Jamene, is this a legit email from you? Laszlo (Les) Josa -----Original Message----- From: hungary-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:hungary-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of jamene.farrell@yahoo.com Sent: Saturday, October 09, 2010 6:59 AM To: Hungary-L@rootsweb.com; jangreenlaw@comcast.net; hhbernard@yahoo.com; caitlin.farrell@trincoll.edu; kkfletcher@fidelco.org; mross@columbushouse.org; capebird@charter.net; peterbennett88@yahoo.com; Dink821@aol.com Subject: [HUNGARY] (no subject) http://www.encafe.co.kr/to.php Best regards, ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HUNGARY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

http://www.encafe.co.kr/to.php Best regards,

Subject: Toxic waste disaster I received this info from my relative near the "spill" with many websites for those interested. Hello Jim! God loves us, none of us is affected by this disaster! A big part of Kolontár (this is the name of village), a medium part of Devecser (this is a very-very small city) and a small part of Somlóvásárhely were detroyed by this toxic material. The distance from us is about 72 km. Unfortunatelly this toxic material went to Marcal (this is river), where the complete wildlife is extincted. That was dangerous, because Marcal ends in Raba, Raba ends in Duna...... Fortunatelly just a very-very-very small part of this toxic material could go to Raba, because this "infection" was stopped before. Galleries: http://galeria.index.hu/bulvar/2010/10/04/iszapomles_devecserben/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/04/mentik_az_embereket_devecseren/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/04/kolontaron_mar_takaritjak_az_utcakat/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/04/kolontar_este/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/05/a_katasztrofa_utani_reggel_kolontaron/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/05/az_aradas_nyomai_devecseren/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/05/legifelvetelek_az_atszakadt_gatrol/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/05/elmult_a_vorosiszaparadas_miatti_kozvetlen_veszely/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/05/vorosiszap_alatt_kolontar/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/06/az_atszakadt_vorosiszap_tarozo/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/06/kolontar/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/07/ajkai_iszapomles_vonul_a_szennyezes_a_marcalon_a_raban/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/07/orban_itt_nem_lehet_elni/ http://galeria.index.hu/belfold/2010/10/07/friss_legifotok_kolontar_es_somlovasarhely_tersegerol/ And a report: http://news.yahoo.com/video/world-15749633/toxic-sludge-flood-22309659 Best regards: Szabolcs

----- Original Message ----- From: Ilona Kiss Sent: Thursday, October 07, 2010 4:54 PM Subject: A flood of toxic sludge - The Big Picture - Boston.com http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2010/10/a_flood_of_toxic_sludge.html

It has reached the Danube now. Here's the article:http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101007/ap_on_he_me/eu_hungary_sludge_flood Nick M. Gombash nickmgombash@yahoo.com www.hungaryexchange.com --- On Wed, 10/6/10, Glenn Stefanovics <gstefanovics@blr.com> wrote: From: Glenn Stefanovics <gstefanovics@blr.com> Subject: Re: [HUNGARY] Hungary and water To: hungary@rootsweb.com Date: Wednesday, October 6, 2010, 1:08 PM They're working hard to keep a toxic sludge spill from reaching the Danube, where it could destroy a thousand miles of interior waterways. -----Original Message----- From: hungary-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:hungary-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Hogan Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 2:07 PM To: hungary@rootsweb.com Subject: [HUNGARY] Hungary and water Does anyone know anything about something happening to the water in Hungary? Thanks ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HUNGARY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HUNGARY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101006/ap_on_he_me/eu_hungary_sludge_flood Here is the latest Julie B in NC

They're working hard to keep a toxic sludge spill from reaching the Danube, where it could destroy a thousand miles of interior waterways. -----Original Message----- From: hungary-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:hungary-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Hogan Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 2:07 PM To: hungary@rootsweb.com Subject: [HUNGARY] Hungary and water Does anyone know anything about something happening to the water in Hungary? Thanks ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HUNGARY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Does anyone know anything about something happening to the water in Hungary? Thanks

Here's a good article on it, that I posted on my facebook last night.. it's from Yahoo News: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101006/ap_on_bi_ge/eu_hungary_sludge_flood Nick M. Gombash nickmgombash@yahoo.com www.hungaryexchange.com --- On Wed, 10/6/10, Glenn Stefanovics <gstefanovics@blr.com> wrote: From: Glenn Stefanovics <gstefanovics@blr.com> Subject: Re: [HUNGARY] Hungary and water To: hungary@rootsweb.com Date: Wednesday, October 6, 2010, 1:08 PM They're working hard to keep a toxic sludge spill from reaching the Danube, where it could destroy a thousand miles of interior waterways. -----Original Message----- From: hungary-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:hungary-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Hogan Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 2010 2:07 PM To: hungary@rootsweb.com Subject: [HUNGARY] Hungary and water Does anyone know anything about something happening to the water in Hungary? Thanks ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HUNGARY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HUNGARY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Thanks Cheryl, Marika

Wow, thanks Cheryl another wonderful article! I heard a story that one of my grandfather's sister's was married to a man whose family were gypsies. I don't know if there was any truth to it, but she had someone in the family smuggle her out and gave her passage money to America. Also the one about Brass Checks 1908 was interesting, because when my grandfather worked in the coalmines of West Virginia they had to buy from the Company Store as well. Sharon

In a message dated 10/4/2010 7:02:28 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, cherlock@cheqnet.net writes: The Evening World New York, New York Dec. 8, 1908 ASHOKAN DAM Workmen Paid Brass Checks Instead Of Cash Thanks Cheryl, Marika

Would anyone have any ideas on who I might be able to hire to do some research in Hungary? I need someone reliable and not too expensive because I'm on a fixed income. I have checked out some of the places online and have no idea who is reliable and who won't think because I live in America, that I'm loaded with money. Ha ha. I noticed that some do church records and I have all of that already from the Family History Library. I've really hit a brick wall that I really need someone there to break down for me. Thanks, any suggestions will be much appreciated. Sharon Dickson-Engelman

The Evening World New York, New York Dec. 8, 1908 ASHOKAN DAM Workmen Paid Brass Checks Instead Of Cash These are good only at "Company Stores," Where victims pay double prices Men herded like pigs in pen on city contract. When MacArthur Bros. Company, the favored contractors of the McClellan administration, got the $12,500,000 contract for building the Ashokan Dam, and John Piercer's bid, lower by $2,500,000 was rejected by the Board of Water Supply, the reason given for the award to the higher bidder was that the MacArthur Bros. Company was a more desirable contractor because they paid their labor so well. The Evening World presents some evidence today of just how well the MacArthur Bros. company is treating its labor through the installation of a system of brass checks and the "company's store," reminders of the days of "Fingy" Conners and his chain of saloons on the shores of the Great Lakes and the riots of Homestead, Pennsylvania. Section 384. 1., of the Penal Code compels the payment of wages of employees on such work as the Aqueduct in cash. Any person, or corporation, who does not pay the wages of its employees in cash as provided by Article 1 of the Labor law is guilty of a misdemeanor, and upon conviction therefore shall be fined not less than $25 nor more than $50 for each offense." Here is the result of a careful investigation of the labor conditions on the Ashokan Dam Contract: By Samuel A. STODEL - Organizer for the Industrial Workers of the World and an investigator for the Brotherhood Welfare Association. The good citizens of New York who are to be benefited by the pure water from the Catskill watershed for which they are paying $161,000,000, will be greatly surprised to learn that a system of brass checks, similar to that utilized by "Fingy" Conners along the docks of Buffalo, is now in operation at Brown's Station, in Ulster County. The proprietors of this particular brass check system are the MacArthur Bros. and Winston & Co, contractors working under the supervision of Mayor McClellan's Board of Water Supply. I went into the "water district" to investigate conditions there for the Brotherhood Welfare Assoc., to whom MacArthur Bros and Winston & Co, the latter being subsidiary contractors, had applied for men, claiming that they could furnish them employment at 20 cents an hour for laborers. Sixteen Hundred Herded Like Pigs On Nov. 18th., I arrived at Brown's Station, which is a little settlement located sixteen miles west of Kingston on the Ulster and Delaware Railroad. Aside from about 1,900 working on the Ashokan Dam in various capacities, including engineers, inspectors, etc., there are probably forty families, old settlers, still remaining in that locality. About 200 of the better paid employees live at the contractor's boarding houses, where conditions are fair, $22.50 a month being charged. About 100 engineers and inspectors live in very good condition at Brown's Farm and Brooks Beaver Kill Club. The remaining 1,600 are herded like pigs on the hill overlooking the Ulster River, which is more of a creek than anything else. These houses for the laborers are built upon piles, about 3 feet above the ground, and are of rough lumber, sheathed with inferior building paper on the outside. They are about 130 feet long and 13 feet deep and fourteen feet high. Inside they are divided off into compartments less than 13 feet square, and in each of these compartments are tiers of bunks, with accommodation for 8 persons. These bunks are made from rough lumber. There is no attempt at ventilation except from such air as comes through cracks in the floors and side walls. In each room there is a small cooking stove, which completes the furnishings. For dishes and cooking utensils old cans pickup up in the vicinity of the railroad station are pressed into use. The men are charged $1 for each blanket, most of which have previously been worn out on horses. The rent charged for these wretched quarters is $2 a man a month, or $38,500 rent a year from the workmen for premises that did not cost $1,500 to build. It was in regard to the condition of the plain laborers, their wages and their method of living, that I was sent into the district by the Brotherhood Welfare Association, my associates on the committee being John C. Calhoun, the Rev. William H. Johnston and Alexander Law. My instructions were to ascertain the true wages being paid to the laborers, how these wages were paid, and the general conditions prevailing in the district. Instead of being paid in American money for their labor, I found that these 1,600 workmen, who are employed by the City of New York through its contractors, are very seldom; if ever, paid anything other than brass checks, which the contractors have installed as a medium of exchange. No Cash Among Them These brass checks can be exchanged at a "company store" similar to those maintained at Homestead, Pa., before the great strike, for such articles of wearing apparel or food as the poor unfortunate laborer needs. During my stay of 11 days in the locality, traveling all the way from Brown's Station to High Falls, a distance of 20 miles, I was unable to change a $1 bill among the laborers. In fact, I found that there was a premium on money - $1 ? money being worth $1.50 in brass. It was not until I had visited the store and priced the articles offered for sale there that I understood the cause behind this premium. No peddlers are allowed to circulate among the men and offer their goods for sale, and any who ? to sell goods to the men are driven off by the contractor's private detectives, who hustle the intruders out of the camps. This is to force the laborers to go to the store. Very few of the laborers get over 15 cents an hour. None know when they go to work what they are going to work for. The 8 hour law is openly violated. In the fall the men worked 10 hours a day, and during my stay in the district the men were worked 9 hours a day, the extreme limit on account of the light. They are even working one driver for two carts. Store System Robbery The charges at the "company stores" are from 25 to 150 per cent more than the same grade of goods can be purchased for in any large community. Potatoes are valued at 1 cent each. Cabbage heads bring 20 cents and upward. Chuck steak brings 18 and 20 cents a pound. Butter of a very poor quality, is sold for 35 cents a pound. The poorest coffee I ever tasted sells for 30 cents a pound, a grade worse than 12 cent coffee sold on the East side. 10 cent cotton socks bring 25 cents a pair. A 35 cent undershirt or pair of drawers brings 75 cents each. A pair of pantaloons sells for $3 also. A pair of 50 cent buckskin gloves sells for $1.35. The 1,600 laborers are divided as to nationalities in about this proportion: Negroes, 400 Italians and Hungarians, 800 and the remainder principally Irish, English, German and American. When a man has worked one day he can draw $1 in brass. These checks are issued like regular money at the contractors offices in 50 cent, 25 cent, 1? cent, 5 cent and 1 cent pieces. They are paid off about the 20th of every month and twenty days pay is always held back by the contractor. "Bootleggers" Are Allowed Thus it will be seen that a man has to work fifty days before he can get hold of his first piece of American money, providing he has any left which, according to the books at the store, is still coming to him. One man, Peter McGuire, of Waterbury, Conn., drew $1.35 for his months pay ending Nov. 29?. While whiskey is no sold to the men at the store it can be got by the laborers from "bootleggers," who have the privilege of selling to them at the camps. These privileged characters, who must "stand in" with the foreman in order to get into the camps charge 50 cents a pint for "third-rail," worse is sold at any Tenth Avenue "shock house." The laborer pays for his liquor with a 50 cent brass check, which the venders rebate for 40 cents. On one Sunday one of the venders to my knowledge sold 60 pints of this whiskey, most of it in the neighborhood of the bull pen.

For those with Poles in their trees........ The Evening Herald Klamath Falls, Oregon June 10, 1920 Polish Women Coming To United States New York A transport bringing 800 wives and children of Polish Immigrants in this country is on the way from Danzig to an American port, according to information received here by the Hebrew Sheltering and Immigrant Society. This is the first group of a total of 50,000 families to be brought to America to be reunited with husbands and fathers from whom they have been separated by war for more than six years. The Hebrew society has undertaken to find the wives and children of Polish Immigrants who have been prevented by the war from sending any aid to their families, many of whom have been driven out of their homes in the war zone and have become lost to their kind in this country. "This is not a project of new immigration," said John L. BORNSTEIN, the societies president. "Much harm has been done by the statement that we were inducing Jewish people of Poland to come over. That is not the fact. We have absolutely no concern with any intended immigrants except the wives and children of men already in this country, more than 60 per cent of whom are now American citizens." Mr. Berstein said that the work which the society was carrying on was done with the hearty consent and co-operation of the bureau of immigration and the state department. "We began our work," he said, "by advertising that we would attempt to locate these men's families and help them get to America. Our seven agencies all over the country were immediately flooded with pleas from 50,000 men who, because of the war, had not been able to bring their families over or even communicate with them. In some cases the men had no idea where their loved ones were. "Our task has been to take what information we could get of the last known residences of these wives and children and put our commissioners in Poland on the trail to locate them. When this is done we advise the family head in America how much money it will take to bring his people over and help him through the formalities of proving their right of admittance. When the families actually arrive we will care for them until they can be established in their new homes which are scattered over the United States but generally in cities, not in farms." Please post this on any Polish sites you may belong to.

The Syracuse Herald Syracuse, New York April 20, 1930 College Professor Tells How He Fiddled His Way Into Strange Adventures With Hungarian Gypsies Dr. Walter STARKIE of Trinity College, Dublin, Describes Fantastic Fights and Frolics in Real Vagabondia With Tribes That Have Never Slept Under A Roof By: Hazel CANNING In all of us there are two selves. As our first conventional, self, solicitous of what the neighbors may say, we go through our nine to five routine, comb our hair as custom decrees, put away a little something regularly in the savings bank, and sigh at night - because our day has left us so unsatisfied. In the person of this proper, civilized self, we sit at desks through all the golden hours of the light, and write books or transact a weary mass of sedentary business. We play our roles as men, ultra civilized. But all the while our second self is making faces at our respectable self, and clamoring to be let out of prison. Sometimes some of us wish we might join the crew of Captain Kidd, or hold up the robber barons in the forest, as the right hand man of Robin Hood. We may, perhaps, wish to ride a wild horse in the circus, or to play gypsy across a strange land and lie down at night under twinkling stars. We want to let ourselves go - to feel strange delights, to indulge in frenzy, maybe. For such reasons did Dr. Walter STARKIE shake the learned dust of Trinity College, Dublin, from his shoes, put on a soiled old khaki suit, toss a knapsack over his back and set out, on foot, to travel with a band of Hungarian gypsies and pay his way with his violin. So Dr. STARKIE explains himself the reason why he, a college professor and director of the Abbey Theater, Dublin, and the chairman of the reception committee to great distinguished visitors for the Irish Free State), started off one day this last year to live by his fiddle with the gypsies. "All men need to let themselves go. I wanted to study gypsy music as a member of a gypsy band. I wanted to find out, what influence it had on peasants of Hungary and Rumania. Gypsy music. I found out, does for the gypsy and the peasant what Dionysius did for the citizens of old Greece. He did more than free them with the influence of his wine. He showed them what it is to be elevated in spirit. What a good thing for a man is a little frenzy, now and then. We have small chance of becoming elevated, in our prosaic modern age. We have little chance of frenzy, in our mechanized era. But these I found, when I danced at gypsy weddings and mourned with the mourners to the wailing cadence of the fiddle and the cello and the bass violin at a gypsy funeral. Life would not be possible, to me, without this elevation and this frenzy." Dr. Sparkie spoke recently about gypsy music, and his adventures with the gypsies of Hungary and Rumania. And this story of his is one to make Robert Louis Stevenson's, "Travels with a donkey" mild and tame, by comparison. First, Dr. Starkie tells how he was able to join a gypsy band at all. "The gypsies are very natural people, and they found me natural, I believe. The way I introduced myself to any horde that took my fancy was to approach them in a café, or in a village square, and to play my fiddle. To the gypsy, the old music handed down from primitive times, the folk lore of the countries where their ancestors have told fortunes and robbed doughty folk who live in houses - to them this music is a sacred thing. "It is they who have preserved it. Well, once I remember I played in a tavern where one of the gypsies prided himself on being the premier fiddler, I played my best, old gypsy strains, and they all paid attention. Finally a bystander, one of the peasants for whom the gypsies have kept alive the old music, remarked that my music was most acceptable. The conceited fellow responded: 'For a non-gypsy his talent is not bad.' "They accepted me as one of them and we set out on our vagabondage. They knew well that I was not one of them, but it did not seem at all strange that I, of the race of men who sleep under a roof, should want to roam the world with my fiddle and lie down in their mixed company at night, to sleep under the stars. They did not know that I had left a suitcase, with decent clothes and a sum of money that would seem big to them, in a town toward which we were faring, nor did they imagine that when we reached Budapest I donned those clothes of civilization and fraternized with the colleagues of mine, college professors. "The Hungarian gypsy professes to be a Catholic. They have a legend telling how one of their ancetors stole the fourth nail from the Cross. That is shy the crucifix has always only three. And that is also why they explain they have license to steal, once every seven years. Actually, they steal oftener than that. "Their weddings are the most frenzied ceremonies. The father of the bride will spend everything he has and invite everybody, gypsy and peasant. They drink, they play their marvellous, stirring music. In the middle of the three day rites, the father may send his old silver cups to the bank to raise more money for the festivities. All laugh, take joy in life and in marriage, its continuance, except the little bride. The one I saw sat in a corner and wept, ghastly frightened at her own bridal." But potent drama happened to this young man who, during eight months of most years, is a college professor and "greeter" for the Irish Free State. Let him tell about how once he was robbed. "It was in the hold of a vessel where I was traveling with a gypsy band in the evil-smelling steerage. I had a small sum of money with me, enough to pay my expenses for a 30 mile journey to the city where my clothes were waiting for me. The was one evil-smelling oil lamp burning on a table in the center of the steerage room. A gypsy man got up, wound the lamp with a cloth saturated in oil. The lamp flared up. A tongue of fire flew down to the floor. There was tremendous hysteria, shouts, cries of women and children, and all was overhung with a vile stench of burning oil and the heat of gross unwashed bodies. "After the hubbub was over I lay back to sleep, overcome by all the noxious fumes. When I wakened, my money was gone. I knew the rascal had started the fire for a smoke screen, that he might rob me during the confusion. I sought him out. "You have robbed me!" I said. "You cannot prove it!" he said. And he laughed in my face. There was nothing to do but to make a pleasant face of it. After we landed, I set out alone to connect up with my clothes. It was a travel of 30 miles, which I had to do on foot. If I ate, it would be thanks to my fiddle. At night I reached the house of a Hungarian peasant, I knocked and tried to make him understand I wanted shelter for the night. He would not open his door. They do not like to open, after they have gone to bed. I raised my fiddle and played a tune 'Hullamzg-Balatsn,' it is called, and it is one of their folk melodies, passionately beloved. "He opened the door and threw his arms about me. He took me in, fed me, insisted that I stay two days with him, and insisted that I sleep in his own bed. The houses, beds and food of the Hungarian peasant are scrupulously clean. "These gypsies whose souls are filled with music, these pagans who could teach melody to our tutored musicians, as they taught music to me, sometimes behaved like the most vicious wild men. The suddenness in which a fight could start, or tears could flow among them, was astounding. Once I started to take the picture of four gypsies playing at cards. One of the men came towards me and dealt me a terrific blow. I was on the ground in a moment, stunned and badly hurt. Others came rushing in to defend me. "Don't mind him!" they urged me, he is ugly. He has had bad luck at cards and he thinks it is your evil eye'. They pointed at the camera, I treated to 'reca' ? - a native brandy - all around. "I never knew of one marriage between a gypsy girl and Christian man to be successful. For one reason, to marry a gypsy girl is to marry her whole tribe. They come about visiting with their vermin and their rags and their stealing ways and, of course, their music. "So I could tell you many more stories of my travels with the gypsies, but, instead, I must now draw the moral. It is good for people to go vagabonding some time in their lives. In America you work that instinct out when, in your Middle West, you desert the quiet farms and go into the lumber camps of a winter. Or when you rig a bed in the Ford and set off for California. We may laugh at the gypsies; we may even scorn them as much as they scorn us, for the prisons of our houses and the slavery of our days.

