Mr. Harris: I'm not going to go into much detail other than to say I don't think anyone questions your groups' motives, sincerety, and dedication in what you are doing. The only thing questioned is the procedures by which you do them and the potential long term adverse effects those practices have on pioneer tombstones in your county. I have witnessed first hand both spectrums and can assure you I would rather have my ancestors' stones properly restored and preserved, even if it meant waiting longer to have it done because money is tight. To put this into perspective using an analogy that I'm more familiar with... The time, effort, and money you have spent to only utilize improper methods is like me...a volunteer firefighter, spending years of my time flipping pancakes and sausage, fighting with town boards and township trustees, and doing all I can to raise money for a new firetruck to help protect my community and then when it finally arrives...filling the water tank with diesel fuel to use in extinguishing fires. Doesn't make much sense, does it? That's how I see what your group is doing to your county's pioneer cemeteries. Your hearts are in the right place....there's no question about it. The only questions pertain to the long term effects of what you are doing, and whether your time and money could be better spent using more accepted techniques. But, yes, in the end, it is your group that has to answer for what you are doing and how you are doing it. If you can look at your end result and the end results of what's being done in my local cemetery as we speak and cemeteries all over our great state and not be bothered with what you have done, then more power to you. You will probably not want to remain on this mail list for an extended period of time. Kyle D. Conrad > As member of the Madison county cemetery commission I was heavily involved > > in the restoration of the Chapman- Cottrell cemetery. I just got on the > mailing list in response to e-mails forwarded to me from it by others. > The MCCC is a volunteer commission. We work under the authority of, and > are > funded by the County Commissioners office. I have been on the commission > for about 7 years. We try to stay out of politics as much as absolutly > possible because our mission is to identify and restore the cemeteries in > the county > to the best extent possible. In past years we had a budget of $10,000 a > year. This year, because of the financial strains so many counties in > Indiana > are suffering and the economic decline of the County Seat (Anderson) over > the > last couple decades since GM has pulled out the many plants it has here, > our > budget was cut in half. > > Now, for those that already did not know it, you have some back ground. > > > I want to provide some insight into our commissions thinking and experience > > (which BTW has a history of restoring cemeteries in Madison county over > twice > as long as the INPCRP has existed). These are not excuses but explanations > > as to why we restore and remount cemetery head stones the way we do. I do > not > feel we need to appologize for anything and have been disturbed that some > posters on this list think they have "just desserts" to dish out to us. > > > 1. Concrete: > > > We set the tablet style headstone markers in concrete because we have no > control over who is mowing and how the cemeteries are mowed. Every year we > get > calls from the public from various townships expressing concern about the > maintenance of this cemetery or that one. > After the MCCC identifies and restores a cemetery the actual maintenance of > > the cemetery is passed to the county trustee.The trustees are elected and > change frequently in the 14 townships of Madison County. Some trustees take > their > charge of maintaining the cemeteries in the township seriously, others do > not and the only pressure that can be brought on those that do not is purely > > grass roots political pressure from the citizens of the township. > > > Vandalism, trees, livestock, and MOWING are among the primary modes by > which > old headstones in our county cemeteries get damaged. Most of the pioneer > cemeteries in the county don't get mowed but once a month if that often and > thus > the vegetation gets pretty high. No matter how much one tries, no matter > how > careful one is, accidents are going to happen on occasion and we have no > guarantee that those mowing the cemeteries in the fourteen townships in the > > county will always be as careful as we would like. . What other pieces of > machinery other than mowing equipment are operated near the markers in our > inactive > cemeteries on a regular basis? So the use of a concrete foundation with a > curb above grade makes it highly unlikely that the old headstones, made > from > softer more fragile stone will be damaged by mowing and. I have seen > plenty of > these old headstones scared by just the repetitive use of a weed wacker > and > others more severely damaged at ground level by what obviously was the > passage of a mower deck. Thus the decision to use concrete with a curb is a > trade > off of trying to protect the headstones we reset. > I have seen comments about salts attacking the stone in the headstones. I > have seen no such problem here in any of the cemeteries I have visited and > inspected which is the vast majority of those listed on our website). > What I > have seen are a few instances of old headstones snapping off an inch or two > > above concrete but in every case the headstone was mounted in concrete > flush > with the grade where it is susceptible to damage to mower decks. > > We apply RTV silicone or epoxy at the stone-concrete interface in order to > seal it. > > The concrete under grade is installed to be about 30" deep with the lower > half configured in a shape like and inverted pyramid to forestall up-lifting > > from frost. We simply do not have the money to pay for the extra labor and > > material to go deep enough to get below the frostline. Further, as anyone > who > has actually dug in these old cemeteries knows, there is a fair chance of > hitting an actual grave as you approach 4' of depth. It simply is not > possible > to establish the exact location of the rows of head stones in some cases. > > > 2. Epoxy: > > My company sells Polygem Inc. epoxies for industrial uses through out the > US > and Canada and the manufacturer of that brand I sell produces many > varieties > and is one of the nations leading experts on polymer rocks, plants, etc, as > > used in museum displays. His company also has a whole "Mine Products" line > for epoxies and polymers used to secure anchors which keep the roofs of > underground mines from collapsing and a "Construction Products" division > which among > many other products, has one that is specified by the Illinois Hwy. > department for anchoring rebar and steel pins in repairs on that states > concrete > roads. I suspect that Kurt Moranuse, President and Manager of Polygem, > Inc. in > west Chicago, who is a chemical engineer who formulates and manufactures > epoxies, and who is the one who recommended the epoxy we use on our markers > has > forgotten more about their proper use in about any application than anyone > posting on the INPCRP board. And I suspect that I have applied a greater > quantity of various types of epoxies in various industrial applications > than > anyone posting messages at the INPCRP. > > 3. Framing: > > At one time steel was used to splint fragmented headstones in this county. > > Shortly after I joined the commission I looked into finding a way to > improve > on that method because the steel rusts and stains the headstones. Drilling > > and doweling headstones is expensive, requires a higher skill level than > framing, and we have had to work with various contractors to maximize the > work we > get done for our limited dollar. I looked into using everything from PVC to > > stainless steel for the frames and in fact we did use some SS on one > cemetery. But aluminum has turned out to be the best answer for us. We > spray the > portion of the frame that will be mounted in the concrete with zinc > chromate > primer to ward off electrolysis and this is in fact a common method used by > > design engineers in buildings, water treatment plants, etc where > aluminum-concrete interface is required. Anodized aluminum is just too > expensive. PVC not > strong enough. > > 4. General > > We HAVE researched the techniques and not just on the web but in various > books published on the subject. I and one other, at our own expense, > attended a > INPCRP sponsored restoration seminar up in Kokomo a few year back. I > wonder > how many of you numerous critics here have used their own personal assets > to > help build a bridge for heavy equipment just to gain access to a cemetery > that needs restored? How many here have driven and walked to and into > EVERY > single known pioneer cemetery in your county at your own expense in order > to > get GPS coordinates for those cemeteries? How many here have used their own > > time to lay out a grid system on paper then on the ground to plot the > locations > of over 50 head stones. Then carefully removed those headstones using > their > own equipment so a cemetery, having been overrun by livestock for years, > can > be graded and landscaped before the headstones are replaced and remounted? > > How many here have researched and searched for years to try and locate the > grave of every Revolutionary war veteran in their county. How many here > spent > the time and effort to put together and maintain a web-site of the quality > of > the MCCC site? How many here have spent hours probing inch by inch for > headstones. How many here have spent the hours and hours and hours of > research > required to try and locate the graves to best extent possible. Members of > the > MCCC have done these things and many more and meet the last Wednesday of 11 > > months of the year to coordiante our ongoing efforts. We are proud of those > > efforts and our results and that includes our results at the Chapman > Cottrell > cemetery which have come under such heavy criticism in this forum. > > > Now, I am open to constructive suggestions as how we can improve our > restoration procedures within our financial and practical limitations here > in > Madison County. I am not, however open to statements or implications of > that we > "are not dedicated", or deserve some "just desserts", etc because, quite > frankly, to my knowledge, I nor the MCCC answers to the IMPCRP or any of > it's > members. I am here for constructive suggestions, if you have none, then I > will > drop off this list. > > Have at it. > > Rob Hains > >