The Old Settlers are the people who were in Arkansas in 1817. As far as Sequoyah=-he is my cousin and he made many trips back and forth. I know there were people here. There were Cherokees called Pin and one morning when my relative went out on the porch to wash his face they came riding out and killed him. Only thing that saved his son was because he got under his mother's skirt. I am a Cherokee-was reared as a Cherokee have traveled , Lowrey family and my people are rather well known. If you read Old Frontier you will find my relatives on almost every page. I also volunteered At OHS "Indian" Archives for five years. When the Trail of Tears came thru Arkansas the Cherokees there could rejoin the Tribe and come on into Indian Territory if they chose. Thereafter, anyone had to get a Permit to come into Indian Territory. Furthermore, anyone leaving theTribe were no longer considered to be aCherokee. I never heard ofthis book you mention but will try to get it. Oleta On Sat, 2 Sep 2006 18:16:26 -0400 "Glee Krapf" <gleek@ptd.net> writes: > There were many people already in Indian Territory before the TOT. > They were > well established and had a goverment already in place. My 2nd great > grand > brother and his wife are on the old Settler roll. His name was John > Beck. He > moved west in 1834 and he did not live in Arkansas he went straight > to what > is now OK. He and his family were with one of the first groups that > moved > west and there is a book out about the trip. Called The River Trail. > They > were NOT on the TOT because they were way before 1837-1838. His name > is > listed in the back of the book as being on that trip. They arrived > in Indian > Territory 14 May 1834 and they had their first child on the trail. > The > leader of the trip was named Lt. Harris. Most of the trip was by > water. > Sequoyah was also early in moving west and was also well established > in IT > before the TOT. > Glee > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "J W Kite Jr" <obengekite@juno.com> > wrote > I've never heard of any Cherokee coming into Indian > Territory prior to TOT. > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > INDIAN-TERRITORY-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the > message > >

Oleta- I've talked to you for ten or more years. Are you SURE that you've never heard of Cherokees being in I.T. before the 1838/39 Trail of Tears? I'm sure that you have, but you have just forgotten it. When the Trail of Tears groups came through Arkansas, all of those who wanted to remain citizens of the Cherokee Nation and their government was already established in the Cherokee Nation of Indian Territory. This is verified by the 1825 Treaty concerning the removal of the Western Cherokees from the Arkansas lands into Indian Territory, the Claims filed and paid for their Arkansas improvements, "The Dwight Mission Journal- 1822/1865", and "Cherokee Emigration Rolls- 1817/1835", transcribed and published by Jack Baker in 1977. Everyone who came west before the Trail of Tears were classified as "Old Settlers"- no matter if they came in 1817 or in 1834. Many are shown on that Emigration book by Baker with the exact dates that they arrived (Lt Harris's group: arrived May 16, 1834"; "James Walkingstick- 2 males under 10, one male under 25, one female under 10, one female under 50, one child died 25 August"; "Jeremiah Horn- arrived May 16, 1834"). These names may be cross-referenced to the Old Settler Rolls! The Pin Indians did not come into the picture until the Civil War, Oleta. Jerri (Rogers) Chasteen Claremore J W Kite Jr wrote: >The Old Settlers are the people who were in Arkansas in 1817. As far as >Sequoyah=-he is my cousin and he made many trips back and forth. I know >there were people here. There were Cherokees called Pin and one morning >when my relative went out on the porch to wash his face they came riding >out and killed him. Only thing that saved his son was because he got >under his mother's skirt. I am a Cherokee-was reared as a Cherokee have >traveled , Lowrey family and my people are rather well known. If you read >Old Frontier you will find my relatives on almost every page. I also >volunteered At OHS "Indian" Archives for five years. When the Trail of >Tears came thru Arkansas the Cherokees there could rejoin the Tribe and >come on into Indian Territory if they chose. Thereafter, anyone had to >get a Permit to come into Indian Territory. Furthermore, anyone leaving >theTribe were no longer considered to be aCherokee. I never heard ofthis >book you mention but will try to get it. Oleta > >

