Jack, This is a cemetery that was given by two separate, adjoining land-owners. So there is an original part given by one pioneer land owner and additions provided in a deed to the cemetery association by a succeeding land-owner. There have been no burials in the original part for many years, perhaps around 1940. I need to check the placement of the tombstones against the records I hold. There have been burials in the first and second additions (all part of the second bequest) very recently. You say no taxes are paid on a cemetery, unless perhaps it is still active. Would that apply to all cemeteries, or cemeteries that are privately owned by a for-profit group or company? The association for this cemetery was never a for-profit group. There are reportedly funds for the cemetery upkeep, so the association, if it were active, could once again maintain the cemetery. Many members of my husband's family are buried in New Albany. Some are buried in the large, newer cemetery at the corner of Old Ford Rd and Charleston Rd. Others are buried further down in town. The cemetery is large and well-maintained (or was when I saw it), and maybe further down on Charleston Rd near town. I haven't visited the site in perhaps five years. Where is the cemetery you mention? And why were the stones removed? Sharon Mills At 07:23 PM 10/29/01 EST, you wrote: >In a message dated 10/29/01 6:38:49 PM US Eastern Standard Time, >mills@reliable-net.net writes: > > >> Can a county government sell for non-payment of taxes, non-taxed >> land? >> >> Sharon Mills >> >> >> > >Sharon, The Answer to your first Question is, NO. as to Your second >Question, If there is an Association Fund, the Trustee is not obligated to >take care of the cemetery. But I believe if the Fund, and the cemetery was >turned over to the Township Trustee, he should accept and permanently take >care of the cemetery. Unless someone wants to maintain it on their own. > Someone else may know more than I do on this. Feel Free to straighten me out. > There can be no non payment of Taxes on Property which was not >Taxed, You can't be charged Taxes for something which was Tax Exempt. No >Taxes are paid on a cemetery, unless maybe it is still Active. (Well I >shouldn't say you can't). There is a cemetery in New Albany, Floyd Co. which >is listed as a cemetery on the Plot Plan. The Stones were moved, but it is >still listed as a cemetery. There are no Taxes Paid on the 52 X 32 foot Lot. >The Residents next door ran a Driveway thru the property and built a Garage >on 18 feet of the property. The Assessor said they can't do anything about >this. > The People adjacent to the Cemetery use the Site, and Pay no Taxes. AND >NO ONE CARES. If it is a cemetery, the DNR is responsible I guess. No one >Else is. Until recently, unless your conscience bothered you, you could do >what ever you wanted to do with a Pioneer Cemetery (or Any cemetery in >existence prior to February 1939 Without Funds) The Laws have improved, but >enforcement is Lagging. I have the Subdivision Plat for the cemetery in New >Albany, and it clearly states "Cemetery" But Joe 6 Pack next door doesn't >care. He uses it Tax Free. And until March of this year, I was the only >person in the County who knew it. I wasted my time looking up the Plat, I >honestly thought I could do something. So much for that. > >Jack E. Briles Sr. > > >==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >Cemetery: (n) A marble orchard not to be taken for granite. > > >

In a message dated 10/29/01 6:38:49 PM US Eastern Standard Time, mills@reliable-net.net writes: > Can a county government sell for non-payment of taxes, non-taxed > land? > > Sharon Mills > > > Sharon, The Answer to your first Question is, NO. as to Your second Question, If there is an Association Fund, the Trustee is not obligated to take care of the cemetery. But I believe if the Fund, and the cemetery was turned over to the Township Trustee, he should accept and permanently take care of the cemetery. Unless someone wants to maintain it on their own. Someone else may know more than I do on this. Feel Free to straighten me out. There can be no non payment of Taxes on Property which was not Taxed, You can't be charged Taxes for something which was Tax Exempt. No Taxes are paid on a cemetery, unless maybe it is still Active. (Well I shouldn't say you can't). There is a cemetery in New Albany, Floyd Co. which is listed as a cemetery on the Plot Plan. The Stones were moved, but it is still listed as a cemetery. There are no Taxes Paid on the 52 X 32 foot Lot. The Residents next door ran a Driveway thru the property and built a Garage on 18 feet of the property. The Assessor said they can't do anything about this. The People adjacent to the Cemetery use the Site, and Pay no Taxes. AND NO ONE CARES. If it is a cemetery, the DNR is responsible I guess. No one Else is. Until recently, unless your conscience bothered you, you could do what ever you wanted to do with a Pioneer Cemetery (or Any cemetery in existence prior to February 1939 Without Funds) The Laws have improved, but enforcement is Lagging. I have the Subdivision Plat for the cemetery in New Albany, and it clearly states "Cemetery" But Joe 6 Pack next door doesn't care. He uses it Tax Free. And until March of this year, I was the only person in the County who knew it. I wasted my time looking up the Plat, I honestly thought I could do something. So much for that. Jack E. Briles Sr.

I understand that the law we are discussing about disturbing the ground within 100 feet of a cemetery came into effect July 1, 2000. Prior to that time, was there any prohibition that prevented a person from building within, say, 20 feet of a cemetery? I'm interested in knowing if a county could legally sell a cemetery on which no taxes had been paid since the former owners had bequeathed the land to a cemetery association. The cemetery association had become inactive, in that no meetings have been held in many years; however funds have been paid continually from the cemetery association account for mowing. Can a county government sell for non-payment of taxes, non-taxed land? Sharon Mills

Susan: Just remember this. That, if it is the trustee's responsibility to maintain a fence, he does have the power to request it from his Cemetery Budget. Most trustees, at least in this area have budgets approved by the State Board of Accounts for the amount that they request. Very rarely, are they turned down or questioned for that matter. If they tell you there is a shortage of funds it means they really don't care and don't want to do it. There is "fat" in those budgets and they also have the authority to use township funds to supplement their cemetery budget. So, if not this year, next you should have a fence, if indeed, this cemetery falls under his jurisdiction. I do not want to disagree with Lois, but I have never received anything out of a trustee by asking. I know a lot of people on this list think a good relationship with them will get you the sky, but with everyone in this county we had to get their attention first. Good luck, Jon >From: Susan Barrett <sbarrett@indy.net> >Reply-To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [INPCRP] Morgan Cemetery >Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2001 22:31:08 -0500 > >Thank you Lois for your very wise letter. I will follow your advice very >carefully. I do not want to rile anyone such as the trustee but am truly >interested in working for the betterment of all including the property >owners who have been kindness itself. I understand the trustee's position >and I know that finances for these kinds of projects are very limited. My >husband and I do not have the funds to put up a fence around the cemetery >but would be willing to build one if supplies can be gotten. We are retired >so have more time than others. I do appreciate you writing so much and can >tell that this is a project of love that you have embarked on. I do hope to >meet you someday soon as I am very interested in Morgan Co. due to the fact >that my GGGgrandfather, William Morgan, was one of the early settlers. He >lived there for 50 years, and left a legacy for us. I feel it is up to us >to preserve that history.Thank you for responding. Susan >Susan Morgan Barrett > > >==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >Quote from William Gladstone (1809-1897), three-time Prime Minister of >England >and Victorian contemporary of Benjamin Disraeli: > "Show me the manner in which a nation or community > cares for its dead and I will measure with mathematical > exactness the tender mercies of its people, their > respect for the laws of the land, and their loyalty > to high ideals." > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

Thank you Lois for your very wise letter. I will follow your advice very carefully. I do not want to rile anyone such as the trustee but am truly interested in working for the betterment of all including the property owners who have been kindness itself. I understand the trustee's position and I know that finances for these kinds of projects are very limited. My husband and I do not have the funds to put up a fence around the cemetery but would be willing to build one if supplies can be gotten. We are retired so have more time than others. I do appreciate you writing so much and can tell that this is a project of love that you have embarked on. I do hope to meet you someday soon as I am very interested in Morgan Co. due to the fact that my GGGgrandfather, William Morgan, was one of the early settlers. He lived there for 50 years, and left a legacy for us. I feel it is up to us to preserve that history.Thank you for responding. Susan Susan Morgan Barrett

Ernie, Jack or whoever on the list, O.K., I've read the statute I.C. 14-21-1-26.5 of which I was well familiar with already. Now, what part of that statute says that I cannot dig my pond, ditch, mound, tree removal, water well, field tile, etc. etc. next to the fence? Shoot, the mere setting of a fence or sign post might constitute digging or disturbance of the ground. And what if my pond is already there and I just want to make it bigger or deeper?What is the state's definition of a structure in this case? What if it's not new and who decides this? To me, there is way too much gray area for a person to walk thru. This is the case with about every DNR statute I have seen, maybe every statute written and this is what creates these problems. Of course, this is also what keeps attorneys in business, but at whose expense. Is it just me, or does this law not pertain to what people assume that it pertains to. I've read it and read it, over and over, and I just don't see what keeps a person from disturbing the soil within 100 feet of a cemetery unless they are building a "STRUCTURE". Somebody explain it to me, please. Jon P.S. Also, take time to read I.C. 14-21-3-1 (a) about recording. If that is not redundant, I don't know what is. >From: Ernie & Connie <elasley@sigecom.net> >Reply-To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Indiana Cemetery Law or not >Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 16:49:39 -0500 > >Jon, > >Go to the INPCRP webpage and scroll down to the section "Indiana Cemetery >Laws", and click on the link: > >14-21-1-26.5 (Disturbance of soil within 100 of known cemetery or burial >ground) > >This is in PDF format. This is the law you are asking about. > >Ernie > >At 04:14 PM 10/27/01, you wrote: >>Jack: >>You are correct! Our Area Plan Commission Director did not even know about >>the 100 foot buffer zone until recently when we made them aware of it. >>There answer to letting it slide was, "well, we wouldn't know if the land >>had a cemetery on it or not, anyway, unless they told us." And, of course, >>we know they are going to run right in and exclaim, WE HAVE A CEMETERY! >>Nor, did the recorder or auditor know anything about placing it on a deed. >>She says, "what do we do, ask everybody that comes in." No lady, just >>collect your paycheck and don't worry about it! They just made the law for >>other counties. >>But, anyway Jack, what statute are you all referring to when you mention >>the 100 ft. zone? Because, I have a question for you. >>Jon >> >> >>>From: Jb502000@aol.com >>>Reply-To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >>>To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >>>Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Indiana Cemetery Law or not >>>Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 09:40:04 EDT >>> >>>In a message dated 10/26/01 11:57:21 PM US Eastern Standard Time, >>>loismauk@home.com writes: >>> >>> >>> > If this developer did, in fact, not "disturb the soil" and instead >>>"built >>> > up" the soil as he claims, does the prohibition against disturbing the >>>soil >>> > within 100 feet of the cemetery now extend to the NEW SOIL he put >>>there? If >>> > so, wouldn't the leveling he did of the new soil dumped next to the >>>fence >>> > constitute "disturbing the soil"????? >>> > >>> > Lois, >>> > The original intent as we discussed it at the Falls, was the vibration >>>of >>> > heavy equipment close to the cemetery could cause damage to the stones >>>by >>> > vibration alone. Otherwise why would you be required to stay back 100 >>>feet. >>> > And the law does not specify weather a piece of heavy equipment, or a >>>hand >>> > shovel may not be used within that distance without a supposed >>> > Environmental Impact statement be filed. It would help get the point >>>across >>> > if someone knew if this Law is being enforced literally, or in theory >>>only. >>> > In other words, how do we know our reports are doing any good. A brief >>> > message about some action taken occasionally would help keep our >>>spirits >>> > up. it would encourage us to be vigilant, instead of thinking "Why >>>Bother" >>> > As far as the Law, it is quite plain. The Developers, and Individuals >>>are >>> > not getting the message, and quite frankly I don't know that they ever >>>will >>> > unless it starts with a simple question at the Zoning Board Hearing, " >>>Is >>> > there a Graveyard on this Property " How else will EVERYONE become >>>aware of >>> > the Law. >>> >>> >>>Jack E. Briles >>> >>> >>> >>>==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >>>Cemetery: (n) A marble orchard not to be taken for granite. >> >> >>_________________________________________________________________ >>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp >> >> >>==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >>Please do not send queries through this list. >> > > >==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >Quote from William Gladstone (1809-1897), three-time Prime Minister of >England >and Victorian contemporary of Benjamin Disraeli: > "Show me the manner in which a nation or community > cares for its dead and I will measure with mathematical > exactness the tender mercies of its people, their > respect for the laws of the land, and their loyalty > to high ideals." > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

Dear Susan: Thanks for the encouraging words. You'll find the folks here on the INPCRP are a wonderful group of human beings; they'll be happy to help with any kind of advice or suggestions they can offer. I hope you'll keep us posted as your investigation progresses. Lois

