A similar excise is being carried out for the last decade or so at in the Thar desert of Pakistan to extract coal or trying to gasify the same underground to generate electricity. An astounding amount of Rs. 900 million has been so far spent by the government with no sign of coal or electricity yet. 'Scientific studies' are still going on. Mike -----Original Message----- From: Nick Balmer <Nicholas.Balmer1@ntlworld.com> To: Harshawardhan_Bosham Nimkhedkar <bosham@gmail.com>; india-british-raj <india-british-raj@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thu, Oct 4, 2012 1:17 am Subject: Re: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Sir Henry Pottinger, East India Company and colonial governor Hello Harshawardhan, Major Pottinger (or rather his servants) discovered coal in Cutch, and this went on to affect the life of one of my "Indian" connections, John Croft Hawkins. This was at the very beginning of the steam age in India before Railways and before the Sir Hugh Lindsay streamship. The story is set out below. Regards Nick Balmer During the summer of 1827 Major Pottinger the Resident at Bhooj[i] in Cutch reported to the Bombay Government that coal had been found in Cutch and that pits had been started to mine the coal. Unfortunately water had been struck very soon after the commencement of these pits, which was holding up efforts to extract the coal. The Bombay Government began to investigate the use of steam engines to pump the water out. On the 23rd of October 1827 Mr Secretary Norris wrote to Major Pottinger: - "With the view to ascertaining the probable power of the Steam Engine required for the Coal Mines in Cutch, I am directed by the Hon'ble the Governor in Council to request that you will be pleased to state your opinion of the water which it is requisite to remove." [ii] Major Pottinger replied on the 10th of November 1827. "I regret that it is not in my power to afford Government anything like satisfactory information as to the quantity of water which it may hereafter become requisite to remove out of the coal mines in Cutch. At Present there is about 7 feet of water in each of the two shafts which have been dug, and the same proportion according to their depths is found in the village wells in the vicinity of the mines: but it may be of course inferred that this only shows the highest level to which the water will rise of itself, and which is within about ten feet of the surface consequently, were the shafts sunk to any great depth, the water would probably be very greatly and rapidly increased. In support of this surmise, I may mention that there is a well in the Residency grounds, in which there is above 50 feet of water, and that during Mr Gardiner's time, when a man had fallen into it, and had been drowned, an attempt was made to draw it off, but after employing 4 sets of bullocks at it, besides people bailing it with buckets from sunrise to sunset; it had only been decreased five feet, and had attained its usual level the following morning. 3. It is not however, very likely that, the springs near the mines will prove so plentiful as the well in question, which is in low ground, whilst the mines are rather on an elevated plain; but Lieutenant Clark informs me that he worked a whole day with two sets of bullocks with the usual apparatus, and had also a number of men drawing with a large cask; that he could not get one of the shafts clear, before dark; and that it again accumulated during the night. 4. I am myself quite ignorant of the power of steam, when used for raising water, or other similar purposes; but I should conceive that it would be better to have two engines on a moderate scale than one larger one, and whatever may be done on this subject, it will be indispensably necessary that a proper person shall be sent with the Engineer, to direct their application. I have etc. Pottinger [iii] The Bombay Government must have been investigating the possibilities of using steam engines. They had discovered that Captain Forbes house, a major trading company, had on offer for sale a 14 HP engine. Without waiting for the technical details to be checked, they decided to order the steam engine from Calcutta where it was located. Mr Secretary Norris wrote on the 19th of December 1827. "The Board has authorized a communication to be made to the Bengal Government requesting it to Purchase and send around to Bombay a 14 horse power engine to be employed in removing the water from the Kutch Coal mines. It is therefore probably necessary that steps should be taken to secure the Services of some Scientific person or persons to receive the engine on its arrival and superintend the erection and the working of it in Kutch. The Superintendent of Marine; the Chief Engineer, and Captain Hawkins ought perhaps to be requested to consider the subject & favor Government with their joint suggestion. Signed Sect Norris. [iv] The three Bombay Marine Officers must have rapidly got together to consider the issues involved in trying to use the steam pumps in the mines, for on the 7th of January 1828, they replied: - >From the Superintendent of Marine[v], Chief Engineer[vi], and Captain Hawkins. In reply we beg you will state to the Hon'ble the Governor in Council we are of opinion, that Captn Hawkins should be instructed to receive the Engine on it's arrival, because, from his intimate knowledge of machines of this kind and with the assistance of the machinists under him, he will be better able than any other person that occurs to us of ascertaining whether all be perfect, to complete what may be wanting, and to give plans and directions for putting it up, and providing some person or persons for working it. It is, however desirable that we should be furnished with any plan or description of the Engine which Government may be in possession of, as well as the information that exists connected with the strata of Coal which it is proposed to work, for without some knowledge of this kind, it is not possible to give an opinion as to the place in which the engine should be fixed, or the best method of doing it, and should it be the intention of the Honorable the Governor in Council to extend our duties to the working of mines, we will, on the receipt of the above information, give our opinion as to what steps it will be proper next to take; for mining is at all times in some degree, a hazardous speculation, and it is desirable not to make it more so by disregarding the indications of success or failure which the science of Geology has put it in our power of attaining. Captain Hawkins having been absent from the Presidency in Consequence of indisposition when your letter was received, will, we hope, be accepted as an apology for the length of time we have taken in replying to it. Bombay We have etc. 7th Jany 1828. Thos Buchanan S Goodfellow J. Hawkins. [vii] It is not clear how John Hawkins had become sufficiently experienced to be seen as a "Scientific Officer", unless he had had some previous experience with steamers. I think he may have been involved in the construction of the Hugh Lindsay, the first steamer to travel up the Red Sea. The master builder Nowrojee Jamsetjee built the hull of the Hugh Lindsay out of teak at the HEIC's Bombay Dockyard. She used two 80 hp engines were supplied by Maudslay of Lambeth. On the 16th of January 1828 Charles Norris, the Secretary to the Bombay Government wrote: - "It appears to the Governor in Council a necessary preliminary measure, that a scientific Officer should report, from inspection of the mines, on the best mode of proceeding when the steam engine arrives. Captn Hawkins would on every ground be the fittest officer to depute, on such a Duty to which the Governor in Council is accordingly pleased to appoint him. I have etc. Bombay Castle Chas Norris. 16 Jany 1828 Sect to Govt [viii] John Hawkins was sent the following letter: - Chas Norris Esq. Secty to Govt To Captain Hawkins. Sir, I am directed to inform you that the Hon'ble the Governor in Council is pleased to appoint you to proceed to cutch to inspect the Coal mines, and to report on the best mode of proceeding when the steam engine which is expected from Calcutta to work the mines arrives. I have etc. Bombay Castle Sign'd Chas Norris 16 Jany 1828 Secty to Govt [ix] John Hawkins must have set off almost immediately to travel to the site of the mines at Cutch, because by the 10th of March 1828 he was back in Bombay and writing his report to the Government. >From the Marine Superintendent, Chief Engineer, and Captain Hawkins dated 10 March 1828. Sir, In reply to your letter of the 16th January last, we have now the honor to submit for the consideration of the Hon'ble the Governor in Council the memorandum of Captain Hawkins on the Coal Strata in Cutch, with a few observations thereon. 2. We think the information afforded by this paper is sufficient to warrant the further search for that mineral, the possession of which is so desirable to promote steam navigation on this side of India, as well for working steam engines at present here, as for the introduction of others, and various other purposes connected with the business of the smith and the founder, and generally, for the improvement of machinery and manufacturers. 3. As the Coal obtained from the present strata appears scarcely worth the labour of extracting, we think that any other galleries that may be found necessary to make in it should not be larger than sufficient for a man to work in, and this should be done only when any favourable consideration presents itself in order to ascertain the quality of the Coal and the thickness of the strata, or for the purpose of Ventilation or draining. 4. It is we think probable that other strata of coal of a Superior quality and greater quantity may be found lying beneath this; and we are of opinion that it would be proper to take the usual method of ascertaining this by boring or sinking shafts. 5. We would therefore recommend that this operation be commenced upon as soon as Rods and a model with instructions for using them can be prepared, but we think it would be better for future operation to get boring rods from England. For they would be of a superior quality to any that can be made here, and they may become useful on other occasions. 6. We would also recommend that a Geological Survey and sketch of the Country in the Vicinity of the Coal mines should be commenced. In it should be the information gained from the mine by boring or otherwise. This we think could be done by the Executive Engineer at Bhooj at little or no expense, and would be valuable not only as a guide to the future operations here, but to the science of Geology in general. 7. In the present state of these mines, we see no purpose to which the steam engine can be applied, and it is probable, when future discoveries point out the spots in which it could be advisable to erect it, some part of it will require new modelling, it being now calculated to lift water only 20 feet, whereas in all probability, many times that depth will be required, but we are not of opinion any alteration should be made until it is ascertained that Coal worth working is to be found, and at what depth, and if the Engine be not already purchased, we think it would be better to get an Engine suited to the purpose from England when required and which might probably be obtained at less expense. Bombay 10th March 1828 We have etc. Signed T. Buchanan S Goodfellow J Hawkins [x] John's actual Memorandum survives, and is especially interesting because it describes the actual workings themselves. Sadly, the diagrams that original accompanied the Memorandum appear to have been lost. Memorandum Conformably to the instructions contained in Mr Secretary Norris's letter dated the 16th Ultimo to our Committee, I proceeded to Cutch, and have examined the Coal work, in the neighbourhood of the village of Tromoo and also the indication of Coal in its Vicinity. The sketch no 1 represents the north bank of the River, where the stratum of Coal which has been worked shews of about 20 inches thick mixed with a kind of slate, and covered by Soft Sand Stone Rock & upwards of 30 feet thick. The miners began by cutting down the face of the bank of the River, to lay the coal stratum bare, but finding this scheme tedious they commenced driving a Tunnel A about 8 feet wide and 7 feet high into the bank, a few inches above the level of the water in the River in the dry season. In the digging of the Tunnel inwards, the Coal Stratum was found to "dip" or incline downwards in a North Easterly direction (See Section No 3) at about ¾ of inch to a foot, so that the River water soon found its way into the Tunnel, and obliged the miners to abandon it. In the rains the tunnel completely filled with water. A second Tunnel B higher up the stratum was then commenced, but it also soon inclined under the level of the River water (see sketch No 2) and was likewise abandoned. A Gallery C, was cut at right angles with the Tunnel with the intention of examining the Coal in that direction. The late Mr Quin attempted to bore in the Spot D but his boring rods were erroneously constructed, and as ill worked, so that they made little progress in boring and broke at the depth of 25 feet. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [i] Modern day Bhuj. [ii] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 15. [iii] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 17 to 21. [iv] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 22. [v] Thomas Buchanan. [vi] S Goodfellow. [vii] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 29-33. [viii] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 34-35 [ix] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 36. [x] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 37 -43. ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

