Mrs. O'Bannons visit to the Stewart-Greisinger Cemetery in Noble Co., for a segment of "Communities Building Community" will air in August. The episode "Generations Apart, Generations Together" will be shown on Thursday August 26th at 7:30 pm and Saturday August 28th at 3:30 pm. on WFYI Channel 20 (PBS). I'm not sure what channel that is on cable. Outside of the Indianapolis viewing area - check with your local PBS station. Theresa Berghoff --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.

Here is a great place to get the cemetery supplies you need. This is the setting compound for setting monuments. http://www.milessupply.com/cemeterysupplies.htm UEB Henry Co, IN

10-1 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Theresa Berghoff" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 11:26 PM Subject: [INPCRP] test > My e-mail earlier today did not go through. Just checking. > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > To UNSUBSCRIBE, send message consisting only of > "UNSUBSCRIBE" to [email protected] > or to [email protected] (for DIGEST version) > >

My e-mail earlier today did not go through. Just checking. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages!

Pat, that sounds very much as if the supervising probation officer should have seen to it that it was paid before he was eighteen. Surely it was terms of probation and the case should have been reviewed. Indiana doesn't have the statute that limits jurisdiction, he would have found the new adult probation terms must less lenient. I have seen flukes like this here, and the probation officers were to blame, such as paying back $10 a month on a several hundred dollar vandalism, the p.o. having told him to pay at least that amount. Someone needs to be at hearings and such to raise hell about the impact, depending on who has authority and of course if the little demons are caught. Leaning on the prosecutor may make alot of difference. He can demand all sorts of resitution and ultimately out of the parents pocket, in a timely manner. Lee Creed Greencastle

This was not the case of a cemetery, but teenagers vandalizing our Lighthouse Catwalk. They were caught and had to make restitution. It was paid back through the county clerk's office. One continued to pay his share, but the other once he was 18 was no longer under the jurisdiction of the juvenile department and the payments were not forthcoming. It looked like nothing was going to happen, but with the cooperation of the county clerk and her records we directly contacted the vandalizer and the parents with a letter stating they would hear from our attorney if they did not complete the payment of the court ordered restitution. We got all our money. Just some food for thought if and when they catch those who vandalized the cemetery and have a judgment made. Pat ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lee" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 5:50 PM Subject: Re: [INPCRP] RE: [IPCRP] Cemetery in Kosciusko County > > Larry, > > First I would make sure there is an actual written report, if and when > someone is > "caught", it is then up to the prosecutors > discretion on actually what charges will stick. The officer can charge > them however he pleases, but in these cases it always seems they are > charged with the very minor misdemeanor. Also the prosecutor is likely > to let them plead down to attain the conviction, which he may consider > very iffy, should the offender choose to fight it or has a rather slick > attorney. > > The only way you can be sure anything is getting done is to stay on top > of it, make it your business. Plenty of these situations evaporate, and > the stones are all thats left. > > I have seen convictions usually result if the state police are involved, > they often have a strict interpretation of the crime. > > Lee Creed > Greencastle > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > Brad Manzenberger < [email protected] > is the INPCRP State Coordinator. Feel free to contact him directly regarding questions or comments you may have about the INPCRP.

Larry, First I would make sure there is an actual written report, if and when someone is "caught", it is then up to the prosecutors discretion on actually what charges will stick. The officer can charge them however he pleases, but in these cases it always seems they are charged with the very minor misdemeanor. Also the prosecutor is likely to let them plead down to attain the conviction, which he may consider very iffy, should the offender choose to fight it or has a rather slick attorney. The only way you can be sure anything is getting done is to stay on top of it, make it your business. Plenty of these situations evaporate, and the stones are all thats left. I have seen convictions usually result if the state police are involved, they often have a strict interpretation of the crime. Lee Creed Greencastle

