The Scotch-Irish - an insult, hardly! To call them Scotch-Irish may be an unacceptable to some Scots, and it is an amusing controversy, but the term is quite acceptable where the many listers hail from. "Scotch-Irish" found its way into the lexicon a very long time ago. Even though the term is an Americanism, and not generally known in Scotland and Ireland, it has been in general use since the 18th century. But it goes back even further. Writing in 1573 good queen Elizabeth (yes, I know - she is hardly a Scot!) used the term Scotch-Irish and nobody raised any objection, except perhaps Sorley Boy � but given the context perhaps his objections were a bit muted. Beth said, �We are given to understand that a nobleman named �Sorley Boy� [McDonald] and others, who be of the Scotch-Irish race, and some of the wild Irish, at this time are content to acknowledge our true and mere right to the countrie of Ulster and the crowne of Ireland�� Good Queen Liz then offered the right, ownership, and the inheritance of the land ��upon the taking of an oath of allegiance to any meer Irish, or Scotch-Irish, or other strangers.� But that was only an English Queen and she should be excused her transgressions, except for the fact that the late Professor James G. Leyburn located in the 1675 register of the University of Glasgow records and enrollment of one Francis Makemie from Ramelton. It included a notation that he was �Scoto-Hibernicus.� That is, of course, Scotch-Irish. This Franciscus Makemius was later to emigrate to North America where he founded the Presbyterian Church on that continent, and organized the first Presbytery in Philadelphia in 1706. By the way, the last time I googled Glasgow, it was still in Scotland. The Rev. Cotton Mather who received his Doctor of Divinity in 1710 from the University of Glasgow was a leading clergyman in the American colonies. In 1706 he wrote, � I write letters unto diverse persons of Honour both in Scotland and in England; to procure Settlements of good Scotch Colonies, to the Northwest of us.� For a little more history, during this formative period of American colonies the term �Scotch-Irish� was little used. This was not because it was felt to be disparaging, but rather the preferred term for those that originally emigrated was �Irish.� Most of these immigrants were originally Ulstermen, and between 1717 and the Revolutionary War more than a quarter million from Ulster came to America. And a majority were Presbyterians and other dissenters. Even during the Revolutionary War they referred to themselves as Irish. And the term stuck until the mid-19th century when the poorer and principally illiterate elements arrived, primarily Roman Catholics. This flood of Irish escaping the Famine was descending upon what was then a Protestant county, much like Ulster. Prejudice against all foreigners was rampant, not so much on a sectarian basis, but because these people would hire out at near slave wages. Like much of Ulster, the antipathy was generated at the lower class, that laboring mass that competed for jobs. It was at this time that the descendants of the original Irish settlers, most from Ulster and a majority were Protestant, sought ways to distinguish themselves from the newcomers � the �shanty Irish� or bog trotters. So the compound name came into being � that cant phrase, a shibboleth, a mongrel absurdity, and even the Scotch-Irish Society of America has been described as a humbug. But a good shot of Glenfiddich Ancient Reserve or even some 20 year old Black Bush will do wonders and might lighten one up just a little bit. That is the true meaning of Scotch-Irish. Myself, I prefer a pint of Smiticks. j.j.carroll@earthlink.net

Nice And Accurate Summary Jim. It seems evident from the snapshots of history that there was a lot of, "Monkey see, monkey do," in record keeping going on. My biased inclination is to use more acceptable titles like Ulster-Scots or Scots-Irish and avoid using the "s" word for the same reasons we avoid using the "n" word, Respect. Because the term(s) appear repeatedly in history does not make them written in stone. Don in Oregon ----- Original Message ----- From: "jim at syracuse" <j.j.carroll@earthlink.net> To: <Irl-Antrim@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 8:37 AM Subject: [IRL-ANTRIM] Scotch-Irish - an insult, hardly! > The Scotch-Irish - an insult, hardly! > > To call them Scotch-Irish may be an unacceptable to some Scots, and it is > an amusing controversy, but the term is quite acceptable where the many > listers hail from. "Scotch-Irish" found its way into the lexicon a very > long time ago. Even though the term is an Americanism, and not generally > known in Scotland and Ireland, it has been in general use since the 18th > century. But it goes back even further. > > Writing in 1573 good queen Elizabeth (yes, I know - she is hardly a Scot!) > used the term Scotch-Irish and nobody raised any objection, except perhaps > Sorley Boy - but given the context perhaps his objections were a bit > muted. Beth said, "We are given to understand that a nobleman named > 'Sorley Boy' [McDonald] and others, who be of the Scotch-Irish race, and > some of the wild Irish, at this time are content to acknowledge our true > and mere right to the countrie of Ulster and the crowne of Ireland." > > Good Queen Liz then offered the right, ownership, and the inheritance of > the land ".upon the taking of an oath of allegiance to any meer Irish, or > Scotch-Irish, or other strangers." > > But that was only an English Queen and she should be excused her > transgressions, except for the fact that the late Professor James G. > Leyburn located in the 1675 register of the University of Glasgow records > and enrollment of one Francis Makemie from Ramelton. It included a > notation that he was "Scoto-Hibernicus." That is, of course, Scotch-Irish. > This Franciscus Makemius was later to emigrate to North America where he > founded the Presbyterian Church on that continent, and organized the first > Presbytery in Philadelphia in 1706. > > By the way, the last time I googled Glasgow, it was still in Scotland. > > The Rev. Cotton Mather who received his Doctor of Divinity in 1710 from > the University of Glasgow was a leading clergyman in the American > colonies. In 1706 