I am doing a very happy , happy dance here in Australia. And because I am so happy I wanted to post, both to share and to say a huge thankyou to so many on this list who have helped. After 20 years of searching, two of it very intensively I have managed to find my German cousins!!!!! (first cousins - or my grandfathers sisters family) And if it hadn't been for this list and some very, very generous folk on the list it would never have happened. THANKYOU everyone!!! With a very particular thankyou to Henning and also Gisella. Without your wonderful, wonderful, wonderful help it would never have happened. I havent actually spoken with them as yet, but thats simply because of time differences. But I know their names, addresses and telephone numbers. Impatience says I will call a little later and try to speak to them by telephone. I only hope that they speak English!!! I know most of the time in researching our family history we look backwards, but in my case my German origins were fairly recent, about 120 years. That plus our family circumstance meant that I wanted to travel forward as well as backward. I found it fairly easy to travel backward with the family tree as we knew where my grandfather was born (Frankfurt am Main) and that his father (my great grandfather) had died in Nieder-Roden. Turned out that the entire family had not left Nieder-Roden since the 1600's - until of course my grandfather left. For a little background. My grandfather, Peter Schuler came to Australia from Germany in 1888. He was working aboard a ship that had sailed from Bremen. Injured in the rigging he was put ashore in Australia, and because the ships passengers were bound for Samoa and a German Man O War they sailed without him. 16 and alone he made his way in Australia and never went back to Germany. He had a very hard life and was a true pioneer. We knew tiny snippets of information about him but very sadly he died in 1930, leaving 9 children. Their mother had died in 1928. Most of them were very young and ended up in orphanges. Separated from their brothers and sisters it took many years for them to find each other. However almost 80 years later there remained 2 brothers who had not been seen since the 1920's. A couple of years ago one of those children turned 90. My Aunt contacted me and said that she didnt want to die not knowing what had happened to her brothers. So my 20 year "fiddle" with the family tree, mainly with the German branch, turned into a huge search - and thats when I linked up with this list. Nine months ago I managed to find one of the missing brothers, the eldest in the family. Well the brother had died but I did find his grandson and as a result his son. The irony was that my father and this brother had looked for each other all their lives and it turned out that they had actually been living 15 minutes apart for most of their lives and never knew. I found him by getting on the internet and writing to every single Schuler in the Australian telephone book and sending an outline of what we knew of the family tree. Surprisingly most people DID respond, even if it was to say that they were not related. I follwed the protocol set out in the German ancestry web sites, that is sending return postage etc. I still really wanted to find my grandfathers family in Germany. Because of the circumstances surrounding his death and the fact that he died during the depression we knew no one here would have contacted his family in Germany In amongst his fathers things the son found a very ancient and very well worn piece of paper that had been written by my grandfather sometime in the 1920's. On it was two addresses. One was for an Anthon Schuler who we did not recognise and the other was for a Christina Eberhardt who we knew was my grandfathers sister. The two addresses in Nieder-Roden (modern day Rodgau) no longer existed. So I set about writing to every single Schuler in Nieder-Roden, Dieburg and Frankfurt am Main (where we knew my grandfathers family had come from). It was an expensive exercise and I wasnt getting very far when I had a bright idea. I wondered what would happen if I wrote to the Stadt in Rodgau. So I did. I just explained a little about my grandfathers death, enclosed a copy of the two addresses we had and asked if they could help. It was months ago that I wrote and I hadnt heard anything and was starting to believe I wouldn't when I got a letter yesterday. In this letter they have identified the Anthon Schuler - it was my grandfathers cousin. And they have also given me details of my grandfathers sister, her marriages, her children and their children. Which of course gives me the married names of my cousins!!!! A quick peek in the German telephone book and sure enough they are both there. In addition to all that they also gave me some of the family tree backwards to 1650. A lot I already had, but they have managed to fill in a few blanks as well. I was equally surprised to find that they have not charged me for the information at all. Rather they have wished me luck on my search and a reunion. Also a few months ago I was introduced to the joys of Ebay and out of curiosity I put in a search for Nieder-Roden. That came up with someone who was selling a book on the History of Nieder-Roden. So I had the book, but not having cousins names I couldnt really relate to a lot of the family, though there were many Schulers menioned (so many thanks Gisella for translating bits for me) Now with this information from the Stadt I looked again and found photographs of family that I can identify. I can actually put faces to names and know that I am looking at my cousins!!!! It was so special to look at a photograph in this book and see my cousin as a young man. The same young man I am going to try and call tonight. I know we often ask questions on the list - so I hope you will forgive this long post - but I thought I would share a joyous success. And whats so special is that the Aunt who started me on the earnest part of my search began to fail a few weeks ago. I pray with all my might that she will recover and have many more years with us, but I know that I have now fulfilled a promise to her. I found her brothers and her cousins. And I couldn't have done it without my fellow list members - THANKYOU!!!! Love many, hate few, learn to paddle your own canoe. -- American Proverb Keep Looking For Rainbows!! _--_|\ /Karen \ \ _.--._ / v Karen, http://members.optushome.com.au/karens

