Dear Elva If you live in Melbourne you are in luck! The microfiche of the Huguenot Society Quarto series are in the Genealogy Section of the State Libarary of Victoria, corner of Swanston and La Trobe Streets, Melbourne. The series contains the History of the Walloon & Huguenot Church at Canterbury by Francis W Cross as well as other very useful information. The bound Cross reference itself is also in the library and can be requested at the Trescowthick Information Centre. You can search their holdings on line at http://www.statelibrary.vic.gov.au I was visiting Melbourne for a conference so I didn't have to time to get the most out of the information. Bronwyn Perth, Australia

Hi Thelma and all, From: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 7:12 AM > Hi fellow members, > > I have found a few people called VERHU(L)ST on the Belgium IGI but many more > on the Netherlands IGI so I think this may be where the family originated. > BALTHASAR VERHU(L)ST is said to be native if Norwich > Does anyone know what the records are like in the Netherlands or how far they > go back ? VERHULST looks of Dutch origin to me. "Ver" is a contraction of Van Der or From The in English. I'm not sure how far back church records go in The Netherlands. I assume it varies church by church. One example: the records of the Dutch Reformed Ch at Zwolle seem to go back to the 1581 for marriages and 1583 for baptisms -- at least as filmed by the LDS. For Huguenot and Walloon records there, you should consult the "Leiden Index " That is on film from the LDS starting with #0199755. I've not looked at this, but I've read that it has Walloon records from some locations other than The Netherlands in addition to The Netherlands records. But it seems to me, you need to start by looking in Norwich and try to find his baptism there. French or Walloon Ch. records: http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/printing/titledetailsprint.asp?titleno=666044 Walloon Ch history and registers: http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/printing/titledetailsprint.asp?titleno=264395 Dutch Refomed records: http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/printing/titledetailsprint.asp?titleno=105472 Regards, Howard [email protected]

Hi William and all, From: "William Johnson" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2003 4:42 AM > Can someone give me an idea of where people who used the Threadneedle St. > church would have been buried in the 1680-1800 period? I have been unable to > find wills of any of my huguenot family in the PCC wills index- did London > huguenots tend to use the smaller London courts more often than the PCC to > prove wills? My impression is that the Prerogative Court of Canterbury (PCC) handled mainly the larger estates and those that had land in more than one jurisdiction. The Phillimore Atlas will tell you which local court would have had jurisdiction for the others. Regards, Howard [email protected]

Here's a link to the Dutch VOC (Dutch East Indies) ships: http://voc.websilon.nl/ If you need translation, email me off list. Sandra Muys =============================================== New! If you are searching for de Blaeij ancestors or trying to connect de Blaeij descendants, join the mailing list to connect with other de Blaeij (deBlaey, deBlaay, de Blaaij) researchers ! Send an email with the word subscribe in the text and the subject to: mailto:[email protected] Sandra Muys & Edwin Hamelink, Terneuzen, The Netherlands web Edwin: http://people.zeelandnet.nl/ehamelink web Sandra: http://www.geocities.com/muys.rm e-mail Sandra: [email protected] Heemkundige Ver. Terneuzen: http://go.to/hvt Heemkundeweb: http://go.to/heemkunde Historie Terneuzen: http://www.terneuzen.com/historie =============================================== -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: Howard Swain [mailto:[email protected]] Verzonden: vrijdag 14 november 2003 22:12 Aan: [email protected] Onderwerp: Re: [HWE] Huguenot Maritime stuff Hi Tony and all, > Hi Peter and Howard and our merry band of Listers > > More interesting stuff, this time on things maritime. Howard, the Huguenot ship lists will keep me occupied for weeks - now, where are the East India Ships (of any nation) among that little lot? This site may keep you busy: http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Styx/6497/index.html Regards, Howard [email protected] ==== HUGUENOTS-WALLOONS-EUROPE Mailing List ==== Need to unsubscribe but not sure how to do it? Full instructions are on the list website at: http://www.island.net/~andreav/unsub.htm. ============================== To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237

Hi Peter and Howard and our merry band of Listers More interesting stuff, this time on things maritime. Howard, the Huguenot ship lists will keep me occupied for weeks - now, where are the East India Ships (of any nation) among that little lot? Regards Tony Fuller

Hi all, From: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2003 4:45 PM > Hello All, > > A snippet to add to the story is as follows, Jacqueline > DE MONTBEL, Countess of d'Entremont and of Nottage, > heiress of the branch, was born in 1541; she first > married in 1561, Claude de Batarnay, Count of Boushage, > Baron of d'Anthon, who was killed in the battle of > Saint-Denis in 1567, leaving no posterity. > Source > http://collections.ic.gc.ca/argyle/html/body_egenealogy4.htm Thanks. So, no conjugal visits while she was in prison, I guess. :) To summarize a timeline, we have -- Jacqueline's first husband dies in 1567. Gaspard's first wife dies in 1568. Jacqueline and Gaspard marry in 1571. Their dau. Beatrix is born after Gaspard dies in 1572. Jacqueline is imprisoned in 1573. (Makes me guess she was a Huguenot.) I wonder who cared for little Beatrix. But she did survive and eventually got married. Jacqueline dies in prison in 1599. (I should also note that I found several web sites claiming Jacqueline died in 1572. Clearly wrong.) I doubt she adopted anybody while in prison. I suppose that ES could be wrong, or she could have been let out only to be re-imprisoned, or she could have adopted someone while in prison (but this latter seems pretty unlikely). As it stands now, it sure appears that Jacqueline did not adopt anybody (because she was in prison at the time of the alledged adoption). This reminds me of the Anneke Jans fairy tale I mentioned earlier. One aspect of that story had her alledged grandfather, William the Silent, mentioning her in his will. However, if anyone had taken the trouble to check historical facts, they would have found that William was murdered in 1584, which was 15 to 20 years before Anneke was born. So, I'm wondering if a similar thing is at work hear: no one bothered to find out that Jacqueline was in prison at the very time she was said to be adopting someone. (Further note: William the Silent married as his 4th wife Louise de COLIGNY, the daughter of Gaspard II de COLIGNY, whom we have been discussing.) I would like to have mentioned the sources that ES used, but there were many of them listed en masse. I will mention 3, though, that might be of interest. Edmond Chevreier, La maison de Coligny au Moyen Age, Bourg (1861) Jacque Dupont, Cahiers de Saint-Louis Mme L.... P.... [sic], Etude historique sur Jacqueline de Montbel, Lyon 1901, pp 12-29; 50. I also found the following book available from the LDS: http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library/fhlcatalog/printing/titledetailsprint.asp?titleno=292719 Regards, Howard [email protected]

Hi Guys Not Lesney as in Matchbox models I'm afraid. The name was an amalgam of names, the given name and surname of the guy who founded the firm. I used to work in Hackney and the outfit I worked with shared a building with Lesney, ended up doing some consultancy for them. It's like Trebor, the name of a sweet company, now part of the Cadbury group, named after its founder and one time owner. Read Trebor backwards. Regards Tony Fuller

Some time ago now I discovered the wonderful work of Alan Stanier http://privatewww.essex.ac.uk/~alan/family/index.html Amongst many other items of some interest to our tribe, happened to be this little article State Papers, Domestic - Commonwealth CXXIX 21 August 1656 Now many might find such reading of little interest, if you happen to be a descendent of a couple of the names then it is of very great importance to your records. Where else would one seek assistance on matters Huguenot other than either the Huguenot Society of Great Britain & Ireland - http://www.huguenotsociety.org.uk/ or right here in this wonderful HWE mailing list. My enquiry is with regard to the following names, who were signatures to the document written so long ago. Are you related to any of these Huguenot folk who signed the document ? No guessing now and so read carefully and then double check your sources. If you are, then please via this list, tell us how you are related. And no.... not the whole 5000 steps to 2003 just John Smith is my Grandfather x 10 or somesuch and maybe a little story of what you know of your ancestor. Dated 18 March 1655/6, Signed by Jean De Kerhuel, Jean Egar, Lieuin Manié, John Le Talle, Jaques Le Roy, James Pinchon, Jehan Le Houcgh, James Hancar, Jacob Descamps, Christienne Smaghues, Jacob Venneille, Jaques Hernue, Charle De Lanoy, John Cuuelie, Anthoinne Hapio, Charle Vaterlo, Danniel Du Verliez, James Becue, Isaac De Lannoy, John Le Haier, Joel Delespiere, Jan Gokelar, Piere Egar, Pierre Du Quenne, Kaerel Pryem, Isanbaer Savatt, Charle Gribau, Samuel Le Talle, John Amory, John Beharel, John Le Hooke ju, Dauid Le Talle, Jehan Du Mollin, André Maniez, Leuren Descou, Osse Le Grand, Vincent Caillet, Jacque Du Bois, Michee Amory, John Amory ju, Peeter Castell, Dauid Morillion, Isaac Amory, Jean Pinchon, Jacques Hernu ju, Phillippe Hennoc, Alisander Foster, Isaac Hancar, Abscalon Le Gran[d], Sidrac Morillion, Samuel Morillion, Jacque Goglær, Jan Dauerow. Any known relatives subscribed ? Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Hi Andrew, Actually, light, especially UV light does ablate ink, not to mention what it could do to the paper. The effect is minute, but over hundreds of years, it is real. I purchased a 3 megapixel camera with real zoom (not just the fake digital zoom) and macro focus for close up copy. It is great for such instances. I try to find enough natural subdued light that I can turn off the flash and use a tripod for time exposure if required. You can take as many images as you want for free and can store the images on CD's which do not take up as much space as paper copies. Today, every person interested in Genealogy should have one if they can afford it. Another great tool is a GPS system. Street names and numbers change over time, but the global co-ordinates remain. I purchased the cheapest one that had output for a laptop PC so that I could connect it to map software. That way it also helps me find places. Ray > > Re: [HWE] Gaspard DE COLIGNY > From: "Andrew Sellon" <[email protected]> > Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 10:14:44 -0000 > To: [email protected] > <SNIP> > in Edinburgh. She refused me permission to photo-copy it, for fear that the > harmful rays might spoil the document! (I had travelled up to Scotland with > my portable photo-copier in the hope of finding just such a treasure there > or at Arniston House). <SNIP>

Hi Thelma Can't help you directly but from some other research I've done, I think that Harry Verelst, big noise in the East India Company in the 18th century, was descended from a Verhust family his grandfather being Cornelius Verelst, a noted botanical painter. Regards Tony Fuller

I was most intrigued to find this name among those quoted ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Fuller" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2003 9:39 AM Subject: [HWE] Spitalfields Ministers, Part II > > 1734 De LESNET. Mm. de l'eg. de .Cook Lane. > Years ago b.g. (before genealogy) when I wasn't interested, I do remember my mother mentioning the name de lesney (at least that was how she pronounced it and she felt that it was probably an anglicized version of a French name). I subsequently found French Huguenot connections in the SIGOURNAY name, and there is also a possibility that the name COULDERY may also come from French emigres back in the 15th Century. My mother had mentioned SIGOURNAY, and my cousin had mentioned COULDERY so when I found these I felt this was all quite logical. BUT ------ WHY did my mother mention the name De lesney, if there was no connection? I have not found any at the moment, but this seems quite a coincidence when I have never found anybody with the name before. I had not thought of this particular spelling, so I am very interested to know anything about anybody with this name. Would anybody have any more information on this name, please? Kind regards and best wishes to all Helen, West Sussex, UK

Just to add another lil smidgeon to the collective. Here is a very good site for Sth African Shipping lists http://sa-passenger-list.za.net/home.php Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

I agree with Tony that researching your family shouldnt be all about finding famous rich ancestors, Im sure all my family come from ordinary working backgrounds however the real fun has not been just discovering the names and dates but discovering the history of why they were where they were and how they might have arrived there and how this fits in with history both local and european, It was a real thrill discovering that the Johncocks who I originally thought were a Kentish family who had been there for ever, actually came to canterbury in the sixteenth century from walloonthe name originally Jancocke, Now whilst tracing the Guernsey branch of my family Ive discovered a direct link to sark and its colonisation in 1565 by the seigneur of St Quens, one of the original tenants was A Jean Guille and his 2 sons, my fathers greatgrandmother was a Harriet Guille and her grandfather was pierre Guille born in sark in 1785. Karen _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself with cool emoticons - download MSN Messenger today! http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger

Hello All, How many times is it said "ask and ye shall receive" ? The suggested link from Howard has set us off on another journey of discovery of a branch of our family tree that has as yet to be fully researched. Then again after many decades of this searching business we are not getting too excited just yet. The omission in my initial post was that our kin being sought were Jacques and his brother Jean. And look what turns up on the first attempt. The Berg China left Rotterdam March 20, 1688, arrived Table Bay August 4, 1688, 160 feet long, carrying 175 passengers, 19 people died, & 50 sick people on board on arrival in Table Bay Jacques Roy Jean Roy These two were among the 34 Huguenots aboard. Well it is a start and who knows where it will take us, to Ille Bourbon (Le Reunion) with some luck. Thank you very much Howard Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Hi Tony and all, > Hi Peter and Howard and our merry band of Listers > > More interesting stuff, this time on things maritime. Howard, the Huguenot ship lists will keep me occupied for weeks - now, where are the East India Ships (of any nation) among that little lot? This site may keep you busy: http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Styx/6497/index.html Regards, Howard [email protected]

Hello all, From: <[email protected]>> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 10:11 AM [some snippage] > Some time during the latter years of the Reformation, > toward the later 1600's (possibly 1695-1700), one of > our Huguenot ancestors decided that all this was enough > and so decided to wander off on a sea voayge. > > The 'rumour' is that he stopped off in Cape Town to > visit for awhile with a very distant cousin (DU > PLESSIS). Around 1716 he continued his sojourn on yet > another ship and found himself admiring the newly > discovered coffee plants of Ile Bourbon or Reunion > Island in the Indian Ocean. From there he continued his > grand adventure stopping at a variety of ports. > Is there a list of French merchant ships that travelled > the route from France to the Cape of Good Hope and > onwards ? Our interest is any that would have stopped > off at Ile Bourbon around 1715 to 1717. > > Slightly off the HWE normal topics, however this > ancestor was a strong follower of the Huguenot faith > and the most unusual story so far concerning his faith > is that he did not "flee" France nor did his family > previous. They were lawyers from Rennes and St.Malo > with a few soldiers thrown in. Could he have gone first to The Netherlands? Here is a list of ships in your time period carrying Huguenots from The Netherlands to South Africa. http://olivetreegenealogy.com/ships/hug_index.shtml If you want some feel for what ship travel was like at that time in that area (going around Aftrica to the Indian Ocean), I recommend: The Pirate Hunter -- The True Story of Captain Kidd by Richard Zacks, 2002. I don't think Reunion Island is mentioned, but seem to recall they beached their ship on one of the Comoro Islands to scrape the barnacles off. Regards, Howard [email protected]

Peter - There are a couple of points I would like to put forward. Firstly, you say "He "supposedly" marries a second time and so his natural children by Charlotte DE LAVAL now have a "Step-Mother",". The term 'natural children' used in this context is perhaps a mite confusing, in that it is very often used to indicate children born out of wedlock. Secondly, is it perhaps possible that the child 'adopted' by the second wife might in fact be the 'natural' child of Gaspard by her, conceived or born before the death of his first wife? In this case there would be a true blood relationship. I have a somewhat charming tale within my own tree along such lines. A Dundas HEIC sea captain, (who, it transpires, was an illegitimate son of a Dundas, but brought up as a 'cousin' by the family, had placed in his charge a charming 18 yo who was travelling out to Bombay. (Why she had no chaperone I know not.) During the voyage the dastardly sea captain 'took advantage' of her, and left her, many months pregnant, on the Bombay quay side, he having a wife and children at home. The final twist is that this girl later married a 'blood' relative of my wife and daughters, by name of Raffles! This I discovered in a very old type-script, a potted Dundas history put down on paper at the start of the C20th, kept by an ancient relative living in Edinburgh. She refused me permission to photo-copy it, for fear that the harmful rays might spoil the document! (I had travelled up to Scotland with my portable photo-copier in the hope of finding just such a treasure there or at Arniston House). Yours Aye Andrew Sellon East Anglia Lord Dudley was one of the most absent men I think I ever met in society. One day he met me in the street, and invited me to meet myself. 'Dine with me today; dine with me and I will get Sydney Smith to meet you.' I admitted the temptation he held out to me, but said I was engaged to meet him elsewhere. Rev. Sydney Smith 1771-1854, Canon of St. Paul's. From: <[email protected]> <snip> > > He "supposedly" marries a second time and so his > natural children by Charlotte DE LAVAL now have a > "Step-Mother", simply put, she is no relative to > Gaspard descendents other than that, the second wife. >