he wrote, " I write letters unto diverse persons of > Honour both in Scotland and in England; to procure Settlements of good > Scotch Colonies, to the Northwest of us." > > For a little more history, during this formative period of American > colonies the term "Scotch-Irish" was little used. This was not because it > was felt to be disparaging, but rather the preferred term for those that > originally emigrated was "Irish." Most of these immigrants were originally > Ulstermen, and between 1717 and the Revolutionary War more than a quarter > million from Ulster came to America. And a majority were Presbyterians and > other dissenters. Even during the Revolutionary War they referred to > themselves as Irish. And the term stuck until the mid-19th century when > the poorer and principally illiterate elements arrived, primarily Roman > Catholics. > > This flood of Irish escaping the Famine was descending upon what was then > a Protestant county, much like Ulster. Prejudice against all foreigners > was rampant, not so much on a sectarian basis, but because these people > would hire out at near slave wages. Like much of Ulster, the antipathy was > generated at the lower class, that laboring mass that competed for jobs. > It was at this time that the descendants of the original Irish settlers, > most from Ulster and a majority were Protestant, sought ways to > distinguish themselves from the newcomers - the "shanty Irish" or bog > trotters. So the compound name came into being - that cant phrase, a > shibboleth, a mongrel absurdity, and even the Scotch-Irish Society of > America has been described as a humbug. > > But a good shot of Glenfiddich Ancient Reserve or even some 20 year old > Black Bush will do wonders and might lighten one up just a little bit. > That is the true meaning of Scotch-Irish. Myself, I prefer a pint of > Smiticks. > > j.j.carroll@earthlink.net -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-ANTRIM-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Jim at Syracuse, i throughly enjoyed your article. James of Lethbridge ----- Original Message ----- From: "jim at syracuse" <j.j.carroll@earthlink.net> To: <Irl-Antrim@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:37 AM Subject: [IRL-ANTRIM] Scotch-Irish - an insult, hardly! > The Scotch-Irish - an insult, hardly! > > To call them Scotch-Irish may be an unacceptable to some Scots, and it is > an amusing controversy, but the term is quite acceptable where the many > listers hail from. "Scotch-Irish" found its way into the lexicon a very > long time ago. Even though the term is an Americanism, and not generally > known in Scotland and Ireland, it has been in general use since the 18th > century. But it goes back even further. > > Writing in 1573 good queen Elizabeth (yes, I know - she is hardly a Scot!) > used the term Scotch-Irish and nobody raised any objection, except perhaps > Sorley Boy - but given the context perhaps his objections were a bit > muted. Beth said, "We are given to understand that a nobleman named > 'Sorley Boy' [McDonald] and others, who be of the Scotch-Irish race, and > some of the wild Irish, at this time are content to acknowledge our true > and mere right to the countrie of Ulster and the crowne of Ireland." > > Good Queen Liz then offered the right, ownership, and the inheritance of > the land ".upon the taking of an oath of allegiance to any meer Irish, or > Scotch-Irish, or other strangers." > > But that was only an English Queen and she should be excused her > transgressions, except for the fact that the late Professor James G. > Leyburn located in the 1675 register of the University of Glasgow records > and enrollment of one Francis Makemie from Ramelton. It included a > notation that he was "Scoto-Hibernicus." That is, of course, Scotch-Irish. > This Franciscus Makemius was later to emigrate to North America where he > founded the Presbyterian Church on that continent, and organized the first > Presbytery in Philadelphia in 1706. > > By the way, the last time I googled Glasgow, it was still in Scotland. > > The Rev. Cotton Mather who received his Doctor of Divinity in 1710 from > the University of Glasgow was a leading clergyman in the American > colonies. In 1706 he wrote, " I write letters unto diverse persons of > Honour both in Scotland and in England; to procure Settlements of good > Scotch Colonies, to the Northwest of us." > > For a little more history, during this formative period of American > colonies the term "Scotch-Irish" was little used. This was not because it > was felt to be disparaging, but rather the preferred term for those that > originally emigrated was "Irish." Most of these immigrants were originally > Ulstermen, and between 1717 and the Revolutionary War more than a quarter > million from Ulster came to America. And a majority were Presbyterians and > other dissenters. Even during the Revolutionary War they referred to > themselves as Irish. And the term stuck until the mid-19th century when > the poorer and principally illiterate elements arrived, primarily Roman > Catholics. > > This flood of Irish escaping the Famine was descending upon what was then > a Protestant county, much like Ulster. Prejudice against all foreigners > was rampant, not so much on a sectarian basis, but because these people > would hire out at near slave wages. Like much of Ulster, the antipathy was > generated at the lower class, that laboring mass that competed for jobs. > It was at this time that the descendants of the original Irish settlers, > most from Ulster and a majority were Protestant, sought ways to > distinguish themselves from the newcomers - the "shanty Irish" or bog > trotters. So the compound name came into being - that cant phrase, a > shibboleth, a mongrel absurdity, and even the Scotch-Irish Society of > America has been described as a humbug. > > But a good shot of Glenfiddich Ancient Reserve or even some 20 year old > Black Bush will do wonders and might lighten one up just a little bit. > That is the true meaning of Scotch-Irish. Myself, I prefer a pint of > Smiticks. > > j.j.carroll@earthlink.net > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > IRL-ANTRIM-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.411 / Virus Database: 268.17.37/682 - Release Date: 2/12/2007