Hi Sandy, I don't have access to very much census data and what is available locally is only available Monday-Friday in the State Library during my work hours. I live in Ohio and there are no Illinois census records beyond 1850 available here. I own four unindexed sets of census records (1860 Bourbon County KS, 1870 Wyandotte County KS, 1870 Marion County IL and 1870 Fayette County IL). I have online access to 1850, 1880, 1900 and 1920 census records, most of which are not indexed. I have found Uriah W. Helm in 1857 Kansas Territorial Census, living near brother John Franklin Helm, and their sister Mary Ann Helm Loveless and her family and in-laws. 1865 Wayne County IL State Census (gives head of household, numbers and ages of people in household but no other names) 1880 Fayette County IL Census, with second wife and children -- none of his children by his first marriage are living with them. He and his wife died in 1885. I have not found a Margaret Helm(s) in any census that I have access to, either before or after the date of divorce that would fit Uriah's wife. I have found some 'stray' HELMs in later census records that *might* be their children but I have no way of knowing. I do have a "suspect": Margaret STOOPS who married Charles B. Carter (marriage is listed as Mrs. Margaret Stoops Helms) in 1892 and was living in Marion County in 1900 with one son, Harlan, near Uriah's brother Josiah. Harlan married in Marion County too. I've also found what looks like Margaret Stoops' mother, who remarried in IL abt 1860, living next door to Uriah HELM and family in the 1865 Wayne County State Census. But without a marriage or divorce record, I can't prove it. I don't have access to the 1860 census for any county and only have unindexed 1870 census records on CDs for Marion and Fayette County IL, and Wyandotte County, KS. I haven't found them in any of the townships where other family members were living in these counties. Since they were living in Wayne County in 1865, I suspect they probably married there and were living there in 1870. According to the 1865 census, they had one son under the age of 10, which places their marriage after 1855 and probably after 1857. Uriah's father died in TN between 1839-1846, but I cannot find his widow and children in any 1850 census. I have looked at every related family, hoping Elizabeth and the children might have been living with them but they are not. They had to have been in the vicinity of Fayette County because I have a marriage between Mary Ann Helm and James Loveless in May 1850. The next marriages take place in 1852 and 1853, both in Fayette County IL. By 1857 Uriah was in 'Bloody Kansas' with his brother, his sister Mary Ann and her families. By 1859, he was gone. By 1865 he was married to Margaret and living in Wayne County. Between then and 1880, I don't know where he was except that he filed for the divorce in Marion County in February 1877. Something very odd was happening with my families in 1877-1878, in that there are marriages and this divorce filed in Marion County but the families show up in Fayette County in 1880. The children of Mary Ann Helm and James Loveless all left Kansas in the 1870s and began marrying in 1877-1878 in Marion County but they didn't seem to live there, even though they had aunts, uncles and cousins that were. There are times when I just feel like I don't know what the heck I'm doing and I always feel that way with my *mystery* ancestors who are all connected to Marion County in some way. Cheryl [email protected] wrote: > Yes, I can see where you are having a difficult time. > > My first question to you is have you exhausted ALL of the census records available to you??? This is the most important > step, if you have not - or don't have access to them, let me know and I may be able to help you on this. The census records > may be able to provide you with clues - where was the mother born? Does one of the children have a middle name that could > be the mother's maiden name? My ancestors routinely gave the third or fourth child the maiden name of the mother, as the > middle name. It sure made my research a little easier at times. At times, the parents gave three or four children the same > middle name, which would turn out to be the mother's maiden name. You may find one of the mother's parents move into the > home, and be listed on the census. > > > Cheryl Helm > <[email protected] To: [email protected] > k.com> cc: > Subject: [ILMARION] Divorce Records > 05/09/01 > 06:14 PM > Please > respond to > ILMARION-L > > > > First of all, Jody, thank you and Sandy so much for all the work you've > done in posting so much information for all of us. > > Among the information from you or Sandy was a divorce record for Uriah W. > HELM vs. Margaret M, 13 Feb 1877 in Marion County. > I'm trying to identify his wife's maiden name. Unlike the rest of this > line, Uriah didn't marry in Fayette County. Since the > marriage doesn't show up in the IL online marriage database, and since I > did find them in Wayne County in the 1865 State > Census, I'm afraid that's where they married which means there is no > marriage record any more thanks to the yahoo who wanted a > new county courthouse and so burned down the old one to force the issue. > > Does anyone know what kinds of information might be available in a divorce > record and how I would go about getting a copy of > the file? I'm hoping that it might identify their marriage date, > Margaret's maiden name which I suspect is STOOPS, and any > minor children living at the time of the divorce. > > The last time I wrote the Marion County Clerk for a marriage record for my > Marion R(eally frustrating) PHILLIPS and Susan > LOVELESS, I got back a paper with nothing but their names and the name of > the JP who performed the marriage. Not very helpful > -( > > Cheryl Helm, Ohio > > ==== ILMARION Mailing List ==== > To unsubscribe from the ILMARION List if you are in mail mode, send to > [email protected] If you are receiving messages in the > digest mode, send to [email protected] > > ==== ILMARION Mailing List ==== > To unsubscribe from the ILMARION List if you are in mail mode, send to > [email protected] If you are receiving messages in the digest mode, send to [email protected]