Hi David, Hugh Thomas was indeed a planter in early Md. He was married to an Ann Samuel. Hugh was born in Llanmadoc, Gla., Wales ca. 1634-1638 and died in Maryland in 1688. He had a son, Hugh, who went on to be a planter in Coastal Virginia. I would imagine that in the period that we're talking about, there were many "headhunters" , who, for a fee, would match up the agent's requirements for indentured help with those having certain trades or skills. It's been well documented in St. Mary's County, Md., early records, as well as Charles County, Md., early records, that in 1674, John WATHEN was given 50 acres of his own following four years of satisfactory servitude to Hugh Thomas. Whether those 50 acres were open land or part of Thomas's plantation is not known. Both practices were in place then. My ancestor John went on to buy more property and even was an agent for three men from Heref., as indentured servants. John eventually acquired much more acreage, mostly under tobacco, which he called WATHEN'S ADVENTURE. Over the years, the boundary between Charles County and St. Mary's County has changed a few times. That's why some records are found in each county today. Some late info I've received is giving me a hint to check out Llantwit Major, in the Vale of Glamorgan. Apparently the name WATHEN is quite common there, as it is in Heref., Gloucs., Pemb., and other areas near the English/Welsh border. Given that Hugh Thomas was from Llanmadoc, near Swansea, and given that the WATHEN name is not uncommon in that area as well (Llantwit Major), that will be the next area I explore. There is a blood connection between the WATHEN and DEERE families of Llantwit Major. Reportedly, the descendants of the DEERE's in that area had a famous descendant here in the States, John DEERE, who invented the farm tractor, altho' this has not been verified. I don't lay claim to any of the DEERE's, but there are wills from that family that mention relatives named WATHEN. As I understand English history of the period, when the head of an estate passed away, the estate, by default, went to the eldest son. The rest of the siblings got left-overs, if anything. Further, if debts were owed on the estate, the siblings would hire out as indentured servants for a given period of time to retire the debt. I have reason to believe that my John was by no means a pauper, he knew the value of hard work as evidenced by his success as a free man in Md. It's possible that his family was what is described as "minor gentry" of the period, given that the DEERE family is much described the same way. The WATHEN name does carry a Coat of Arms, not from one of those sites where one is invented for you, but the information comes from a respected genealogist in South Bend, Indiana, who has studied the family name for many, many years. In fact, it was her efforts that started me on this quest to find out more about John. On this side of the pond, we've been able to trace John's descendancy from his first marriage down to the present day. I'm merely curious as to where he came from, what is background was, etc. Finding and verifying that information would really round out the family history. Like you say, David, THOMAS is a very popular name, especially in Wales, where I understand it originated. If you're interested in finding out more about the chap who came to either Virginia or Maryland, you may want to check either the Maryland Gen Web Project, or the Virginia Gen Web project. As I say, my Hugh's son, Hugh, moved from Maryland to Virginia to become a large plantation owner there. Speaking of destinations, many indentures sailed from Bristol to the Caribbean, specifically to Barbados. Sometimes that was a stopping off place as part of the known trade routes. Throughout the Caribbean during that time there were many sugar plantations and that sugar was distilled into rum which was taken back to Britain and Europe. In the deep south, the Carolinas and Georgia, you'd find rice plantations, and in the Chesapeake Bay area (Maryland and Virginia) were the tobacco growers. Further up the coast toward the Massachussetts Bay Colony were the woolen mills. It was a great time for the maritime merchants. By around 1690, the practice of indenture went away when it was discovered that a plantation owner, regardless of what he was raising, could do better by buying slaves, and we know what that led to. If I can be of any help in helping you find your ancestor, please let me know. I'll find what I can and forward to you. Can you give me a little more to go on? The year he was indentured, etc? I'll dig up what I can for you. Best regards, bill wathen ----- Original Message ----- From: "David Daniell" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 4:15 PM Subject: Re: [GLS] John WATHEN > Hi Bill, > > I admire your ambition in setting out to identify a particular Hugh > Thomas. That's a very popular name. Is it possible he was just the > agent in perhaps Bristol who contracted the labour and sent them to > Maryland? I have a then young ancestor (32) who newly widowed left > the two children with family (I descend from one of them) and > indentured himself in the same way from London for "Virginia or > Maryland" (and disappeared) but it is a few decades later than your man. > > The person he is contracted to is fortunately well-recorded, he lived > in London and his brother, Captain Hector MacNeal, Bristol-based, > shipped the contractees to North America and the Caribbean. I read > that Neal MacNeal's London clerks were lazy and used ditto marks too > often so the cargo often went to different places from those > apparently specified! (Though presumably as the individual contract > specified.) Neal MacNeal must have had a very substantial business > apparently founding a gentry family - ref. "Family papers of MacNeal > of Tirfergus, Ugadale and Losset". All this MacNeal info through > Google Books. > > Can anyone tell me the essential difference between contracting > oneself for four years indentured labour in Maryland 1670 and say a > four year contract 2008-2012 to work in, say, a hospital in Saudi > Arabia? > > Are you sure Hugh Thomas was in Maryland? > > Best wishes > David > > > On 5/12/2008, at 6:31 AM, bill waathen wrote: > >> Hi Elizabeth, >> >> For sure that's the guy I'm researching. We pretty much have our >> lineage on >> him from his arrival at Port Tobacco, Md., in 1670, indentured to Hugh >> Thomas for 3-4 years. John's history prior to landing in Md. is >> still the >> big mystery that I'm trying to resolve. John was indentured to Hugh >> Thomas >> Sept. 10, 1670, and sailed on the Francis and Mary from Bristol, >> England to >> Port Tobacco, Md. Where he lived and who his family was in Britain is >> unknown to me at this time. I've searched the Bristol Records >> office twice >> for immigrants opting for servitude in the American colonies for the >> period, >> and what I've mentioned here is all that's showing. However, my >> nose is >> leading me to the Glamorgan, Wales, area, because that's where Hugh >> Thomas >> was from. Wish me luck and I thank you for your input. >> >> Have a good'ern, >> >> Bill > _____________________________________________ > > Have you considered adding "postems" to "your" events on > www.freebmd.org.uk , giving your contact details? Other researchers will > then be able to make contact. Click on the info button to add your postem. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Hi David, I believe I may have found the meaning of the word "agent" as used during the period of indentures. An "agent" as I understand, was a "head-hunter" or "broker" who matched up what the plantation owner was looking for in the way of an indentured servant, with a potential indenture having the desired credentials. In the case of Hugh THOMAS and John WATHEN, it appears that Hugh acted as his own agent in acquiring John, thus cutting out the "middleman." Apparently it worked well enough so that when John was in need of indentures himself, he acted as his own "agent" in acquiring three chaps from Heref. Or is my thinking a bit fuzzy? More L8R, Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "bill waathen" <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 11:00 PM Subject: Re: [GLS] John WATHEN > Hi David, > > Hugh Thomas was indeed a planter in early Md. He was married to an Ann > Samuel. Hugh was born in Llanmadoc, Gla., Wales ca. 1634-1638 and died in > Maryland in 1688. He had a son, Hugh, who went on to be a planter in > Coastal Virginia. I would imagine that in the period that we're talking > about, there were many "headhunters" , who, for a fee, would match up the > agent's requirements for indentured help with those having certain trades > or > skills. It's been well documented in St. Mary's County, Md., early > records, > as well as Charles County, Md., early records, that in 1674, John WATHEN > was > given 50 acres of his own following four years of satisfactory servitude > to > Hugh Thomas. Whether those 50 acres were open land or part of Thomas's > plantation is not known. Both practices were in place then. My ancestor > John went on to buy more property and even was an agent for three men from > Heref., as indentured servants. John eventually acquired much more > acreage, > mostly under tobacco, which he called WATHEN'S ADVENTURE. Over the years, > the boundary between Charles County and St. Mary's County has changed a > few > times. That's why some records are found in each county today. > > Some late info I've received is giving me a hint to check out Llantwit > Major, in the Vale of Glamorgan. Apparently the name WATHEN is quite > common > there, as it is in Heref., Gloucs., Pemb., and other areas near the > English/Welsh border. Given that Hugh Thomas was from Llanmadoc, near > Swansea, and given that the WATHEN name is not uncommon in that area as > well > (Llantwit Major), that will be the next area I explore. There is a blood > connection between the WATHEN and DEERE families of Llantwit Major. > Reportedly, the descendants of the DEERE's in that area had a famous > descendant here in the States, John DEERE, who invented the farm tractor, > altho' this has not been verified. I don't lay claim to any of the > DEERE's, > but there are wills from that family that mention relatives named WATHEN. > > As I understand English history of the period, when the head of an estate > passed away, the estate, by default, went to the eldest son. The rest of > the > siblings got left-overs, if anything. Further, if debts were owed on the > estate, the siblings would hire out as indentured servants for a given > period of time to retire the debt. I have reason to believe that my John > was by no means a pauper, he knew the value of hard work as evidenced by > his > success as a free man in Md. It's possible that his family was what is > described as "minor gentry" of the period, given that the DEERE family is > much described the same way. The WATHEN name does carry a Coat of Arms, > not > from one of those sites where one is invented for you, but the information > comes from a respected genealogist in South Bend, Indiana, who has studied > the family name for many, many years. In fact, it was her efforts that > started me on this quest to find out more about John. On this side of the > pond, we've been able to trace John's descendancy from his first marriage > down to the present day. I'm merely curious as to where he came from, > what > is background was, etc. Finding and verifying that information would > really > round out the family history. > > Like you say, David, THOMAS is a very popular name, especially in Wales, > where I understand it originated. If you're interested in finding out > more > about the chap who came to either Virginia or Maryland, you may want to > check either the Maryland Gen Web Project, or the Virginia Gen Web > project. > As I say, my Hugh's son, Hugh, moved from Maryland to Virginia to become a > large plantation owner there. Speaking of destinations, many indentures > sailed from Bristol to the Caribbean, specifically to Barbados. Sometimes > that was a stopping off place as part of the known trade routes. > Throughout > the Caribbean during that time there were many sugar plantations and that > sugar was distilled into rum which was taken back to Britain and Europe. > In > the deep south, the Carolinas and Georgia, you'd find rice plantations, > and > in the Chesapeake Bay area (Maryland and Virginia) were the tobacco > growers. > Further up the coast toward the Massachussetts Bay Colony were the woolen > mills. It was a great time for the maritime merchants. By around 1690, > the > practice of indenture went away when it was discovered that a plantation > owner, regardless of what he was raising, could do better by buying > slaves, > and we know what that led to. If I can be of any help in helping you find > your ancestor, please let me know. I'll find what I can and forward to > you. > Can you give me a little more to go on? The year he was indentured, etc? > I'll dig up what I can for you. > > Best regards, > > bill wathen > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "David Daniell" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 4:15 PM > Subject: Re: [GLS] John WATHEN > > >> Hi Bill, >> >> I admire your ambition in setting out to identify a particular Hugh >> Thomas. That's a very popular name. Is it possible he was just the >> agent in perhaps Bristol who contracted the labour and sent them to >> Maryland? I have a then young ancestor (32) who newly widowed left >> the two children with family (I descend from one of them) and >> indentured himself in the same way from London for "Virginia or >> Maryland" (and disappeared) but it is a few decades later than your man. >> >> The person he is contracted to is fortunately well-recorded, he lived >> in London and his brother, Captain Hector MacNeal, Bristol-based, >> shipped the contractees to North America and the Caribbean. I read >> that Neal MacNeal's London clerks were lazy and used ditto marks too >> often so the cargo often went to different places from those >> apparently specified! (Though presumably as the individual contract >> specified.) Neal MacNeal must have had a very substantial business >> apparently founding a gentry family - ref. "Family papers of MacNeal >> of Tirfergus, Ugadale and Losset". All this MacNeal info through >> Google Books. >> >> Can anyone tell me the essential difference between contracting >> oneself for four years indentured labour in Maryland 1670 and say a >> four year contract 2008-2012 to work in, say, a hospital in Saudi >> Arabia? >> >> Are you sure Hugh Thomas was in Maryland? >> >> Best wishes >> David >> >> >> On 5/12/2008, at 6:31 AM, bill waathen wrote: >> >>> Hi Elizabeth, >>> >>> For sure that's the guy I'm researching. We pretty much have our >>> lineage on >>> him from his arrival at Port Tobacco, Md., in 1670, indentured to Hugh >>> Thomas for 3-4 years. John's history prior to landing in Md. is >>> still the >>> big mystery that I'm trying to resolve. John was indentured to Hugh >>> Thomas >>> Sept. 10, 1670, and sailed on the Francis and Mary from Bristol, >>> England to >>> Port Tobacco, Md. Where he lived and who his family was in Britain is >>> unknown to me at this time. I've searched the Bristol Records >>> office twice >>> for immigrants opting for servitude in the American colonies for the >>> period, >>> and what I've mentioned here is all that's showing. However, my >>> nose is >>> leading me to the Glamorgan, Wales, area, because that's where Hugh >>> Thomas >>> was from. Wish me luck and I thank you for your input. >>> >>> Have a good'ern, >>> >>> Bill >> _____________________________________________ >> >> Have you considered adding "postems" to "your" events on >> www.freebmd.org.uk , giving your contact details? Other researchers will >> then be able to make contact. Click on the info button to add your >> postem. >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> > > _____________________________________________ > > Have you considered adding "postems" to "your" events on > www.freebmd.org.uk , giving your contact details? Other researchers will > then be able to make contact. Click on the info button to add your postem. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message