Dear Susan: There are a couple of great resources available on the INPCRP main webpage to help you in your quest. Go to http://www.rootsweb.com/~inpcrp The first I would suggest to you would be Marlene Mattox's wonderful article on researching cemetery deed records. You are apparently way ahead of the game on this already, but I recommend reading this anyway. You need to first be armed with the full recorded history of the cemetery (copy of the deed, etc.) By the way, the deed to the cemetery property, upon examination, may reveal an easement for ingress and egress. Alternatively, it may be mentioned on current or past deeds to the surrounding property. This is the right to enter and exit across another's land. That might be very important in this project. Then you need to confirm through the County Auditor's Office that real property taxes are NOT paid on the cemetery itself. I suggest you get written confirmation of this from the County. Assuming taxes are NOT paid on the cemetery property and armed with the above information, photographs of the site (if possible), a map of the area (see www.topozone.com) and a well-read copy of Indiana Code 23-14-68 (CARE OF CEMETERIES BY TOWNSHIPS) [see http://www.ai.org/legislative/ic/code/title23/ar14/ch68.html ], I then suggest that you approach your Township Trustee [see http://www.IN.gov/sboa/publications/roster/ for a current Roster of Indiana State and Local Officals if you don't know who is the Trustee] in a courteous, cooperative spirit to find out how you and the Trustee can work together to protect and maintain this site. To answer the question about the responsibilities of the owner of the surrounding property, they are few to none. He/she/it has no obligation to build a fence, though the Township Trustee does have a duty to do so. There is a prohibition against "disturbing the soil" within 100 feet of a known cemetery, but there is no duty for the owner of the surrounding property to care for or maintain the cemetery, even if the cemetery were not deeded out and remained a part of the surrounding property. For more information, see IC 14-21-1-26.5 at http://www.ai.org/legislative/ic/code/title14/ar21/ch1.html#IC14-21-1-26.5 If the cemetery is deeded out as I believe this one is, then the property owner can't take advantage of the new special classification of cemeteries on private property to receive a token assessment for tax purposes. For more information, see IC 6-1.1-6.8 (ASSESSMENT OF CEMETERY LAND) at http://www.ai.org/legislative/ic/code/title6/ar1.1/ch6.8.html There is also no other "duty" for a surrounding property owner to permit or allow ingress and egress to a cemetery that is "deeded out" from the rest of the parcel, unless entry could be made without trespassing on the property owner's surrounding land. (For instance, if the cemetery is bounded by a public road, the owner of the surrounding property could not legally restrict your access to the "deeded out" cemetery.) That is apparently not the case. Again, I suggest you obtain a copy of the deed to the cemetery itself AND a copy of the deeds going back 100 years or so for the surrounding property. You may find that ingress and egress is set out in the very old deed documents. Then you will have a much stronger leg to stand on! You didn't indicate what the new owners of the surrounding property intend to do with the property. Do you believe that they intend to develop it or will it continue to be use for residential/agricultural/commercial purposes? If development is planned for the future, your interests would be well-served to find out when any County Plan Commission hearings will be held to discuss those plans. Finally, assuming I understand the circumstances correctly, you've got an "excepted" or "deeded" cemetery on which taxes are NOT paid. I suspect your very best bet will be to work in cooperation with the Township Trustee to gain access to the site to do maintenance pursuant to IC 23-14-68. I beg you to not approach the Township Trustee in a threatening or aggressive manner. There are all manner of reasons why he/she or his/her predecessors in office did not maintain the site in the past. What's more important here is the FUTURE and how interested parties such as yourself can participate in IMPROVING the situation. You might also want to type up a very SIMPLE petition to give to the Township Trustee at your first meeting and collect signatures of family members (especially those who live in the area. . . potential voters!) who want to see the cemetery restored. Don't forget to mention to the Township Trustee that he/she has access to FREE LABOR in the form of inmate work crews and Community Service workers who can assist with any heavy clean-up efforts. Hope this was of some help. Lois ----- Original Message ----- From: "Susan Barrett" <sbarrett@indy.net> To: <INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2001 9:30 PM Subject: [INPCRP] Cemetery Preservation > I am new at the quest for safe cemeteries. The land, my family's cemetery is on, is being sold.The cemetery was deeded to the cemetery's successors and if found recorded in the deeds office and in the grantor books. My family does not own the land the cemetery is on. What rights as a descendant do I have to protect that cemetery and what are the responsibilities of the owner to the cemetery. I have contacted the realtor but I do not know the legalities and she said she did not know anything about cemetery law. I need to know if the new owner should fence in the cemetery, is that my responsibility, and since there is no egress-ingress to this cemetery, does the owner have to provide me with one if I want to go in and clean it up as the old owner was very pleasant about allowing to happen. Thank you for all your expertise. Susan >

Holly Jenks has put some photos up on the web of damage at Oak Grove Cemetery in LaPorte County as a result of the tornado that swept through there earlier this week. Go to: http://www.cartogra.com/rs/B54E3242-CB2B-11D5-B429-0090277A760E (if this URL splits onto more than one line, you'll have the paste the rest of it in to your browser). The following message is from Holly: The story of the flag pole....the flag is tattered and the pole bent in half but it stands proudly in the cemetery. About 60 persons with chainsaws, payloaders and trucks came to the rescue. Now we need to add Tornados to the list of causes for cemetery destruction. Other cemeteries had their trees destroyed too. One lady died and her prefab home of only 4 mo was destroyed. Her house just flew away with her in it and she and the house landed in a farm field across from this cemetery. We are so lucky that nobody else was hurt. At least a 5 mile radius of the cemetery had trees destroyed. The road was closed but sightseers went by anyway. One group of ladies said they would stop but they needed gloves. But there were gloves, they parked their car and dragged brush to the road. Met so many nice people. HOLLY Jenks Laporte County

In a message dated 10/27/01 9:16:34 PM US Eastern Standard Time, sbarrett@indy.net writes: > I need to know if the new owner should fence in the cemetery, is that my > responsibility, and since there is no egress-ingress to this cemetery, does > the owner have to provide me with one if I want to go in and clean it up I'll give someone else a chance to answer. Jack E. Briles Sr. Floyd County PCRP Coordinator Po Box 444 New Albany, In. 47151-0444 (812) 282-6585 Fax (812) 282-6585

I am new at the quest for safe cemeteries. The land, my family's cemetery is on, is being sold.The cemetery was deeded to the cemetery's successors and if found recorded in the deeds office and in the grantor books. My family does not own the land the cemetery is on. What rights as a descendant do I have to protect that cemetery and what are the responsibilities of the owner to the cemetery. I have contacted the realtor but I do not know the legalities and she said she did not know anything about cemetery law. I need to know if the new owner should fence in the cemetery, is that my responsibility, and since there is no egress-ingress to this cemetery, does the owner have to provide me with one if I want to go in and clean it up as the old owner was very pleasant about allowing to happen. Thank you for all your expertise. Susan

In a message dated 10/27/01 6:15:48 PM US Eastern Standard Time, KidClerk@aol.com writes: > . Let's all pray for these kids, because if I find > them before the law does, they'll get a first hand view of the inside of > one > of those crypts, and it may not be an empty one this time... > > Kyle D. Conrad AMEN to that.!!!!!!!! > > Jack E. Briles Sr.

Hi list: Things got off to a bad start this weekend...as I was taking a digital photo of a grave stone at Riverside Cemetery to e-mail to a researcher in Texas, I discovered a hole in the stained glass window in our mausoleum. Upon further investigation, the windows in both ends had holes in them, a marble crypt slab had been damaged (empty crypt, thank God) and a couple of old tombstones in the cemetery were broken. You won't see this in the paper, but I wanted to post it to the list. We've had a rash of barn fires in the last couple of weeks near town, and I guess they've moved on to bigger things. We suspect kids since the barns that were burned and the cemetery are all within bike riding distance from town. Let's all pray for these kids, because if I find them before the law does, they'll get a first hand view of the inside of one of those crypts, and it may not be an empty one this time... Kyle D. Conrad

Jack: You are correct! Our Area Plan Commission Director did not even know about the 100 foot buffer zone until recently when we made them aware of it. There answer to letting it slide was, "well, we wouldn't know if the land had a cemetery on it or not, anyway, unless they told us." And, of course, we know they are going to run right in and exclaim, WE HAVE A CEMETERY! Nor, did the recorder or auditor know anything about placing it on a deed. She says, "what do we do, ask everybody that comes in." No lady, just collect your paycheck and don't worry about it! They just made the law for other counties. But, anyway Jack, what statute are you all referring to when you mention the 100 ft. zone? Because, I have a question for you. Jon >From: Jb502000@aol.com >Reply-To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Indiana Cemetery Law or not >Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 09:40:04 EDT > >In a message dated 10/26/01 11:57:21 PM US Eastern Standard Time, >loismauk@home.com writes: > > > > If this developer did, in fact, not "disturb the soil" and instead >"built > > up" the soil as he claims, does the prohibition against disturbing the >soil > > within 100 feet of the cemetery now extend to the NEW SOIL he put there? > If > > so, wouldn't the leveling he did of the new soil dumped next to the >fence > > constitute "disturbing the soil"????? > > > > Lois, > > The original intent as we discussed it at the Falls, was the vibration >of > > heavy equipment close to the cemetery could cause damage to the stones >by > > vibration alone. Otherwise why would you be required to stay back 100 >feet. > > And the law does not specify weather a piece of heavy equipment, or a >hand > > shovel may not be used within that distance without a supposed > > Environmental Impact statement be filed. It would help get the point >across > > if someone knew if this Law is being enforced literally, or in theory >only. > > In other words, how do we know our reports are doing any good. A brief > > message about some action taken occasionally would help keep our spirits > > up. it would encourage us to be vigilant, instead of thinking "Why >Bother" > > As far as the Law, it is quite plain. The Developers, and Individuals >are > > not getting the message, and quite frankly I don't know that they ever >will > > unless it starts with a simple question at the Zoning Board Hearing, " >Is > > there a Graveyard on this Property " How else will EVERYONE become aware >of > > the Law. > > >Jack E. Briles > > > >==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >Cemetery: (n) A marble orchard not to be taken for granite. > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

Jon, Go to the INPCRP webpage and scroll down to the section "Indiana Cemetery Laws", and click on the link: 14-21-1-26.5 (Disturbance of soil within 100 of known cemetery or burial ground) This is in PDF format. This is the law you are asking about. Ernie At 04:14 PM 10/27/01, you wrote: >Jack: >You are correct! Our Area Plan Commission Director did not even know about >the 100 foot buffer zone until recently when we made them aware of it. >There answer to letting it slide was, "well, we wouldn't know if the land >had a cemetery on it or not, anyway, unless they told us." And, of course, >we know they are going to run right in and exclaim, WE HAVE A CEMETERY! >Nor, did the recorder or auditor know anything about placing it on a deed. >She says, "what do we do, ask everybody that comes in." No lady, just >collect your paycheck and don't worry about it! They just made the law for >other counties. >But, anyway Jack, what statute are you all referring to when you mention >the 100 ft. zone? Because, I have a question for you. >Jon > > >>From: Jb502000@aol.com >>Reply-To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >>To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >>Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Indiana Cemetery Law or not >>Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2001 09:40:04 EDT >> >>In a message dated 10/26/01 11:57:21 PM US Eastern Standard Time, >>loismauk@home.com writes: >> >> >> > If this developer did, in fact, not "disturb the soil" and instead "built >> > up" the soil as he claims, does the prohibition against disturbing the >> soil >> > within 100 feet of the cemetery now extend to the NEW SOIL he put >> there? If >> > so, wouldn't the leveling he did of the new soil dumped next to the fence >> > constitute "disturbing the soil"????? >> > >> > Lois, >> > The original intent as we discussed it at the Falls, was the vibration of >> > heavy equipment close to the cemetery could cause damage to the stones by >> > vibration alone. Otherwise why would you be required to stay back 100 >> feet. >> > And the law does not specify weather a piece of heavy equipment, or a hand >> > shovel may not be used within that distance without a supposed >> > Environmental Impact statement be filed. It would help get the point >> across >> > if someone knew if this Law is being enforced literally, or in theory >> only. >> > In other words, how do we know our reports are doing any good. A brief >> > message about some action taken occasionally would help keep our spirits >> > up. it would encourage us to be vigilant, instead of thinking "Why >> Bother" >> > As far as the Law, it is quite plain. The Developers, and Individuals are >> > not getting the message, and quite frankly I don't know that they ever >> will >> > unless it starts with a simple question at the Zoning Board Hearing, " >>Is >> > there a Graveyard on this Property " How else will EVERYONE become >> aware of >> > the Law. >> >> >>Jack E. Briles >> >> >> >>==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >>Cemetery: (n) A marble orchard not to be taken for granite. > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > >==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >Please do not send queries through this list. >