the first source i saw said that a class d felony carried up to three years and a 10k fine. This is from only one source and I don't know Indiana law to know how this would apply to juveniles -if that is the case here??? I am mailing a letter tomorrow to Mr. Doyle Munson, the Secretary-Treasurer of Pleasant Grove Cemetery association stating we have no money but we do have a lot of hopeful support and ideas for he and his commission there just east of Warsaw which is south of South Bend and West of Ft Wayne. His address is Mr. Doyle Munson, 2120 E 375 S, Warsaw, IN 46580-8746. His telephone number is 574-267-4154. He doesn't live very far from this very pretty cemetery flanked by corn fields, cows and across the street from an old but active church in a pretty rural rolling hill Indiana setting. It is a pretty place and I believe has a lot of good things already going for it--it is well groomed but does have a good bit of very old markers which with some good education could be restored by more than likely local volunteers and maybe a few traveling INPCRP advisers. Could some of y'all contact him and extend our sympathies and support as well? It would be good to know what they could use from us and it would be good for us i think to see this matter through and for us to follow what turns up on the criminal aspect of this case as well. Larry Leahy Muncie

According to the statues posted on the INPCRP website: IC 35-43-1-2.1 Cemetery mischief Sec. 2.1. (a) This section does not apply to the following: (1) A person who acts in a proper and acceptable manner as authorized by IC 14-21 other than a person who disturbs the earth for an agricultural purpose under the exemption to IC 14-21 that is provided in IC 14-21-1-24. (2) A person who acts in a proper and acceptable manner as authorized by IC 23-14. (b) A person who recklessly, knowingly, or intentionally: (1) damages a cemetery, a burial ground (as defined in IC 14-21-1-3), or a facility used for memorializing the dead; (2) damages the grounds owned or rented by a cemetery or facility used for memorializing the dead; or (3) disturbs, defaces, or damages a cemetery monument, grave marker, grave artifact, grave ornamentation, or cemetery enclosure; commits cemetery mischief, a Class A misdemeanor. However, the offense is a Class D felony if the pecuniary loss is at least two thousand five hundred dollars ($2,500). As added by P.L.100-1999, SEC.3. Amended by P.L.177-2001, SEC.4. Guess it would depend on what the punishment is for a Class D felony. Rhonda Stoffer Head of Indiana History and Genealogy Services Marion Public Library -----Original Message----- From: Sue Silver [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 12:24 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [INPCRP] photo of Pleasant Grove near Warsaw in Kosciusko County Doesn't the value of the individual monuments elevate a crime like this from misdemeanor to felony? At what dollar amount of damage might this kick into being a felony? In California, it's something like $2500 or $3500 dollars. In addition to cemetery vandalism, this should also be pursued as a crime against PROPERTY with the value of the damaged property determining if it is charged as a misdemeanor or a felony. The combined total value (in today's dollars to repair/replace) of the damaged items PLUS the cost to reset, should take it to a felony category. Or am I wrongheaded? Sue Silver California ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 10:00 AM Subject: [INPCRP] photo of Pleasant Grove near Warsaw in Kosciusko County > > http://www.fortwayne.com/mld/journalgazette/news/local/9234864.htm > > In the article, the cemetery trustee is asking for help--he says he doesn't > know where to turn and is also frustrated with it being just a misdemeanor > if someone is caught. Can someone with more experience than me make contact > with him--he seems to be at a loss, and rightly so. > > Gene Andert -the gen web coordinator for Kosciusko County provided us with > this article. I have sent him an e-mail expressing gratitude > > Larry Leahy > Muncie -Delaware County > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > Blessed are the Elderly, for they remember what we will never know. > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== This list is for discussion of topics related to the Indiana Pioneer Cemeteries Restoration Project only. Please do not send genealogical queries through this list. The surname and geographic Mailing Lists on Rootsweb at http://lists.rootsweb.com are a better venue. Thank you.

I think it is a felony if the damage is $2500 or more. Brad Manzenberger -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 12:01 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [INPCRP] photo of Pleasant Grove near Warsaw in Kosciusko County http://www.fortwayne.com/mld/journalgazette/news/local/9234864.htm In the article, the cemetery trustee is asking for help--he says he doesn't know where to turn and is also frustrated with it being just a misdemeanor if someone is caught. Can someone with more experience than me make contact with him--he seems to be at a loss, and rightly so. Gene Andert -the gen web coordinator for Kosciusko County provided us with this article. I have sent him an e-mail expressing gratitude Larry Leahy Muncie -Delaware County ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== Blessed are the Elderly, for they remember what we will never know.

Brad, I want to change my email address to [email protected] on the mailing list. How can I do this? - Mary Volmer -----Original Message----- From: Brad Manzenberger [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2004 7:52 AM To: [email protected] Subject: [INPCRP] Greenlawn Cemetery The Johnson County Daily Journal has a section on the editorial page called Hearts and Darts. Hearts are for people to thank someone... Two hearts appeared in today's paper... - Heartfelt thanks to Brad Manzenberger of Johnson County Indiana Pioneer Cemeteries Restoration Project, John "Walt" Walters of Graveyard Groomers from Connersville and the many volunteers who helped restore monuments and stones in Greenlawn Cemetery on July 10. After vandals disheartened many of us by their actions, you have restored our faith in community. The work you did was outstanding. Thank you again for all your help. signed: Franklin park board, cemetery staff and park staff - Hearts to all the volunteers who helped repair vandalized gravestones in Greenlawn Cemetery in Franklin. Special hearts to Brad and Angela Manzenberger for coordinating the effort. As historian of Grace United Methodist Church in Franklin, I know how meaningful the stones are to people in the community, even those stones without local families. Rich Gotshall Franklin (Rich Gotshall is also a reporter for the Indianapolis Star.) Brad ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== Brad Manzenberger < [email protected] > is the INPCRP State Coordinator. Feel free to contact him directly regarding questions or comments you may have about the INPCRP.

Thanks for the update Larry. Rhonda Stoffer Head of Indiana History and Genealogy Services Marion Public Library -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 12:01 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [INPCRP] photo of Pleasant Grove near Warsaw in Kosciusko County http://www.fortwayne.com/mld/journalgazette/news/local/9234864.htm In the article, the cemetery trustee is asking for help--he says he doesn't know where to turn and is also frustrated with it being just a misdemeanor if someone is caught. Can someone with more experience than me make contact with him--he seems to be at a loss, and rightly so. Gene Andert -the gen web coordinator for Kosciusko County provided us with this article. I have sent him an e-mail expressing gratitude Larry Leahy Muncie -Delaware County ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== Blessed are the Elderly, for they remember what we will never know.

http://www.fortwayne.com/mld/journalgazette/news/local/9234864.htm In the article, the cemetery trustee is asking for help--he says he doesn't know where to turn and is also frustrated with it being just a misdemeanor if someone is caught. Can someone with more experience than me make contact with him--he seems to be at a loss, and rightly so. Gene Andert -the gen web coordinator for Kosciusko County provided us with this article. I have sent him an e-mail expressing gratitude Larry Leahy Muncie -Delaware County

I woke up thinking about Pleasant Grove cemetery in Kosciusko County. I am very new to IPCRP and want to ask some questions up there but don't want to "go over" anyone. My main goal at this time is to gather info and provide it to our list. I e-mailed the Warsaw Times-Union newspaper and asked for a copy of what they had written about it. I also asked the genweb coordinator of the county about any info they had. I am curious to find out what happened and where they are in the investigation -I have some ideas about who to write for more info, but it is a big fear of mine that I will offend someone especially since I am way down here in Muncie. Any insights? Am I doing good work? Larry Leahy Muncie

Larry, What you are doing is fine. You are a concerned citizen, and part of the INPCRP. The first thing to do is find out who owns the Pleasant Grove Cemetery. My guess is the Pleasant Grove United Methodist Church. Contact them, and find out where the Sheriffs Dept. investigation stands. If they are not the landowner, see if there is a cemetery association, or whether the cemetery has been turned over to the Township Trustee. No clean up work can be done until documentation of damage has been completed for the investigation, and for any insurance claims, and of course, only with permission of the landowner. It's wonderful that you were concerned enough to drive to Warsaw to check this out. Hopefully,some local people will also be so outraged that they are moved to take some action in terms of prosecution of the vandals, restoration, and involvement in the INPCRP. Theresa Berghoff [email protected] wrote: I woke up thinking about Pleasant Grove cemetery in Kosciusko County. I am very new to IPCRP and want to ask some questions up there but don't want to "go over" anyone. My main goal at this time is to gather info and provide it to our list. I e-mailed the Warsaw Times-Union newspaper and asked for a copy of what they had written about it. I also asked the genweb coordinator of the county about any info they had. I am curious to find out what happened and where they are in the investigation -I have some ideas about who to write for more info, but it is a big fear of mine that I will offend someone especially since I am way down here in Muncie. Any insights? Am I doing good work? Larry Leahy Muncie ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== INPCRP State Coordinator: Brad Manzenberger < [email protected] > --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.