G'day Folks, It is not usual for listers on either of these two INDIA related List, to meet in real life. Today my brother, in company with the owner and founder of the INDIA List, Cathy Day and myself, the owner and founder of the RAJ List, paid a visit to one our long time Listers, Joyce Munro and her family in Belgium. We were warmly welcomed to her house and treated to the generous hospitality of her table. The conversations were happy and convivial. Calcutta and people and places that we knew in common, were recalled and others that were not common. All in all Cathy, Michael and I thoroughly enjoyed our stay at the Munro abode. Thankyou Joyce and family. John Feltham - presently on holidays in the Netherlands.

Wednesday, October 03, 2012 Today's ODNB Life of the Day features Sir Henry Pottinger, first baronet (1789-1856), army officer in the East India Company and colonial governor. Free online for one week, at http://www.oxforddnb.com/view/lotw/2012-10-03 ---- Harshawardhan_Bosham Nimkhedkar

Hello Harshawardhan, Major Pottinger (or rather his servants) discovered coal in Cutch, and this went on to affect the life of one of my "Indian" connections, John Croft Hawkins. This was at the very beginning of the steam age in India before Railways and before the Sir Hugh Lindsay streamship. The story is set out below. Regards Nick Balmer During the summer of 1827 Major Pottinger the Resident at Bhooj[i] in Cutch reported to the Bombay Government that coal had been found in Cutch and that pits had been started to mine the coal. Unfortunately water had been struck very soon after the commencement of these pits, which was holding up efforts to extract the coal. The Bombay Government began to investigate the use of steam engines to pump the water out. On the 23rd of October 1827 Mr Secretary Norris wrote to Major Pottinger: - "With the view to ascertaining the probable power of the Steam Engine required for the Coal Mines in Cutch, I am directed by the Hon'ble the Governor in Council to request that you will be pleased to state your opinion of the water which it is requisite to remove." [ii] Major Pottinger replied on the 10th of November 1827. "I regret that it is not in my power to afford Government anything like satisfactory information as to the quantity of water which it may hereafter become requisite to remove out of the coal mines in Cutch. At Present there is about 7 feet of water in each of the two shafts which have been dug, and the same proportion according to their depths is found in the village wells in the vicinity of the mines: but it may be of course inferred that this only shows the highest level to which the water will rise of itself, and which is within about ten feet of the surface consequently, were the shafts sunk to any great depth, the water would probably be very greatly and rapidly increased. In support of this surmise, I may mention that there is a well in the Residency grounds, in which there is above 50 feet of water, and that during Mr Gardiner's time, when a man had fallen into it, and had been drowned, an attempt was made to draw it off, but after employing 4 sets of bullocks at it, besides people bailing it with buckets from sunrise to sunset; it had only been decreased five feet, and had attained its usual level the following morning. 3. It is not however, very likely that, the springs near the mines will prove so plentiful as the well in question, which is in low ground, whilst the mines are rather on an elevated plain; but Lieutenant Clark informs me that he worked a whole day with two sets of bullocks with the usual apparatus, and had also a number of men drawing with a large cask; that he could not get one of the shafts clear, before dark; and that it again accumulated during the night. 4. I am myself quite ignorant of the power of steam, when used for raising water, or other similar purposes; but I should conceive that it would be better to have two engines on a moderate scale than one larger one, and whatever may be done on this subject, it will be indispensably necessary that a proper person shall be sent with the Engineer, to direct their application. I have etc. Pottinger [iii] The Bombay Government must have been investigating the possibilities of using steam engines. They had discovered that Captain Forbes house, a major trading company, had on offer for sale a 14 HP engine. Without waiting for the technical details to be checked, they decided to order the steam engine from Calcutta where it was located. Mr Secretary Norris wrote on the 19th of December 1827. "The Board has authorized a communication to be made to the Bengal Government requesting it to Purchase and send around to Bombay a 14 horse power engine to be employed in removing the water from the Kutch Coal mines. It is therefore probably necessary that steps should be taken to secure the Services of some Scientific person or persons to receive the engine on its arrival and superintend the erection and the working of it in Kutch. The Superintendent of Marine; the Chief Engineer, and Captain Hawkins ought perhaps to be requested to consider the subject & favor Government with their joint suggestion. Signed Sect Norris. [iv] The three Bombay Marine Officers must have rapidly got together to consider the issues involved in trying to use the steam pumps in the mines, for on the 7th of January 1828, they replied: - >From the Superintendent of Marine[v], Chief Engineer[vi], and Captain Hawkins. In reply we beg you will state to the Hon'ble the Governor in Council we are of opinion, that Captn Hawkins should be instructed to receive the Engine on it's arrival, because, from his intimate knowledge of machines of this kind and with the assistance of the machinists under him, he will be better able than any other person that occurs to us of ascertaining whether all be perfect, to complete what may be wanting, and to give plans and directions for putting it up, and providing some person or persons for working it. It is, however desirable that we should be furnished with any plan or description of the Engine which Government may be in possession of, as well as the information that exists connected with the strata of Coal which it is proposed to work, for without some knowledge of this kind, it is not possible to give an opinion as to the place in which the engine should be fixed, or the best method of doing it, and should it be the intention of the Honorable the Governor in Council to extend our duties to the working of mines, we will, on the receipt of the above information, give our opinion as to what steps it will be proper next to take; for mining is at all times in some degree, a hazardous speculation, and it is desirable not to make it more so by disregarding the indications of success or failure which the science of Geology has put it in our power of attaining. Captain Hawkins having been absent from the Presidency in Consequence of indisposition when your letter was received, will, we hope, be accepted as an apology for the length of time we have taken in replying to it. Bombay We have etc. 7th Jany 1828. Thos Buchanan S Goodfellow J. Hawkins. [vii] It is not clear how John Hawkins had become sufficiently experienced to be seen as a "Scientific Officer", unless he had had some previous experience with steamers. I think he may have been involved in the construction of the Hugh Lindsay, the first steamer to travel up the Red Sea. The master builder Nowrojee Jamsetjee built the hull of the Hugh Lindsay out of teak at the HEIC's Bombay Dockyard. She used two 80 hp engines were supplied by Maudslay of Lambeth. On the 16th of January 1828 Charles Norris, the Secretary to the Bombay Government wrote: - "It appears to the Governor in Council a necessary preliminary measure, that a scientific Officer should report, from inspection of the mines, on the best mode of proceeding when the steam engine arrives. Captn Hawkins would on every ground be the fittest officer to depute, on such a Duty to which the Governor in Council is accordingly pleased to appoint him. I have etc. Bombay Castle Chas Norris. 