Dear Listers, I've just added another subject to my 'Welsh Churches and Chapels Collection': St David's (old) Church, Manordeifi, Pembrokeshire Guest photographer: Gill Thomas. Go to www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/churches/manordeifi1.htm The 'Welsh Churches and Chapels Collection' now features 354 churches and chapels, with thirty-five still in the pipeline. Kind regards, John -------------------- John Ball, Brecon, Mid-Wales, UK E-mail: john@jlb2011.co.uk Personal Homepage: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk Images of Wales: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/ Welsh Family History Archive: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/wales/ Blog: http://johnofbrecon.com Webmaster, Breconshire Local & Family History Society http://www.blfhs.co.uk/ GENUKI Breconshire Maintainer: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/BRE/ Administrator - Powys RootsWeb mailing list

Hello Jeff Or as the Jones boy would say. Macsen may have left Wales in AD 383 but Yma o Hyd Ry'n ni yma o hyd, er gwaetha pawb a phopeth which translates as "We're still here, in spite of everyone and everything. Regards Gareth

I have heard, via Glamorgan Family History Society, that a TV company called Green Bay Media is working on a factual TV series about ancestral DNA testing and genetic genealogy. "The research has already begun on a group of Tudors to find out if their surname group has significant DNA matches. If so, we will then look for known male descendants of the Tudors of Penmynydd, Henry VII's ancestors, to test for Y-chromosome matches in order to identify possible genetic connections between members of our surname group and the Tudor dynasty. Similar genetic genealogy work has been done in Scotland and Ireland where 'clan markers' have been identified with a number of prominent family lineages. To extend our search for Welsh clan markers they are keen to contact family history society members who have documented family trees which show descent from historic figures such as Rhodri Mawr, Hywel Dda, Rhys ap Tewdwr, Iestyn ap Gwrgant, Bleddyn ap Cynfyn or any other prominent Welsh patriarch." Anyone who has knowledge of possible descent from a Welsh prince or patriarch would be welcome to get in touch. Green Bay Media have a number of a free ancestral DNA kits to hand out as part of our project's aim to identify genetic markers associated with prominent Welsh lineages. I think the best way forward is for anyone interested to contact me, and I will then give you contact details for Ms Jones of Green Bay Media who is working on the programme, which is due for broadcast in autumn 2015 on S4C. I have no particular interest in this project other than to make it widely known to those researching family history with Glamorgan ancestors. Jeff Coleman Jeff.Coleman@ntlworld.com PS maybe they think it would be a bit ambitious to look for putative descendants of Macsen Wledig !

Hi Sue, On the FREE FamilySearch is a census for 1871. Registration District: Camberwell Sub-District: St George Parish: St Giles Camberwell County: London, Surrey Household Role Gender Age Birthplace William Beale Self M 40 Neath, Glamorganshire Zelina Beale Wife F 37 London Emily Beale Daughter F 13 Hoxton, Middlesex Alice Beale Daughter F 10 Deptford, Kent I hope this helps. Jill Apologies Dai. -----Original Message----- From: glamorgan-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:glamorgan-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dai & Angela Bevan via Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 10:12 AM To: glamorgan@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [GLA] BEAL Sue, William Beal, aged 10 was with his parents John and Martha at Zoar, Neath in 1841 (indexed on Ancestry as Beel). In 1851 he is in Skewen (my birthplace), still living with his parents and working as a pattern maker (indexed on Ancestry as Bale, but looks more like Beale to me). However, in 1861 there is a William Beale, aged 31, born NEath working as an engineers fitter in Deptford, Kent, so you may need to do some further digging. Dai On 13/06/2015 09:02, Sue Barker via wrote: > Hello Listers, > > This is the first time I have carried out any research in Wales. > > I am looking for the BEAL family. > > William Beal b abt 1831 (Glamorgan, Wales?) – married Mary Ann? > Chn Charlotte Beal b abt 1853 > John Beal b abt 1855 > Hannah b abt 1857 > These birth dates were taken from the shipping list. > This family arrived in Australia in 1859 leaving from Liverpool. > > I am looking for the marriage of William Beal to Mary Ann? pre 1853 > Birth of William Beal abt 1831 (it was stated that William was from > Glamorgan on the shipping list) > > Births for all 3 children (I do not know where the children were > born?) > > Hoping some one can help with info. > > Kind Regards > Sue Barker > Mahogany Creek, WA

Hello Listers, This is the first time I have carried out any research in Wales. I am looking for the BEAL family. William Beal b abt 1831 (Glamorgan, Wales?) – married Mary Ann? Chn Charlotte Beal b abt 1853 John Beal b abt 1855 Hannah b abt 1857 These birth dates were taken from the shipping list. This family arrived in Australia in 1859 leaving from Liverpool. I am looking for the marriage of William Beal to Mary Ann? pre 1853 Birth of William Beal abt 1831 (it was stated that William was from Glamorgan on the shipping list) Births for all 3 children (I do not know where the children were born?) Hoping some one can help with info. Kind Regards Sue Barker Mahogany Creek, WA

Sue, William Beal, aged 10 was with his parents John and Martha at Zoar, Neath in 1841 (indexed on Ancestry as Beel). In 1851 he is in Skewen (my birthplace), still living with his parents and working as a pattern maker (indexed on Ancestry as Bale, but looks more like Beale to me). However, in 1861 there is a William Beale, aged 31, born NEath working as an engineers fitter in Deptford, Kent, so you may need to do some further digging. Dai On 13/06/2015 09:02, Sue Barker via wrote: > Hello Listers, > > This is the first time I have carried out any research in Wales. > > I am looking for the BEAL family. > > William Beal b abt 1831 (Glamorgan, Wales?) – married Mary Ann? > Chn Charlotte Beal b abt 1853 > John Beal b abt 1855 > Hannah b abt 1857 > These birth dates were taken from the shipping list. > This family arrived in Australia in 1859 leaving from Liverpool. > > I am looking for the marriage of William Beal to Mary Ann? pre 1853 > Birth of William Beal abt 1831 (it was stated that William was from Glamorgan on the shipping list) > > Births for all 3 children (I do not know where the children were born?) > > Hoping some one can help with info. > > Kind Regards > Sue Barker > Mahogany Creek, WA

Hello Sue, Birth, Marriage and Death Indexes from Jul 1837 onwards are online at [1]http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl There is a possible marriage in 1851 in Abergavenny District, Monmouthshire (neighbouring county of Glamorgan): Marriages Dec 1851 Abergavenny 26 51 BEALL William ; DANIEL Jane ; DAVIES Morgan ; Morgan Hannah ; MORGAN Jane ; PRICE David; Willmott James; Woodward Mary Ann. Unfortunately, it is not possible to tell from the index who married who. I had a quick look at the births, but could not identify the children in Glamorgan or Monmouthshire. I had a quick look at the birth index but could readily identify the children. Not much help I'm afraid, but it may be possible to identify them with a bit more time. regards, Dai Bevan On 13/06/2015 09:02, Sue Barker via wrote: Hello Listers, This is the first time I have carried out any research in Wales. I am looking for the BEAL family. William Beal b abt 1831 (Glamorgan, Wales?) – married Mary Ann? Chn Charlotte Beal b abt 1853 John Beal b abt 1855 Hannah b abt 1857 These birth dates were taken from the shipping list. This family arrived in Australia in 1859 leaving from Liverpool. I am looking for the marriage of William Beal to Mary Ann? pre 1853 Birth of William Beal abt 1831 (it was stated that William was from Glamorgan o n the shipping list) Births for all 3 children (I do not know where the children were born?) Hoping some one can help with info. Kind Regards Sue Barker Mahogany Creek, WA References 1. http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl

Hi, I was hoping someone in Dowlais could help me. my ancestors lived in Dowlais and I contacted the Pant Cemetery in regards to my Rees ancestors who lived on Bryn Sion st. Mr. Smith of the Merthyr Tydfil County Borough Council (which is responsible for that cemetery), emailed me stating my Rees ancestors were not buried there and to check the Dowlais church grave yards. I have the dates of death of my Rees family, but the record does not say where they were buried in Dowlais. I was hoping that someone from Dowlais could shed some light on what churches are there, and if there are any grave yard records. On the Internet I can only find the Pant Cemetery listed in Dowlais, so I assumed they were all buried there. I also found out that Dowlais is missing from the 1841 Census. David Rees d. March 5, 1877. lived at 32 Bryn Sion St. Dowlais Charlotte John Rees d. May 24, 1861 19 Bryn Sion St. Dowlais Gwellian Rees (1st wife) d. July 6, 1849 Bryn Sion St. Dowlais. any information would be appreciated, and hopefully I can find where they and others are buried. Sincerely Yours. Jason Bahrt Bronx, New York

You might want to trawl thru http://freereg2.freereg.org.uk/ you might get some goodies, even tho I suspect 1855 is as far as they have gotten with Dowlais. But I would expand the search to all of Glams just incase they belonged to an outlying church. Eliz Not Today and Not without a Fight (Anon) For all that has been, thanks. For all that will be, yes. (Dag Hammarskjold) On Wed, Jun 10, 2015 at 2:03 PM, Heather Smith via <glamorgan@rootsweb.com> wrote: > Hi, I was hoping someone in Dowlais could help me. my ancestors lived in Dowlais and I contacted the Pant Cemetery in regards to my Rees ancestors who lived on Bryn Sion st. Mr. Smith of the Merthyr Tydfil County Borough Council (which is responsible for that cemetery), emailed me stating my Rees ancestors were not buried there and to check the Dowlais church grave yards. > I have the dates of death of my Rees family, but the record does not say where they were buried in Dowlais. > > I was hoping that someone from Dowlais could shed some light on what churches are there, and if there are any grave yard records. On the Internet I can only find the Pant Cemetery listed in Dowlais, so I assumed they were all buried there. I also found out that Dowlais is missing from the 1841 Census. > > > > David Rees d. March 5, 1877. lived at 32 Bryn Sion St. Dowlais > > Charlotte John Rees d. May 24, 1861 19 Bryn Sion St. Dowlais > > Gwellian Rees (1st wife) d. July 6, 1849 Bryn Sion St. Dowlais. > > > > any information would be appreciated, and hopefully I can find where they and others are buried. > > Sincerely Yours. > > Jason Bahrt Bronx, New York > > > -- > > To send to the list send to glamorgan@rootsweb.com > GLAMORGAN Family History Mailing List archives etc. are at > http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/WLS/GLAMORGAN.html > - > > A web site has been prepared to help you use the Glamorgan List > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~glamorgan/ > > - > A large amount of information, and a wide variety of useful links, may be found at http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/ > > - > The South/West Wales Lookup Exchange and Gareth's Help Pages > http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~walesle/wal/AW.html and > http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ukwales2/hicks.html > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GLAMORGAN-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Dear Listers, I've just added another subject to my 'Welsh Churches and Chapels Collection': St John the Baptist Church, Hafod, Swansea, Glamorgan Photography by John Ball. Go to www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/churches/swansea4.htm The 'Welsh Churches and Chapels Collection' now features 353 churches and chapels, with thirty-five still in the pipeline, including some from earlier in the alphabet. Kind regards, John -------------------- John Ball, Brecon, Mid-Wales, UK E-mail: john@jlb2011.co.uk Personal Homepage: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk Images of Wales: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/ Welsh Family History Archive: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/wales/ Blog: http://johnofbrecon.com Webmaster, Breconshire Local & Family History Society http://www.blfhs.co.uk/ GENUKI Breconshire Maintainer: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/BRE/ Administrator - Powys RootsWeb mailing list

The Welsh Bible uses the spelling Naomi http://www.beibl.net/beibl-chwilio?viewid=BNET%3ARut.1&newwindow=BOOKREADER I can't think of any similar Welsh names - what spellings do you have? Liz On 05/06/2015 00:38, Eliz Hanebury wrote: > I have consistently corrected what I thought were misspellings of > Naomi but is there a more Welsh version of the name? > > It runs thru my James family, I have no idea why. Susan or Susannah > is my 3Xggmother and all the children I have found use it. In that > case, some wishful thinking here, Naomi might be the first name of > Susanna mother > > > > > Eliz > Not Today and Not without a Fight > (Anon) > > For all that has been, thanks. > For all that will be, yes. > (Dag Hammarskjold) >

Dear Colete There is a family tree on Ancestry about your David Arnold and son Joseph. The sons worked in an Iron works - that is a works where iron ore was smelted in a blast furnace to iron, and the iron was then 'purified' by puddling. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puddling_%28metallurgy%29 describes the process. Almost certainly the house where David lived in 1851 belonged to the iron company. It was common for iron companies to own and run collieries, as large amounts of coal were needed to produce iron from iron ore. Bizarre coincidence - two doors away from David in 1851 was Horatio Gaccon and family. My second-cousins (one of whom sent me family history information yesterday) are descended from the Gaccon family. http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/Aberdare/ especially http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/Aberdare/Lewis1833.html are relevant. It was the iron works at Abernant they worked at I think. http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/Aberdare/CynonNames.html is by Deric John who is a member of the Glamorgan list. http://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Aberdare_Ironworks is a potted history of ironworks in Aberdare http://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Abernant_Iron_Co is about the Abernant ironworks. By the 1860s these works, owned by the Fothergill family, were in decline as they were somewhat obsolete and uncompetitive. They collapsed in the 1870s, and huge unrepayable loans to these and other obsolete ironworks ( eg at Pentyrch) also led to the collapse of the West of England Bank. http://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Richard_Fothergill_(1822-1903) If the ARNOLD sons got out in the 1860s by emigrating to use their skills in the growing iron industry in Pennsylvania and Ohio, they were maybe wise. Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: Colete Morlock To: Jeff Coleman Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2015 2:31 PM Subject: Re: [GLA] Two Questions Dear Jeff and All, Thank you so much for the information provided! It was my understanding that David and Jennet's sons worked in the iron mines. At least, that's what happened with the sons Thomas, William, and Joseph. Thomas was a puddler in Massachusetts before the Civil War. William, the one I have the least information for worked in a forge in East St. Louis, Illinois. Joseph, the youngest of the three brothers worked in a rolling mill in Sharpsburg, Pennsylvania, which is outside Pittsburgh. One brother, I believe it was Richard, who was the eldest remained back in Wales. When David Arnold passed away, Jennet lived with Richard and his family. Up to this point, we had never any information on David Arnold's family. Your information gives me a place to start. Thanks so much! Colete On Thu, Jun 4, 2015 at 8:59 AM, Jeff Coleman <Jeff.Coleman@ntlworld.com> wrote: I have looked at the index to marriages at St John's Aberdare published by Glamorgan Family History Society. The date of the marriage is given as 21 November 1818, so it should be in one of the new-style marriage registers brought in in 1813. The Glamorgan FHS index shows that they were recorded as 'both of this parish'. It is likely that the two witnesses will be listed. The register would appear to be held at Glamorgan Archives, Cardiff but there may be a copy at Aberdare Library. If you are not a member of Glamorgan FHS you may wish to join to get access to research help. the Cynon Valley branch covering Aberdare has quite a lot of records not all of which are widely available. I expect you already know that a large proportion of Aberdare records are on the excellent FREE web site FreeReg www.freereg.org.uk including this marriage. However the witnesses are not listed in this case. It shows that he was a bachelor and she a spinster. If you do a search on FreeReg for all ARNOLD baptisms in Glamorgan you will find a surprising number, back to the 1600s, mainly in lowland agricultural parishes in the south and west of the County. FreeReg baptisms for Arnold include a number of baptisms of your couple's children at Trecynon-Hen Dy Cwrdd, Aberdare, which indicates that they were nonconformists who presumably married in the parish church only because the law required them to. Sometimes Jennet is recorded as Shoned, maybe nearer to the Welsh pronunciation. Nonconformists (Dissenters) were unlikely to have baptised their children in parish churches, but you might find 1790s baptisms in the nonconformist registers deposited at the GRO in 1837. As for Llanwonno, the earliest ARNOLD baptism was William, son of William ARNOLD on 30th August 1801. There are also burials at Llanwonno of William aged 76 on 25 April 1833 and Ann age 66 on 3 November 1833, who might perhaps be the parents of the child mentioned above ( and possibly of other ARNOLDs born in Llanwonno) Both were buried from the 'Upper Workhouse' so workhouse or parish vestry records, if surviving, might tell you more. [Maybe not the same, as William ARNOLD married Anne WILLIAM at Llanwonno 11May 1805. He was a bachelor, she a spinster. That might have been a younger man.] William age 76 in 1833 would seem to have been born around 1756. There is a baptism of a William on 21 Apr 1754 in St. Donat's, father David ARNOLD. [not clear which of the two St Donat's parishes this is.] Also buried at Llanwonno was William son of William Thomas ARNOLD, age 25, on 30th May 1817, who might perhaps be the child baptised in 1801. You may have to think laterally and search all occurrences of a surname in the right time and place, and work on the possibility that William son of David may then have named his son David, even if you don't have solid evidence. Why should there be migration from fertile lowland parishes to hill-farming upland parishes like Llanwonno and Aberdare. Better pay as coal miners or iron workers than as agricultural labourers, I suspect. Best of luck with your search. Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Colete Morlock via" <glamorgan@rootsweb.com> To: <glamorgan@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2015 6:30 PM Subject: [GLA] Two Questions 1. Can anyone tell me what information would have been shown on the Marriage Records? David Arnold/Jennet Jenkin show up on the "Glamorgan Marriage Index, pre 1837" on Find My Past. 2. Also, since we can't find the birth record for David Arnold ( abt 1793 in Llanwonno, Glamorgan, Wales), did it ever occur that a birth would not have been recorded until years later? The only way I know the approximate birth year is from the 1851 and 1861 Census. Thanks! Colete

I have looked at the index to marriages at St John's Aberdare published by Glamorgan Family History Society. The date of the marriage is given as 21 November 1818, so it should be in one of the new-style marriage registers brought in in 1813. The Glamorgan FHS index shows that they were recorded as 'both of this parish'. It is likely that the two witnesses will be listed. The register would appear to be held at Glamorgan Archives, Cardiff but there may be a copy at Aberdare Library. If you are not a member of Glamorgan FHS you may wish to join to get access to research help. the Cynon Valley branch covering Aberdare has quite a lot of records not all of which are widely available. I expect you already know that a large proportion of Aberdare records are on the excellent FREE web site FreeReg www.freereg.org.uk including this marriage. However the witnesses are not listed in this case. It shows that he was a bachelor and she a spinster. If you do a search on FreeReg for all ARNOLD baptisms in Glamorgan you will find a surprising number, back to the 1600s, mainly in lowland agricultural parishes in the south and west of the County. FreeReg baptisms for Arnold include a number of baptisms of your couple's children at Trecynon-Hen Dy Cwrdd, Aberdare, which indicates that they were nonconformists who presumably married in the parish church only because the law required them to. Sometimes Jennet is recorded as Shoned, maybe nearer to the Welsh pronunciation. Nonconformists (Dissenters) were unlikely to have baptised their children in parish churches, but you might find 1790s baptisms in the nonconformist registers deposited at the GRO in 1837. As for Llanwonno, the earliest ARNOLD baptism was William, son of William ARNOLD on 30th August 1801. There are also burials at Llanwonno of William aged 76 on 25 April 1833 and Ann age 66 on 3 November 1833, who might perhaps be the parents of the child mentioned above ( and possibly of other ARNOLDs born in Llanwonno) Both were buried from the 'Upper Workhouse' so workhouse or parish vestry records, if surviving, might tell you more. [Maybe not the same, as William ARNOLD married Anne WILLIAM at Llanwonno 11May 1805. He was a bachelor, she a spinster. That might have been a younger man.] William age 76 in 1833 would seem to have been born around 1756. There is a baptism of a William on 21 Apr 1754 in St. Donat's, father David ARNOLD. [not clear which of the two St Donat's parishes this is.] Also buried at Llanwonno was William son of William Thomas ARNOLD, age 25, on 30th May 1817, who might perhaps be the child baptised in 1801. You may have to think laterally and search all occurrences of a surname in the right time and place, and work on the possibility that William son of David may then have named his son David, even if you don't have solid evidence. Why should there be migration from fertile lowland parishes to hill-farming upland parishes like Llanwonno and Aberdare. Better pay as coal miners or iron workers than as agricultural labourers, I suspect. Best of luck with your search. Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Colete Morlock via" <glamorgan@rootsweb.com> To: <glamorgan@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2015 6:30 PM Subject: [GLA] Two Questions > 1. Can anyone tell me what information would have been shown on the > Marriage Records? David Arnold/Jennet Jenkin show up on the "Glamorgan > Marriage Index, pre 1837" on Find My Past. > > 2. Also, since we can't find the birth record for David Arnold ( abt 1793 > in Llanwonno, Glamorgan, Wales), did it ever occur that a birth would not > have been recorded until years later? The only way I know the approximate > birth year is from the 1851 and 1861 Census. > > Thanks! > > Colete

Marriage records give name age Sometimes just stating full age or might give exact age occupation address where living at time father and fathers occupation also same for bride also witnesses but sometimes they are witnessed by the clerks of church after 1837, pre this gives limited info as doesn't say fathers name or age sometimes says a parish if different to where wedding being held althea

I have consistently corrected what I thought were misspellings of Naomi but is there a more Welsh version of the name? It runs thru my James family, I have no idea why. Susan or Susannah is my 3Xggmother and all the children I have found use it. In that case, some wishful thinking here, Naomi might be the first name of Susanna mother Eliz Not Today and Not without a Fight (Anon) For all that has been, thanks. For all that will be, yes. (Dag Hammarskjold)

Hi Colete You can find info on parishregisters at http://joinermarriageindex.co.uk/history-of-parish-registers/ and also at http://www.archivecdbooks.org/resources/registers/7marpre1837.htm, which has some example images. Liz On 03/06/2015 18:30, Colete Morlock wrote: > 1. Can anyone tell me what information would have been shown on the > Marriage Records? David Arnold/Jennet Jenkin show up on the "Glamorgan > Marriage Index, pre 1837" on Find My Past. > > 2. Also, since we can't find the birth record for David Arnold ( abt 1793 > in Llanwonno, Glamorgan, Wales), did it ever occur that a birth would not > have been recorded until years later? The only way I know the approximate > birth year is from the 1851 and 1861 Census. > > Thanks! > > Colete >

Dear Listers, I've just added another subject to my 'Welsh Churches and Chapels Collection': Mount Pleasant Baptist Chapel, Kingsway, Swansea, Glamorgan Photography by John Ball. Go to www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/churches/swansea2.htm The 'Welsh Churches and Chapels Collection' now features 351 churches and chapels, with thirty-seven still in the pipeline, including some from earlier in the alphabet. Kind regards, John -------------------- John Ball, Brecon, Mid-Wales, UK E-mail: john@jlb2011.co.uk Personal Homepage: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk Images of Wales: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/walespic/ Welsh Family History Archive: http://www.jlb2011.co.uk/wales/ Blog: http://johnofbrecon.com Webmaster, Breconshire Local & Family History Society http://www.blfhs.co.uk/ GENUKI Breconshire Maintainer: http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/BRE/ Administrator - Powys RootsWeb mailing list

ELECTORAL ROLLS I am interested to learn if there are any ELECTORAL ROLLS available for Senghenydd Wales and Llanbradach Glamorgan Wales. I am looking for the period 1900 to 1915. Kind Regards Kay P.

Hi Colete, It's difficult to answer your first question. Before 1837, the state did not keep records of the marriages of ordinary people. Record-keeping would have depended on religious authorities (from 1753, Church of England, Quaker, and Jewish marriages were officially recognised in England and Wales) and at least in the Church of England changed over time. For the most part, there were no official *birth* records in England and Wales before 1837. Baptisms were recorded by various Christian denominations but not everyone was baptized and, of those who were, some were baptized many years after birth. Many Church of England baptismal records have survived and may be seen online or in archives but Nonconformist and Catholic records are often hard to find. Concerning your David Arnold, remember that birthplaces as well as ages were often reported incorrectly in censuses. Sometimes the "birthplace" shown is the place where the person lived as a child; ages of middle-aged people are often off by 5-10 years. Best wishes, Seán On Wednesday, June 3, 2015, Colete Morlock via <glamorgan@rootsweb.com <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','glamorgan@rootsweb.com');>> wrote: > 1. Can anyone tell me what information would have been shown on the > Marriage Records? David Arnold/Jennet Jenkin show up on the "Glamorgan > Marriage Index, pre 1837" on Find My Past. > > 2. Also, since we can't find the birth record for David Arnold ( abt 1793 > in Llanwonno, Glamorgan, Wales), did it ever occur that a birth would not > have been recorded until years later? The only way I know the approximate > birth year is from the 1851 and 1861 Census. > > Thanks! > > Colete > -- > > >

1. Can anyone tell me what information would have been shown on the Marriage Records? David Arnold/Jennet Jenkin show up on the "Glamorgan Marriage Index, pre 1837" on Find My Past. 2. Also, since we can't find the birth record for David Arnold ( abt 1793 in Llanwonno, Glamorgan, Wales), did it ever occur that a birth would not have been recorded until years later? The only way I know the approximate birth year is from the 1851 and 1861 Census. Thanks! Colete