oh! that was so very hard to read without wanting to reach out and clobber an 160 year old or better propagandist. Thank you for letting us see some of the predjudiced views our ancestors were subject to. Donna Franklin

The other day I posted a critical opinion of the Otherdays.com on line subscription program because there was no way to print or save the Griffith Valuation images. Well, I heard from Francis Dowling today. He owns Otherdays and he informed me that they have restored the the print function and added the ability to save the image, which is a great improvement in my estimation. I checked out the program and you can indeed do both. Printing the image, using Netscape browser, I got a small image printed. However, using a photo program, I was able to bring up the image that I save and then print it so it filled a full page which the print was larger and easier to read. So the object of this is, if you are using either program to access the Griffith Valuation, both now have the same ability to print and save. In my last email, I mentioned that the GV Index was missing a lot of names and should not be relied on to do you family research. I was referring to the Broderbund CD that you can buy on line, not the indexes being used on Otherdays or Origins. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com All outgoing mail virus free, scanned by Norton

IF WE KNEW If we knew the woe and heartache Waiting for us down the road, If our lips could taste the wormwood, If our backs could feel the load, Would we waste the day in wishing For a time that ne'er can be? Would we wait in such impatience For our ships to come from sea? If we knew the baby fingers Pressed against the windowpane Would be cold and stiff tomorrow -- Never trouble us again -- Would the bright eyes of our darling Catch the frown upon our brow? Would the print of rosy fingers Vex us then as they do now? Ah! the little ice-cold fingers -- How they point our memories back To the hasty words and actions Strewn along our backward track! How those little hands remind us, As in snowy grace they lie, Not to scatter thorns - but roses -- For our reaping by and by. Strange we never prize the music Till the sweet-voiced bird has flown; Strange that we should slight the violets Till the lovely flowers are gone; Strange that summer skies and sunshine Never seem one half so fair As when winter's snowy pinions Shake their white down in the air! Lips from which the seal of silence None but God can roll away, Never blossomed in such beauty As adorns the mouth today; And sweet words that freight our memory With their beautiful perfume, Come to us in sweeter accents Through the portals of the tomb. Let us gather up the sunbeams Lying all around our path; Let us keep the wheat and roses, Casting out the thorns and chaff; Let us find our sweetest comfort In the blessings of today, With a patient hand removing All the briars from the way. -- May Riley Smith, from "The Best Loved Poems of the American People," ed. Hazel Felleman, Doubleday (1936) --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.690 / Virus Database: 451 - Release Date: 5/22/2004

I'm hoping that there may be NY residents on the list! I have managed to find family members in the 1920 and 1930 censuses and I would like to get more info about their lives and possibly trace their descendants. Their names are John and Julia REGAN, they lived with daughters Margaret and Mary and Julia's sister Ellen Berry. The family lived at 209 or 211 Canal Street, STAPLETON township, RICHMOND borough, NEW YORK. Julia's brother Thomas and his family lived at 105/6 or 8 68th Street, NY city in 1920. Does anyone on the list live in or know one of these areas? The Berry family was Catholic so I am particularly interested in churches, schools, cemetaries etc Margaret

I was subscribed to Otherdays.com for a year and and was pleased with it service at the time. A one point, last year, Origins.com offered a free day and after testing it, I thought Otherdays was a better deal and wrote on some mailing lists that it was a better deal for your buck/euro/pound. However, I take it all back. Both programs offer the Griffiths Valuation with an index. When I was on Otherdays, you could print the GV image, now you can't. While I still have access to Otherdays, yesterday when doing some family research, I got frustrated with the program and decided to check out Origins again. I paid for 900 credits or two weeks for $16+. They basically have the same index but allow you to use wildcards in the search. Like I could put on Conn* and get all the names that start with Conn, including Conners and Connors. I could search Flan?gan and get Flannagan, Flanagan, Flannigan etc. So this certainly is a better index tool. Then I started checking out the images. After some confusion...my Quick Time plugin kept opening the image but I wasn't getting the ability to print (or the tool bar). Origins help section didn't help because when I clicked to see if I had the Tiff plugin, it showed the image, however, when I went to where you can get the tiff plugin free, it stated that if I didn't get the tool bar, I needed to disable Quick Time (they gave good instructions) and download the Tiff plug in. Well, after I did so, it was excellent! I could manipulate the images, print them, save them etc. The images were not as fluid as they are on Otherdays, they were more stable and the ability to save the image is wonderful for my records. So, the object of this post to to take back my good review of Otherdays and my panning of Origins. For the money, I find Origins a better deal. Recently, I found some major defects in the Griffiths Valuation Index. Many parishes don't have the beginning of the alphabet, so if you are depending on the index to give you reliable information, you are mistaken. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com All outgoing mail virus free, scanned by Norton

Posting to this list as I can't remember which list's member wanted this info: Valorous Green, Salvia, Co. C 5 Regt., Michigan Vols., Died Dec. 31, 1898 & Mother, Emma M. Green, 1856-1938 Evergreen Cemetery, New Haven, CT

I think somehow I've been bumped off both lists ---- again.

Hi- For the NYC Irish, 1840+. Most if not all Barrett/Corrigan/Gallagher/Quinn families on the lower east side, especially on and around Baxter St., are all related to me in one way or another. The Barrett`s moved uptown, on and around 117th St. and Bklyn, later on, about 1878, maybe earlier. They all came from Sligo so far as I know. Anyone relate to these families? Barbara : )

SNIPPET: The following detailed obituary is from an early March 1898 issue of the "NEW WORLD," the official newspaper of the Catholic Archdiocese of Chicago: "Thomas MURPHY of 319 Illinois St., father of Joseph H., William, Thomas M., Frank G., John S., James R., Mrs. FLEMING, Mrs. R. FULLEN, died Feb 28 after a brief illness of one week with la-grippe, age 72 years. Mr. MURPHY was of Trim, County Meath, Ireland and came to America in 1849 and has been a resident of Chicago and the Cathedral Parish since 1853. He was engaged for a number of years in the ice business and won for himself hosts of friends in social and business circles. He retired from active business a few years ago. A peculiar incident in connection with Mr. MURPHY's death was the fact that he died on the same day, date and hour that his wife died eleven years ago. The funeral took place at the Holy Name Cathedral Wednesday morning March 2, at 10:30 o'clock where Solemn High Mass of Requiem was celebrated by the Reverend J. M. SCANLAN; Reverend J. P. DORR, deacon; and Reverend F. J. BARRY, subdeacon. The eulogy over the remains was delivered by the Rev. J. M! . SCANLAN who paid a well merited tribute to the departed and revered father. The remains were laid to rest in the family lot in Calvary, Reverend J. P. DORR officiating at the grave. The pall-bearers were: Messrs. James HEALY, William WALSH, Thomas DUGGAN, Martin COONEY, Thomas DRURRY, and William SPAIN. May he rest in peace." Newspapers are important sources of information, especially so in cases where an individual was actively involved in a religious or ethnic organization. These small newspapers often contain more information about a family than would normally be found in a local newspaper. Immigrants to America generally longed for familiarity and gravitated toward others who shared similar origins, cultures, customs, languages and religious beliefs. They often congregated in ethnic communities and associated with others of their own ethnic and religious groups. In such communities, individuals were more likely to be recognized and respected. They also had more opportunities to create channels for communication between the old world and the new world. Religious and ethnic newspapers often contributed to this process as obituaries tended to provide abundant information not necessarily found in local newspapers. Ethnic newspapers often gave flowery eulogies that included information ab! out an ancestor's emigration, town of origin, marriage, spouse's maiden name, and children's names and location. If you are searching for a European town of origin, this might be the only source containing that vital information. You will also find lists of immigrants who had recently arrived in the area, advertisements for goods and services, announcements of weddings, births, and birthdays, letters to the editor, descriptions of ocean voyages, societal affaris and gatherings, membership lists, school news, biographical sketches, testimonials, and even pictures of individuals. Early ethnic newspapers sometimes ran notices from immigrants and worried Europeans who were searching for relatives who had been "lost" since coming to America. These advertisemente often gave personal descriptions, last-known addresses, and names and descriptions of spouse and children. Such notices can be helpful in connecting old-world families and can provide new leads to the town of origin. Some ethnic and religious newspapers are available in the possession of current ethnic and religious organizations. Others have been preserved by local libraries, genealogical societies, and historical archives in the state or county where they were originally published. Some have been sent to special collections of a particular ethnic or religous group, such as the Swenson Swedish Immigration Research Center at Augustana College, Rock Island, IL, and the Balzekas Museum of Lithuanian Culture in Chicago. Others are now part of large collections, such as the Immigrant Archives at the University of MN in Minneapolis and the Balch Institute in Philadelphia, both of which collect and preserve materials for all immigrant groups. Indexes for many of these ethnic and religious newpapers have been created by the groups themselves and by local genealogical societies and can be found in their repositories. Some indexes are in the hands of private individuals or groups. See Chap! ter 12, "The Source: A Guidebook of American Genealogy," Salt Lake City: Ancestry, 1984) for a list of many of these indexes. -- Excerpt, "Ancestry" magazine May/June 1996 --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.690 / Virus Database: 451 - Release Date: 5/23/2004

The Banbridge and Dromore 1896 Municipal voters list is now on my website, the website search engine will not pick up this information till Monday, please go to the Banbridge and Dromore index pages of my website to link to the information, If anyone has any information on a William Gibson, from Dromore, A watchmaker and jeweler born circa 1860, died 1913,in England, who built Dromboneth House in Dromore in 1901, please email me.also any information on Dromboneth House will be very helpfull. Raymond http://www.raymondscountydownwebsite.com