16 Jany 1828 Sect to Govt [viii] John Hawkins was sent the following letter: - Chas Norris Esq. Secty to Govt To Captain Hawkins. Sir, I am directed to inform you that the Hon'ble the Governor in Council is pleased to appoint you to proceed to cutch to inspect the Coal mines, and to report on the best mode of proceeding when the steam engine which is expected from Calcutta to work the mines arrives. I have etc. Bombay Castle Sign'd Chas Norris 16 Jany 1828 Secty to Govt [ix] John Hawkins must have set off almost immediately to travel to the site of the mines at Cutch, because by the 10th of March 1828 he was back in Bombay and writing his report to the Government. >From the Marine Superintendent, Chief Engineer, and Captain Hawkins dated 10 March 1828. Sir, In reply to your letter of the 16th January last, we have now the honor to submit for the consideration of the Hon'ble the Governor in Council the memorandum of Captain Hawkins on the Coal Strata in Cutch, with a few observations thereon. 2. We think the information afforded by this paper is sufficient to warrant the further search for that mineral, the possession of which is so desirable to promote steam navigation on this side of India, as well for working steam engines at present here, as for the introduction of others, and various other purposes connected with the business of the smith and the founder, and generally, for the improvement of machinery and manufacturers. 3. As the Coal obtained from the present strata appears scarcely worth the labour of extracting, we think that any other galleries that may be found necessary to make in it should not be larger than sufficient for a man to work in, and this should be done only when any favourable consideration presents itself in order to ascertain the quality of the Coal and the thickness of the strata, or for the purpose of Ventilation or draining. 4. It is we think probable that other strata of coal of a Superior quality and greater quantity may be found lying beneath this; and we are of opinion that it would be proper to take the usual method of ascertaining this by boring or sinking shafts. 5. We would therefore recommend that this operation be commenced upon as soon as Rods and a model with instructions for using them can be prepared, but we think it would be better for future operation to get boring rods from England. For they would be of a superior quality to any that can be made here, and they may become useful on other occasions. 6. We would also recommend that a Geological Survey and sketch of the Country in the Vicinity of the Coal mines should be commenced. In it should be the information gained from the mine by boring or otherwise. This we think could be done by the Executive Engineer at Bhooj at little or no expense, and would be valuable not only as a guide to the future operations here, but to the science of Geology in general. 7. In the present state of these mines, we see no purpose to which the steam engine can be applied, and it is probable, when future discoveries point out the spots in which it could be advisable to erect it, some part of it will require new modelling, it being now calculated to lift water only 20 feet, whereas in all probability, many times that depth will be required, but we are not of opinion any alteration should be made until it is ascertained that Coal worth working is to be found, and at what depth, and if the Engine be not already purchased, we think it would be better to get an Engine suited to the purpose from England when required and which might probably be obtained at less expense. Bombay 10th March 1828 We have etc. Signed T. Buchanan S Goodfellow J Hawkins [x] John's actual Memorandum survives, and is especially interesting because it describes the actual workings themselves. Sadly, the diagrams that original accompanied the Memorandum appear to have been lost. Memorandum Conformably to the instructions contained in Mr Secretary Norris's letter dated the 16th Ultimo to our Committee, I proceeded to Cutch, and have examined the Coal work, in the neighbourhood of the village of Tromoo and also the indication of Coal in its Vicinity. The sketch no 1 represents the north bank of the River, where the stratum of Coal which has been worked shews of about 20 inches thick mixed with a kind of slate, and covered by Soft Sand Stone Rock & upwards of 30 feet thick. The miners began by cutting down the face of the bank of the River, to lay the coal stratum bare, but finding this scheme tedious they commenced driving a Tunnel A about 8 feet wide and 7 feet high into the bank, a few inches above the level of the water in the River in the dry season. In the digging of the Tunnel inwards, the Coal Stratum was found to "dip" or incline downwards in a North Easterly direction (See Section No 3) at about ¾ of inch to a foot, so that the River water soon found its way into the Tunnel, and obliged the miners to abandon it. In the rains the tunnel completely filled with water. A second Tunnel B higher up the stratum was then commenced, but it also soon inclined under the level of the River water (see sketch No 2) and was likewise abandoned. A Gallery C, was cut at right angles with the Tunnel with the intention of examining the Coal in that direction. The late Mr Quin attempted to bore in the Spot D but his boring rods were erroneously constructed, and as ill worked, so that they made little progress in boring and broke at the depth of 25 feet. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [i] Modern day Bhuj. [ii] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 15. [iii] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 17 to 21. [iv] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 22. [v] Thomas Buchanan. [vi] S Goodfellow. [vii] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 29-33. [viii] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 34-35 [ix] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 36. [x] OIOC IOR/F/4/1131/30216 folio 37 -43.

G'day Begin forwarded message: > New update published: 124 biographies with a special focus on the modern churches: > http://www.oup.com/oxforddnb/info/freeodnb/shelves/sept2012/ > > Full list of new biographies: > http://www.oup.com/oxforddnb/info/newupdates/contents/newlives12c/ > > Editor’s introduction: > http://www.oup.com/oxforddnb/info/newupdates/contents/preface12c/ > > New biography podcast: Frank Pantridge (1916-2004), inventor of the heart defibrillator: > http://www.oup.com/oxforddnb/info/freeodnb/pod/ > > > ======================================================================== > > > > To read this Life of the Day complete with a picture of the subject, > visit http://www.oxforddnb.com/view/lotw/2012-10-03 > > > > Pottinger, Sir Henry, first baronet (1789-1856), army officer in the East India Company and colonial governor, was born at Mount Pottinger, co. Down, Ireland, on 3 October 1789, the fifth son of Eldred Curwen Pottinger, a descendant of the Pottingers of Berkshire, and his wife, Anne, daughter of Robert Gordon of Florida Manor, co. Down. He was educated at Belfast Academy, which he left when twelve years old, and went to sea. In 1803 he travelled to India to join the marine service there, but friends persuaded Lord Castlereagh in 1804 to substitute a cadetship in the East India Company's army. Meanwhile he studied in Bombay, and acquired a knowledge of Indian languages. He worked well, became an assistant teacher, and on 18 September 1806 was made an ensign, and promoted lieutenant on 16 July 1809. > > In 1808 Pottinger was sent on a mission to Sind under Nicholas Hankey Smith, the British political agent at Bushehr. In 1809, when Sir John Malcolm's mission to Persia was postponed, Pottinger and a friend, Captain Charles Christie, offered to explore the area between India and Persia in order to acquire information lacking to the government, which accepted the offer. The travellers, disguised as Indians, and accompanied by a local horse dealer and two servants, left Bombay on 2 January 1810, journeying by sea to Sind, and from there by land to Kalat. They were immediately recognized as Europeans, and even as having belonged to the embassy at Sind, but safely reached Nushki, near the boundary between Afghanistan and Baluchistan; here Christie diverged northwards to Herat, and proceeded thence by Yazd to Esfahan, while Pottinger, keeping in a westerly direction, travelled through Kerman to Shiraz, and joined Christie at Esfahan. Christie was directed to remain there, and was killed in a Russian attack on the Persians in 1812. Pottinger, returning via Baghdad and Basrah, reached Bombay in February 1811. He reported the results of his journey, published as Travels in Beloochistan and Sinde (1816). Pottinger married, in 1820, Susanna Maria (1800-1886), daughter of Captain Richard Cooke of Dublin, whose family was a branch of the Cookes of Cookesborough, co. Westmeath. They had a daughter and three sons; the eldest son died in infancy. > > Pottinger was next appointed to the staff of Sir Evan Nepean, governor of Bombay, by whom he was sent as assistant to Mountstuart Elphinstone, the British resident at Poona. On 15 October 1821 he was made captain. He served during the Anglo-Maratha War, and at its close became collector of Ahmednagar. He was promoted major on 1 May 1825, and in the same year was made resident in Cutch. He was promoted lieutenant-colonel on 17 March 1829, and brevet colonel on 23 January 1834. While resident in Cutch he conducted a mission to Sind in 1831, successfully negotiating a commercial treaty. He conducted further missions in 1833-4 and 1836-7, being appointed political agent there in 1836, negotiating the treaty of 1839 which achieved domination of Sind. Out of sympathy with what he saw as Auckland's excessively coercive approach, Pottinger left India in 1840, ill health being given as the reason for his return. He was created a baronet on 27 April 1840. > > Pottinger accepted Lord Palmerston's offer of the post of envoy and plenipotentiary in China and superintendent of British trade, thus superseding Captain Charles Elliot. The First Opium War had begun in January 1840. After Elliot, the British representative, had seized the forts by Canton (Guangzhou), a preliminary treaty had been drawn up in January 1841, but it was disavowed by both governments. Palmerston directed Pottinger to replace this treaty by one which would open China to British trade, but before he reached China hostilities had recommenced. Major-General Sir Hugh Gough arrived in March 1841 to command the expeditionary force from India. Gough took the four forts defending Canton in May 1841, and while he was preparing to attack the town itself, Pottinger reached Macau (9 August). He deemed it essential to the success of his mission to make a further display of force, and he co-operated with Gough and Admiral Sir William Parker (1781-1866) in the capture of Amoy (Xiamen), Chushan, Chintu (Chengdu), and Ningpo (Ningbo). On 13 June 1842 Pottinger, with Parker, entered the Yangtze (Yangzi) River with the object of taking Nanking (Nanjing). After many successes by the way, an assault on that city was imminent in July, when Pottinger announced that the Chinese were ready to treat for peace on a satisfactory basis. The Chinese diplomatists had already found that Pottinger could not be trifled with: an intercepted letter from the chief Chinese negotiator to his government stated that 'to all his representations the barbarian, Pottinger, only knit his brows and said "No"'. Eventually peace was signed on 29 August 1842 on board HMS Cornwallis before Nanking. By this treaty of Nanking, China agreed to pay an indemnity of 21 million, Hong Kong was ceded to England, and the five 'treaty ports'-Canton, Amoy, Foochow (Fuzhou), Ningpo, and Shanghai-were opened to British traders, and were to receive British consuls. In recognition of his successful conduct of negotiations Pottinger was made GCB (2 December 1842), and on 5 April 1843 was appointed the first British governor of Hong Kong. > > Pottinger returned to Britain in the spring of 1844, and was much honoured: he was sworn of the privy council (23 May 1844), was presented with the freedom of many cities, and in June 1845 the House of Commons voted him £1500 a year for life. On 28 September 1846 he succeeded Sir Peregrine Maitland as governor of Cape Colony. He stayed there less than six months, and apparently without reputation or distinction in the view of G. M. Theal, according to whom Pottinger left the colony 'without the esteem of a single colonist' (Lehmann, 279). In 1848 he returned once more to India as governor of Madras and attained the rank of lieutenant-general in 1851. He held the post until 1854, when he returned to Britain in broken health. His government of Madras had not been a success. He was resistant to change and had become dilatory in the discharge of public business, failing to recognize the need for essential improvements. He was better fitted to deal with a crisis than with ordinary administration. He died at Malta on 18 March 1856, and was buried at Valletta. His two surviving sons successively succeeded to the baronetcy. > > William Broadfoot > > James Lunt > > Sources Burke, Peerage (1907) + Hart's Army List + M. E. Yapp, Strategies of British India: Britain, Iran and Afghanistan, 1798-1850 (1980) + J. A. Norris, The First Afghan War, 1838-1842 (1967) + H. Pottinger, Travels in Beloochistan and Sindi (1816) + A. Burnes, Travels into Bokhara, 3 vols. (1834) + A. Burnes, Cabool: residence, 1836-8 (1842) + Fortescue, Brit. army, vol. 12 + A. J. Smithers, The Kaffir wars (1973) + G. M. Theal, History of South Africa, 11 vols. (1915-20); facs. edn (Cape Town, 1964) + J. H. Lehmann, Remember you are an Englishman: a biography of Sir Harry Smith (1977) > Archives TNA: PRO, corresp. and papers, FO 705 | BL, corresp. with Lord Aberdeen, Add. MS 43198 + BL, letters to Sir John Hobhouse, Add. MS 36478 + BL OIOC, letters to Mountstuart Elphinstone, MSS Eur. F 87-9 + BL OIOC, corresp. with Sir John Hobhouse, MS Eur. F 213 + NL Scot., corresp. with Sir Thomas Cochrane + NMM, letters to Sir William Parker + TNA: PRO, corresp. with Lord Ellenborough, PRO 30/12 + U. Durham L., corresp. with third Earl Grey + U. Southampton L., letters to Lord Palmerston > Likenesses F. Grant, oils, 1845, Gov. Art Coll. [see illus.] · H. Griffiths, stipple, pubd 1846 (after a lithograph by S. Laurence, 1842), NG Ire. · J. Brown, line engraving, NG Ire. · L. Dickinson, lithograph (after S. Laurence), BM, NPG · portrait (after F. Grant), Oriental Club, London · portrait (after F. Grant), possibly government house, Hong Kong · portrait (after F. Grant), priv. coll. > > > > > ======================================================================== > © Oxford University Press, 2004. See legal notice: > http://www.oup.com/oxforddnb/legal/ > > We hope you have enjoyed this Life of The Day, but if you do wish to stop > receiving these messages, please EITHER send a message to > LISTSERV@WEBBER.UK.HUB.OUP.COM with > > signoff ODNBLIFEOFTHEDAY-L > > in the body (not the subject line) of the message > > OR > > send an email to epm-oxforddnb@oup.com, asking us to stop sending you > these messages.