In a message dated 10/26/01 11:57:21 PM US Eastern Standard Time, loismauk@home.com writes: > If this developer did, in fact, not "disturb the soil" and instead "built > up" the soil as he claims, does the prohibition against disturbing the soil > within 100 feet of the cemetery now extend to the NEW SOIL he put there? If > so, wouldn't the leveling he did of the new soil dumped next to the fence > constitute "disturbing the soil"????? > > Lois, > The original intent as we discussed it at the Falls, was the vibration of > heavy equipment close to the cemetery could cause damage to the stones by > vibration alone. Otherwise why would you be required to stay back 100 feet. > And the law does not specify weather a piece of heavy equipment, or a hand > shovel may not be used within that distance without a supposed > Environmental Impact statement be filed. It would help get the point across > if someone knew if this Law is being enforced literally, or in theory only. > In other words, how do we know our reports are doing any good. A brief > message about some action taken occasionally would help keep our spirits > up. it would encourage us to be vigilant, instead of thinking "Why Bother" > As far as the Law, it is quite plain. The Developers, and Individuals are > not getting the message, and quite frankly I don't know that they ever will > unless it starts with a simple question at the Zoning Board Hearing, " Is > there a Graveyard on this Property " How else will EVERYONE become aware of > the Law. Jack E. Briles

I hope that when Jeannie Regan-Dinius gets back to her office on Monday she will get permission to disclose to us what DNR has done recently. I know there have been several cemetery-related arrests recently, but don't know any details and don't want to speak "out of school". She has mentioned a couple of incidents to me recently, but I can't say any more than that. One of the problems is getting the County Prosecutors to PROSECUTE cemetery-related crimes. As for the situation at McClintick Cemetery, where the developer allegedly did not "disturb the soil" but instead allegedly built up the soil to within INCHES of the cemetery fence and thus is apparently avoiding prosecution, despite the fact that he did not have a permit from DNR, I have a question myself: If this developer did, in fact, not "disturb the soil" and instead "built up" the soil as he claims, does the prohibition against disturbing the soil within 100 feet of the cemetery now extend to the NEW SOIL he put there? If so, wouldn't the leveling he did of the new soil dumped next to the fence constitute "disturbing the soil"????? Lois

Heck, no one would poach a deer anymore. Its too easy to get them legally. There are so many now that no one wants them anymore. So, what do the CO's do? Set and drink coffee, I bet. And, can you imagine a CO catching someone now with raccoon out of season. Who would want them. Maybe we could get the CO's to hunt the overpopulated deer, raccoons, possums, and squirrels. And, now too many coyotes too boot. But, now you can't find a rabbit in the country. My, how things have changed in 20 years. Art D. ----- Original Message ----- From: "jon andrews" <sianoil@hotmail.com> To: <INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2001 5:28 PM Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Indiana Cemetery Law or not > Jack: > So, keep thinking about my question and let me know. This is exactly the > kind of answer that I expected. Nobody really knows for sure just exactly > what you can do and what you can't. There is no clear cut and dry answer to > these problems. I mean, nothing against you, Jack. We know where you stand, > but what about the next guy. > And, heaven forbid we could have a deer poached this season. > Take care, > Jon > > > >From: Jb502000@aol.com > >Reply-To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com > >To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com > >Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Indiana Cemetery Law or not > >Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2001 18:07:01 EDT > > > >In a message dated 10/25/01 11:38:47 PM US Eastern Standard Time, > >sianoil@hotmail.com writes: > > > > > > > Can I, (John Q. Landowner), get my bulldozer this weekend and start > >digging > > > a pond right next to the fence of the cemetery that is located on my > > > property without any kind of permit or approval? Why, why not and where > > > does > > > it say that? > > > > > > Jon Andrews > > > > > > > > Jon, > >I forgot to tell you, I went by McClintock Cemetery Monday evening and the > >ground that had been "just moved up" and leveled (This is not disturbing > >the > >ground) has been cut down 6 inches, just 2 feet from the fence. Knowing the > >developer, doesn't reinforce my belief he has obtained a permit. Anyhow, I > >thought I read somewhere that an Environmental Impact statement concerning > >any work within 100 feet of a cemetery also had to be filed BEFORE work > >BEGINS. But who am I. I've raised H--- since the first of the year on > >violations like this. They are still outstanding. I understand Enforcement > >is > >tough now, Deer season is in, and the DNR is understaffed for everything > >they > >have to cover. Enough said > > > >Jack > > > > > >==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > >THIS IS A CEMETERY ----- > > "Lives are commemorated - deaths are recorded - families > >are reunited - memories are made tangible - and love is > >undisguised. This is a cemetery. > > "Communities accord respect, families bestow reverence, > >historians seek information and our heritage is thereby enriched. > > "Testimonies of devotion, pride and remembrance are carved > >in stone to pay warm tribute to accomplishments and to the life - > >not the death - of a loved one. The cemetery is homeland for family > >memorials that are a sustaining source of comfort to the living. > > "A cemetery is a history of people - a perpetual record of > >yesterday and sanctuary of peace and quiet today. A cemetery > >exists because every life is worth loving and remembering - always." > > --Author unknown -- Seen at a monument dealer in West Union, IA > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > THIS IS A CEMETERY ----- > "Lives are commemorated - deaths are recorded - families > are reunited - memories are made tangible - and love is > undisguised. This is a cemetery. > "Communities accord respect, families bestow reverence, > historians seek information and our heritage is thereby enriched. > "Testimonies of devotion, pride and remembrance are carved > in stone to pay warm tribute to accomplishments and to the life - > not the death - of a loved one. The cemetery is homeland for family > memorials that are a sustaining source of comfort to the living. > "A cemetery is a history of people - a perpetual record of > yesterday and sanctuary of peace and quiet today. A cemetery > exists because every life is worth loving and remembering - always." > --Author unknown -- Seen at a monument dealer in West Union, IA > >