Doesn't the value of the individual monuments elevate a crime like this from misdemeanor to felony? At what dollar amount of damage might this kick into being a felony? In California, it's something like $2500 or $3500 dollars. In addition to cemetery vandalism, this should also be pursued as a crime against PROPERTY with the value of the damaged property determining if it is charged as a misdemeanor or a felony. The combined total value (in today's dollars to repair/replace) of the damaged items PLUS the cost to reset, should take it to a felony category. Or am I wrongheaded? Sue Silver California ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, July 28, 2004 10:00 AM Subject: [INPCRP] photo of Pleasant Grove near Warsaw in Kosciusko County > > http://www.fortwayne.com/mld/journalgazette/news/local/9234864.htm > > In the article, the cemetery trustee is asking for help--he says he doesn't > know where to turn and is also frustrated with it being just a misdemeanor > if someone is caught. Can someone with more experience than me make contact > with him--he seems to be at a loss, and rightly so. > > Gene Andert -the gen web coordinator for Kosciusko County provided us with > this article. I have sent him an e-mail expressing gratitude > > Larry Leahy > Muncie -Delaware County > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > Blessed are the Elderly, for they remember what we will never know. > >

My wife Amy & I drove from Delaware to Kosciusko County to the Pleasant Grove Cemetery on Tuesday (7-27) The initial reports are accurate -thereabouts 60 stones are involved. Over 75 % are pushovers of very large family markers, but what broke my heart were the most earliest markers which were basically just ripped in two. There are a good bit of those - -One of a civil war sgt really struck home with me. There are a lot of heavy monuments that will need mechanized lifting skill and then are those that even the most skilled among us will more than likely in my opinion look and say "I can't do much about this one" We took some pics--they will be back next week. The cemetery is on a nice grassy knoll in the country outside of Warsaw across from Pleasant Grove UMC and is well maintained, mowed, attended, etc.. It is active it seems and has a more recent (active) area that didn't appear to be disturbed. It is a pretty place. It was a relief to me to see the majority of the damage were of the push over variety, however the damage to smaller older stones that look devastating really got to me. Even though this cemetery looked wonderful a month ago--there were signs of advancing age on those of its earlier population -maybe this incident can help not just the stones that got damaged get repaired , but actually afford some of our group to give consultation/help regarding the preservation of the cemetery as a whole (especially the older part). This was the first visit either of us had made to a cemetery which had been vandalized. We weren't afforded the opportunity to speak with anyone about the cemetery, but both agree with the reports that it had been vandalized. There were no tire tracks evident and it seems that a lot were pushed over in the same direction. Larry & Amy Leahy Muncie

Has anyone heard about vandalism in a cemetery in Kosciusko County? I heard it mentioned Monday morning on a Ft. Wayne radio station, this is what was on their web page: VANDALS DO A GREAT DEAL OF DAMAGE TO A SMALL CEMETARY IN KOSCIUSKO COUNTY. SCORES OF HEAD STONES WERE SMASHED OR DESTROYED AT THE PLEASANT GROVE CEMETARY LATE LAST WEEK. IN ALL MORE THAN 60 STONES DAMAGED...SOME WITH CHUNKS OF STONE MISSING .. OTHERS SMASHED IN HALF. AUTHORITIES SAY THEY DON'T KNOW WHO IS RESPONSIBLE. I checked the Warsaw newspaper web site, I didn't find any stories about Pleasant Grove. Anyone in the area? Rhonda Stoffer Head of Indiana History and Genealogy Services Marion Public Library

It took several years, I used to live there and still get the local Albion weekly paper. She went to the commissioner's many times trying to work out access. The cemetery is in the wooded area of a large field, there was no access when crops were planted, and it was on private property. I think there was a time period when the farmer wouldn't allow access, he may have just become upset with a few people, I'm not sure. The area of the cemetery was given to the township I believe, with the condition that the county pay for the surveys necessary, which they did. There is an access lane now so you can drive to the woods where the cemetery is. Hopefully I'm remembering this correctly! Mark and Helen can add what I forgot. Rhonda Stoffer Head of Indiana History and Genealogy Services Marion Public Library -----Original Message----- From: tielking [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 9:38 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Mrs. O'Bannon visits cemetery Wow! What a great article. I am particularly interested in how Martha Barnhart "spearheaded a project that has restored legal public access to the site". Mark or Helen do you know? Angela Tielking ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Silver" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:48 AM Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Mrs. O'Bannon visits cemetery > This could be a springboard for your lobbying campaign for the next > legislative session. Perhaps Mrs. O'Bannon could be persuaded to serve as > an honorary spokesperson for INPCRP volunteers. > > You might also wish to consider getting permission to video tape this > episode, make copies and send them to all the legislators.... > > Sue Silver > CA > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Rhonda Stoffer" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 9:21 AM > Subject: [INPCRP] Mrs. O'Bannon visits cemetery > > > > > <http://kpcnews.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=72737&SectionID=15&SubSectio > > nID=&S=1> > > Former first lady Mrs. O'Bannon spent time last Thursday at the > > Stewart-Greisinger Cemetery in Noble County which was restored last year > by > > Mark and Helen during a cemetery workshop. A good article in the local > > paper about her visit and the plight of old cemeteries. Don't know when > this > > show will air, but might be a good tie in to the positive publicity that's > > been talked about. > > > > > > > > Rhonda Stoffer > > Head of Indiana History and Genealogy Services > > Marion Public Library > > > > > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > > Blessed are the Elderly, for they remember what we will never know. > > > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > INPCRP State Coordinator: Brad Manzenberger < [email protected] > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== THIS IS A CEMETERY ----- "Lives are commemorated - deaths are recorded - families are reunited - memories are made tangible - and love is undisguised. This is a cemetery. "Communities accord respect, families bestow reverence, historians seek information and our heritage is thereby enriched. "Testimonies of devotion, pride and remembrance are carved in stone to pay warm tribute to accomplishments and to the life - not the death - of a loved one. The cemetery is homeland for family memorials that are a sustaining source of comfort to the living. "A cemetery is a history of people - a perpetual record of yesterday and sanctuary of peace and quiet today. A cemetery exists because every life is worth loving and remembering - always." --Author unknown -- Seen at a monument dealer in West Union, IA

Wow! What a great article. I am particularly interested in how Martha Barnhart "spearheaded a project that has restored legal public access to the site". Mark or Helen do you know? Angela Tielking ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sue Silver" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 11:48 AM Subject: Re: [INPCRP] Mrs. O'Bannon visits cemetery > This could be a springboard for your lobbying campaign for the next > legislative session. Perhaps Mrs. O'Bannon could be persuaded to serve as > an honorary spokesperson for INPCRP volunteers. > > You might also wish to consider getting permission to video tape this > episode, make copies and send them to all the legislators.... > > Sue Silver > CA > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Rhonda Stoffer" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 9:21 AM > Subject: [INPCRP] Mrs. O'Bannon visits cemetery > > > > > <http://kpcnews.com/main.asp?Search=1&ArticleID=72737&SectionID=15&SubSectio > > nID=&S=1> > > Former first lady Mrs. O'Bannon spent time last Thursday at the > > Stewart-Greisinger Cemetery in Noble County which was restored last year > by > > Mark and Helen during a cemetery workshop. A good article in the local > > paper about her visit and the plight of old cemeteries. Don't know when > this > > show will air, but might be a good tie in to the positive publicity that's > > been talked about. > > > > > > > > Rhonda Stoffer > > Head of Indiana History and Genealogy Services > > Marion Public Library > > > > > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > > Blessed are the Elderly, for they remember what we will never know. > > > > > > ==== INPCRP Mailing List ==== > INPCRP State Coordinator: Brad Manzenberger < [email protected] > >