I ran across this way to determine those 3rd cousin, twice removed things. It was new to me and it seems to work in my tests. Count the number of generations back to the common ancestor for you and your "cousin." The number of cousin is 1 less than the lower number of generations to the common ancestor. The number of times removed is the difference between the number of generations between the two "cousins." So, If I am 5 generations away from the common ancestor and you are 7, then we are 5 - 1 = 4th cousins. As for removeds, 7 - 5 =2 times removed. So we are 4th cousins twice removed. Cheryl Rothwell LoganCty@mindspring.com http://www.rootsweb.com/~illogan/loindex.htm Central Illinois Regional Coordinator, ILGenWeb --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.281 / Virus Database: 149 - Release Date: 9/18/01