Jerri, Where could I get a copy of the Jack Baker? I have a lot of relatives in Claremore and I have always considered the Will Rogers Memorial a religious shrine. ________________________________ From: indian-territory-roots-bounces@rootsweb.com on behalf of Jerri (Rogers) Chasteen Sent: Sun 9/3/2006 12:19 PM To: indian-territory-roots@rootsweb.com; obengekite@juno.com Subject: [INDIAN-TERRITORY-ROOTS] Cherokees in I.T. prior to TOT. Oleta- I've talked to you for ten or more years. Are you SURE that you've never heard of Cherokees being in I.T. before the 1838/39 Trail of Tears? I'm sure that you have, but you have just forgotten it. When the Trail of Tears groups came through Arkansas, all of those who wanted to remain citizens of the Cherokee Nation and their government was already established in the Cherokee Nation of Indian Territory. This is verified by the 1825 Treaty concerning the removal of the Western Cherokees from the Arkansas lands into Indian Territory, the Claims filed and paid for their Arkansas improvements, "The Dwight Mission Journal- 1822/1865", and "Cherokee Emigration Rolls- 1817/1835", transcribed and published by Jack Baker in 1977. Everyone who came west before the Trail of Tears were classified as "Old Settlers"- no matter if they came in 1817 or in 1834. Many are shown on that Emigration book by Baker with the exact dates that they arrived (Lt Harris's group: arrived May 16, 1834"; "James Walkingstick- 2 males under 10, one male under 25, one female under 10, one female under 50, one child died 25 August"; "Jeremiah Horn- arrived May 16, 1834"). These names may be cross-referenced to the Old Settler Rolls! The Pin Indians did not come into the picture until the Civil War, Oleta. Jerri (Rogers) Chasteen Claremore J W Kite Jr wrote: >The Old Settlers are the people who were in Arkansas in 1817. As far as >Sequoyah=-he is my cousin and he made many trips back and forth. I know >there were people here. There were Cherokees called Pin and one morning >when my relative went out on the porch to wash his face they came riding >out and killed him. Only thing that saved his son was because he got >under his mother's skirt. I am a Cherokee-was reared as a Cherokee have >traveled , Lowrey family and my people are rather well known. If you read >Old Frontier you will find my relatives on almost every page. I also >volunteered At OHS "Indian" Archives for five years. When the Trail of >Tears came thru Arkansas the Cherokees there could rejoin the Tribe and >come on into Indian Territory if they chose. Thereafter, anyone had to >get a Permit to come into Indian Territory. Furthermore, anyone leaving >theTribe were no longer considered to be aCherokee. I never heard ofthis >book you mention but will try to get it. Oleta > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to INDIAN-TERRITORY-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

The relative that was killed by the Pin Cherokee was his name James Starr? Betty ----- Original Message ----- From: "J W Kite Jr" <obengekite@juno.com> To: <indian-territory-roots@rootsweb.com> Sent: Sunday, September 03, 2006 9:03 AM Subject: Re: [INDIAN-TERRITORY-ROOTS] Where do you look? > The Old Settlers are the people who were in Arkansas in 1817. As far as > Sequoyah=-he is my cousin and he made many trips back and forth. I know > there were people here. There were Cherokees called Pin and one morning > when my relative went out on the porch to wash his face they came riding > out and killed him. Only thing that saved his son was because he got > under his mother's skirt. I am a Cherokee-was reared as a Cherokee have > traveled , Lowrey family and my people are rather well known. If you read > Old Frontier you will find my relatives on almost every page. I also > volunteered At OHS "Indian" Archives for five years. When the Trail of > Tears came thru Arkansas the Cherokees there could rejoin the Tribe and > come on into Indian Territory if they chose. Thereafter, anyone had to > get a Permit to come into Indian Territory. Furthermore, anyone leaving > theTribe were no longer considered to be aCherokee. I never heard ofthis > book you mention but will try to get it. Oleta > On Sat, 2 Sep 2006 18:16:26 -0400 "Glee Krapf" <gleek@ptd.net> writes: >> There were many people already in Indian Territory before the TOT. >> They were >> well established and had a goverment already in place. My 2nd great >> grand >> brother and his wife are on the old Settler roll. His name was John >> Beck. He >> moved west in 1834 and he did not live in Arkansas he went straight >> to what >> is now OK. He and his family were with one of the first groups that >> moved >> west and there is a book out about the trip. Called The River Trail. >> They >> were NOT on the TOT because they were way before 1837-1838. His name >> is >> listed in the back of the book as being on that trip. They arrived >> in Indian >> Territory 14 May 1834 and they had their first child on the trail. >> The >> leader of the trip was named Lt. Harris. Most of the trip was by >> water. >> Sequoyah was also early in moving west and was also well established >> in IT >> before the TOT. >> Glee >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "J W Kite Jr" <obengekite@juno.com> >> wrote >> I've never heard of any Cherokee coming into Indian >> Territory prior to TOT. >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> INDIAN-TERRITORY-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word >> 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the >> message >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > INDIAN-TERRITORY-ROOTS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' > without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >