,Edward Gorman elected Coroner. (Turtle Bunbury (History)) > 3. Re: 1834,Edward Gorman elected Coroner. (Turtle Bunbury (History)) > 4. Re: 1834,Edward Gorman elected Coroner. (Michael Purcell) > 5. 1834,Reviewing the situation. (Michael Purcell) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2013 10:01:05 +0100 > From: Michael Purcell <carlowmike@gmail.com> > Subject: [IRL-CARLOW] 1834,Edward Gorman elected Coroner. > To: irl-carlow@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: > <CAKqwSs6p_ypkgj7GPbFQZgTVhaGkc7u9CfT1q4L1JM6Z29bzwg@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Carlow Sentinel. [ continued ]. > 24th May 1834. > > Carlow Sentinel > 24th May 1834. > Election of Coroner, Mr Gorman Triumphant. > Elected by a majority of 154, the announcement was received with loud > cheering. > Edward Gorman briefly addressed the crowd - he stated " Gentlemen, I > sincerely thank you for the honor you have this day conferred upon me ; I > trust I shall perform my duty honestly, and to the satisfaction of the > public (cheers ). > The defeated Mr Thomas Bunbury rose and appeared greatly agitated. > He stated, that the most unconstitutional means were resorted to by the > gentry of the county to oppose him ; he was not a party man, ( a voice from > the Grand Jury gallery shouted "nor an Orangeman" ) nor had he ever headed > a mob, ( loud laughter ) and he conceived himself badly treated by the > gentry, who were to a man opposed to him ( continued loud laughter ; ) > he stood by the constituency of the county to assert their rights, but he > was always a lover of the constitution ( laughter ; ) he hated not the man > because he went to mass ( laughter ; ) Sir Thomas Butler's tenantry > promised him their vote but the honourable baronet had compelled them to > vote against him, was that fair play ? , Butler had deceived him, ( more > comments shouted from the gallery ). > He thanked the High Sheriff for his impartial manner but he had to publicly > charge Mr Butler the Sub-Sheriff with partiality ; he sided with Mr Gorman. > Mr Bunbury resumed his seat amid the cheers of his followers and the hearty > groans of all parties who knew Mr Butler to be a man of honor, a gentleman > of the strictest integrity. > Mr Butler rose, and after considerable difficulty quietened the > ungovernable ruffians who supported Mr Bunbury, he stated , that it was not > the first time he was accused of partiality ( loud cheers ; ) he, however, > took that opportunity in the strongest terms which the English language > afforded of proclaiming the fallacy of the charge ( cheers ; ).... [ > account of Butler's speech continues with much interruption by loud > cheering ] . > Mr Bunbury then rose again stating - I beg leave to withdraw the term > "partiality" I am sorry for having used the term and therefore apologise ( > hisses and loud cries of " no thanks to you" ) I certainly thought it more > to my advantage to leave the poll open ( loud laughter ). > The High Sheriff , Mr Watson, moved to adjourn the court but Mr Finn > presented himself amid a volley of cheers from the respectable portion of > the crowd and the groans and yelling of the Bunbury mob. > Mr Finn addressed the meeting -- > " I congratulate you on the calm, dignified, and dispassionate manner in > which you conducted the election, I congratulate the gentry and the > tenantry of Carlow, they have taught a lesson to a reckless faction who > have endeavoured to revive the spirit of disunion and bigotry but thanks to > the united efforts of all that is respectable and intelligent this reckless > faction may be considered prostrate ( cheers ) reduced to their proper > dimensions, and that like the inflated toad their power and malignity will > expire together - ( cheers and great uproar ) ; ~~~~~~~~ [ note added 2013 > -- and so on and so forth, with hisses, groans, cheers, uproar, loud > laughter, loud cries and yelling, for what must have been at least another > hour ]. > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2013 10:28:38 +0100 > From: "Turtle Bunbury (History)" <turtlehistory@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: [IRL-CARLOW] 1834,Edward Gorman elected Coroner. > To: irl-carlow@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <BBEE8C00-DA5D-4772-B3D2-4015531B5436@gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Fantastic stuff Mick. I had no knowledge of Thomas C Bunbury before this but he was clearly quite a man. My cousin Peter Bunbury advises that Thomas Charles Bunbury was the eldest of five illegitimate sons born to Henry Bunbury and Margaret Walsh. He has some kind of connection with Sandgate in Kent as his first son Henry Bunbury was born 7.9.1811 in Sandgate to his wife Sarah Rodwell who in fact died in Brighton in 1857 whilst her husband TCB died 25.2.1852 according to Urglin Parish records. Their son Henry did not marry and became a barrister and appears in several census of England - 1891 living at Camberwell. > > I particularly like the expression 'the ungovernable ruffians who supported Mr Bunbury'. > > All best for now and thanks again. > > Turtle > > > Turtle Bunbury?? > > Check http://www.facebook.com/Wistorical to learn more about Turtle?s fascinating new project and its extraordinary cast of heroes, villains, eccentrics and crackpots. > > Turtle will curate the 2nd annual History Festival of Ireland at Duckett's Grove, Co. Carlow, on 15-16 June 2013. For the History Festival programme, visit http://www.thehistoryfestivalofireland.com/ > To book your tickets, click on http://www.visualcarlow.ie/events/category/the-history-festival-of-ireland-eigse-carlow-arts-festival-2013 or phone 059 9172400. > > www.turtlebunbury.com??? ? > > Oldfort, Tobinstown, Tullow, Co. Carlow, Ireland?? > Mob: + 353 (0) 87 6453 486 Office: +353 (0) 5991 80559 Skype: turtle1847 www.facebook.com/turtle.bunbury > > > > > > > > On 13 Jun 2013, at 10:01, Michael Purcell wrote: > > > Carlow Sentinel. [ continued ]. > > 24th May 1834. > > > > Carlow Sentinel > > 24th May 1834. > > Election of Coroner, Mr Gorman Triumphant. > > Elected by a majority of 154, the announcement was received with loud > > cheering. > > Edward Gorman briefly addressed the crowd - he stated " Gentlemen, I > > sincerely thank you for the honor you have this day conferred upon me ; I > > trust I shall perform my duty honestly, and to the satisfaction of the > > public (cheers ). > > The defeated Mr Thomas Bunbury rose and appeared greatly agitated. > > He stated, that the most unconstitutional means were resorted to by the > > gentry of the county to oppose him ; he was not a party man, ( a voice from > > the Grand Jury gallery shouted "nor an Orangeman" ) nor had he ever headed > > a mob, ( loud laughter ) and he conceived himself badly treated by the > > gentry, who were to a man opposed to him ( continued loud laughter ; ) > > he stood by the constituency of the county to assert their rights, but he > > was always a lover of the constitution ( laughter ; ) he hated not the man > > because he went to mass ( laughter ; ) Sir Thomas Butler's tenantry > > promised him their vote but the honourable baronet had compelled them to > > vote against him, was that fair play ? , Butler had deceived him, ( more > > comments shouted from the gallery ). > > He thanked the High Sheriff for his impartial manner but he had to publicly > > charge Mr Butler the Sub-Sheriff with partiality ; he sided with Mr Gorman. > > Mr Bunbury resumed his seat amid the cheers of his followers and the hearty > > groans of all parties who knew Mr Butler to be a man of honor, a gentleman > > of the strictest integrity. > > Mr Butler rose, and after considerable difficulty quietened the > > ungovernable ruffians who supported Mr Bunbury, he stated , that it was not > > the first time he was accused of partiality ( loud cheers ; ) he, however, > > took that opportunity in the strongest terms which the English language > > afforded of proclaiming the fallacy of the charge ( cheers ; ).... [ > > account of Butler's speech continues with much interruption by loud > > cheering ] . > > Mr Bunbury then rose again stating - I beg leave to withdraw the term > > "partiality" I am sorry for having used the term and therefore apologise ( > > hisses and loud cries of " no thanks to you" ) I certainly thought it more > > to my advantage to leave the poll open ( loud laughter ). > > The High Sheriff , Mr Watson, moved to adjourn the court but Mr Finn > > presented himself amid a volley of cheers from the respectable portion of > > the crowd and the groans and yelling of the Bunbury mob. > > Mr Finn addressed the meeting -- > > " I congratulate you on the calm, dignified, and dispassionate manner in > > which you conducted the election, I congratulate the gentry and the > > tenantry of Carlow, they have taught a lesson to a reckless faction who > > have endeavoured to revive the spirit of disunion and bigotry but thanks to > > the united efforts of all that is respectable and intelligent this reckless > > faction may be considered prostrate ( cheers ) reduced to their proper > > dimensions, and that like the inflated toad their power and malignity will > > expire together - ( cheers and great uproar ) ; ~~~~~~~~ [ note added 2013 > > -- and so on and so