Ah memories of my highschool love Gerda van Tilbourg, tis odd how the human mind works at times, just seeing a similar can provoke all manner of delight. > I assume this synod has taken place in Dordrecht > (Netherlands) as Dordt was the old name of the town. Hmm an atlas, my computer desk for an atlas. Perhaps another Walloon descendent can advise if Dordrecht and Dordt are one and the same. Gerda assumes that this is so ? Hmm I have no idea now and so I shall ask. Ar the Arminsians also Walloon ? Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Hello Fellow Listers Now it has come to my mind that not all refugee Huguenots surely wandered off to far off North America, Wales, Ireland, Belgium, England, South Africa or Scotland. I wonder if any made the journey to the East Indies, afterall the Dutch did have a huge stake in that region. Perhaps some settled in India or even far off Cathay ? I know some did make it as far as Australia, although they were more likely the ancestors of Huguenots. Did Dirk Hartog have Walloon crew members ? For those who are not aware or have forgotten basic history, he happened to bump into Australia some 150 years prior to the Englishman Cook. And how, if our brave ancestors did arrive in the east, did they get there ? And what became of them after they arrived ? Kind of opens the field somewhat ? Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Ah hah! See folks, just the mention of what would seem a minor thing to me at least, may open a small window of opportunity to others. I hope that Andrew finds something of value to his research. And the La Trobe ancestors, what a wonderful story. But before our very quiet concierge leaps from her balcony, let's see if this topic can be related to things Huguenot. Obviously from Andrew's side it is. How do the La Trobe family come to have a Huguenot connection ? By simply answering, I am sure that all things will relate to this Huguenot-Walloon mailing list. Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Andrew, You have or are aware of this page ? Languedoc and Sellon, mentioned on the same page ? http://pw1.netcom.com/~latrobe/legend.htm Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Roy - Perhaps no one at the time was persecuted as a follower if Jacob, I do not know. Certainly his teachings later caused great upsets amongst the early Dissenters from the Anglican faith. This extract is from TOPLADY AS A CONTROVERSIALIST BY REV. J. C. RYLE D.D. [Extract from his "Church Leaders of 18th century"] Found at: http://www.soft.net.uk/arden/toplady.doc . "He appears to think it impossible that an Arminian can be saved, and never shrinks with classing Arminians with Pelagians, Socinians, Papists, and heretics. He says things about Wesley and Sellon which never ought to have been said. All this is melancholy work indeed! But those who are familiar with Toplady's controversial writings know well that I am stating simple truths." Augustus Toplady had attacked John Wesley and Rev. Walter Sellon in his Arminianism: The Road to Rome! (See http://www.swrb.com/newslett/actualnls/RHNarmin.htm Mr. Sellon, moreover, reminds me (p. 128.) that, "while the shepherds are quarrelling, the wolf gets into the sheep fold;" not impossible: but it so happens, that the present quarrel is not among "the shepherds," but with the "wolf" himself; which "quarrel" is warranted by every maxim of pastoral meekness and fidelity. <snip> Should it be said, "True, this proves that Arminianism is Pelagianism revived; but it does not prove, that the doctrines of Arminianism are originally Popish:" a moment's cool attention will make it plain that they are. Wesley and Selina, Countess of Huntingdon, were very much working together until the outbreak of the Arminian controversy rent the dissenters, they held opposing views. (It was not until Rev. William Sellon, of Clerkenwell, ran her through the Ecclesiastical Courts, and won, that Selina, Countess of Huntingdon, neatly turned the tables on him by invoking the Toleration Acts and declaring herself a Dissenter, taking all her chapels with her). There was perhaps not such a further upheaval until Puseyism. Yours Aye Andrew Sellon East Anglia I solemnly believe blue and red baboons to be more popular here than Catholics and Presbyterians; they are more understood, and there is a greater disposition to do something for them. When a country squire hears of an ape, his first feeling is to give it nuts and apples; when he hears of a Dissenter, his immediate impulse is to commit it to the county jail, to shave its head, to alter its customary food, and to have it privately whipped. Rev. Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. From: <[email protected]> Subject: [HWE] Synod of Dordt > I wonder if anyone knows of the 'Synod of Dort' ? > > 1618 and it seems that not everyone was all excited > about this Calvinism. Especially is one were a follower > of Jacob Arminius. > > Was anyone persecuted for being one of his followers ? > > The Arminiainists had much difficulty with Beza and > Calvin, so much so that in 1610 a nifty little document > was produced 'The Remonstrance'. > > Now all you folks who are of Dutch ancestry will most > likely know of this document which was directly > opposite the thoughts of Calvinist doctrine. > > Does anyone have any information or had ancestors who > were strongly involved with the beginnings of this side > of the Reformation ? > > I do hope that there are not too many who still believe > that the Reformation was all to do with this Calvin > character, after all, it did begin before his birth and > ended long after his death. >

