Not disagreeing, but just thought I would add my personal experience. Several years back a homeless man broke in our Florida vacation house and set up shop, living there for several days. He was later arrested on another crime and tied to my house and convicted of burglary from his fingerprint which was lifted from a Kool-aid package that he had used from my kitchen cabinet. The Kool-aid package was pulled from my garbage and was pretty nasty, I do say. The process that was used is as old as the hills in criminology. They placed the package containing the print in a bell jar and injected the fumes from a substance similar to super-glue which enhances the print off of the package. Just like on TV. Results were, without a doubt, his print. His defense was of course that he might have touched that Kool-aid in the local grocery and then I, by chance, bought it and carried it into my house. The only problem was that the Kool-aid was bought in Indiana, which blew their case right out of the water. My point, which I agree has nothing much to do with cemeteries, is law enforcement can, if they are willing and smart enough (and I stress smart enough), to find the culprit in most any crime. But first, they have to be interested enough to go look and then go to any extreme to find enough evidence to convict them. In this case, I will admit we were lucky to have experienced investigators. But, you wonder how many cases go untouched, because of the old line, "We probably won't find them anyway" or "they won't do anything to them if they catch them." It has become an excepted way of life. My favorite is, "I don't get paid enough for this." ---THEN GET ANOTHER JOB AND LET SOMEBODY ELSE DO IT! Back to cemeteries..... We had a very similar case not long ago in Vincennes City Cemetery where at least 60 + stones were vandalized. In the end, the girl and two male friends responsible were turned in to authorities by her own mother after somebody talked to much around the dinner table. Let's hear it for Mom! Chances are that somebody will let it slip about this incident. Jon Andrews >From: Geography Department <geogdept@iupui.edu> >Reply-To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Fw: {not a subscriber} New Haven IOOF Cemetery >Vandalism >Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 17:21:23 -0500 > >It's possible that the stones would not take a fingerprint. The surface has >to be >fairly smooth with no dust or other smudges on it to get a good print. I >know on TV >and in the movies it seems like they can fingerprint anything (and in some >cases >they MIGHT be able to lift prints from some pretty exotic places) but the >equipment >that would be needed would be fairly expensive and most local police >departments >wouldn't have access to that sort of thing. Even the FBI might not be able >to do. >A week or so ago on The District they talked about lifting a really good >print off >of a ball point pen that had been thrown into the trash and then into a >dumpster >that was full of really yucky garbage. The response to that should be >"Yeah, >right." When my garage was broken into, the police officer that came to >take the >report said that they wouldn't be able to get prints if even a little bit >of dust >was present. >Joyce Haibe > >Brad Renno wrote: > > > I must correct myself, SIXTY Stones not One Hundred Sixty. I misread the > > paper as I choked on my cereal and grabbed the camera and headed to the > > cemetery. I thought my reporting error was trapped as I sent this >message > > from an email account different from the one I subscribed with and was > > informed that it was not posted. I guess it was. I resubmitted under >the > > email I belive I signed up with so there will probably be a duplicate > > message when it arrives, opps. > > > > Either way it must have been quite a project. In discussing the >righting of > > the stones with one of the trustees, who, as it turned out went to >school > > with my uncle Donald Renno (killed in WW2) and had his stone was >upended, > > said the stones in the photographs being righted weigh about 1000 pounds >and > > one stone that was turned weighted over 2000 pounds! He asked the >police if > > they were going to get prints from the stones and they said they would >not. > > > > I am guessing of course, but I would think that it would take at least >two > > people to tip the 1000 pounders and several more to turn the really big >one > > I saw turned. Several rows had five to ten stones turned in a row. >There > > were no vehicle tracks so they were done by hand (or foot). I >volunteered > > to spend the afternoon helping to right the stones but was turned down >as > > they were worried about liability. > > > > Brad Renno > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Debra Dougherty [mailto:djd434@rnetinc.net] > > Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 1:46 PM > > To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com > > Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Fw: {not a subscriber} New Haven IOOF Cemetery > > Vandalism > > > > One hundred sixty stones? > > That's not a prank. That's a crime. > > It is a crime, isn't it? > > > > One hundred sixty stones? > > That was a huge task. > > How long does that take? > > How many breaks did they need? > > Do they work that hard at their day jobs? > > Or in school? > > > > One hundred sixty stones? > > The enormity stuns me. > > How many people does that take? > > No footprints? > > No fingerprints? > > No witnesses? > > No injuries? > > > > One hundred sixty stones? > > I don't understand. > > Where is the guidance? > > The sense of right or wrong? > > Are they troubled? > > Or are they stupid? > > > > Who - EXACTLY - are the criminals? > > What - EXACTLY - is the cost? > > When - EXACTLY - will it end? > > Where - EXACTLY - are the prosecutors? > > > > One of these days, somebody's "little angel" will manage to get >themselves > > seriously hurt or even killed pulling a stunt like this. And I can hear >the > > cries of the parents now..... > > "WHY didn't somebody do something about this???!" > > > > One hundred sixty stones. > > I don't understand. > > > > Debra Dougherty > > Martinsville, IN > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Lois Mauk" <loismauk@insightbb.com> > > To: <INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com> > > Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 11:36 AM > > Subject: [INPCRP] Fw: {not a subscriber} New Haven IOOF Cemetery >Vandalism > > > > > Brad Renno's message (below) did not post to the group because he is >not > > > listed as a subscriber through that address. Brad, if you need help > > > subscribing, just let me know. > > > Lois > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Brad Renno" <brad@renno.org> > > > To: <INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com> > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 19, 2002 10:55 AM > > > Subject: {not a subscriber} New Haven IOOF Cemetery Vandalism > > > > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > > > Saturday night (3/16/2002) the New Haven IOOF Cemetery (Allen >County, > > > > Indiana) was attacked by vandals. Approxamately 160 granite stones > > were > > > > toppled. I visited the cemetery today (Tuesday, March 19, 2002 and > > found > > > > rescue efforts were well underway by the cemetery staff and trustees > > > > (YEAH!). I also found that the stone of two of my uncles was one of > > those > > > > damaged. Fortunatly, the valdals chose only the newer stones and >little > > > > physical damage was done to the stones. Most damage was limited to > > > > scratches and gouges to the stone when it fell onto its base. If >they > > had > > > > done this to the stones from the 1850's it would have been much >worse. > > I > > > > posted photos of the damage at > > > > >www.renno.org/genealogy/Gravestones/Cemeteries/NewHavenIOOF/page_01.htm. > > > If > > > > the link length is too much for your browser to handle or you have >to > > type > > > > it in, there is a link on the home page of www.renno.org. > > > > > > > > Brad Renno > > > > brad@renno.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > > > This list is for discussion of topics related to the Indiana Pioneer > > > Cemeteries Restoration Project only. > > > > > > > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > > Cemetery: (n) A marble orchard not to be taken for granite. > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > > If you know of some good cemetery related links, send them to >LoisMauk@usa.net. > > >==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >Blessed are the Elderly, for they remember what we will never know. > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp.