They are neighbor states, I do believe. -----Original Message----- From: Carl Becker <carl@becker-wiesbaden.de> To: hesse@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [HESSE] (no subject) Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2011 23:45:13 +0100 Alsace and Lorraine are *not* the same place. The German names are Elsaß and Lothringen. However, these two regions frequently happened to be conquered and annexed by either Germany or France as a single piece of war loot. Just see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alsace and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorraine_%28region%29 Carl ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marleen Van Horne" <msvnhrn@jps.net> To: <hesse@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, February 28, 2011 9:13 PM Subject: Re: [HESSE] (no subject) > This is my understanding of the situation: > > The Alsace/Lorraine region is/was a state that under different political > circumstances was in either Germany or France. It is currently a part > of France. > > Alzey, however, has always been in the German state of Hesse-Darmstadt. > The confusion, as I see it is in the fact that on various occasions, > as a result of war, that part of Hesse-Darmstadt on the west side of the > Rhein River has been occupied by France, i.e., the Napoleonic Wars, WWI > and WWII. In each instance the territory was eventually returned to the > German state. > > Alsace and Lorraine are the same place, called Alsace by the Germans and > Lorraine by the French. > > Hessen is north and east of Alsace/Lorraine, and is well within the > borders of present day Germany. This state does not share a border with > France, and was only under French control as an occupied territory. > > I am sure if I have gotten this wrong, someone more knowledgeable will > correct me. > > Marleen Van Horne > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

This is my understanding of the situation: The Alsace/Lorraine region is/was a state that under different political circumstances was in either Germany or France. It is currently a part of France. Alzey, however, has always been in the German state of Hesse-Darmstadt. The confusion, as I see it is in the fact that on various occasions, as a result of war, that part of Hesse-Darmstadt on the west side of the Rhein River has been occupied by France, i.e., the Napoleonic Wars, WWI and WWII. In each instance the territory was eventually returned to the German state. Alsace and Lorraine are the same place, called Alsace by the Germans and Lorraine by the French. Hessen is north and east of Alsace/Lorraine, and is well within the borders of present day Germany. This state does not share a border with France, and was only under French control as an occupied territory. I am sure if I have gotten this wrong, someone more knowledgeable will correct me. Marleen Van Horne

On Feb 28, 2011, at 10:22 AM, Kathy Cochran wrote: > I seem to be having a political argument with a cousin who still > insists > that our Born family came from Alsace, Lorraine. Even though I > actually > found the exit docs, thanks to Alexis (on this list) in the town of > Alzey, > Hessen, Darmstadt, Germany in 1836. Is there ANYONE out there who > can tell > me if Alzey was EVER part of Alsace, Lorrain, and what time period? The question has come up before in other mail lists: http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/th/read/PABERKS/2005-03/1110651508 The short answer is no, Alzey was never a part of Alsace but both were part of Rheinland-Pfalz for a period of time. Could this be where your cousin's confusion originated? Alzey was part of Hesse-Darmstadt in the 18th and 19th centuries. Does your cousin have any documents that might point to an origin at some point for some folks with the Born surname? Did any of them emigrate to the USA and indicate Alsace as their point of origin? Were some of them originally from Alsace, then Alzey? Documentation is key in this instance, particularly church or civil records. Even with documentation it's possible that your cousin may not be convinced. Regards, Debra MacLaughlan-Dumes http://sakionline.net/familypage

Hello Listers! I seem to be having a political argument with a cousin who still insists that our Born family came from Alsace, Lorraine. Even though I actually found the exit docs, thanks to Alexis (on this list) in the town of Alzey, Hessen, Darmstadt, Germany in 1836. Is there ANYONE out there who can tell me if Alzey was EVER part of Alsace, Lorrain, and what time period? I send my eternal thanks in advance..... Kathy Cochran ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message _____ No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1204 / Virus Database: 1435/3418 - Release Date: 02/02/11

Hello Nicholas, I have a Stephan / Stevens Family in St Louis,Mo. A Peter Stephan b1816 & his brother Jacob b1822 both immigrated from what is now country of Germany to Missouri through Ohio. Another brother immigrated to Adams Co, Pa in 1832. Their father Adam Steffan b 1775 was older brother of my GGG/grandfather Johan Georg Stephan b1787.This Georg Stephan/Stephens died in 1869 - Cleveland,Ohio. Maybe your A.J.L. Stevens was part of this St Louis Clan of Stephens/Stevens. They were quite prolific, Peter had 8 children - he died in 1900, Jacob had 7 children though he died in 1867. Their father Adam Steffon was Godfather to my GG/Grandfather - Adam Stephan b1813 of Pennsylvania.( I have a copy of the Birth Record) I list the various spellings of the name as each record I found showed it to be - quite a variation there. This Family Line has been traced back to a Nicolaus (Claus)Stephan b1566 in what was then the German Principality of Hesse-Darmstadt now in the country of Germany. I have also traced most of the Stephan Lines down from Claus of 1566. I even connected up recently with a number of distant 'Cousins'descended from 0ne Johan Philip Stephan b1681 in Lampertheim, Hessen - germany Thx,Gene(Stephan)Stevens (This will be listed on message board also) From: gc-gateway@rootsweb.com > To: STEVENS-L@rootsweb.com > Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2011 03:49:01 +0000 > Subject: [STEVENS] George L Stevens, d. Galveston, TX > > > Author: iisentaku > Surnames: Stevens > Classification: queries > > > > Looking for descendants of George L Stevens, d. Galveston, TX, 11 Dec 1926. He was the son of A. J. L Stevens, originally of St Louis, MO, but may have been living in AR. > > Does anyone on the list see a match? > > Thanks > > Nicholas >

RESENDING DUE TO DATE CORRECTION - date of arrival in USA was 1852 -----Original Message----- From: rijoperk@twcny.rr.com Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2011 11:02 AM To: hesse@rootsweb.com Subject: [HESSE] Fw: Koeppel/Koppel From: rijoperk@twcny.rr.com Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2011 9:37 AM To: Hesse@rootsweb.com Subject: Koeppel/Koppel Hi, I am looking for the marriage of Margaretha Koeppel/Keppel of Holzhausen, Hesse-Homburg to Karl/Carl Jung of Lich, Hesse. Margareth was born 26 Dec 1829 – they emigrated to USA – New York State – in 1952. I am also looking for names of her parents. Any help greatly appreciated. Joan Perkins, NYS-USA ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Hanau has 3 Protestant parishes: Marienkirche (I guess reformed) Johanniskirche (I guess lutheric) Niederländisch Wallonisch (lutheric immigrants from Wallonia) Microfiches of the church books of Marienkirche and Johanniskirche are available in Stadtarchiv Hanau: Schloßplatz 2 63450 Hanau Tel: 06181 / 295-918 Fax: 06181 / 295-419 The church books of the Niederländisch Wallonische Kirche were burned during a bomb attack in WWII.   Regards Karl  

Marsha - I went to the Lutheran Archives in Philadelphia because they hold the church records of a German church in Newark, NJ that my 2G grandparents attended. I don't know how extensive their collection is, but you won't know until you call. You never know what you're going to find until you examine the records. I've seen records that barely got the birth info recorded and I've seen records that recorded the birth of a child, the birthplace of each parent, the age and occupation of parents, & the godparents and their occupation. In one marriage record I found the groom testifying that he would take full responsibilty for raising and loving the illegitimate child of the bride and it continued to give me the name, birth date, birthplace and baptismal info about that child. Solved a 10 year old mystery for me.

Not sure why I am starting a search to find their New York Church which they attended less than 9 years (after emigration Abt 1854, since Helena was born in 1855 in NYC - Abt 1864 when Louise was born in Jersey City. Are you suggesting that the Philadelphia Archives will let me look at original Lutheran records for a Luthern Church in New York City which will happen to be the one near where Andreas and Maria S (Seifert) Kiesling lived (11th Ward on 123 Columbus Street) and baptized their children? It is a nice thought. The 11th Ward was primarily Germans who lived near the Lower East Side. I might obtain or might not the parents' names from the NYC Lutheran Church records. Jersey City tended to records lots of details including occupation, and parents' names and origin including village. Since I already know Andreas Kiesling's date of birth and Maria's date of birth and they were from Hanau, Germany, I thought that was sufficient to find the parish in Germany, you need the town and date of person that you are searching for: Andrea 31 May 1813 and Maria 02 Dec 1830. Are you saying that the Lutheran Church in NYC may have even more than Hanau, Germany? I have the NJ death certificates for Andreas 06 Dec 1893 and Maria Kiesling 16 Feb 1907, and parents' names were not required at that time. Obituaries in the Jersey Journal were limited and sparse - name of spouse, date and name of cemetery. The New York Archives on Chamber Street has indexes by year for marriages and since I know Edward and Marie/Helena Kiesling were married according to US Census About 1875, I could go through each year until 1882 when first known child is born to see if certificate records parents' names. I really wanted to try to find records in Hanau Germany. Is it great to fill in the complete list of children and more details, but that can be done later. Marsha On 2/23/2011 4:18 PM, Helen wrote: > Marsha - I believe you may be missing a child. > > Name: William Kiesling > Gender: Male > Birth Date: 18 Jan 1861 > Birthplace: Manhattan, New York, New York, USA > Father's Name: Andreas Kiesling > Mother's Name: Maria Kiesling > Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C00817-3 > System Origin: New_York-ODM > Source Film Number: 1315313 > Reference Number: > Collection: New York Births and Christenings, 1640-1962 > > Also I have found this place very helpful. > > http://ltsp.edu/lutheran-archives-philadelphia > > I visited the Archives about 6 or 7 years ago and at the time, they let you > look through the original books. Don't know if that policy still holds. Be > prepared for the records to be written in German. If you find something you > want, they will copy it for you. Minimal expense. The staff was very nice. > If you call or write to them, they may be able to help you target which > church to start your search with and let you know if they have those > records. > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hello Marsha, if you want to i would forward your query to the Hessenliste. Greetings Ruediger Am 23.02.2011 16:34, schrieb brian@amason.net: > I think that was supposed to be 1813, > or else how would he immigrate and have 2 children by 1855? > also, not that Marie looks very much life wife #2 or greater. > > At 1813 he'd have been ~31 and ~36 where Marie would have been 14& 19. > Possible but improbable. > > It's unlikely either child was Marie's. > > And it's likely this marriage happened 1850-1854 in Hanau. > > There for searching Hanau for deaths in the 1849-1854 range would be > probably a good place to start. Also looking for the marriage in that time > frame. Which should give a closer approximation to the immigration date, > and there, might even be a note about them immigrating. > > My suggestions for Parish is to start in the US, in the church they were > members of. Look for baptisms and marriages of the two children. In a > German > Reformed Church you will probably find a place of birth listed in any such > events. > > Brian > > > On Wed, February 23, 2011 8:46 am, Fred H Held wrote: >> Marsha, >> >> Please clarify your query. How can the husband be born on 31 May 1913 >> and his wife on 02 Dec 1830? Where did they live in America? >> >> At 02:00 AM 2/23/2011, you wrote: >>> From: Marsha<mstesdal@verizon.net> >>> Subject: [HESSE] KIESLING in HANAU, HESSE >>> To: HESSE@rootsweb.com >>> >>> Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates for >>> the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his wife, >>> Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. >>> Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. >>> Children: >>> Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>> to USA with parents. >>> Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>> to USA with parents >>> >>> Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform >>> Church in USA. >>> >>> M. Tesdal >> ____________________________________________________________ >> Dermatologists Hate Her >> Local Mom Reveals $5 Trick to Erase Wrinkles. Shocking Results Exposed >> http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d651dad3d3be4369d6st06duc >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I think you'll find Caroline's baptism here: First German Presbyterian Church Rivington Street. I no longer have the film on loan, so can't do a look up for you. You can rent the film from the FHL. It'll be in German, It will almost certainly give the town of birth of both parents. Good luck! PS Hanau is also a city. You may not get down to the Parish, but if you have the town/city, then it's not too hard. Brian On Wed, February 23, 2011 2:12 pm, Marsha wrote: > Thanks for the good suggestions: I have attempted to locate the Lutheran > Church in New York City for Baptisms/Marriages of Marie Helena b. 31 > Oct 1855 and Caroline Kiessling 1b. 858 without success. I then > thought it might be easier to find the Lutheran Church Baptism/Marriage > record for Louise b. 1864 in Jersey City, NJ (Jersey City had around 10 > German Lutheran Churches in the 1800s) so not successful in locating it > yet. Since Frederick and Catharine were born in Germany, I thought > maybe it would be time to try to find the Lutheran Parish in Hanau that > had like you said a death of a first wife, a marriage of Mary/Marie > Seifert to Andeas/Andrew in USA Kiessling, and Baptism of two children? > I still would like to find the name of the parish in or near Hanau to > see if this is possible. > > Marsha > > OK. Andreas Kiesling b. Abt 31 May 1813 Hanau, Germany d. 06 Dec 1893 > Jersey City, NJ and Mary/Marie Seifert b. Abt 02 Dec 1830 d. 16 Feb > 1907(Based on NJ Death Certificates) Child born in USA 1855 and 1858 - > so I assumed that they emigrated > before 1855. > Children: > Frederick b. Abt 1844 Germany > Catharine b. Abt 1849 Germany > Marie Helena b. 13 Oct 1855 Germany > Caroline b. Abt 1858 in New York City > Louise b. Abt 1864 in Jersey City, New Jersey. > > Their Daughter: Marie Helena Kiesling (b. 13 Oct 1855 ) married Edward > Roth Abt 1875 in New York City - I am trying to locate the Lutheran > Church based on where they lived on the Lower East Side according to US > Census. > Their Children: a Dtr b. 24 April 1882; Ernest Roth b. 13 May 1884 and > d. 28 Dec 1970; Herman Roth b. 1 Aug 1885; George Roth b. Feb 1888; > Catherine Roth b. 31 March 1891 m. 07 Oct 1911 in Jersey City NJ d. 04 > Dec 1963 Burial Hillside Cemetery, Lyndhurst, NJ; Louise Roth b. 1892. > > Since I found a document citing Hanau > > > On 2/23/2011 10:34 AM,brian@amason.net wrote: > >> > I think that was supposed to be 1813, >> > or else how would he immigrate and have 2 children by 1855? >> > also, not that Marie looks very much life wife #2 or greater. >> > >> > At 1813 he'd have been ~31 and ~36 where Marie would have been 14& >> 19. >> > Possible but improbable. >> > >> > It's unlikely either child was Marie's. >> > >> > And it's likely this marriage happened 1850-1854 in Hanau. >> > >> > There for searching Hanau for deaths in the 1849-1854 range would be >> > probably a good place to start. Also looking for the marriage in that >> time >> > frame. Which should give a closer approximation to the immigration >> date, >> > and there, might even be a note about them immigrating. >> > >> > My suggestions for Parish is to start in the US, in the church they >> were >> > members of. Look for baptisms and marriages of the two children. In a >> > German >> > Reformed Church you will probably find a place of birth listed in any >> such >> > events. >> > >> > Brian >> > >> > >> > On Wed, February 23, 2011 8:46 am, Fred H Held wrote: >>> >> Marsha, >>> >> >>> >> Please clarify your query. How can the husband be born on 31 May >>> 1913 >>> >> and his wife on 02 Dec 1830? Where did they live in America? >>> >> >>> >> At 02:00 AM 2/23/2011, you wrote: >>>> >>> From: Marsha<mstesdal@verizon.net> >>>> >>> Subject: [HESSE] KIESLING in HANAU, HESSE >>>> >>> To:HESSE@rootsweb.com >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates >>>> for >>>> >>> the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his >>>> wife, >>>> >>> Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. >>>> >>> Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. >>>> >>> Children: >>>> >>> Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. >>>> Emigrated >>>> >>> to USA with parents. >>>> >>> Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. >>>> Emigrated >>>> >>> to USA with parents >>>> >>> >>>> >>> Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform >>>> >>> Church in USA. >>>> >>> >>>> >>> M. Tesdal >>> >> ____________________________________________________________ >>> >> Dermatologists Hate Her >>> >> Local Mom Reveals $5 Trick to Erase Wrinkles. Shocking Results >>> Exposed >>> >> http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d651dad3d3be4369d6st06duc >>> >> >>> >> ------------------------------- >>> >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> >> HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes >>> >> in the subject and the body of the message >>> >> >>> >> >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email >> toHESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email > toHESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > On 2/23/2011 10:34 AM, brian@amason.net wrote: >> I think that was supposed to be 1813, >> or else how would he immigrate and have 2 children by 1855? >> also, not that Marie looks very much life wife #2 or greater. >> >> At 1813 he'd have been ~31 and ~36 where Marie would have been 14& 19. >> Possible but improbable. >> >> It's unlikely either child was Marie's. >> >> And it's likely this marriage happened 1850-1854 in Hanau. >> >> There for searching Hanau for deaths in the 1849-1854 range would be >> probably a good place to start. Also looking for the marriage in that >> time >> frame. Which should give a closer approximation to the immigration date, >> and there, might even be a note about them immigrating. >> >> My suggestions for Parish is to start in the US, in the church they >> were >> members of. Look for baptisms and marriages of the two children. In a >> German >> Reformed Church you will probably find a place of birth listed in any >> such >> events. >> >> Brian >> >> >> On Wed, February 23, 2011 8:46 am, Fred H Held wrote: >>> Marsha, >>> >>> Please clarify your query. How can the husband be born on 31 May 1913 >>> and his wife on 02 Dec 1830? Where did they live in America? >>> >>> At 02:00 AM 2/23/2011, you wrote: >>>> From: Marsha<mstesdal@verizon.net> >>>> Subject: [HESSE] KIESLING in HANAU, HESSE >>>> To: HESSE@rootsweb.com >>>> >>>> Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates for >>>> the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his wife, >>>> Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. >>>> Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. >>>> Children: >>>> Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>>> to USA with parents. >>>> Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>>> to USA with parents >>>> >>>> Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform >>>> Church in USA. >>>> >>>> M. Tesdal >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> Dermatologists Hate Her >>> Local Mom Reveals $5 Trick to Erase Wrinkles. Shocking Results Exposed >>> http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d651dad3d3be4369d6st06duc >>> >>> ------------------------------- >>> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >>> HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >>> quotes >>> in the subject and the body of the message >>> >>> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > >

Marsha - I believe you may be missing a child. Name: William Kiesling Gender: Male Birth Date: 18 Jan 1861 Birthplace: Manhattan, New York, New York, USA Father's Name: Andreas Kiesling Mother's Name: Maria Kiesling Indexing Project (Batch) Number: C00817-3 System Origin: New_York-ODM Source Film Number: 1315313 Reference Number: Collection: New York Births and Christenings, 1640-1962 Also I have found this place very helpful. http://ltsp.edu/lutheran-archives-philadelphia I visited the Archives about 6 or 7 years ago and at the time, they let you look through the original books. Don't know if that policy still holds. Be prepared for the records to be written in German. If you find something you want, they will copy it for you. Minimal expense. The staff was very nice. If you call or write to them, they may be able to help you target which church to start your search with and let you know if they have those records.

Thanks for the good suggestions: I have attempted to locate the Lutheran Church in New York City for Baptisms/Marriages of Marie Helena b. 31 Oct 1855 and Caroline Kiessling 1b. 858 without success. I then thought it might be easier to find the Lutheran Church Baptism/Marriage record for Louise b. 1864 in Jersey City, NJ (Jersey City had around 10 German Lutheran Churches in the 1800s) so not successful in locating it yet. Since Frederick and Catharine were born in Germany, I thought maybe it would be time to try to find the Lutheran Parish in Hanau that had like you said a death of a first wife, a marriage of Mary/Marie Seifert to Andeas/Andrew in USA Kiessling, and Baptism of two children? I still would like to find the name of the parish in or near Hanau to see if this is possible. Marsha OK. Andreas Kiesling b. Abt 31 May 1813 Hanau, Germany d. 06 Dec 1893 Jersey City, NJ and Mary/Marie Seifert b. Abt 02 Dec 1830 d. 16 Feb 1907(Based on NJ Death Certificates) Child born in USA 1855 and 1858 - so I assumed that they emigrated before 1855. Children: Frederick b. Abt 1844 Germany Catharine b. Abt 1849 Germany Marie Helena b. 13 Oct 1855 Germany Caroline b. Abt 1858 in New York City Louise b. Abt 1864 in Jersey City, New Jersey. Their Daughter: Marie Helena Kiesling (b. 13 Oct 1855 ) married Edward Roth Abt 1875 in New York City - I am trying to locate the Lutheran Church based on where they lived on the Lower East Side according to US Census. Their Children: a Dtr b. 24 April 1882; Ernest Roth b. 13 May 1884 and d. 28 Dec 1970; Herman Roth b. 1 Aug 1885; George Roth b. Feb 1888; Catherine Roth b. 31 March 1891 m. 07 Oct 1911 in Jersey City NJ d. 04 Dec 1963 Burial Hillside Cemetery, Lyndhurst, NJ; Louise Roth b. 1892. Since I found a document citing Hanau On 2/23/2011 10:34 AM,brian@amason.net wrote: > > I think that was supposed to be 1813, > > or else how would he immigrate and have 2 children by 1855? > > also, not that Marie looks very much life wife #2 or greater. > > > > At 1813 he'd have been ~31 and ~36 where Marie would have been 14& 19. > > Possible but improbable. > > > > It's unlikely either child was Marie's. > > > > And it's likely this marriage happened 1850-1854 in Hanau. > > > > There for searching Hanau for deaths in the 1849-1854 range would be > > probably a good place to start. Also looking for the marriage in that time > > frame. Which should give a closer approximation to the immigration date, > > and there, might even be a note about them immigrating. > > > > My suggestions for Parish is to start in the US, in the church they were > > members of. Look for baptisms and marriages of the two children. In a > > German > > Reformed Church you will probably find a place of birth listed in any such > > events. > > > > Brian > > > > > > On Wed, February 23, 2011 8:46 am, Fred H Held wrote: >> >> Marsha, >> >> >> >> Please clarify your query. How can the husband be born on 31 May 1913 >> >> and his wife on 02 Dec 1830? Where did they live in America? >> >> >> >> At 02:00 AM 2/23/2011, you wrote: >>> >>> From: Marsha<mstesdal@verizon.net> >>> >>> Subject: [HESSE] KIESLING in HANAU, HESSE >>> >>> To:HESSE@rootsweb.com >>> >>> >>> >>> Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates for >>> >>> the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his wife, >>> >>> Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. >>> >>> Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. >>> >>> Children: >>> >>> Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>> >>> to USA with parents. >>> >>> Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>> >>> to USA with parents >>> >>> >>> >>> Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform >>> >>> Church in USA. >>> >>> >>> >>> M. Tesdal >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> >> Dermatologists Hate Her >> >> Local Mom Reveals $5 Trick to Erase Wrinkles. Shocking Results Exposed >> >> http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d651dad3d3be4369d6st06duc >> >> >> >> ------------------------------- >> >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> >> HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >> >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> >> >> > > > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email toHESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email toHESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message On 2/23/2011 10:34 AM, brian@amason.net wrote: > I think that was supposed to be 1813, > or else how would he immigrate and have 2 children by 1855? > also, not that Marie looks very much life wife #2 or greater. > > At 1813 he'd have been ~31 and ~36 where Marie would have been 14& 19. > Possible but improbable. > > It's unlikely either child was Marie's. > > And it's likely this marriage happened 1850-1854 in Hanau. > > There for searching Hanau for deaths in the 1849-1854 range would be > probably a good place to start. Also looking for the marriage in that time > frame. Which should give a closer approximation to the immigration date, > and there, might even be a note about them immigrating. > > My suggestions for Parish is to start in the US, in the church they were > members of. Look for baptisms and marriages of the two children. In a > German > Reformed Church you will probably find a place of birth listed in any such > events. > > Brian > > > On Wed, February 23, 2011 8:46 am, Fred H Held wrote: >> Marsha, >> >> Please clarify your query. How can the husband be born on 31 May 1913 >> and his wife on 02 Dec 1830? Where did they live in America? >> >> At 02:00 AM 2/23/2011, you wrote: >>> From: Marsha<mstesdal@verizon.net> >>> Subject: [HESSE] KIESLING in HANAU, HESSE >>> To: HESSE@rootsweb.com >>> >>> Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates for >>> the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his wife, >>> Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. >>> Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. >>> Children: >>> Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>> to USA with parents. >>> Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>> to USA with parents >>> >>> Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform >>> Church in USA. >>> >>> M. Tesdal >> ____________________________________________________________ >> Dermatologists Hate Her >> Local Mom Reveals $5 Trick to Erase Wrinkles. Shocking Results Exposed >> http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d651dad3d3be4369d6st06duc >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Thanks for the good suggestions: I have attempted to locate the Lutheran Church in New York City for Baptisms/Marriages of Marie Helena b. 31 Oct 1855 and Caroline Kiessling 1b. 858 without success. I then thought it might be easier to find the Lutheran Church Baptism/Marriage record for Louise b. 1864 in Jersey City, NJ (Jersey City had around 10 German Lutheran Churches in the 1800s) so not successful in locating it yet. Since Frederick and Catharine were born in Germany, I thought maybe it would be time to try to find the Lutheran Parish in Hanau that had like you said a death of a first wife, a marriage of Mary/Marie Seifert to Andeas/Andrew in USA Kiessling, and Baptism of two children? I still would like to find the name of the parish in or near Hanau to see if this is possible. Marsha OK. Andreas Kiesling b. Abt 31 May 1813 Hanau, Germany d. 06 Dec 1893 Jersey City, NJ and Mary/Marie Seifert b. Abt 02 Dec 1830 d. 16 Feb 1907(Based on NJ Death Certificates) Child born in USA 1855 and 1858 - so I assumed that they emigrated before 1855. Children: Frederick b. Abt 1844 Germany Catharine b. Abt 1849 Germany Marie Helena b. 13 Oct 1855 Germany Caroline b. Abt 1858 in New York City Louise b. Abt 1864 in Jersey City, New Jersey. Their Daughter: Marie Helena Kiesling (b. 13 Oct 1855 ) married Edward Roth Abt 1875 in New York City - I am trying to locate the Lutheran Church based on where they lived on the Lower East Side according to US Census. Their Children: a Dtr b. 24 April 1882; Ernest Roth b. 13 May 1884 and d. 28 Dec 1970; Herman Roth b. 1 Aug 1885; George Roth b. Feb 1888; Catherine Roth b. 31 March 1891 m. 07 Oct 1911 in Jersey City NJ d. 04 Dec 1963 Burial Hillside Cemetery, Lyndhurst, NJ; Louise Roth b. 1892. Since I found a document citing Hanau On 2/23/2011 10:34 AM, brian@amason.net wrote: > I think that was supposed to be 1813, > or else how would he immigrate and have 2 children by 1855? > also, not that Marie looks very much life wife #2 or greater. > > At 1813 he'd have been ~31 and ~36 where Marie would have been 14& 19. > Possible but improbable. > > It's unlikely either child was Marie's. > > And it's likely this marriage happened 1850-1854 in Hanau. > > There for searching Hanau for deaths in the 1849-1854 range would be > probably a good place to start. Also looking for the marriage in that time > frame. Which should give a closer approximation to the immigration date, > and there, might even be a note about them immigrating. > > My suggestions for Parish is to start in the US, in the church they were > members of. Look for baptisms and marriages of the two children. In a > German > Reformed Church you will probably find a place of birth listed in any such > events. > > Brian > > > On Wed, February 23, 2011 8:46 am, Fred H Held wrote: >> Marsha, >> >> Please clarify your query. How can the husband be born on 31 May 1913 >> and his wife on 02 Dec 1830? Where did they live in America? >> >> At 02:00 AM 2/23/2011, you wrote: >>> From: Marsha<mstesdal@verizon.net> >>> Subject: [HESSE] KIESLING in HANAU, HESSE >>> To: HESSE@rootsweb.com >>> >>> Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates for >>> the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his wife, >>> Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. >>> Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. >>> Children: >>> Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>> to USA with parents. >>> Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>> to USA with parents >>> >>> Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform >>> Church in USA. >>> >>> M. Tesdal >> ____________________________________________________________ >> Dermatologists Hate Her >> Local Mom Reveals $5 Trick to Erase Wrinkles. Shocking Results Exposed >> http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d651dad3d3be4369d6st06duc >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Here's what you get when you simply search Hanua, Germany at FamilySearch.org catalog.  I don't know about the Lutheran church records in the United States, but they are worth looking as since they might indicate the exact location or parish from which your ancestors came.   Germany, Hanau-Munzberg Germany, Elsas-Lothringen-Hanua, Lichtenberg Germany, Prussen, Hessen-Nassau, Hanua Germany, Prussen, Hessen-Nassua, Hanua (Grafschaft) Germany, Prussen, Hessen-Nassua, Hanua-Munzberg (Grafschaft) Germany, Prussen, Hessen-Nassua, Bergen (Kr. Hanua) Germany, Prussen, Hessen-Nassua, Bischofsheim (Kr. Hanua) Germany, Prussen, Hessen-Nassua, Buchertal (Hanua) Germany, Prussen, Hessen-Nassua, Gronau (Kr. Hanua) Germany, Prussen, Hessen-Nassua, Hochstadt (Kr. Hanua)

Have you done a place search of the catalog at familysearch.org? It will tell you what is films are available to request at your nearest Family History Center. You can see what they have for New Jersey as well as Germany. Susan Sent from my iPhone On Feb 23, 2011, at 12:01 PM, Marsha <mstesdal@verizon.net> wrote: >

I think that was supposed to be 1813, or else how would he immigrate and have 2 children by 1855? also, not that Marie looks very much life wife #2 or greater. At 1813 he'd have been ~31 and ~36 where Marie would have been 14 & 19. Possible but improbable. It's unlikely either child was Marie's. And it's likely this marriage happened 1850-1854 in Hanau. There for searching Hanau for deaths in the 1849-1854 range would be probably a good place to start. Also looking for the marriage in that time frame. Which should give a closer approximation to the immigration date, and there, might even be a note about them immigrating. My suggestions for Parish is to start in the US, in the church they were members of. Look for baptisms and marriages of the two children. In a German Reformed Church you will probably find a place of birth listed in any such events. Brian On Wed, February 23, 2011 8:46 am, Fred H Held wrote: > Marsha, > > Please clarify your query. How can the husband be born on 31 May 1913 > and his wife on 02 Dec 1830? Where did they live in America? > > At 02:00 AM 2/23/2011, you wrote: >>From: Marsha <mstesdal@verizon.net> >>Subject: [HESSE] KIESLING in HANAU, HESSE >>To: HESSE@rootsweb.com >> >>Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates for >>the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his wife, >>Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. >>Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. >>Children: >>Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>to USA with parents. >>Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >>to USA with parents >> >>Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform >>Church in USA. >> >>M. Tesdal > > ____________________________________________________________ > Dermatologists Hate Her > Local Mom Reveals $5 Trick to Erase Wrinkles. Shocking Results Exposed > http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d651dad3d3be4369d6st06duc > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > HESSE-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > >

Marsha, Please clarify your query. How can the husband be born on 31 May 1913 and his wife on 02 Dec 1830? Where did they live in America? At 02:00 AM 2/23/2011, you wrote: >From: Marsha <mstesdal@verizon.net> >Subject: [HESSE] KIESLING in HANAU, HESSE >To: HESSE@rootsweb.com > >Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates for >the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his wife, >Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. >Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. >Children: >Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >to USA with parents. >Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated >to USA with parents > >Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform >Church in USA. > >M. Tesdal ____________________________________________________________ Dermatologists Hate Her Local Mom Reveals $5 Trick to Erase Wrinkles. Shocking Results Exposed http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL3241/4d651dad3d3be4369d6st06duc

Hoping to find Parish records for birth, death and marriage dates for the family members of Andreas Kiesling, b. 31 May 1913 and his wife, Marie Seifert Kiesling b. 02 Dec 1830 in Hanau, Hesse. Emigrated to USA: Before 1855 with two children. Children: Frederick Kiesling, b. Abt 1844 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated to USA with parents. Catharine Kiesling, b. Abt 1849 in Hanau, Hesse, Germany. Emigrated to USA with parents Suggestions for locating the parish-Family attended German Reform Church in USA. M. Tesdal

From: rijoperk@twcny.rr.com Sent: Sunday, February 20, 2011 9:37 AM To: Hesse@rootsweb.com Subject: Koeppel/Koppel Hi, I am looking for the marriage of Margaretha Koeppel/Keppel of Holzhausen, Hesse-Homburg to Karl/Carl Jung of Lich, Hesse. Margareth was born 26 Dec 1829 – they emigrated to USA – New York State – in 1952. I am also looking for names of her parents. Any help greatly appreciated. Joan Perkins, NYS-USA