Hi fellow members, Has anyone on the list any connection with either of the above two names ? DANIEL le VEFUE (father of ESTER le Vefue was probably born in France c 1569.) His dau ESTER married CHARLES HAUET of Canterbury 1/5/1612 or 1613. Charles was native of Canterbury but his father NICOLAS HAUET was native of DENE (Denay) The other person I am trying to find out about is the Father of ELIZABETH DESTAILLEU(R) who was said to be JOSSE(JOOS) DESTAILLEU(R) native of Norwich. Her mother (presumably a widow contracted to marry JAQUES du BOIS ). We think there must have been two people named JOSSE (JOOS) DESTAILLEU(R) as I found the widow of one of them contracted to marry JAQUES du BOIS above 26/2/1594/5, whereas someone who was given as widow of JOS DESTAILLEU was a witness to baptism in March 1592.! So there must be two people of the same name , possiby father & son, but I can't trace them, the earlier JOS is said to be native of Commines and of Canterbury ! Is it possible that JOSSE (JOOS) is a nickname or derived form another name ? I have found a few people called VERHU(L)ST on the Belgium IGI but many more on the Netherlands IGI so I think this may be where the family originated. BALTHASAR VERHU(L)ST is said to be native if Norwich Does anyone know what the records are like in the Netherlands or how far they go back ? Most grateful for any information. Thelma Morgan

Hello Listers and other readers, I have included "other readers" as it has come to my attention that they should be included in our greetings and salutations. Why you may ask ? Well I am very much aware of at least 4 people who read the posts and yet are not subscribers. All in all, hello to you. Shipping is my interest this time out and I would imagine that many others have a blank when it comes to just how did your ancestor(s) get from point a to b. Some time during the latter years of the Reformation, toward the later 1600's (possibly 1695-1700), one of our Huguenot ancestors decided that all this was enough and so decided to wander off on a sea voayge. The 'rumour' is that he stopped off in Cape Town to visit for awhile with a very distant cousin (DU PLESSIS). Around 1716 he continued his sojourn on yet another ship and found himself admiring the newly discovered coffee plants of Ile Bourbon or Reunion Island in the Indian Ocean. From there he continued his grand adventure stopping at a variety of ports. Very vague is it not, the story so far, that is ? And so to my enquiry. Is there a list of French merchant ships that travelled the route from France to the Cape of Good Hope and onwards ? Our interest is any that would have stopped off at Ile Bourbon around 1715 to 1717. Slightly off the HWE normal topics, however this ancestor was a strong follower of the Huguenot faith and the most unusual story so far concerning his faith is that he did not "flee" France nor did his family previous. They were lawyers from Rennes and St.Malo with a few soldiers thrown in. Any assistance will be appreciated. Kind Regards, Peter Leroy

Hello all, bonjour, je vis en Belgique et suis à la recherche (en FRANCE) d'ancêtres HUGUENOTS du nom de : PERÉ, PERE, PEREE, PERREE, PERRÉE Who can help me ? Thanks to all of you Blanca Peré ----Original Message Follows---- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Subject: [HWE] Gaspard DE COLIGNY Date: Thu, 13 Nov 2003 14:22:14 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: from mc1-f24.hotmail.com ([64.4.50.31]) by mc1-s20.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Thu, 13 Nov 2003 14:26:12 -0800 Received: from lists2.rootsweb.com ([207.40.200.39]) by mc1-f24.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Thu, 13 Nov 2003 14:26:12 -0800 Received: (from [email protected])by lists2.rootsweb.com (8.12.8/8.12.8) id hADMM9Ud006551;Thu, 13 Nov 2003 15:22:09 -0700 X-Message-Info: 0jbW5ANosZIyVCuX/g6PBvj31Cns7uCk Resent-Date: Thu, 13 Nov 2003 15:22:09 -0700 X-Original-Sender: [email protected] Thu Nov 13 15:22:09 2003 X-Sent: 13 Nov 2003 22:22:17 GMT Old-To: [email protected] X-Sent-From: [email protected] X-Mailer: Web Mail 5.5.0-3_sol28 Message-Id: <[email protected]> Resent-Message-ID: <[email protected]> Resent-From: [email protected] X-Mailing-List: <[email protected]> archive/latest/5879 X-Loop: [email protected] Precedence: list Resent-Sender: [email protected] Return-Path: [email protected] X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Nov 2003 22:26:12.0355 (UTC) FILETIME=[24C78530:01C3AA35] Hello All, Now isn't this just what we all wonder at times ? When is a person a relative ? I shall attempt to shorten the situation for those of you who just came in to this discussion. Gaspard DE COLIGNY, the son of Gaspard DE COLGINY marries Charlotte DE LAVAL-MONTFORT and they have a tribe of children. These children would then be recorded as an anscestor if you happen to be related. But what is a relationship ? In most situations if your name is say DE COLGINY then your mother is very much a relative, well she is your mother. Now that is simple enough. And so we extend this line way back to Gaspard DE COLIGNY and so he is your umpteenth Grandfather. Again very simplistic genealogy. In some cases there is a second marriage and so what is the relationship between you and the second wife ? By blood, nil. By marrage, she is the wife of your Grandfather so many times removed. Now lets make this even more complicated. The second wife already has children. So what is the relationship between you and these children ? Some genealogy programs allow for the term "Step-Child" and so therefore they are step cousins or are they step something else to you ? And so listers we come to the topic of this subject. Gaspard DE COLIGNY dies 24th August, 1572. His wife passes away prior to him on 3rd of March, 1567. He "supposedly" marries a second time and so his natural children by Charlotte DE LAVAL now have a "Step-Mother", simply put, she is no relative to Gaspard descendents other than that, the second wife. And now folks for the really really biggie. Gaspard DE COLIGNY is recorded by some as having a second wife and no natural children with that union, or is there ? (Add information if you have documentation that indicates that there was a child of this union) And so Gaspard dies, this second wife reportedly "Adopts" a child after he, Gaspard, is long dead. What relation to you is this adopted child as he is, technically (ie by blood), not related to Gaspard DE COLIGNY at all ? Well how could he/she possibly be related to the DE COLIGNY family as the child does or at least did have a natural mother and father prior to being adopted by the second wife. So if the second wife is not related to you then surely the adopted child of the second wife is not even nearly related to you. Especially when the adopted child was adopted "after" the death of Gaspard DE COLIGNY. And so how can it be that a familly can claim the DE COLIGNY family as anscestors by way of the adopted child when there is no relationship between the adopted child and the DE COLIGNY line ? All clear as mud now ? I suppose one could place a note in the file that says that "I am related to the child who was adopted by the second wife of Gaspard DE COLIGNY after his death", which makes for some nice reading, but like many other historical points in all our genealogical research, that is all that it would be, a 'Remark' for future family members to delight in. Maybe I have a different understanding and some of you have another perspective on this topic, please go ahead and present your scenario for open discussion without any fear of ridicule or abuse from any listers. Discussion not damnation, please. Kind Regards, Peter Leroy ==== HUGUENOTS-WALLOONS-EUROPE Mailing List ==== When posting to the HWE list: SURNAMES written in capitals, s'il vous plaît. Also, please specify dates and location, including country. ============================== To join Ancestry.com and access our 1.2 billion online genealogy records, go to: http://www.ancestry.com/rd/redir.asp?targetid=571&sourceid=1237 _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: votre e-mail gratuit ! http://www.fr.msn.be/hotmail