SNIPPET: Ciaran CARSON, Irish musician, poet and novelist, was born in Belfast (Antrim) No. Ireland in 1948 and has won awards in England and America. In the latter case, his books of poetry are published by the Wake Forest University, Winston-Salem, NC. Here are some excerpt from one of his books - "Last Night's Fun ..." pub. 1996 -- including a marvelous poem "Rubber Legs" by John LOUGHRAN. "We are in Garrison on the Fermanagh-Leitrim border. It is a late summer's evening. A gang of us -- flute-players Mick Hoy, Andy Dickson, Seamus Quinn and Deirdre Shannon; the concertina-player and singer Gabie McArdle and others - have been recruited from the pub. The Festival committee has switched on the fairy lights that drape the back of the lorry parked in the carpark; the lough beside reflects a still-enduring streak of sky, and the whole dusk seems to glow. Precarious on the makeshift mobile stage, we play a few tunes to the crowd that's scattered round in knots and dots and couples. Then Gabie sings 'Edmund on Lough Erne Shore'" - 'Each step I take by the winding river/Makes me reminded of days of yore.' The song ends; there is a little ripple of applause. Someone comes up and hand us cigarettes, and asks for 'The Harvest Home.' We sit and talk and smoke a while, then nick our cigarettes and start to play. Almost instantly, one knot of the crowd unravels! and this old man in a topcoat and a hat and big boots tied with yellow laces steps out. From another dark annex of the carpark, his counterpart appears. By the time we hit the last part of the first part first time round, they're poised and ready - arms not stiff and rigid like the modern over-educated dancer, but relaxed, palms held outwards in a gesture some way between a welcome and a challenge. They face each other, one foot pointing outwards, while the crowd has shifted and coagulated round them in a focus of attention. But they have space, the dancers. As we hit the first part of the repeat, their feet begin to move. Their hands accompany the dance in little wristy arcane movements, thumbs alternating with their digits. Their feet are hardly off the ground as they heel and toe and tap, till it seems there is a skim of twilight shimmering between their boot-soles and the black wet tarmac. Loose change jingles in their pockets as they waver gravely in the pre-determined figures, facing, backing off and circling, making pirouettes and formal quarter-bows, catching one another's little fingers on occasions, sometimes going for a full hand-clasp, instantly and rhythmically released. They doppelganger one another. Nods and winks are witnessed as they undergo the subtle drama of the ceili house. They reinvent the past and all their past encounters; then the pattern comes to its conclusion. Four feet stand on terra firma for one instant, then they break apart and take the gait of normal hu! man beings. Everyone's relaxed now. Cigarettes are passed around and lit. There is a surreptitious bottle full of who knows what. A buzz of conversation. Laughter shimmers out across Lough Melvin; the fairly lights are swaying, chinking gently in the desultory breeze..." RUBBER LEGS But then I mind Keenan and this man Brian McAleer, there was a big barn dance in it one night and the thing got going that good and Brian came out of the kitchen. Och, he was going on maybe seventy years of age at the time. But a light, thin man, you know, and always with good spirit. Great singer too. And him and Keenan hit the floor for a reel. Well, if you seen them two men dancing, boy, they were dancing from when they were young fellows, you know, in their youth, and still this was a great meeting for them to meet again two old men, you know, they'd been dancing whenever they were young fellows. I'll tell you what they done too and they sung together and they herded, when there was no ditches and no fences about and you went out and herded your cattle the whole day and him and Brian was raised together. That was Keenan's farm there and McAleer's farm was here and the two men herding on the one mountain together and they sung together the whole day and exchanged songs. And Brian and him going out that night on the floor and if you seen them boys, you would just think their legs was rubber. I could mind Brian McAleer, you want to see that man and him over eighty, and the thin light legs of him, and I can see him yet. And Keenan was down below, and Keenan was a small man, a small tight wee man, sort of wee pernickety man, you know, and he was down there dancing. And Keenan and McAleer was up and then they would change places. Well, you want to see McAleer; you'd think the legs was rubber, for a man like that, no pains nor arthritis nor rheumatism nor damn what else. He was quivering and carrying on with his feet and Keenan was down below and Keenan was putting in nice fancy steps, you know. Ah Jesus, you want to see them two men dancing, you could have played for them for a week. -- John Loughran --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.690 / Virus Database: 451 - Release Date: 5/22/2004

I have found some information that leads me to believe my gggrandfather Dennis Mellon arrived on the Ship "Washington" in May of 1832. It was from Liverpool to NY. And they had a large Cholera epidemic on board. I have searched many ship lists and can't find the Washington. Does anyone know where I can find it? And the passenger lists. Hopefully on line. Beth

> > >Does anyone know where I can find it? And the passenger lists. > Have you checked all the Passenger List Links, associated with this list's website. There is a link for it under: Irish-American Links. There are some major website links on that site. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com All outgoing mail virus free, scanned by Norton

Pat, If you are using SpyBot, those windows are most likly to inform you that some advertiser is trying to give you a cookie. I automatically refuse those 'offers' and have not encountered any problems as a result. I've been using SpyBot for several months now. -Pat- ----- Original Message ----- Now, I need some help since I am ignorant on how this firewall is working and getting all these strange messages about files trying to invade my computer when surfing from website to website. The dialog boxes asks me if I want to block the file, and I don't know what I am actually blocking. Does anyone know where I can go on the net to find out more? Thanks. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA, list admin http://www.connorsgenealogy.com All outgoing mail virus free, scanned by Norton ==== IRISH-AMERICAN Mailing List ==== The IRISH-AMERICAN Mailing List Website and Lookup Service http://www.connorsgenealogy.com/IrishAmerican/ Use this to unsub, change your subscription, links, etc. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.613 / Virus Database: 392 - Release Date: 3/4/2004

I have just put a Flanagan (all variant spellings) surname registry up on the Flanagan section of my website. Add your Flanagan and hopefully you can make some connections. I had a Flynn 2nd cousin contact me a couple of months ago because she found my name on a surname registry. I had put the name up over three years ago! You can find the registry by going to the URL below my name. On my homepage, under Surnames, chose Flanagan. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com All outgoing mail virus free, scanned by Norton

People in the Westchester area may be interested in this: For the summer months of June, July and August, The Town of Pelham Public Library is changing the 350th Anniversary Lecture Series dates from the third Sunday of the month at 2:00 p.m. to the second Thursday evening of the month beginning at 7:30 p.m. The next presentation, entitled "Early Postcard Views of Pelham", will be held on Thursday, June 10 beginning at 7:30 p.m.

thanks to George at the Irish Heritage Newsletter... Irish Chocolate Cake Sponge 175g/ 6oz self-raising flour 1/2tsp salt 50g/ 2oz dark chocolate 110g/ 4oz butter 175g/ 6oz caster sugar 80g/ 3oz cooked mashed potato 2 eggs, beaten 4tbsp milk Filling 110g/ 4oz dark chocolate 125ml/ 4fl oz double cream 50g/ 2oz icing sugar 3tbsp Irish cream liqueur Preheat oven to gas mark 5/ 190°C/ 375°F, and grease and line two 20cm/ 8 inch cake tins. Sift flour and salt into a mixing bowl. Melt chocolate in a bowl placed over a saucepan of hot water. In a separate bowl, cream butter and sugar together until fluffy, then beat in the chocolate and mashed potato. Gradually beat in the eggs, adding a little flour with each addition. Fold in the rest of the flour and stir in the milk. Divide mixture between cake tins and bake for 25-30 minutes or until top is firm but springy to the touch. Remove from oven and after a few minutes, turn out on a cooling rack. While the cake is cooling, make the filling. Melt the chocolate as before, stir in the other ingredients and mix well. Use the filling to sandwich the sponge layers together and coat the top and sides of the cake. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com All outgoing mail virus free, scanned by Norton

I have just updated the Ireland Genealogical Projects' County Limerick website by adding and/or updating the following town(land) webpages on the site: Crehaun, Kilflin, Ballyfeerode, Barryarthur, Knockainy, Knockainy East, Knockainy West, Bottomstown, Knocklong, Croom, Newcastle, Hospital, Askeaton, Glin, Ballyorgan. You can access the website at: http://www.rootsweb.com/~irllim/ -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com All outgoing mail virus free, scanned by Norton

> > >Has anyone ever heard of a census list for 1911 for the Lack (Leach) area of >Castlebar, Co Mayo ??? > Go to Http://www.seanraud.com Find the Poor Law Union, which is then called registrar'a district in the census. So, when you go to LDS films, you will have to know the registrar's district to know what film to order. -- Pat Connors, Sacramento CA http://www.connorsgenealogy.com All outgoing mail virus free, scanned by Norton

Hello Listers, Has anyone ever heard of a census list for 1911 for the Lack (Leach) area of Castlebar, Co Mayo ??? Lack I believe is outside of Castlebar, near Turlough and Foxford.. If not someone please advise correct placement... MaryPat Researching: Gibbons, Flanagan, Hughes, Murphy, O Hora/ O Hara, Gavin, Howley, Loftus, Jordan ALL MAYO Carey- Ireland (?), Jersey City/Astoria NY Lichacz- Ukraine, Jersey City, Astoria NY and Fairfield Ct. Pifko-Ukraine, Brooklyn, Broad Albin NY