In reply to Cyndi's E mail about English Holmes. I have some info. The following is taken from a letter written by Thorp HOLMES the second, in St Catharines January 27, 1887 being the grandfather of Mother DOUGAN. Thorp HOLMES(the first) was born in the County of Cambridge,. April 24, 1777 at Wisbech, opposite the southeast corner of Lincolinshire. His father seems to have migrated from Claythorpe, a village on the Cliff Road(the old Roman Empire Street from London to Humber), halfway between Grantham and Lincolin where the family appears to have had long standing, and married a widow, named SWAIN. Thorp HOLMES died while his family were young,Thorp, Joseph, and Ann. A sister of Thorp HOLMES was married to a wealthy farmer in Caythorpe, named HACKETT; and they being childless, adopted Robert. They articled him to an attorney in Grantham, and this brought the rest of the family there. Robert finally went to Newark where he became a cashier in a bank, and soon the managing partner. Here most of the family were born. All are not remembered, nor the order of birth. Joseph became a traveling companion to a Newcastle doctor who died in Paris. Among his papers,Joseph found essays on fire, damp explosions,and on his return to Newcastle published something from them. Sir Humphrey DAVY happened to see the paper, and invited Joseph to London, sending funds. Hence the Safety Lamp. In Newcastle, he became acquainted with and corresponded with a young lady. On condition of finding certain means to live, her father consented, and promised 10,000 pounds Sterling. Joseph was appointed Judge Advocate in Denavava. He was a tiff aristocrat, and here he became infamous for his prosecution of those supposed to b e implicated in a slave insurrection in August 1823. Rev John SMITH, sent out by the London Missionary Society in in 1816,, was put on trial Oct.16, which lasted six weeks, and was sentenced by Court Martial to death, which being left over for Imperial consideration, he was pardoned, but died under the rigorous confinement, Feb 6, 1822. The Society petitioned Parliament on the subject, and on June 1 1824, Mr.BROUGHAM had made an address on the subject which was seconded by James Meachintosh, whose works contain his speech. Joseph died in Demaraara, and his wife and t who sons returned to Newcastle. John was a surveyor of Government Buildings, and the Wellington Barracks in London were built on his designs and under his superintendence. After the death of John his family went to British Columbia. William I saw in London at the same time, and I understand he was in the Herald' office. Henry apprenticed to a Chronometer make, and it was understood he was employed by the Dutch Government as an Engineer, and sent Surinam, where he disappeared. Thomas was apprenticed to a grocer in Grantham, name PAGE, in the building next to the one in which his father had studied law in Vine Street. He did not live long, and his widow and children came to America. George, the youngest son was a playfellow of mine. John found him a situation in his own department. He was sent to the Ionian Isles and to the Cape of Good Hope. James went to Demaavava and went into the drug business. Cathrine married a very worthy man who used to work for the Manthorpe Flour Mill. Robert HOLMES, while at Newark had rented a farm of Lord BROWNLOW on Gonerby Manor, over 10 miles from Newark. On Cathrine's marriage her husband obtained the farm and died ther leaving four sons and one daughter. Millicent found her way to New York and married there. Charlotte married a tailor in Great Gonerby, named John ATTER, and died Nov 9, 1885 aged 75. I do not know whether my father of Joseph was the elder, but he had three children older than myself. His early life was spent in the banking business, he was for many years actuary of the Savings Bank. The eldest son Joseph, was a hatter and in partnership with CROPSAN who married sister Mary. Thorpe HOLMES was apprenticed to to a tailor, HANDY. He afterwards enlisted in the 7th Hussars of the Anglesse, and was in the disastrous campaign under the Duke of YORK in Holland. His discharge was obtained, and after trying several businesses he migrated to the Province of Ontario, bought a farm in Gainsboro, where he lived for ten years, and then moved to St. Catharines, died at age 80 , January 19, 1857. I hope this helps you or some one else. Larry Stackhouse