In a message dated 7/10/2004 3:03:42 AM Eastern Standard Time, HESSE-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: I found the church website and want to write via e-mail to see if when I come, I can look at and perhaps copy church records. Any suggestions are appreciated, as I read no German and can not understand the website. http://www.kuhstedt-erloeser.de/ Hi Gail: If you want to e-mail the church, go to the website and, on the left side under "Gemeinde" click on "Kontakt." An e-mail form should appear. Paul

My mother, first generation here in America, was always so ashamed that she only understood "Low German." What is so bad about the "Low German." Location? Virginia

Patty Appreciate being on the list. Am going to Ireland on Aug 4 for 2 weeks. When I get back I will try to be more contributary than I have. Best Ed

I will be traveling to Germany in about 3-4 weeks and have found the town from where my Great-grandfather was born. It is Kuhstedt, which is in NIEDERSACHSEN. I found the church website and want to write via e-mail to see if when I come, I can look at and perhaps copy church records. Any suggestions are appreciated, as I read no German and can not understand the website. http://www.kuhstedt-erloeser.de/ Also, Would I be more likely to find records post 18500 at the local church or here? Sprengel (area) Stade Church district Bremervörde-Zeven Bevern, Bremervörde, Elsdorf, Gnarrenburg, Gyhum, Heeslingen, Kirchwistedt, Kuhstedt, Oerel, Oese, Rhade, Selsingen, Sittensen, Zeven I hope that this makes sense as it is confusing to me. Gail

Hi Ray, > Also, the same papers have a reference to "Bechtolsheim, O, Hessen." Can > anyone suggest to what the "O" refers. Bechtolsheim belonged (19th century) to the county Oppenheim, may be that's the "O". I I'd also guess they're talking about the same Wattenheim. Thomas www.tr62.de ----- Original Message ----- From: <PROSK@aol.com> To: <HESSE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, July 08, 2004 9:25 PM Subject: [HESSE] Query re Wattenheim, etc. > Hi, > > I have some genealogical workpapers that refer to: > 1. Wattenheim, Lampertheim, Hessen > 2. Wattenheim, Bensheim, Hessen > > Can anyone tell me if these are the same villages and, if so, why the > references to Lampertheim and Bensheim are used? > > Also, the same papers have a reference to "Bechtolsheim, O, Hessen." Can > anyone suggest to what the "O" refers. > > Thanks. > > Ray Prohaska > Columbus >