Bronwyn has an interesting ancestor. Just as a first step I wonder if she has contacted the Huguenot Society ? http://www.huguenotsociety.org.uk/ or perhaps the Walloon Society, )yes they do have some webpage information in English) http://www.vallon.a.se/ Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Now how did I know that Andrew would be in a position to provide us all with some very interesting information on this topic ? Thank you to Andrew Sellon. Hmm I wonder if the Sellon mentioned in his post is an ancestor ? Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

I wonder if anyone knows of the 'Synod of Dort' ? 1618 and it seems that not everyone was all excited about this Calvinism. Especially is one were a follower of Jacob Arminius. Was anyone persecuted for being one of his followers ? The Arminiainists had much difficulty with Beza and Calvin, so much so that in 1610 a nifty little document was produced 'The Remonstrance'. Now all you folks who are of Dutch ancestry will most likely know of this document which was directly opposite the thoughts of Calvinist doctrine. Does anyone have any information or had ancestors who were strongly involved with the beginnings of this side of the Reformation ? I do hope that there are not too many who still believe that the Reformation was all to do with this Calvin character, after all, it did begin before his birth and ended long after his death. Some would even venture that it continues to this day. Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Shirley - It must be gratifying to be related to the prettiest girl at the Paris Ball of Lady Granville, a leading light in London Society of the time. Just as a palliative, let us remember that Rev. Sydney Smith's mother was most definite Huguenot; her maiden name being Ollier. To keep the Nelsonian connection going, (very difficult on a Huguenot list), and a further view on Bishops, (Anglican ones), see below. Yours Aye (Naughty but Not New ) Andrew Sellon East Anglia I would rather have the approbation of Sir Thomas Hardy [Nelson's Flag Captain] than that of several bishops. If Bishops approved, the sermons must be pompous, intolerant and full of useless Theology. If Sir Thomas likes them they are true, honest and useful. Rev. Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. Letter to Lady Hardy, 26th March 1839. (777). From: "Shirley Arabin" <[email protected]> > > Maria Rumbold (1788-1875) married Septimus Arabin R.N.(1785-1855). Hence my > interest in the S.Smiths. <snip> > "Admiral Sir Sydney Smith who had married the widow of Sir Geo Rumbold.

I just knew that Andrew would bring this topic back to something to do with Huguenots Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Andrew - Maria Rumbold (1788-1875) married Septimus Arabin R.N.(1785-1855). Hence my interest in the S.Smiths. from "Recollections of a Diplomatist" by Sir Horace Rumbold,Bart. who was brought up by his aunt Maria second dau. of Sir Wm Rumbold, who was a son of Sir Geo.Rumbold. p.65.."our first days stage from Avignon ending at the sleepy old city of Aix en Provence - whence, by the way, the Arabins, originally Huguenot Provencal noblesse driven out at the revocation of the Edict of Nantes, derive their ancestry, was marred by a violent mistral, that scourge of the valley of the Rhone." Septimus then lived at 6 Rue d'Anjou, St.Honore,Paris "Admiral Sir Sydney Smith who had married the widow of Sir Geo Rumbold was very partial to Septimius. Before his death, he made over a large tract of land at Rio de Janeiro which had been presented to him by King John of Portugal, to Septimius. But when the title of this very valuable property was enquired into, it was found impossible to prove it owing to Sir Sydneys neglect to have it registered, so that Septimus failed to get it. "Admiral Sir Sydney Smith who had married the widow of Sir Geo Rumbold was very partial to Septimus. Before his death, he made over a large tract of land at Rio de Janeiro which had been presented to him by King John of Portugal, to Septimus. But when the title of this very valuable property was enquired into, it was found impossible to prove it owing to Sir Sydneys neglect to have it registered, so that Septimus failed to get it. "Septimus was obliged to leave Paris owing to severe pecuniary losses so had to give up his residence to the Rue d'Anjou and to sell his furniture etc and he moved to Nice" p.138."Another - a very different figure - rises up and fills my thoughts ; that of the dear old man(Septimus) who had brought me up and had stood me in a father's stead. Had I skill to portray him,I would use none but the softest most delicate tints, for in this veteran of our greatest naval struggles, who had landed with Abercromby in Egypt, had fought at Maida, had forced the Dardanelles with Duckworth, had followed Sir Sydney Smith in his adventurous career, there dwelt a soul as tender and gentle, a mind as pure and unselfish as we are wont to associate only with the most perfect of womankind. Precious to me therefore is the recollection of the last winter I spent with him at this time: I still weak and ailing, but he fast breaking up, yet far more thoughtful of my condition than his own heavy load of trouble and ill health. Some years later I met with him again in fiction, and with strange emotions, traced the same tender yet unselfish over-confiding nature sketched to the life by the great novelist in that most pathetic of his creations, the elder Newcombe" Poor old Septimus had incredibly bad luck financially. He invested in land in Ceylon and could not obtain title there either, and he invested in the Bank of Australia which collapsed. There was also some other land disaster in Australia. He retired as Rear Admiral. Shirley Arabin Mount Maunganui, New Zealand . ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Sellon" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, 17 September 2003 22:38 > Shirley - > > As you rightly say, very much the same period, but not related. > > They met at least once in Paris, the gallant Admiral was not quite sure what > too make of the younger witty cleric. > Yours Aye Andrew Sellon East Anglia > At Lady Granville's Ball; nothing can be more superb. ... The prettiest girl > in the room was Miss Rumbold, the (step) daughter of (Adm.) Sir Sydney > Smith. Rev. Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. Letter (from Paris) > to Mrs. Sydney Smith, 27th April 1826. (473). >

Are you speaking of "In Flanders Fields" by John McRae. It is about World War I. I have attached a link to a version of it: http://www.arlingtoncemetery.net/flanders.htm > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [SMTP:[email protected]] > Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 7:23 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: [HWE] Flanders > > Many of my ancestors came from Flanders. I seem to remember learning in > school a poem about the Poppies of Flanders field. Problem is I cannot > remember > the author or the title, can anyone help me? I am also looking for anyone > > looking for PIERRE DE LES PIERRE born about 1540. Also SUSANNE ACHAR born > about > 1577 Caloenene Pas de Calais, France, Her parents were TOUSSAIN ACHAR & > ADRIANE > NOIRS. Thanks for the help. > Phyl > > > ==== HUGUENOTS-WALLOONS-EUROPE Mailing List ==== > When posting to the HWE list: > SURNAMES written in capitals, s'il vous plaît. > Also, please specify dates and location, including country. > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, > go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237

Was the Rev Syd Smith related to the Admiral Sir Sydney Smith? About the same time period. Shirley Arabin Mount Maunganui, New Zealand . ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Sellon" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, 17 September 2003 20:20 Subject: Re: [HWE] How much ? > Peter - > > In which case you will surely agree with the below thought of my good > friend, Rev. Sydney Smith, a very independently minded Anglican Churchman.. > > Yours Aye Andrew Sellon East Anglia > It is a maxim with me that a Bishop must always be in the wrong. Rev. Sydney > Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. > > From: <[email protected]> > <snip> > > > > Just prior to the Wars of Religion my own family had > > collected a degree of wealth and now I can't even > > afford a computer upgrade. No wonder I have this little > > moment, now and again, when I see a bishop pass my way. > > > > It is genetics you see. > > > > Thank you again Barbara > > > > Kind Regards, > > Peter Leroy > > > > > > ==== HUGUENOTS-WALLOONS-EUROPE Mailing List ==== > When posting to the Huguenots-Walloons-Europe list: > Make your subject line specific and relevent. > eg. include topic or surname(s) and/or date and/or location. > > ============================== > To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: > http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 >

Hello Phyl At 07:22 PM 17-09-2003 -0400, [email protected] wrote: >Many of my ancestors came from Flanders. I seem to remember learning in >school a poem about the Poppies of Flanders field. Problem is I cannot >remember >the author or the title, can anyone help me? Try www.emory.edu/ENGLISH/LostPoets/McCrae.html A search on Google for either the author, McCrae, or the poem `In Flanders Fields' will produce numerous results. Cheers, Jim Jim & Lois Roberts, New Brunswick, Canada. <[email protected]> Currently Members of MLFHS (#8778), Devon FHS (#7506), Somerset & Dorset FHS (#7623B), LANCSGEN, CBGHA. All email checked by e-Trust EZ Antivirus-updated daily.

Many of my ancestors came from Flanders. I seem to remember learning in school a poem about the Poppies of Flanders field. Problem is I cannot remember the author or the title, can anyone help me? I am also looking for anyone looking for PIERRE DE LES PIERRE born about 1540. Also SUSANNE ACHAR born about 1577 Caloenene Pas de Calais, France, Her parents were TOUSSAIN ACHAR & ADRIANE NOIRS. Thanks for the help. Phyl

Hello Folks, Has any one heard from our beautiful concierge of late ? Her abscence is duely noted and she had better have a note for being away so long. Meantime... the wonderful Andrea has been known to make little posts from time to time concerning all sorts of ideas for those of us who are just setting out on the long journey of genealogy and family history. Why anyone would pick the middle bit first is only something that they can answer. But subscribed you did and now you sit "hiding" terrorfied of the darkness that is surely to be found in this most enjoyable of enjoyable mailing lists! Nothing further from the truth. This little list can provide you with an enormous amount of assistance. Ok, shush Mr. Fuller maybe I will just say some information. Yes some do tend to "waffle" along and write about all manner of topics, all to do with things Huguenot of course. It is very naughty to write about things that are not really related to this mailing list. For that kind of thing perhaps direct email to whomever you think might know something that you really really do need to know but alas it is not about your Huguenot ancestry. But!!! If you want to know or know something that needs to be told and it is about things Huguenot or Walloon, then press fingers to the keyboard and write away. It might be about one of your own ancestors, it might be about some important fact of the Wars of Religion, it might be a follow-up to something that you read while browsing the HWE posts. Whatever it is, do it and do it now before you forget! And for those who dont really believe that men ruled the Huguenot / Walloon world during those times, I am sure you might discover that there are one or two very very well versed lady subscribers who can fill entire books on the role of women in Huguenot times. And for those who may have an enquiry regarding the theology of the times, yes folks, there are one or two subscribers who are quite expert in that little field. Then of course there are the other 300 or so subscribers who sit quietly waiting to pounce on that juicy morsel of information but rarely say too much. They too, from time to time, also have information that while they might think is of no interest to other subscribers will be mightarily suprised to discover that they are actually a potential source for our newer subcribing "Fellows and Fellowettes" and some of the more mature variety. And so where might you find things, apart from asking in a post to the mailing list ? Well for starters try these URL's (a URL is the address you type at the top of your browser to find things on the Internet) The first URL is the webpage for this HWE mailing list. It will take you off to discover all manner of things. http://www.island.net/~andreav/index.html And this one is off to another site which attempts to answer that age old question.. What names might be Huguenot ? http://www.aftc.com.au/Huguenot/Huguenot_surnames.html So there we are new subscribers, and perhaps I have refreshed the memory of the old hmm nay; subscribers of the list who have been so for some time (sound better than old subscribers ?) Good luck with your research and a small "tip" for those beginning. a) check your information twice and if in doubt search for a third source b) do not believe all sources such as family webpages as being accurate. Many are, some are very good guesses c) Do not be backward in coming forward on this list with either question or answer. oops nearly forgot. Be nice, play good and smile lots. Ok Andrea you can come out now ? Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Shirley - As you rightly say, very much the same period, but not related. They met at least once in Paris, the gallant Admiral was not quite sure what too make of the younger witty cleric. I give below two mentions of him. Although he mocked 'dissenters' in general he very much stood up for their right to worship as they pleased. (Also, he was a major influence in the winning of the campaign for Roman Catholic emancipation). Yours Aye Andrew Sellon East Anglia At Lady Granville's Ball; nothing can be more superb. ... The prettiest girl in the room was Miss Rumbold, the (step) daughter of (Adm.) Sir Sydney Smith. Rev. Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. Letter (from Paris) to Mrs. Sydney Smith, 27th April 1826. (473). I bought the other day some Cheshire Cheese at Cullims in Bond St., desiring him to send it to Mrs. Sydney Smith. - He smiled and said Sr your name is very well known to me. No I replied Mr Cullim, I am not Sir Sydney Smith but Mr. Sydney Smith - "I am perfectly aware of that he said I am aware of whom I am addressing, I have often heard of the Cheeses you send to Lord Grey". So you see there is no escaping from Fame. Rev. Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. Letter to Lady Grey, 1st Feb. 1836. (710). From: "Shirley Arabin" <[email protected]> > Was the Rev Syd Smith related to the Admiral Sir Sydney Smith? About the > same time period.

Peter - In which case you will surely agree with the below thought of my good friend, Rev. Sydney Smith, a very independently minded Anglican Churchman.. Yours Aye Andrew Sellon East Anglia It is a maxim with me that a Bishop must always be in the wrong. Rev. Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. From: <[email protected]> <snip> > > Just prior to the Wars of Religion my own family had > collected a degree of wealth and now I can't even > afford a computer upgrade. No wonder I have this little > moment, now and again, when I see a bishop pass my way. > > It is genetics you see. > > Thank you again Barbara > > Kind Regards, > Peter Leroy >

Peter - What a disappointment! I have to confess to a preliminary skim of your post during which I came across the word 'avocat'. I live in the land of the avocet, and knew the word avocation, but 'avocat'? Out with my dictionary, (regrettably only the Concise Oxford, I still can not prevail upon my OED disc to work with Windows XP), but no help. I then did what I should have been doing earlier and read your post with some greater care, only to find that it was no more than a turgid typo, of the type that afflicts us all. Where upon I had a vague tinkling at the back of my cranium, was there not a pre-war concert pianist named Dupaty? At last my little grey cells got somewhere near up to speed - wrong again. Was he not named something like Denu Le Pati? (Very phonetic). Yours Aye Andrew Sellon East Anglia A Quaker baby? Impossible! There is no such thing; there never was; they are always born broad-brimmed and in full quake. Rev. Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. From: <[email protected]> <snip> > > I believe that this very ordinary avocat was born in > the Alsace region ? > <snip>

> > It is a maxim with me that a Bishop must always be in the wrong. Rev.Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. Why of course, but only if Roman Catholic between the year "Dot" and the end of the 'Wars of Religion' How could anyone subscribed to this particular mailing see anything but good in the good Reverand Smith. After all did not our ancestors go from those Bishops who gathered their daily tokens from the masses of good French folk by stealth or direct theft and move across the the channel to where more likable Bishops gave them assist right inside the Canterbury Cathedral ? And for free, well almost. I doubt that too many young Bishops of the Anglican faith back in those days could have mustered up the amounts that the "other" Bishops could over in France at that time. The 1,300,000 livre "donation" was not the only time that those illustrious and pious men of the Catholic cloth made such "donations" to the royal family in order to influence against our ancestors. But I should withdraw some comments as they may be taken as too direct for some or I am lacking equal opportunity for those followers of Calvin. Hmm I feel an urge to propose yet another question in regards, to funding and it is in line with this topic ? This Calvin character; ever wondered how he had the money for the bus ticket from Geneve to Paris ? And just who did pay his hotel bills and Visa card payments ? At various time historians seem to portray this wonderful man as though he was just a little struggling theologist, making his way in the world by selling pamphlets. Surely this was not so ? Now I am almost certain that Catherine de Medici was not one of his benefactors? Kind Regards, Peter Leroy