Kerry, this is not a reply to your main query ''if he was dismissed as a Weapons master's mate, how did he become governor of Madras?'' I just want to point out that Sadras and Madras are two separate places. Quite close to each other but not one and the same. Madras was a British presidency and so could not have a Dutch governor in 1823. Sir Thomas Munro was the governor of Madras from 1814 to 1827. On the other hand, the nearby Sadras or Sadurangapattinam remained in Dutch hands and they had built a fort there. Your man is therefore a Sadrasi and not a Madrasi ... See = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sadras http://www.thehindu.com/life-and-style/metroplus/article3527885.ece http://in.lifestyle.yahoo.com/tryst-with-the-coromandel-coast-%E2%80%93-part-1.html I hope some of our experts would be able to guide you further. Best, ---- Harshawardhan_Bosham Nimkhedkar ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kerry Edwards" Help with Dutch records I am trying to confirm/locate details of a Francis Casparus Regel B about 1776 died 27 November 1823 Sadras (Madras) India. He is shown as the Dutch Governor of Madras 1818 - 1824 . The record shows he was 'dismissed' hardly 6 months after he was employed (and 2-3 mnths of that was the sea voyage). The question that come to mind is that if he was dismissed as a Weapons master's mate, how did he become governor of Madras? Can anyone provide any guidance to search Dutch Govt Records on his appointment as Govenor of Madras?

Dear listers I am trying to confirm/locate details of a Francis Casparus Regel B about 1776 died 27 November 1823 Sadras (Madras) India. He is shown as the Dutch Governor of Madras 1818 - 1824 . I have written to the Netherland Archive who have found a Frans Casparus Regel from Houglij who commenced employment: 15-01-1793. His date of termination of employment: 02-08-1793 Occupation at commencement of employment: Weapons master's mate Reason for terminating employment: Dismissal Sailed away with the ship: Ceylon Where ended tenure of service: Asia Month certificate: No Debenture: No Information concerning the voyage Ship: Ceylon Departure: 15-01-1793 Chamber: Amsterdam Cape: 11-04-1793 The record shows he was 'dismissed' hardly 6 months after he was employed ( and 2-3 mnths of that was the sea voyage). The NA has also provided some details of 'a' FC Regel and his ancesty however I am suspicious that this is not my man. The question that come to mind is that if he was dismissed as a Weapons master's mate, how did he become governor of Madras? Can anyone provide any guidance to search Dutch Govt Records on his appointment as Govenor of Madras? Would there be any baptism records for FC Regel in or around Houglij in 1776? I have asked these question of the NA and awaiting a response. Kind Regards Kerry

Dear Moira, I am so sorry for your loss. Phyllis From: NEVILLE WILSON DE ROZE Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2012 3:51 PM To: india-british-raj@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Moira Breen's brother ~ I never knew any of the recently deceased, but it is sad news, and I offer my condolences. ________________________________ From: Lynne Hadley <lynnehadley@bigpond.com> To: india-british-raj@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, 25 September 2012, 0:02 Subject: Re: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Moira Breen's brother ~ Oh no. This is such sad news, Sandra. My deepest sympathies to Moira. ----- Original Message ----- From: "sandra carney" <sandracarney@nc.rr.com> To: <india-british-raj@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 5:20 AM Subject: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Moira Breen's brother ~ > > Dear Listers, > I also wanted to let you know that our beloved Moira Breen lost her only > brother, Bevis Breen on 19th Sept., 2012. > Bevis had been ill for a while, but none the less it was a shock to poor > Moira. She cared very deeply for her baby brother and spoke very highly > of > him to me many times. He had participated in WWII - in Burma. > He will be buried on September 27th, 2012 in England. > > Moira will post an obituary a little later. But as I know our grand lady > is loved and so deeply admired by so many on this list, I thought you > would > like to know. > > Bevis Breen was 86 years old. He is survived by his widow. > > Very sad for our Moira, > Sandra Campagnac-Carney > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

I never knew any of the recently deceased, but it is sad news, and I offer my condolences. ________________________________ From: Lynne Hadley <lynnehadley@bigpond.com> To: india-british-raj@rootsweb.com Sent: Tuesday, 25 September 2012, 0:02 Subject: Re: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Moira Breen's brother ~ Oh no.  This is such sad news, Sandra.  My deepest sympathies to Moira. ----- Original Message ----- From: "sandra carney" <sandracarney@nc.rr.com> To: <india-british-raj@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 5:20 AM Subject: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Moira Breen's brother ~ > > Dear Listers, > I also wanted to let you know that our beloved Moira Breen lost her only > brother, Bevis Breen on 19th Sept., 2012. > Bevis had been ill for a while, but none the less it was a shock to poor > Moira.  She cared very deeply for her baby brother and spoke very highly > of > him to me many times.  He had participated in WWII - in Burma. > He will be buried on September 27th, 2012 in England. > > Moira will post an obituary a little later.  But as I know our grand lady > is loved and so deeply admired by so many on this list, I thought you > would > like to know. > > Bevis Breen was 86 years old.  He is survived by his widow. > > Very sad for our Moira, > Sandra Campagnac-Carney > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

G'day Folks, On 25/09/2012, at 7:16, Harshawardhan_Bosham Nimkhedkar <bosham@gmail.com> wrote: > Many thanks to Sandra for telling us about these sad events. > Our heartfelt condolences to the bereaved families of both > Mark Steevens and Bevis Breen. > > RIP. I add my condolences to the two families in their recent losses. John Feltham

Hello Members, I am saddened at the news that Mark Stephens is now in the hands of his Maker. I have regularly corresponded with Mark for about 5 years and was shocked to receive a message from Matilda, last Sunday, 23/9/2012. Mark was a visionary - of a very special kind - and he has done more than anyone else to record the Raj in Burma. His Anglo Burmese Library is quite amazing. We collaborated on matters of interest to us: - His collection of un-published records spanning a period 1900 to 1947 (hundreds of pages) - The Army in Burma Reserve of Officers - The 2nd Burma Rifles (his father was a Captain in this force during WW2) - The Public Works Department in Burma - Now and again we knitting together our records so as to give others a better insight to their family research. Matilda Steevens is committed to maintaining the Anglo Burmese Library and I will be doing my best to support her. My condolences to the Matilda and Mark's family. Regards Vivian Rodrigues Perth Western Australia -----Original Message----- From: india-british-raj-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:india-british-raj-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of sandra carney Sent: Tuesday, 25 September 2012 3:09 AM To: india-british-raj@rootsweb.com Subject: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Sad News ~ Hello Listers, It is with deepest regret that I have to inform you that one of our members, Mark Steevens died on Thursday, Sept. 20th, 2012. Mark was in the process of compiling the History of the Anglo-Burmese people. He had access to hundreds of thousands of documents that would have been lost to history had it have not been for his discovery. He set up "The Anglo-Burmese Library", which you can find on google. It also has a FaceBook image. Although still in infancy, the Library has already astounded many and delighted many others who have found members of their family documented. The entire Trek and Casualty list WWII is on there - This in itself has put to rest the questions of many who had lost trace of their loved ones and friends following World War II. So much more really - Mark Steevens' loss is irreplaceable. He had more knowledge in his head about Anglo-Burmese History than anyone else in our realm. I came to know him quite by accident, when he found that some of my grandfather's work, which I was still working on editing to get published, was being sold on the internet - an entire chapter ... I contacted the site and following a call from their Lawyer, with a lot of sweet talk which lasted for 42 minutes - the work was removed. Mark was so aware of and protective of all things Anglo-Burmese - he was the great "defender" of our race and as he saw it vanishing before his very eyes, he did not just talk, but took action to see that our history would be preserved for future generations. I cannot even begin to express how shocked I was this morning when I received a note from Matilda Steevens, his wife. Mark died quite suddenly and unexpectedly in England. His funeral will be in Bedford on October 4th. Matilda will continue on with the concept of the Library - Mark and she shared the idea and she knows how to go forward. Please continue to visit Mark's "Anglo-Burmese Library". We can pay no greater tribute to this important man than to continue his life's dream. Mark Steevens was 59 years old. With the saddest heart for this great loss, Sandra Campagnac-Carney ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Many thanks to Sandra for telling us about these sad events. Our heartfelt condolences to the bereaved families of both Mark Steevens and Bevis Breen. RIP. ---- Harshawardhan_Bosham Nimkhedkar, List Administrator ----- Original Message ----- From: "sandra carney" I also wanted to let you know that our beloved Moira Breen lost her only brother, Bevis Breen on 19th Sept., 2012. He had participated in WWII - in Burma. Bevis Breen was 86 years old. He is survived by his widow. ------------------------------- It is with deepest regret that I have to inform you that one of our members, Mark Steevens died on Thursday, Sept. 20th, 2012. Mark was in the process of compiling the History of the Anglo-Burmese people.

Oh no. This is such sad news, Sandra. My deepest sympathies to Moira. ----- Original Message ----- From: "sandra carney" <sandracarney@nc.rr.com> To: <india-british-raj@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 5:20 AM Subject: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Moira Breen's brother ~ > > Dear Listers, > I also wanted to let you know that our beloved Moira Breen lost her only > brother, Bevis Breen on 19th Sept., 2012. > Bevis had been ill for a while, but none the less it was a shock to poor > Moira. She cared very deeply for her baby brother and spoke very highly > of > him to me many times. He had participated in WWII - in Burma. > He will be buried on September 27th, 2012 in England. > > Moira will post an obituary a little later. But as I know our grand lady > is loved and so deeply admired by so many on this list, I thought you > would > like to know. > > Bevis Breen was 86 years old. He is survived by his widow. > > Very sad for our Moira, > Sandra Campagnac-Carney > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thank you John for posting that wonderful article about Derek O'Brien. I well recall how devastated my grandfather, James J. Stroud, a former BI Army Sergeant and bandmaster in the Viceroy's band in the early 1900s, was when the news of the partition of India and Pakistan was made known in Australia. He held a deep regard for India all his life, as did his wife (an English lass who sailed off to India as a "Lady's Companion" around the turn of the century) Occasionally I meet people here in Adelaide, Sth Aust. who had links back to that era who also speak so highly of their experiences in India. Regards, Ainslie.

Hi Sandra, Thanks for sharing the news. What treasures we lose as each person with first hand knowledge of our interest passes away. Condolences to his wife and family. Cheers Ainslie (in Sth Australia)

Dear Moira, Please accept my deepest condolences on the sad passing of your brother. May his soul rest in peace and the good Lord give to the courage to bear this great loss. Amen. Warm regards, Mike -----Original Message----- From: sandra carney <sandracarney@nc.rr.com> To: india-british-raj <india-british-raj@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tue, Sep 25, 2012 12:23 am Subject: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Moira Breen's brother ~ Dear Listers, I also wanted to let you know that our beloved Moira Breen lost her only brother, Bevis Breen on 19th Sept., 2012. Bevis had been ill for a while, but none the less it was a shock to poor Moira. She cared very deeply for her baby brother and spoke very highly of him to me many times. He had participated in WWII - in Burma. He will be buried on September 27th, 2012 in England. Moira will post an obituary a little later. But as I know our grand lady is loved and so deeply admired by so many on this list, I thought you would like to know. Bevis Breen was 86 years old. He is survived by his widow. Very sad for our Moira, Sandra Campagnac-Carney ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Sandra, Please accept my heartfelt condolences on this great loss. May his soul rest in peace. Amen. Mike -----Original Message----- From: sandra carney <sandracarney@nc.rr.com> To: india-british-raj <india-british-raj@rootsweb.com> Sent: Tue, Sep 25, 2012 12:10 am Subject: [INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ] Sad News ~ Hello Listers, It is with deepest regret that I have to inform you that one of our members, Mark Steevens died on Thursday, Sept. 20th, 2012. Mark was in the process of compiling the History of the Anglo-Burmese people. He had access to hundreds of thousands of documents that would have been lost to history had it have not been for his discovery. He set up "The Anglo-Burmese Library", which you can find on google. It also has a FaceBook image. Although still in infancy, the Library has already astounded many and delighted many others who have found members of their family documented. The entire Trek and Casualty list WWII is on there - This in itself has put to rest the questions of many who had lost trace of their loved ones and friends following World War II. So much more really - Mark Steevens' loss is irreplaceable. He had more knowledge in his head about Anglo-Burmese History than anyone else in our realm. I came to know him quite by accident, when he found that some of my grandfather's work, which I was still working on editing to get published, was being sold on the internet - an entire chapter ... I contacted the site and following a call from their Lawyer, with a lot of sweet talk which lasted for 42 minutes - the work was removed. Mark was so aware of and protective of all things Anglo-Burmese - he was the great "defender" of our race and as he saw it vanishing before his very eyes, he did not just talk, but took action to see that our history would be preserved for future generations. I cannot even begin to express how shocked I was this morning when I received a note from Matilda Steevens, his wife. Mark died quite suddenly and unexpectedly in England. His funeral will be in Bedford on October 4th. Matilda will continue on with the concept of the Library - Mark and she shared the idea and she knows how to go forward. Please continue to visit Mark's "Anglo-Burmese Library". We can pay no greater tribute to this important man than to continue his life's dream. Mark Steevens was 59 years old. With the saddest heart for this great loss, Sandra Campagnac-Carney ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to INDIA-BRITISH-RAJ-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Listers, I also wanted to let you know that our beloved Moira Breen lost her only brother, Bevis Breen on 19th Sept., 2012. Bevis had been ill for a while, but none the less it was a shock to poor Moira. She cared very deeply for her baby brother and spoke very highly of him to me many times. He had participated in WWII - in Burma. He will be buried on September 27th, 2012 in England. Moira will post an obituary a little later. But as I know our grand lady is loved and so deeply admired by so many on this list, I thought you would like to know. Bevis Breen was 86 years old. He is survived by his widow. Very sad for our Moira, Sandra Campagnac-Carney

Hello Listers, It is with deepest regret that I have to inform you that one of our members, Mark Steevens died on Thursday, Sept. 20th, 2012. Mark was in the process of compiling the History of the Anglo-Burmese people. He had access to hundreds of thousands of documents that would have been lost to history had it have not been for his discovery. He set up "The Anglo-Burmese Library", which you can find on google. It also has a FaceBook image. Although still in infancy, the Library has already astounded many and delighted many others who have found members of their family documented. The entire Trek and Casualty list WWII is on there - This in itself has put to rest the questions of many who had lost trace of their loved ones and friends following World War II. So much more really - Mark Steevens' loss is irreplaceable. He had more knowledge in his head about Anglo-Burmese History than anyone else in our realm. I came to know him quite by accident, when he found that some of my grandfather's work, which I was still working on editing to get published, was being sold on the internet - an entire chapter ... I contacted the site and following a call from their Lawyer, with a lot of sweet talk which lasted for 42 minutes - the work was removed. Mark was so aware of and protective of all things Anglo-Burmese - he was the great "defender" of our race and as he saw it vanishing before his very eyes, he did not just talk, but took action to see that our history would be preserved for future generations. I cannot even begin to express how shocked I was this morning when I received a note from Matilda Steevens, his wife. Mark died quite suddenly and unexpectedly in England. His funeral will be in Bedford on October 4th. Matilda will continue on with the concept of the Library - Mark and she shared the idea and she knows how to go forward. Please continue to visit Mark's "Anglo-Burmese Library". We can pay no greater tribute to this important man than to continue his life's dream. Mark Steevens was 59 years old. With the saddest heart for this great loss, Sandra Campagnac-Carney

http://quizderek.blogspot.in/2012/08/the-obriens-of-india-and-pakistan_13.html Well worth the read. It will cause some thinking to be done too. ooroo