forth, with hisses, groans, cheers, uproar, loud > > laughter, loud cries and yelling, for what must have been at least another > > hour ]. > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-CARLOW-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2013 11:05:54 +0100 > From: "Turtle Bunbury (History)" <turtlehistory@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: [IRL-CARLOW] 1834,Edward Gorman elected Coroner. > To: irl-carlow@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: <BED39B3B-8F3C-41CC-850B-E795DFE38F36@gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Here's another detail on Thomas Bunbury for you Mick: > > On Wednesday June 5th 1850, the Ballina Chronicle reported that 'Mr. Thomas Bunbury, of Russeltown, is committed to Carlow gaol and his son, Mr. Henry Bunbury, is admitted to bail, both for threatening the life of a sheriff's bailiff and discharging a gun at him.' It is not yet known who the sheriff's baliff was or why they were shooting at him. The High Sheriff was Beauchamp Bartholomew Newton (1798-1850) of Rathwade, the son of Colonel Philip Newton and Sarah Westrop. Mr. Newton held the office of High Sheriff in 1850. Whether the Bunbury's shooting made any impact on this or not, Mr. Newton died on 21 August 1850 at age 51.According to Urglin Parish records, Thomas Charles Bunbury was buried on 25 February 1852. > > > > On 13 Jun 2013, at 10:01, Michael Purcell wrote: > > > Carlow Sentinel. [ continued ]. > > 24th May 1834. > > > > Carlow Sentinel > > 24th May 1834. > > Election of Coroner, Mr Gorman Triumphant. > > Elected by a majority of 154, the announcement was received with loud > > cheering. > > Edward Gorman briefly addressed the crowd - he stated " Gentlemen, I > > sincerely thank you for the honor you have this day conferred upon me ; I > > trust I shall perform my duty honestly, and to the satisfaction of the > > public (cheers ). > > The defeated Mr Thomas Bunbury rose and appeared greatly agitated. > > He stated, that the most unconstitutional means were resorted to by the > > gentry of the county to oppose him ; he was not a party man, ( a voice from > > the Grand Jury gallery shouted "nor an Orangeman" ) nor had he ever headed > > a mob, ( loud laughter ) and he conceived himself badly treated by the > > gentry, who were to a man opposed to him ( continued loud laughter ; ) > > he stood by the constituency of the county to assert their rights, but he > > was always a lover of the constitution ( laughter ; ) he hated not the man > > because he went to mass ( laughter ; ) Sir Thomas Butler's tenantry > > promised him their vote but the honourable baronet had compelled them to > > vote against him, was that fair play ? , Butler had deceived him, ( more > > comments shouted from the gallery ). > > He thanked the High Sheriff for his impartial manner but he had to publicly > > charge Mr Butler the Sub-Sheriff with partiality ; he sided with Mr Gorman. > > Mr Bunbury resumed his seat amid the cheers of his followers and the hearty > > groans of all parties who knew Mr Butler to be a man of honor, a gentleman > > of the strictest integrity. > > Mr Butler rose, and after considerable difficulty quietened the > > ungovernable ruffians who supported Mr Bunbury, he stated , that it was not > > the first time he was accused of partiality ( loud cheers ; ) he, however, > > took that opportunity in the strongest terms which the English language > > afforded of proclaiming the fallacy of the charge ( cheers ; ).... [ > > account of Butler's speech continues with much interruption by loud > > cheering ] . > > Mr Bunbury then rose again stating - I beg leave to withdraw the term > > "partiality" I am sorry for having used the term and therefore apologise ( > > hisses and loud cries of " no thanks to you" ) I certainly thought it more > > to my advantage to leave the poll open ( loud laughter ). > > The High Sheriff , Mr Watson, moved to adjourn the court but Mr Finn > > presented himself amid a volley of cheers from the respectable portion of > > the crowd and the groans and yelling of the Bunbury mob. > > Mr Finn addressed the meeting -- > > " I congratulate you on the calm, dignified, and dispassionate manner in > > which you conducted the election, I congratulate the gentry and the > > tenantry of Carlow, they have taught a lesson to a reckless faction who > > have endeavoured to revive the spirit of disunion and bigotry but thanks to > > the united efforts of all that is respectable and intelligent this reckless > > faction may be considered prostrate ( cheers ) reduced to their proper > > dimensions, and that like the inflated toad their power and malignity will > > expire together - ( cheers and great uproar ) ; ~~~~~~~~ [ note added 2013 > > -- and so on and so forth, with hisses, groans, cheers, uproar, loud > > laughter, loud cries and yelling, for what must have been at least another > > hour ]. > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-CARLOW-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2013 11:26:09 +0100 > From: Michael Purcell <carlowmike@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: [IRL-CARLOW] 1834,Edward Gorman elected Coroner. > To: irl-carlow@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: > <CAKqwSs7PD0Jb30RQt-M2zNSPtUHETL=WWyf4tgho3c1STpNsuw@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 > > thanks Turtle for the feedback and info, appreciated by all here...the > "ungovernable ruffians" were of course the priests and their acolytes. > > On 13 June 2013 10:28, Turtle Bunbury (History) <turtlehistory@gmail.com>wrote: > > > Fantastic stuff Mick. I had no knowledge of Thomas C Bunbury before this > > but he was clearly quite a man. My cousin Peter Bunbury advises that Thomas > > Charles Bunbury was the eldest of five illegitimate sons born to Henry > > Bunbury and Margaret Walsh. He has some kind of connection with Sandgate in > > Kent as his first son Henry Bunbury was born 7.9.1811 in Sandgate to his > > wife Sarah Rodwell who in fact died in Brighton in 1857 whilst her husband > > TCB died 25.2.1852 according to Urglin Parish records. Their son Henry did > > not marry and became a barrister and appears in several census of England - > > 1891 living at Camberwell. > > > > I particularly like the expression 'the ungovernable ruffians who > > supported Mr Bunbury'. > > > > All best for now and thanks again. > > > > Turtle > > > > > > Turtle Bunbury > > > > Check http://www.facebook.com/Wistorical to learn more about Turtle?s > > fascinating new project and its extraordinary cast of heroes, villains, > > eccentrics and crackpots. > > > > Turtle will curate the 2nd annual History Festival of Ireland at Duckett's > > Grove, Co. Carlow, on 15-16 June 2013. For the History Festival programme, > > visit http://www.thehistoryfestivalofireland.com/ > > To book your tickets, click on > > http://www.visualcarlow.ie/events/category/the-history-festival-of-ireland-eigse-carlow-arts-festival-2013or phone 059 9172400. > > > > www.turtlebunbury.com > > > > Oldfort, Tobinstown, Tullow, Co. Carlow, Ireland > > Mob: + 353 (0) 87 6453 486 Office: +353 (0) 5991 80559 Skype: > > turtle1847 www.facebook.com/turtle.bunbury > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 13 Jun 2013, at 10:01, Michael Purcell wrote: > > > > > Carlow Sentinel. [ continued ]. > > > 24th May 1834. > > > > > > Carlow Sentinel > > > 24th May 1834. > > > Election of Coroner, Mr Gorman Triumphant. > > > Elected by a majority of 154, the announcement was received with loud > > > cheering. > > > Edward Gorman briefly addressed the crowd - he stated " Gentlemen, I > > > sincerely thank you for the honor you have this day conferred upon me ; I > > > trust I shall perform my duty honestly, and to the satisfaction of the > > > public (cheers ). > > > The defeated Mr Thomas Bunbury rose and appeared greatly agitated. > > > He stated, that the most unconstitutional means were resorted to by the > > > gentry of the county to oppose him ; he was not a party man, ( a voice > > from > > > the Grand Jury gallery shouted "nor an Orangeman" ) nor had he ever > > headed > > > a mob, ( loud laughter ) and he conceived himself badly treated by the > > > gentry, who were to a man opposed to him ( continued loud laughter ; ) > > > he stood by the constituency of the county to assert their rights, but he > > > was always a lover of the constitution ( laughter ; ) he hated not the > > man > > > because he went to mass ( laughter ; ) Sir Thomas Butler's tenantry > > > promised him their vote but the honourable baronet had compelled them to > > > vote against him, was that fair play ? , Butler had deceived him, ( more > > > comments shouted from the gallery ). > > > He thanked the High Sheriff for his impartial manner but he had to > > publicly > > > charge Mr Butler the Sub-Sheriff with partiality ; he sided with Mr > > Gorman. > > > Mr Bunbury resumed his seat amid the cheers of his followers and the > > hearty > > > groans of all parties who knew Mr Butler to be a man of honor, a > > gentleman > > > of the strictest integrity. > > > Mr Butler rose, and after considerable difficulty quietened the > > > ungovernable ruffians who supported Mr Bunbury, he stated , that it was > > not > > > the first time he was accused of partiality ( loud cheers ; ) he, > > however, > > > took that opportunity in the strongest terms which the English language > > > afforded of proclaiming the fallacy of the charge ( cheers ; ).... [ > > > account of Butler's speech continues with much interruption by loud > > > cheering ] . > > > Mr Bunbury then rose again stating - I beg leave to withdraw the term > > > "partiality" I am sorry for having used the term and therefore apologise > > ( > > > hisses and loud cries of " no thanks to you" ) I certainly thought it > > more > > > to my advantage to leave the poll open ( loud laughter ). > > > The High Sheriff , Mr Watson, moved to adjourn the court but Mr Finn > > > presented himself amid a volley of cheers from the respectable portion of > > > the crowd and the groans and yelling of the Bunbury mob. > > > Mr Finn addressed the meeting -- > > > " I congratulate you on the calm, dignified, and dispassionate manner in > > > which you conducted the election, I congratulate the gentry and the > > > tenantry of Carlow, they have taught a lesson to a reckless faction who > > > have endeavoured to revive the spirit of disunion and bigotry but thanks > > to > > > the united efforts of all that is respectable and intelligent this > > reckless > > > faction may be considered prostrate ( cheers ) reduced to their proper > > > dimensions, and that like the inflated toad their power and malignity > > will > > > expire together - ( cheers and great uproar ) ; ~~~~~~~~ [ note added > > 2013 > > > -- and so on and so forth, with hisses, groans, cheers, uproar, loud > > > laughter, loud cries and yelling, for what must have been at least > > another > > > hour ]. > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > IRL-CARLOW-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > IRL-CARLOW-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Thu, 13 Jun 2013 12:54:58 +0100 > From: Michael Purcell <carlowmike@gmail.com> > Subject: [IRL-CARLOW] 1834,Reviewing the situation. > To: irl-carlow@rootsweb.com > Message-ID: > <CAKqwSs7_sGEU1LtvRoUd14QBCb6xsXX9vTx3iLgSKQyj+JxYFg@mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Carlow Sentinel. > 24th May 1834. > HENRY BUTLER, Esquire, SUB-SHERIFF. > As will be perceived by our report of the proceedings at the close of the > election on Monday, a most unwarrantable and insolent attack was made on > the above gentleman by Mr Thomas Bunbury. > Had Mr Bunbury not made an abject apology before the public for his conduct > we would feel ourselves called upon to say more on the subject, acquainted > as we are intimately with Mr Butler's character as a public officer. > But we must make allowances for a defeated candidate - a man who coolly > calculated on slipping into the position of Coroner without the slightest > opposition, and consequently his rage and disappointment because Mr Butler > would not lend himself to cooperate with a plan calculated to > smuggle Bunbury into a public job by holding the election the day after he > received the writ for the vacancy, which writ was obtained at the special > request of Mr Bunbury. > Mr Butler's exposure of the patriot Bunbury was admirable, his defence was > brief, manly, and energetic ; and Bunbury, feeling the extreme delicacy of > his situation, publicly apologised. > Bunbury's attack on Sir Thomas Butler was equally unhappy. The worthy > Baronet had, in his capacity of freeholder of the county, publicly declared > his reasons for voting for Mr Gorman, and in doing so informed the public > of the exact price of a patriot, namely that "an appointment as Coroner" > would cool his patriotism, shut his mouth for ever, or as the poet has it, > ~~~ > "To place and power all public spirit tends, > In place and power all public spirit ENDS. > And thus it was with Mr Bunbury ; he would discontinue abusing the gentry > of the county, if they allowed Bunbury to take office. > We thank Sir Thomas Butler from the bottom of our hearts for giving us so > excellent a definition of a "patriot" and exposing those itinerant brawlers > who presume to seek for public situations. > > > ------------------------------ > > To contact the IRL-CARLOW list administrator, send an email to > IRL-CARLOW-admin@rootsweb.com. > > To post a message to the IRL-CARLOW mailing list, send an email to IRL-CARLOW@rootsweb.com. > > __________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to IRL-CARLOW-request@rootsweb.com > with the word "unsubscribe" without the quotes in the subject and the body of the > email with no additional text. > > > End of IRL-CARLOW Digest, Vol 8, Issue 209 > ******************************************