Jack: So, keep thinking about my question and let me know. This is exactly the kind of answer that I expected. Nobody really knows for sure just exactly what you can do and what you can't. There is no clear cut and dry answer to these problems. I mean, nothing against you, Jack. We know where you stand, but what about the next guy. And, heaven forbid we could have a deer poached this season. Take care, Jon >From: Jb502000@aol.com >Reply-To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >To: INPCRP-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Indiana Cemetery Law or not >Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2001 18:07:01 EDT > >In a message dated 10/25/01 11:38:47 PM US Eastern Standard Time, >sianoil@hotmail.com writes: > > > > Can I, (John Q. Landowner), get my bulldozer this weekend and start >digging > > a pond right next to the fence of the cemetery that is located on my > > property without any kind of permit or approval? Why, why not and where > > does > > it say that? > > > > Jon Andrews > > > > > Jon, >I forgot to tell you, I went by McClintock Cemetery Monday evening and the >ground that had been "just moved up" and leveled (This is not disturbing >the >ground) has been cut down 6 inches, just 2 feet from the fence. Knowing the >developer, doesn't reinforce my belief he has obtained a permit. Anyhow, I >thought I read somewhere that an Environmental Impact statement concerning >any work within 100 feet of a cemetery also had to be filed BEFORE work >BEGINS. But who am I. I've raised H--- since the first of the year on >violations like this. They are still outstanding. I understand Enforcement >is >tough now, Deer season is in, and the DNR is understaffed for everything >they >have to cover. Enough said > >Jack > > >==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== >THIS IS A CEMETERY ----- > "Lives are commemorated - deaths are recorded - families >are reunited - memories are made tangible - and love is >undisguised. This is a cemetery. > "Communities accord respect, families bestow reverence, >historians seek information and our heritage is thereby enriched. > "Testimonies of devotion, pride and remembrance are carved >in stone to pay warm tribute to accomplishments and to the life - >not the death - of a loved one. The cemetery is homeland for family >memorials that are a sustaining source of comfort to the living. > "A cemetery is a history of people - a perpetual record of >yesterday and sanctuary of peace and quiet today. A cemetery >exists because every life is worth loving and remembering - always." > --Author unknown -- Seen at a monument dealer in West Union, IA > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

In a message dated 10/25/01 11:38:47 PM US Eastern Standard Time, sianoil@hotmail.com writes: > Can I, (John Q. Landowner), get my bulldozer this weekend and start digging > a pond right next to the fence of the cemetery that is located on my > property without any kind of permit or approval? Why, why not and where > does > it say that? > > Jon Andrews > > Jon, I forgot to tell you, I went by McClintock Cemetery Monday evening and the ground that had been "just moved up" and leveled (This is not disturbing the ground) has been cut down 6 inches, just 2 feet from the fence. Knowing the developer, doesn't reinforce my belief he has obtained a permit. Anyhow, I thought I read somewhere that an Environmental Impact statement concerning any work within 100 feet of a cemetery also had to be filed BEFORE work BEGINS. But who am I. I've raised H--- since the first of the year on violations like this. They are still outstanding. I understand Enforcement is tough now, Deer season is in, and the DNR is understaffed for everything they have to cover. Enough said Jack