In a message dated 7/8/04 12:40:49 PM, PROSK@aol.com writes: << I have some genealogical workpapers that refer to: 1. Wattenheim, Lampertheim, Hessen 2. Wattenheim, Bensheim, Hessen Can anyone tell me if these are the same villages and, if so, why the references to Lampertheim and Bensheim are used? Also, the same papers have a reference to "Bechtolsheim, O, Hessen." Can anyone suggest to what the "O" refers. >> There is a Wattenheim in Kreis Bergstrasse, just west of Biblis. Lampertheim, also in Kreis Bergstrasse, is about 6 miles south of Biblis. So, I'd guess they're talking about the same village. However, another Wattenheim is in Kreis Bad Dürkheim, Rheinland-Pfalz, not too far west of these places in Hessen. Bechtolsheim in is Kreis Alzey, Rheinland-Pfalz now. If this paper is referring to a time when this area was Rhein-Hessen, that may be another clue that the Wattenheim is the place in Kreis Bad Dürkheim. Dona Ritchie

This website suggests that "Biedenkopf" is a place name in Darmstadt. Perhaps start there? I know a family that went right to the place name of their ancestor and struck gold. http://www.rootsweb.com/~pacambri/books/Storey/v3/p146.html The worst that could happen is that you are down to every Protestant Church in Hessen minus one. There are no silly questions. How can we know everything about a past that has become buried through the generations? At least we are all trying to come to an understanding and appreciation of those who went before us. Dianne ----- Original Message ----- From: <DmRice@aol.com> To: <HESSE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 07, 2004 11:57 PM Subject: [HESSE] German Dialect - why I am clueless! > Thanks to all those who responded to my question about clues from language > dialects. > I regret that I did not supply complete data. I had asked about the family > names before and gotten no connections, so here I confined myself to seeking > some off-the (brick) -wall method of narrowing location. It appears I will > have to read every Protestant church record in Hessen looking for one containing > two names I need. (And my eyes are NOT what they once were.) > > I am looking for the hometown of William BIEDENKOPF and wife Eva MAYGOLD, > presumably from somewhere in Hessen Darmstadt (census) > They were in Maryland in the 1820s and worked their way across Ohio to Cinti > by 1850 and Spencer Co.IN by 1860 (cn) > Source: a centennial county history bio of a son ("mean uncle" -see below). > As yet I have not located any passenger or naturalization records in > Maryland, nor found any of the family in a census of MD, OH or IN prior to 1850. > (using all sorts of spelling variants.) > > Their daughter Katherine married Ludwig Adam (Louis ADAMS) in Cinti > (recovered marriage book). Three Adams children survived. Dora, the youngest was my > great grandmother who argued in German (In Indiana they termed it "Dutch"}. > Dora was orphaned at six, so her memories were few. Her sister was raised > by a BIEDENKOPF uncle, listed as a servant in his hotel (census), and married > another servant. She died before her children were grown - possibly in > Missouri. Edward, the oldest, ran off to Texas because his (another) uncle was so > "mean", and came back years later to sue for his inheritance and win. (That is > court documented.) Dora was raised by her Aunt Eva (Biedenkopf) Kramer, who > for the sake of this quiery, I am assuming raised Dora with her mother's > speech pattern. > > I have traced a number of family lines in Spencer County, so I am fairly > familiar with available records there. > I do not know where the family worshiped. > Dora's parents lived in Centerville in Spencer County - a bend in the road > which no longer exists. > I have found no record of where they were buried. My grandmother supposed > Centerville. > William Biedenkopf left a will, and Louis Adams has estate records (his > brothers-in-law all owed him money. Dora didnt get any of it, and didnt sue.) > None of this is helpful in tracing the family in Germany. > > I also corresponded with a cousin - descended from the mean uncle. She > helped me with cousins but had no better information on early generations. > > Between lack of official records and memories lost by untimely deaths, I > fear I have found all that I am likely to find on this side of the water. > > So that is why I asked a silly question. > > > Barbara Feigel Rice > > ======================== > also among others more remote- > RIMSTIDT (the husband who didnt understand) /Seveus / Lullman/Luerke > - Hannover near Bremen > > Bretz, Rothenberger, Griess, Decker, Bohland etc. > within hiking distance of Alzey - "Rhennish Hesse" > Feigel, Dietrich, Bolz ... - Belheim Pfalz > Elzer, Roth ... - Westheim Pfalz > Maier - Gruenwettersbach -Baden > Veigel, Johle/Uhlin ... Hessignheim, Wurtemburg > > ================================== > > > ==== HESSE Mailing List ==== > Don't overlook the Hesse mailing list taglines at the > bottom of each list E-Mail you receive. Valuable infor- > mation is presented there! >

Hi, I have some genealogical workpapers that refer to: 1. Wattenheim, Lampertheim, Hessen 2. Wattenheim, Bensheim, Hessen Can anyone tell me if these are the same villages and, if so, why the references to Lampertheim and Bensheim are used? Also, the same papers have a reference to "Bechtolsheim, O, Hessen." Can anyone suggest to what the "O" refers. Thanks. Ray Prohaska Columbus

Thanks to all those who responded to my question about clues from language dialects. I regret that I did not supply complete data. I had asked about the family names before and gotten no connections, so here I confined myself to seeking some off-the (brick) -wall method of narrowing location. It appears I will have to read every Protestant church record in Hessen looking for one containing two names I need. (And my eyes are NOT what they once were.) I am looking for the hometown of William BIEDENKOPF and wife Eva MAYGOLD, presumably from somewhere in Hessen Darmstadt (census) They were in Maryland in the 1820s and worked their way across Ohio to Cinti by 1850 and Spencer Co.IN by 1860 (cn) Source: a centennial county history bio of a son ("mean uncle" -see below). As yet I have not located any passenger or naturalization records in Maryland, nor found any of the family in a census of MD, OH or IN prior to 1850. (using all sorts of spelling variants.) Their daughter Katherine married Ludwig Adam (Louis ADAMS) in Cinti (recovered marriage book). Three Adams children survived. Dora, the youngest was my great grandmother who argued in German (In Indiana they termed it "Dutch"}. Dora was orphaned at six, so her memories were few. Her sister was raised by a BIEDENKOPF uncle, listed as a servant in his hotel (census), and married another servant. She died before her children were grown - possibly in Missouri. Edward, the oldest, ran off to Texas because his (another) uncle was so "mean", and came back years later to sue for his inheritance and win. (That is court documented.) Dora was raised by her Aunt Eva (Biedenkopf) Kramer, who for the sake of this quiery, I am assuming raised Dora with her mother's speech pattern. I have traced a number of family lines in Spencer County, so I am fairly familiar with available records there. I do not know where the family worshiped. Dora's parents lived in Centerville in Spencer County - a bend in the road which no longer exists. I have found no record of where they were buried. My grandmother supposed Centerville. William Biedenkopf left a will, and Louis Adams has estate records (his brothers-in-law all owed him money. Dora didnt get any of it, and didnt sue.) None of this is helpful in tracing the family in Germany. I also corresponded with a cousin - descended from the mean uncle. She helped me with cousins but had no better information on early generations. Between lack of official records and memories lost by untimely deaths, I fear I have found all that I am likely to find on this side of the water. So that is why I asked a silly question. Barbara Feigel Rice ======================== also among others more remote- RIMSTIDT (the husband who didnt understand) /Seveus / Lullman/Luerke - Hannover near Bremen Bretz, Rothenberger, Griess, Decker, Bohland etc. within hiking distance of Alzey - "Rhennish Hesse" Feigel, Dietrich, Bolz ... - Belheim Pfalz Elzer, Roth ... - Westheim Pfalz Maier - Gruenwettersbach -Baden Veigel, Johle/Uhlin ... Hessignheim, Wurtemburg ==================================

Barbara, the language problem between both result most probably from the Low German of him. Everyone living in a High (including Middle) German language area has problems with Low German. Many of them do understand nothing even when it is spoken in its best on television or radio today. So unfortunately it won't be no difference if she came from northern or southern Hesse-Darmstadt. You mention two surnames for Hesse-Darmstadt, one (Maygold) I can't find in the telephone directory, one is rather seldom: only 54 Biedenkopf in todays Hesse, 41 of them in a 20 miles distance from the town Giessen (which is in the northern half of former Hesse-Darmstadt): village Angelburg 5, small town Friedberg 4, city/town Giessen 10, small town Gruenberg 6, small town Laubach 5, village Muecke 3 (Muecke, Laubach and Gruenberg are neighbors just east of Giessen). Thomas German dialect (text, map) on www.tr62.de/german.html ----- Original Message ----- From: <DmRice@aol.com> To: <HESSE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, July 07, 2004 6:10 AM Subject: [HESSE] German dialect - any clue? > My grandmother told a story about her parents- both American-born (1860s) > German speaking children of immigrant parents. His were born in "Hanover" > within sight of Bremen - her mother was probably born in Hessen Darmstadt and she > was raised (an orphan) by a maternal aunt. > > The story is that one spoke "High Dutch" and one spoke "Low Dutch", and when > they argued they shifted to German and they could not understand one another. > > I am trying to narrow my search for HER village. Can anyone speculate > whether there would be any clue in the language difference which might make some > regions of H.Darmstadt more probable places to focus or postpone others as > unlikely? > > > Barbara Rice > Rimstidt/Seveus/ Lullman (Hannover) > Biedenkopf / Maygold - (H.Darmstadt) > Bretz, Decker, Griess, Bohlander, etc - Rhine Hessen near Alzey > >

My grandmother told a story about her parents- both American-born (1860s) German speaking children of immigrant parents. His were born in "Hanover" within sight of Bremen - her mother was probably born in Hessen Darmstadt and she was raised (an orphan) by a maternal aunt. The story is that one spoke "High Dutch" and one spoke "Low Dutch", and when they argued they shifted to German and they could not understand one another. I am trying to narrow my search for HER village. Can anyone speculate whether there would be any clue in the language difference which might make some regions of H.Darmstadt more probable places to focus or postpone others as unlikely? Barbara Rice Rimstidt/Seveus/ Lullman (Hannover) Biedenkopf / Maygold - (H.Darmstadt) Bretz, Decker, Griess, Bohlander, etc - Rhine Hessen near Alzey

There is no such place as Baden Baden , Hesse! Baden Baden was the capital of the duchy of Baden. Hesse was another state, in 1852 there were two Hessen: Hesse-Kassel Hesse-Darmstadt You will have to provide more information than "family rumor" before anyone can help you find out this persons origins. ----- Original Message ----- From: "C Edw Wolfe" <deskipper@sbcglobal.net> To: <HESSE-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Monday, July 05, 2004 5:04 PM Subject: [HESSE] An Inquiry > I signed with Hesse- L having been baited that there was information on Heinrick FURST. > He arrived in New Orleans in June 23, 1852.. He was accompanied by a wife named > Louise and two children both born in Germany. > Family rumour is that he came from Baden Baden , Hesse . He was a protestant. > I am interested in establishing his origin, his marriage and the birth certificate of his > two children - Martha age 7and Grorg age 6 on arrival in this country > > > ==== HESSE Mailing List ==== > Don't overlook the Hesse mailing list taglines at the > bottom of each list E-Mail you receive. Valuable infor- > mation is presented there! >

I too am interested in a FURST. I realize that this list does not cover the area of Stuttgart. My grand fathers name was Franz Joesph Furst. I would appreciate any information on to look for him. Thank you, Maggie __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

I signed with Hesse- L having been baited that there was information on Heinrick FURST. He arrived in New Orleans in June 23, 1852.. He was accompanied by a wife named Louise and two children both born in Germany. Family rumour is that he came from Baden Baden , Hesse . He was a protestant. I am interested in establishing his origin, his marriage and the birth certificate of his two children - Martha age 7and Grorg age 6 on arrival in this country

According to the catalog I have for the Lutheran Church Archive in Kassel, the records for Schluchtern are available from 1577 - 1918. No mention of Herolz in the catalog. -----Original Message----- From: Pm401kplan@aol.com [mailto:Pm401kplan@aol.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 29, 2004 3:27 PM To: HESSE-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [HESSE] Re: HESSE-D Schluchtern/Herolz records In a message dated 6/29/2004 11:00:41 AM Eastern Standard Time, HESSE-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: I am wondering where the church records for the time around 1840 and before for this area would be. I don't think that the LDS church has filmed them. I am probably interested in the Catholic records, but would be good to know where the Luthern records are as well. Hello Stephen: If the records haven't been filmed by LDS, try contacting the church archives in the area to find out if the records are stored there or are still at the local churches. You can contact the Catholic and Lutheran archives by e-mail: Catholic Archives: Diocesan Archives in Fulda: Archiv@bistum-fulda.de Lutheran Archives: Central Archive of the Evangelical Church in Hessen and Nassau, Darmstadt: zentralarchiv@ekhn-kv.de If the records for these two towns are stored somewhere else, the archives should give you contact information, as well as the year for which the records begin Paul ==== HESSE Mailing List ==== Don't overlook the Hesse mailing list taglines at the bottom of each list E-Mail you receive. Valuable infor- mation is presented there!

Hi List I am looking for any information on Anna Catharina BECKER LINGELBACH born in/residing in Deckenbach. Born around 1800 Came to American with son Heinrich Lingelbach age 15 in 1855 Husband was Heinrich Lingelbach and did not come to America with her Thank you for any help you might be able to give me sam from WY

Here is what I was able to find on the LDS site: Henry Lingelbach Male Event(s): Birth: 20 DEC 1839 Darmstadt, , Rheinhessen, Hessen Christening: Death: 30 OCT 1921 Burial: Parents: Father: Henry Lingelbach Family Mother: Anna Catherine Becker Marriages: Spouse: Catherine Kindelberger Family Marriage: 12 JUL 1859 Harriettsville, Noble, Ohio Thx Geno >From: "L,M. MEAD" <jrsam@tctwest.net> >Reply-To: "L,M. MEAD" <jrsam@tctwest.net> >To: HESSE-L@rootsweb.com >Subject: [HESSE] LINGELBACH >Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 18:43:50 -0600 > >Hi List I am looking for any information on Anna Catharina BECKER >LINGELBACH >born in/residing in Deckenbach. Born around 1800 >Came to American with son Heinrich Lingelbach age 15 in 1855 >Husband was Heinrich Lingelbach and did not come to America with her >Thank you for any help you might be able to give me > sam from WY > > >==== HESSE Mailing List ==== >Going on Vacation? Longer than 4 days? Go to >http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/DEU/HESSE.html >to unsubscribe >

In a message dated 6/29/2004 11:00:41 AM Eastern Standard Time, HESSE-D-request@rootsweb.com writes: I am wondering where the church records for the time around 1840 and before for this area would be. I don't think that the LDS church has filmed them. I am probably interested in the Catholic records, but would be good to know where the Luthern records are as well. Hello Stephen: If the records haven't been filmed by LDS, try contacting the church archives in the area to find out if the records are stored there or are still at the local churches. You can contact the Catholic and Lutheran archives by e-mail: Catholic Archives: Diocesan Archives in Fulda: Archiv@bistum-fulda.de Lutheran Archives: Central Archive of the Evangelical Church in Hessen and Nassau, Darmstadt: zentralarchiv@ekhn-kv.de If the records for these two towns are stored somewhere else, the archives should give you contact information, as well as the year for which the records begin Paul

I am wondering where the church records for the time around 1840 and before for this area would be. I don't think that the LDS church has filmed them. I am probably interested in the Catholic records, but would be good to know where the Luthern records are as well. Dr. Stephen Pegler Stargate Charter School