Hi Carol, the two countries - prior to the 1876 agreement - could be used interchangeably since in practical terms they were the same. Even long years after there were folks who named either/or as their place of origin. To search for their true place of birth - you have to start at 'home'! :-) If you don't have any documents, certificates, or others stuff: old letters, pictures, etc., 'dig up' as much as you can about their way of life: what language was spoken at home; they way they dressed, which church they attended, what kind of family lore was left over via their progeny? Every little bit will help (no matter how insignificant if might seem) to narrow down the field. From what you told us they arrived separately and got to know each other here, got married and had children. Do you know exactly when they arrived? What port? From where? How many children were born, stayed alive and had children on their own? Are you in touch with any or all of them? Who 'inherited' the old homestead? Who might possess left over personal effects, papers, etc.? They might have had birth certificates (for their marriage), passports, letters from folks left behind in the old country, maybe even pictures? Since just about anybody arriving here joined a church here, going after those church records should be also rewarding; since you found them on the census, that can help locate their church. Local papers of the times will have to be consulted to find birth announcements, marriage notices, other local news which might shed light on them. Also keep in mind: after the 1920 census people were asked their country of origin in the 'present' countries of the time, which - in Trianon - changed a lot of borders. So if they say in the 1930 census records they were born in Hungary, then that excludes Austria, Czechoslovakia, Romania and Serbia. Going for their 'ancestral' home - 'across the pond' - is worth your while only if you have places of birth for them. Without those places it will be an almost futile effort, I'm afraid. Joe Equinunk, PA - USA jjarfas@verizon.net charris721@aol.com wrote: >Hello, >My great-grandparents, Frank Ulbrich and Maria Progner, came to Pittsburgh, PA in the 1890s. On their marriage application they list their place of birth as Austria, but on census info they list their place of birth as Hungary. Can anyone tell me why they would have done this and where should I be searching for their place of origin? > >Thank you. >Carol >

Hello all, as usual Joe is exactly correct. I could not have said it better. Carol whatever info you have please share with us and we will help you in figuring out your family history. You will eventually break a hole into the wall (obstacle). Laszlo (Les) Josa Hi Carol, the two countries - prior to the 1876 agreement - could be used interchangeably since in practical terms they were the same. Even long years after there were folks who named either/or as their place of origin. To search for their true place of birth - you have to start at 'home'! :-) If you don't have any documents, certificates, or others stuff: old letters, pictures, etc., 'dig up' as much as you can about their way of life: what language was spoken at home; they way they dressed, which church they attended, what kind of family lore was left over via their progeny? Every little bit will help (no matter how insignificant if might seem) to narrow down the field. From what you told us they arrived separately and got to know each other here, got married and had children. Do you know exactly when they arrived? What port? From where? How many children were born, stayed alive and had children on their own? Are you in touch with any or all of them? Who 'inherited' the old homestead? Who might possess left over personal effects, papers, etc.? They might have had birth certificates (for their marriage), passports, letters from folks left behind in the old country, maybe even pictures? Since just about anybody arriving here joined a church here, going after those church records should be also rewarding; since you found them on the census, that can help locate their church. Local papers of the times will have to be consulted to find birth announcements, marriage notices, other local news which might shed light on them. Also keep in mind: after the 1920 census people were asked their country of origin in the 'present' countries of the time, which - in Trianon - changed a lot of borders. So if they say in the 1930 census records they were born in Hungary, then that excludes Austria, Czechoslovakia, Romania and Serbia. Going for their 'ancestral' home - 'across the pond' - is worth your while only if you have places of birth for them. Without those places it will be an almost futile effort, I'm afraid. Joe Equinunk, PA - USA jjarfas@verizon.net charris721@aol.com wrote: >Hello, >My great-grandparents, Frank Ulbrich and Maria Progner, came to Pittsburgh, PA in the 1890s. On their marriage application they list their place of birth as Austria, but on census info they list their place of birth as Hungary. Can anyone tell me why they would have done this and where should I be searching for their place of origin? > >Thank you. >Carol > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HUNGARY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hello, My great-grandparents, Frank Ulbrich and Maria Progner, came to Pittsburgh, PA in the 1890s. On their marriage application they list their place of birth as Austria, but on census info they list their place of birth as Hungary. Can anyone tell me why they would have done this and where should I be searching for their place of origin? Thank you. Carol

Why thank you Marika! cheryl -------------------------------------------------- From: <MLPecsi@aol.com> Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2010 9:42 AM To: <hungary@rootsweb.com> Subject: Re: [HUNGARY] Hungary Has Lost Millions 1905 (followup) > Cheryl, thank you for this most interesting article. > Here is some information on Sauk City, Wisconsin today. > > > It appears to be the oldest incorporated village in the state and > features > today: > > Halasz Manor: Charles Halasz Home > Charles Halasz, cousin of Agoston Haraszthy, built this home in 1861. He > married Emma Rendtorff and founded what became the Lachmund Lumber > Company. > This house remained in the family until 1944, one of the oldest homes in > the village of Sauk City. It is now three apartments on Water Street. > > The emigration to America has set in only since the > eighteenth century, and in 1841 the Hungarians founded in the state of > Wisconsin, the colony of Harasztyfaulu, which now, as Sauk City, has long > lost > all trace of Magyar character. (article written in Feb. 1905) > > It appears the Freethinkers from Germany gained some influence in the > village of Sauk City, coming here in 1852 and having a German language > curriculum until WW1 1917. > > The following hyperlinks are better copy-pasted for viewing: > > Their historical society features a Halasz Manor. > _http://www.saukcity.net/historicregistry.htm#halasz_ > (http://www.saukcity.net/historicregistry.htm#halasz) > > History features: The oldest incorporated village in Wisconsin. > _http://www.saukcity.net/historicpreservation.htm_ > (http://www.saukcity.net/historicpreservation.htm) > > > > Marika > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > HUNGARY-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >