Dr. Thierry, Can either of these sites be viewed in english? My sixteen year-old can read German, but he's 16 and not interested in helping his mother!! Thank you, Cindy Phipps ----- Original Message ----- From: "Thierry Dietrich" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, April 10, 2009 2:28 PM Subject: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp It is a mixture of macro-scale historical knowledge adding a few micro-scale aspects from the internet (in this case from www.abenheim.de and www.worms.de). ;-) The internet is so to say an extension to my brain. ;-) Dr. Thierry P. Dietrich D-61250 Usingen ________________________________ Von: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> An: [email protected] Gesendet: Freitag, den 10. April 2009, 20:32:45 Uhr Betreff: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp Wow! How do you keep all that information in your head!? And don't say wikipedia, because it doesn't even talk about Napolean. lol Brian On Fri, April 10, 2009 12:52 pm, Thierry Dietrich wrote: > Just a little comment on "Abenheim in Hessen Darmstadt 1796". > > Abenheim first became part of the Grand-Duchy of Hessen (a.k.a. > Hessen-Darmstadt) after the Napoleonic time and the congress of Vienna in > 1816. > > Thus in 1796 Abenheim has never been Hessian. Until 1797 it belonged to > the noble family of Dalberg. Then it was occupied and annexed by France. > > Regards, > > Thierry > > Dr. Thierry P. Dietrich > > D-61250 Usingen > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Brian, where is the US did your 'Rupp's settle? Mine landed in St. Louis, MO, and some in Louisiana. Are we related? Cindy ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, April 10, 2009 8:57 AM Subject: [HESSE] A question on surnames > Should I consider Rupp as a separate surname from Ruppel? I have at least > one confirmed case in this town where Rupel was used in naming a Rupp, but > that could be an isolated incident. > > Thanks, > Brian > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message
No doubt it's hard to jump over to German roots. Here's some ideas to help you. 1) Check for your surname in the IGI (International Genealogical Index). The location of births and marriages is listed if known. 2) Search Die Ahnenstammkartei des Deutschen Volkes. It's an under utilized research tool. 3) Check for others researching your surname, find these from the FHL ( Ancestral File). Also the FEEFHS website used to have an index. Not sure if it's still there. 4) Look for a German Language Obituary. 5) Check a German Nammenlexikon for the earliest known place where your surname is found. Bahlow's Nammenlekicon is usually found as part of the core German collection at all Family History Centers in North Amrica. Others for various provinces (such as Silesia and Pommern) are found in the main library at larger cities and at University libraries, especially research and reference libraries. 6) Get a copy of the Germany: Research Outline: - available from most FHC's. This is an excellent summary of FHL sources available to help you. See also my Research Outline: Germany - Annotations. 7) Try locating the place of Origin using the Meyers Orts- und Verkehrs-lexikon des Deutschen Reichs by E. Uetrecht (1912-1913). The "FHLC" (FHL Catalog) listing is under Germany, Gazetteers (topic #77 of 500, collection #35 of 69). The 29 FHL microfiche numbers are 6000001 - 6000029. The 2 FHL microfilm numbers are 496460 and 496641. 8) Check genealogy website databases. 9) Search the WWW with a Web Search engine and use several to search the web. You'll need to get comfortable looking at German, if you are going to do your own research. I recommend installing the Firefox web browser and the abctajpu language plugin, which will translate almost any page out there to varying degrees of success. Usually primitively understandable or better. HTH, Brian On Mon, April 13, 2009 2:49 pm, Barbara Meredith wrote: > Thanks, Brian, but I don't read German and that looks pretty confusing to > me!!! Georg arrived in 1751 at Halifax and the ship record says he was > from > Hesse. That's it!!!! Sure not much to go on, but thanks anyway. > > Barb > > On Mon, Apr 13, 2009 at 1:27 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > >> I don't think you will find any censuses for German states, if that is >> the >> question. Your best bet is to use the emigration information you have >> and >> try to locate a town from there, either in a ships log, or emigration >> book >> or online at the hesse HADIS archives. >> >> http://www.hadis.hessen.de/ >> >> Although, the online archives never really helped me. >> >> Brian >> >> >> On Mon, April 13, 2009 1:08 pm, Barbara Meredith wrote: >> > It is rather difficult to find information on George Frolig born >> Hessen >> > circa 1710 when one does not know the town. Are there any Census >> records >> > that one can check looking for a surname which would then give you the >> > Town? Any ideas would be most helpful. George left on a ship out of >> > Rotterdamn in 1751 on a voyage to Canada. >> > >> > Thanks, >> > Barbara, in Alberta Canada >> > >> > -- >> > "Forgotten Settlers": Nova Scotia's Foreign Protestants >> > www.barbarameredith.com >> > >> > ------------------------------- >> > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes >> > in the subject and the body of the message >> >
I don't think you will find any censuses for German states, if that is the question. Your best bet is to use the emigration information you have and try to locate a town from there, either in a ships log, or emigration book or online at the hesse HADIS archives. http://www.hadis.hessen.de/ Although, the online archives never really helped me. Brian On Mon, April 13, 2009 1:08 pm, Barbara Meredith wrote: > It is rather difficult to find information on George Frolig born Hessen > circa 1710 when one does not know the town. Are there any Census records > that one can check looking for a surname which would then give you the > Town? Any ideas would be most helpful. George left on a ship out of > Rotterdamn in 1751 on a voyage to Canada. > > Thanks, > Barbara, in Alberta Canada > > -- > "Forgotten Settlers": Nova Scotia's Foreign Protestants > www.barbarameredith.com > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > >
Ok two questions. Question one: Ok, I have an ancestor who has in his death index the name Gräf after his forename ( Milde, Carl Christian Gräf). The Gräf is not used in his baptismal name. I have other people where it appears the last name is Gräf. These people, I do not think are related to any royal family. Is it unusual to see "Gräf" used as a name rather than a title? ============================================================================ Question 2: Also, I'd like to confirm an entry in my research so I know for sure what a proper entry for a royal looks like. I have two batismal records for the Solmsische Stallmeister Hn. Eyersmann's children (no relation) the first is: Wilhelmina Christina, get. 17 Nov 1699 (P. Hochgeb Gräffin & FR. Wlihemine Christina zu Solms) This would be Wilhelmine Cristina the Countess of Solms, correct? The next entry is: Ludvig, geb 9. 5. 1704 (P. H. Graff Ludvig Henrich Graf zu Solms, Herr zu Munzenb.) This would be Ludvig Henrich Count of Solms [and Assenheim], of Munzenberg, right? Both Ludvig Henrich and his wife Wilhelmine Christine are buried in Assenheim (1728 and 1745 respectively). They had issue, among others, of: 4) Johan Ernst Carl Graf zu Solms-Rodelheim und Assenheim, and 5) Karl Christian Heinrich (*killed in a duel in 1745). These two could be the sponsors on the record for my ancestor Carle Christian Milde, even though the "Christian Heinrich" is reversed in the index transcription. Or am I way off? Neither of them would have been adults in 1725 and Johan Ernst Carl would not yet have been the count, he was second in line at this time. I think these two are the most likely candidates for the sponsors as no last name is given and both of them lived in Assenheim (at least part of the time). Thanks, Brian
Thanks, Brian, but I don't read German and that looks pretty confusing to me!!! Georg arrived in 1751 at Halifax and the ship record says he was from Hesse. That's it!!!! Sure not much to go on, but thanks anyway. Barb On Mon, Apr 13, 2009 at 1:27 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > I don't think you will find any censuses for German states, if that is the > question. Your best bet is to use the emigration information you have and > try to locate a town from there, either in a ships log, or emigration book > or online at the hesse HADIS archives. > > http://www.hadis.hessen.de/ > > Although, the online archives never really helped me. > > Brian > > > On Mon, April 13, 2009 1:08 pm, Barbara Meredith wrote: > > It is rather difficult to find information on George Frolig born Hessen > > circa 1710 when one does not know the town. Are there any Census records > > that one can check looking for a surname which would then give you the > > Town? Any ideas would be most helpful. George left on a ship out of > > Rotterdamn in 1751 on a voyage to Canada. > > > > Thanks, > > Barbara, in Alberta Canada > > > > -- > > "Forgotten Settlers": Nova Scotia's Foreign Protestants > > www.barbarameredith.com > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes > > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > -- "Forgotten Settlers": Nova Scotia's Foreign Protestants www.barbarameredith.com
---- Kenneth Lampel <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hello! >Kenneth, You have a lot more searching before you have an answer Hesse Darmstadt would be like the size of a state in the US...now you must locate a town. Marie > I am looking for birth, marraige, death, baptism records for a Emma Keller. Born approx NOV 1848 in Hesse-Darmstadt. I think that is in Germany now correct? I have no clue who her father and mother are but she married Matthais Strobel. She had approx 7 children Emma, Charles, Edward, John, Mary, Connie, Joseph. I have census records to show this and 1900 census shows immigration year as 1857. I know her last name from Leonhard Lampel and Emma Strobels 1886 marraige certificate stating her parents were Mathew Strobel and Emma Keller. The 1870 census lists her place of birth as H. Darmstadt. Can anyone help find who her parents were?? btw I can read German! > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Sadly, it doesn't look like it would be helpful to me. None of the towns listed cover my small region. There was a Ortsfamilienbuch done in 1939, but the only copy I know of is in Leipzig, I think. I have this reference, which I've never been able to make heads or tails of. O. A.: Ev.-luth. Verkartung Assenheim 1654-1754. o. A.; ST StA Darmstadt QU Praetorius: KB Hessen 1939 It's from this site: http://www.v-weiss.de/ofbmeur-a5.html If a book was done for your town it's probably listed there. It's in German, naturally. Not something you'd normally find in a search unless you use google.de. Near as I can make out, it was done by the Lutheran Church in Assenheim. Anyone interested in such material should definitely check out the site. Here's the entry for Gross-Karben: Groß-Karben/064/1993/1654-1737 (?) Steinbaur, Max: Groß-Karbener Familien 1654-1737. o. O. 1993; ST HFV Darmstadt (auch Kartei im Schrank 10-7) Similar to the title given in an earlier post. Sorry, I don't know how to read German references. other than seeing the author, title and place of publication (I think). Brian On Mon, April 13, 2009 3:26 am, Thierry Dietrich wrote: > Motivated by the many discussions around Assenheim and Karben here a > little hint on a new CD-ROM from Gottlieb See which seem to have > been published recently. As I don't do any research in the Wetterau > region, I can't provide any further details nor do I intend to purchase > this CD-ROM. I just want to spot this for those, which might be interested > and want to pursue this hint further. > > The CD-ROM is titled: "Hessische Familienbücher von Gottlieb See". > Gottlieb See is a genealogist known for his profound knowledge in the > south-west area of the Wetterau and additionally of the city of > Friedrichsdorf incl. some of its suburbs and two suburbs of the city of > Bad Homburg (which however do not belong to the county of Wetterau but > rather to the county of Hochtaunus). > > This CD-ROM is containing files in pdf Format with the entire content of > all available church books from the very beginning of the records, > sometimes until WW II. > > Included are the towns Friedrichsdorf, Köppern, Rodheim v.d.H., > Ober-Rosbach, Burgholzhausen, Dillingen, Nieder-Rosbach, Kirdorf and > Gonzenheim. > > If you want to know more, please google for further details, as I don't > have any more then this. > > Regards, > > Thierry > > PS: For those of you not familiar with Ortsfamilienbücher, they are not > simply transcriptions of church books. They are structured books resulting > from years of research, transcriptions and analysis, clearly > depicting entire genealogies of these towns. Starting from these materials > you can built entire genealogies within a few hours effort. Lucky is who > does research in towns where such Family books are available. However, of > course they are secondary sources. They cannot contain each single detail > (for instance they do not always contain witnesses, reasons of death, > etc.). It depends on the author what level of detail he wants to > integrate. Also sometimes transcription errors or typos in dates may > happen. Anyway, the value of these books still is tremendous and the > quality is much higher than the records of the mormons where typos or > transcription errors are occuring quite regularly. > > Dr. Thierry P. Dietrich > > D-61250 Usingen > > > > > ________________________________ > Von: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > An: [email protected] > Gesendet: Montag, den 13. April 2009, 05:52:38 Uhr > Betreff: Re: [HESSE] Bauer translation help > > I see records of people from Gross-Karben in Assenheim from time to time. > Not surprising though as I see entries for most of the nearby towns. I > have not seen any Bauers from there though. I'll have to go through my > sponsors and see if I have any from there (time consuming). Small world. > > Brian > > On Sat, April 11, 2009 4:19 pm, [email protected] wrote: >> Hello, >> >> What town does this family come from? I have a Maria Barbara Bauer from >> Gross-Karben ..late 1700s. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Bev W >> >> >> ************** >> Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for >> $10 or less. >> (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > >
It is rather difficult to find information on George Frolig born Hessen circa 1710 when one does not know the town. Are there any Census records that one can check looking for a surname which would then give you the Town? Any ideas would be most helpful. George left on a ship out of Rotterdamn in 1751 on a voyage to Canada. Thanks, Barbara, in Alberta Canada -- "Forgotten Settlers": Nova Scotia's Foreign Protestants www.barbarameredith.com
Hello! I am looking for birth, marraige, death, baptism records for a Emma Keller. Born approx NOV 1848 in Hesse-Darmstadt. I think that is in Germany now correct? I have no clue who her father and mother are but she married Matthais Strobel. She had approx 7 children Emma, Charles, Edward, John, Mary, Connie, Joseph. I have census records to show this and 1900 census shows immigration year as 1857. I know her last name from Leonhard Lampel and Emma Strobels 1886 marraige certificate stating her parents were Mathew Strobel and Emma Keller. The 1870 census lists her place of birth as H. Darmstadt. Can anyone help find who her parents were?? btw I can read German!
Brian, I have Bauer's from Saarbrucken, some emigrated and settled in Wisconsin. >I see records of people from Gross-Karben in Assenheim from time to time. > Not surprising though as I see entries for most of the nearby towns. I > have not seen any Bauers from there though. I'll have to go through my > sponsors and see if I have any from there (time consuming). Small world. > > Brian > > On Sat, April 11, 2009 4:19 pm, [email protected] wrote: >> Hello, >> >> What town does this family come from? I have a Maria Barbara Bauer from >> Gross-Karben ..late 1700s. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Bev W >> >> >> ************** >> Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for >> $10 or less. >> (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes >> in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >
Motivated by the many discussions around Assenheim and Karben here a little hint on a new CD-ROM from Gottlieb See which seem to have been published recently. As I don't do any research in the Wetterau region, I can't provide any further details nor do I intend to purchase this CD-ROM. I just want to spot this for those, which might be interested and want to pursue this hint further. The CD-ROM is titled: "Hessische Familienbücher von Gottlieb See". Gottlieb See is a genealogist known for his profound knowledge in the south-west area of the Wetterau and additionally of the city of Friedrichsdorf incl. some of its suburbs and two suburbs of the city of Bad Homburg (which however do not belong to the county of Wetterau but rather to the county of Hochtaunus). This CD-ROM is containing files in pdf Format with the entire content of all available church books from the very beginning of the records, sometimes until WW II. Included are the towns Friedrichsdorf, Köppern, Rodheim v.d.H., Ober-Rosbach, Burgholzhausen, Dillingen, Nieder-Rosbach, Kirdorf and Gonzenheim. If you want to know more, please google for further details, as I don't have any more then this. Regards, Thierry PS: For those of you not familiar with Ortsfamilienbücher, they are not simply transcriptions of church books. They are structured books resulting from years of research, transcriptions and analysis, clearly depicting entire genealogies of these towns. Starting from these materials you can built entire genealogies within a few hours effort. Lucky is who does research in towns where such Family books are available. However, of course they are secondary sources. They cannot contain each single detail (for instance they do not always contain witnesses, reasons of death, etc.). It depends on the author what level of detail he wants to integrate. Also sometimes transcription errors or typos in dates may happen. Anyway, the value of these books still is tremendous and the quality is much higher than the records of the mormons where typos or transcription errors are occuring quite regularly. Dr. Thierry P. Dietrich D-61250 Usingen ________________________________ Von: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> An: [email protected] Gesendet: Montag, den 13. April 2009, 05:52:38 Uhr Betreff: Re: [HESSE] Bauer translation help I see records of people from Gross-Karben in Assenheim from time to time. Not surprising though as I see entries for most of the nearby towns. I have not seen any Bauers from there though. I'll have to go through my sponsors and see if I have any from there (time consuming). Small world. Brian On Sat, April 11, 2009 4:19 pm, [email protected] wrote: > Hello, > > What town does this family come from? I have a Maria Barbara Bauer from > Gross-Karben ..late 1700s. > > Thanks, > > Bev W > > > ************** > Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for > $10 or less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Hi Brian, That would be terrific if you can get to it. I have Heck, Bronst and Bauer from Gross-Karben. Regards, Bev W ************** Access 350+ FREE radio stations anytime from anywhere on the web. Get the Radio Toolbar! (http://toolbar.aol.com/aolradio/download.html?ncid=emlweusdown00000035&ncid=emlcntusdown00000002)
I see records of people from Gross-Karben in Assenheim from time to time. Not surprising though as I see entries for most of the nearby towns. I have not seen any Bauers from there though. I'll have to go through my sponsors and see if I have any from there (time consuming). Small world. Brian On Sat, April 11, 2009 4:19 pm, [email protected] wrote: > Hello, > > What town does this family come from? I have a Maria Barbara Bauer from > Gross-Karben ..late 1700s. > > Thanks, > > Bev W > > > ************** > Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for > $10 or less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > >
Fellow Hesse researchers, Thanks for the help on the translation. The wife and daughters of Johannes and Appolonia Bauer, Elizabeth, Sophia and two daughters both named Maria emigrated to Baltimore Maryland in September 1856. One of the Maria's married Heinrich Noegel and moved to Florida in the 1870's, the other daughters stayed in Baltimore and married into the family Nies, who also emigrated from Hesse at the same time as the Bauers. Bauer was a pretty common name. I have been told Kranich or Kraunich was common in Hungary. Thanks again and happy hunting! Wayne Scott ------------------------------------------------------------ Associates Degree Earn your associates degree. Find a school near you. http://tagline.excite.com/fc/FgElN1guh2i0uRO6D7oWqFmnQbhWlL4kpsr6nek3X1hd0S2bCYpZXRBVp5G/
Here the full transcript. 1842. 2. Im Jahr Christi Achtzehnhundert Zwei und Vierzig den fünfzehnten Mai wurden, ohne vorhergegange- ne Proklamation wegen anticipirtem Concubitus nach eingegangener kreisräthlicher und landgerichtlicher be- scheinigung, daß, sowohl hinsichtlich der bürgerlichen, als der privatrechtlichen Verhältnisse, der vollziehung der Ehe kein Hindernis im Wege stehe, und nach Mahnung der canonischen Erfordernisse von Seiten des unterzeichne- ten Geistlichen mit Einwilligung der Mutter der Braut getraut und ehelich eingesegnet:Johannes Bauer wesenen Tagwächters allhier mit A. Dorothea, Catharina, Gertrude geborenen Busker[?] ehelich erzeugter ledigen Sohns, neu angehender Ortsbürger und Weißbinder dahier, mit ein und dreißig Jahrn, vier Monate, undApollonia Kranich Ortsdieners dahier mit Anna Maria geborenen Bas[?] ehelich erzeugte ledige Tochter, alt achtundzwanzig Jahre. Wobei der Bräutigam erklärt hat, daß er das von der Braut unehelich geborene Kind für ein durch ihn erzeugtes erkenne, welches Kind mit NamenAnna Maria zig geboren und in der Kirche dahier den zwölften dessel- ben monats und Jahres getauft worden ist. Zeugen waren: 1.) Heinrich Winter, Beigeordnete dahier 2.) Heinrich Kranich, lediger Bruder der Braut, welche gegenwärtiges Protocoll nebst mir dem Pfarrer, der die Copulation peinichtet[?], unterschrieben haben [Signatures follow] Heinrich Kranich Hainrich Winter Beigeordnete Friedrich Lehr[?] Regards, Thierry Dr. Thierry P. Dietrich D-61250 Usingen ________________________________ Von: TW Scott <[email protected]> An: [email protected] Gesendet: Samstag, den 11. April 2009, 21:06:54 Uhr Betreff: [HESSE] Bauer translation help Fellow Hesse researchers, I have what I think is a birth record for Anna Maria Bauer, born of Johannes Bauer and Appolonia Kranich. I can make out the date okay, and of course the names. Does anyone see anything else of obvious value that I can't don't understand?(which is most of it) Does anyone know what the 1) and 2) and writing next to them is concerning? Here is a link to the images, named Bauer 1, 2 and 3. I enlarged the top, middle and bottom of the document for better viewing. http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/s/c/o/Thomas-W-Scott/ Thanks for the help. Regards, TW Scott ------------------------------------------------------------ Psychology School Be a professional. Click here to earn a psychology degree. http://tagline.excite.com/fc/FgElN1g4wynUQcp5XrjH08wjZa3rNK9joL7dQeHRwFMvxGNzgUZfAopRLmY/ ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message : den fünften Juli Achtzehnhundert und vier- des weiland Stephan Kranich, gewesenen, der weiland Bernhard Bauer ge-
I don't know whether there are older records nor where they may be kept. I don't do any research in that area. May be others in this list may help you there. Note Johann Rapp may have been tailor, but he very likely also was a farmer in Abenheim. Often farmers had a kind of second job to feed their families. As nearly everybody was a farmer, even if they mainly lived from farming, this was no differentiator. This is why a side-job often was mentioned as job as this was the differentiator. Only in cities tailors could live from tailoring alone. On the countryside this was rather an exception. I am telling you this as this may help you understand switching to farmer only in the U.S. may not have been as difficult for Johann as you may have imagined. Regards, Thierry Dr. Thierry P. Dietrich D-61250 Usingen ________________________________ Von: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> An: [email protected] Gesendet: Samstag, den 11. April 2009, 07:21:13 Uhr Betreff: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp My 2nd great grandfather, Johan Rapp (1819 Abenheim), immigrated?to the US in 1851.??In Germany?he was a tailor, but a farmer upon settling in?the US. His father is Valentine Rapp (1781 Abenheim) and mother Catherine Trunk (1776 Abenheim).??Valentine's father is Philip Rapp and his mother is?Eva.? Now?I suppose they could have been born?there too, but I could find no earlier records to search.??I guess that's two generations I'm aware of in Abenheim.? Are there any earlier records available for this area that I may search.? I guess that would be?Dalberg Family records? Sure hopes this?helps you help me.? Thanks again for your kind response. Twila -----Original Message----- From: Thierry Dietrich <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 2:18 pm Subject: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp For how long have they stayed in Abenheim? How many generations? When did they emigrate to the U.S.? There is far to little information to really give you any meaningful advice. Regards, Thierry ? Dr. Thierry?P. Dietrich D-61250 Usingen ________________________________ Von: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> An: [email protected] Gesendet: Freitag, den 10. April 2009, 18:08:48 Uhr Betreff: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp I understand.? Thank you. I wonder if anyone has any direction for me in my Rapp search.? I've researched then from the US back to Abenheim with the help of an old family letter that took me to?the church records in Abenheim, but?there is no mention in those records where they?were before then 1796.? Was there a pattern of migration at this time?? Should I look in neighboring towns?? Is there?another resource for?this time period?? Any direction would help.? Thanks again. Twila -----Original Message----- From: Thierry Dietrich <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 10:56 am Subject: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp Possible. You need to confirm this for your specific case in searching backwards for common ancestors. Regards, Thierry ? Dr. Thierry?P. Dietrich D-61250 Usingen ________________________________ Von: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> An: [email protected] Gesendet: Freitag, den 10. April 2009, 16:36:47 Uhr Betreff: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp I have a question...Is there any chance that Rupp and Rapp could have ever been the same?? I have Rapps from Abenheim in Hessen Darmstadt 1796, and would love to know where they migrated to there from. Twila -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 9:57 am Subject: [HESSE] A question on surnames Should I consider Rupp as a separate surname from Ruppel? I have at least one confirmed case in this town where Rupel was used in naming a Rupp, but that could be an isolated incident. Thanks, Brian ------------------------------- To u nsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ? ? ? ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Thomas, this is a marriage record. The wedding is in 1842, whereby the groom declares that he is the father of the bride's child born in 1840. The persons 1) and 2) are the witnesses. Carl Becker ----- Original Message ----- From: "TW Scott" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2009 9:06 PM Subject: [HESSE] Bauer translation help > Fellow Hesse researchers, > > I have what I think is a birth record for Anna Maria Bauer, born of > Johannes Bauer and Appolonia Kranich. I can make out the date okay, and > of course the names. Does anyone see anything else of obvious value that > I can't don't understand?(which is most of it) > > Does anyone know what the 1) and 2) and writing next to them is > concerning? > > Here is a link to the images, named Bauer 1, 2 and 3. I enlarged the top, > middle and bottom of the document for better viewing. > http://familytreemaker.genealogy.com/users/s/c/o/Thomas-W-Scott/ > > Thanks for the help. > Regards, > TW Scott > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > Psychology School > Be a professional. Click here to earn a psychology degree. > http://tagline.excite.com/fc/FgElN1g4wynUQcp5XrjH08wjZa3rNK9joL7dQeHRwFMvxGNzgUZfAopRLmY/ > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message >
I am not a specialist of today's Palatinate region, but probably best would be to refer to it as "Abenheim, Herrschaft (Lordship) Dalberg zu Herrnsheim" and if you want to refer to a bigger nation, then I would refer to the Holy Romano-Germanic Empire (which ended 1806), rather then to "Germany". Note Switzerland, the Netherlands, Belgium, Austria, Luxemburg, Lichtenstein and large parts of Italy, France, Poland and the Czech Republik were once part of the Holy Romano-Germanic Empire. Today's Germany is quite different from its extension and Middle-Europe has gone through quite significant changes in terms of borderlines all over the history until 1945 and then again in the 1990s (German reunion, split of the USSR, Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia). This is why "Germany" is a bit diffuse and often misunderstood. Regarding Abenheim... from about 1500 to 1797 (as far as I know) it was part of the "Herrschaft Dalberg zu Herrnsheim". Then it was occupied by France and annected to France end of the 18th century (probably 1797). 1813 it was given to the Grand-Duchy of Hessen (aka Hessen-Darmstadt). 1945 it became part of the newly formed Bundesland Rheinland-Pfalz. Regards, Thierry Dr. Thierry P. Dietrich D-61250 Usingen ________________________________ Von: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> An: [email protected] Gesendet: Samstag, den 11. April 2009, 06:49:51 Uhr Betreff: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp Thanks for the information.? I check and was a little off on my estimation of his birth, it actually is: Abenheim Parish Records, Film number 0949093 which is Roll 2, Page 65, 5th entry from the bottom of the page shows Eva and the mother and Philip Rapp as father of Valentine Rapp, baptized 3 june 1781 in Abenheim, Hessen-Darmstadt, Germany What would be correct to record his birth if not?? Would it be Abenheim, Darlberg, Germany? -----Original Message----- From: Thierry Dietrich <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 1:52 pm Subject: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp Abenheim Parish Records, Film number 0949093 which is Roll 2, Page 65, 5th entry from the bottom of the page shows Eva and the mother and Philip Rapp as father of Valentine Rapp, baptized 3 june 1781 in Abenheim, Hessen-Darmstadt, Germany What would be correct to record his birth if not?? Would it be Abenheim, Darlberg, Germany? -----Original Message----- From: Thierry Dietrich <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 1:52 pm Subject: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp Just a little comment on "Abenheim in Hessen Darmstadt 1796". Abenheim first became part of?the Grand-Duchy of Hessen (a.k.a. Hessen-Darmstadt) after the Napoleonian time and the congress of?Vienna in 1816. Thus in 1796 Abenheim has never been Hessian. Until 1797 it belonged to the noble family of Dalberg. Then it was occupied and annected by France.? Regards, Thierry ? Dr. Thierry?P. Dietrich D-61250 Usingen ________________________________ Von: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> An: [email protected] Gesendet: Freitag, den 10. April 2009, 19:04:30 Uhr Betreff: Re: [HESSE] Rupp - Rapp A very badly written u or a could be interpreted as the other. Or an illegible page may lead to confusion. Even worse is if the a has an umlaut over it. What is the source of your data on the placename? My Rupps are from Assenheim, until you go back far enough, in which case I haven't yet figured out exactly where they came from, although I have clues. I believe I also have seen Rapps in Assenheim, and/or in other places in the German states. So unless you have actual source documents it is hard to say what your ancestors' names were, and even then the person entering the record may have gotten it wrong.? Consider I have about 5000 records on my family, and if only 1 out 500 has a mistake in the name that would be 10 records with an incorrect name. the percentage is considerably higher than that, at least for the ones I can prove with certainty. the best proof is to gather as many sources as you can on a person, and rule out other explanations. I have persons who have gone through three or four different spellings of their lastname over their life (but most of them were French). Strange coincidence Abenheim vs. Assenheim. I have Rupps in Assenheim beginning in the late 1600s, and on in to the 1800s at least. But, I'm just beginning to work that line. On Fri, April 10, 2009 9:36 am, [email protected] wrote: > I have a question...Is there any chance that Rupp and Rapp could have ever > been the same?? I have Rapp s from Abenheim in Hessen Darmstadt 1796, and > would love to know where they migrated to there from. > > Twila > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Sent: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 9:57 am > Subject: [HESSE] A question on surnames > > > > Should I consider Rupp as a separate surname from Ruppel? I have at least > one confirmed case in this town where Rupel was used in naming a Rupp, but > that could be an isolated incident. > > Thanks, > Brian > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] > with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body > of > the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes > in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message
Hello, What town does this family come from? I have a Maria Barbara Bauer from Gross-Karben ..late 1700s. Thanks, Bev W ************** Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)