I haven't had a chance to speak with my son, but I know our Horner's are in Maryland and on the Eastern Shore of Virginia in the 1600's--wills, court documents, census, and still here now, in this county where we live, and husbands family has been since the very early 1800's as far as we know at this point And, he knows of these other lines of Horner's, but at this point he has so much documentation to work on for the Horner's here, he is drawing from the primary sources for the area. He works as an archivist and genealogist at the Nabb center. He's knows his Horner's arrived into the Virginia area. Unfortunately, every time he finds another member, there's all the connections to figure in. For a Christmas family dinner with mostly Horner's he has a huge chart printed, it's probably at least 8' by 4' and everyone he has with the direct connections are there. Every year, he has another "layer" to add. I suspect the Horner's are drawn from many families from many places, and arrived during a stretch of time, in a variety of places. I'm a bit lucky, in that my direct ancestor, Waters, came to Jamestown, Virginia in 1619, I think I have that year right, it's the 16th or 19th, but 1616 never looks right when I type it. I've actually been to where he was when he died in, well, I've been the village, and the church, as he returned to England, and his will was done there. Unfortunately, none of the graves from the 1600's remained, but there are documents there concerning him, and we know what happened to his 2 children and widow back in Virginia. I'll give my son the info and ask him. Thanks. Gloria