Hi there, I am new to this list and interested in the STOKES family of 20 Cliff St Mountain Ash as stated in 1901 and 1911 census. The head of the family was Frederick Stokes b 1865 Upton on Severn Worcestershire. He worked at the Mine in Mountain Ash and died in M. Ash 1932 . His wife Mary Ann b in Wales was in the 1901 census and in the 1911 census a Martha Jane b Wales was Frederick's wife of 3 years. Also a son Fred b 1894 butchers salesman. Another son Stanley b 1910 M.Ash. Married 1937 Romford Essex died 1973 Havering Greater London. The two boy's seemed to have different mothers, half brothers. I was hoping sks may be able to shed some light on this family, maybe a lookup in the MI booklet for Mountain Ash or for Stanley MI Havering Greater London or even info from a electoral Roll any info would be wonderful. Stanley STOKES had one daughter b 1938 and in 1939 he went off to WW11 but never came home to his wife and daughter but survived the war. His daughter now 70 living in Wales has no memory of her father and knows little of her family hence, I with your help maybe able to tell her more. Thank you. Cheers, David NZ

http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=p&p=home&e=-------10-BOPT-1----0wales-- Robert Alun Chick (Penarth)

Not watching euro vision...Found this ..not pc in today's speak. But very interesting. http://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/cgi-bin/paperspast?a=d&d=WC19130721.2.68&l=mi&e=-------10--1----0-- Robert Alun Chick (Penarth)

Hi, I wonder if Frederick Stokes was being economical with the truth in 1911 about number of years married! There is this marriage in 1911 in Pontypridd on freebmd: Marriages Mar 1911 Lane Martha A Pontypridd 11a 761 Stokes Frederick Pontypridd 11a 761 Also on freebmd: Death of first wife: Sep 1906 Stokes Mary Ann 38 Pontypridd 11a 268 Maybe another son? Name: Ivor H Stokes Mother's Maiden Name: Lane Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1911 Registration district: Pontypridd Volume: 11a Page: 1262 Pamela

Name: Frederick H Stokes Birth Date: abt 1863 Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1931 Age at Death: 68 Registration district: Pontypridd Volume: 11a Page: 538

Message: 2 Date: Fri, 13 May 2011 17:15:56 +0100 From: "Heather Smith" <heather.smith8@virgin.net> Subject: [GLA] Gravestone but no death certificate? To: <glamorgan@rootsweb.com> I wonder if I could also comment on the problem of gravestone inscriptions. It is based on a family one which has caused me more problems than offered answers. The headstone is in good condition so the writing is clear therefore no ambiguities. The inscription reads: In memory of Evan Daniel who died Jan. 10, 1873 aged 49 years. Also George his son who died Oct. 25, 1885 aged 7 years. Also Gwenllian Daniel who died January 11, 1914 aged 78. ‘*She hath done what she could*’. Also of their son Robert who died Nov. 22, 1916 aged 59 years. Also their daughter Mary who died March 21, 1917 aged 64 years. “*Thy will be done*” The details on Evan are correct. The information on his son George does not make sense for several reasons. If he was 7 years old when he died then he was born 5 years after his father died! An early case of IVF? There is evidence that there was a son called George who lived from 1854 to 1860 and another called George Herbert born in 1861 who has got ‘lost’. Neither of these two sons fit the inscription. As for Gwenllian, in the 1911 Census she gave her age as 84. On her death certificate it is 78 coinciding with the inscription. The ages admitted on all the censuses is never the same. Having been born before 1837 and with the maiden name Morgan it is not easy to be sure but the best guess suggests she was probably 88 when she died. Then there is their son Robert. He was born in 1863 so he was only 53 when he died. Finally Mary’s age is about correct as she was in her 64th year. This particular experience has taught me to be wary of headstones as it means a lot of careful research before you can be sure of the facts. It also begs the question as to whether stonemasons paused to think what they were doing or queried their instructions. I suspect most did. Alas for the odd rogue one! Best wishes Edward

Depending on who the informant was at the time of death can also make a diffference. An example from my own family tree is my great great grandfather. He was born in 1814, and died in 1871, aged 57 years. The informant was not a family member, and both the GRO death index and the death certificate has his age as 67. If he didn't have such an uncommon name, Joseph Nixey, it could have caused some problems locating his death index. Another thing to ponder on that happened in my own family is that the place of death and the place of burial don't always match. Two examples are my great great great uncles, John and Edward Nixey. John died in 1857 in Essex, Edward died in 1866 in London, but both burials took place in Slough, Buckinghamshire. Kind regards, Jon

Just a thought Heather, but it may be that the stone was not erected until a year or two after David's death, and the stone-mason has made a mistake in his age at death. Believe me this does happen. I wonder if an email to the Registrar at Neath asking if she has a death certificate for David, son of James and Ann Thomas, who died aged 20 years, in 1867-1869 would be the answer. OR if you know where he is buried, as you do, see if the Burial register is still in existence. OR if the newspapers have any mention of his death. I would think that one of these will bring about his true date of death, either to confirm or deny the gravestone inscription. Best wishes, Jill http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~glamorgan/ -----Original Message----- From: glamorgan-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:glamorgan-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Heather Smith Sent: Friday, May 13, 2011 5:16 PM To: glamorgan@rootsweb.com Subject: [GLA] Gravestone but no death certificate? Help I cannot locate a death certificate for my David Thomas although I have a picture of the gravestone in Jerusalem C.M. Chapel in Pontrhydfen Neath Glamorgan. ER COF AM DAVID mab James a Ann Thomas o'r lle hwn yr hwn a Fu Farw MEDI 6 1868 yn 20 mlwydd oed There is no David Thomas who died in the July-September 1868 of the correct age or even near to it in any district. There is a few in the January-March quarter of 1868 one in Neath. That seems too far away to await burial in September. I understand that MEDI in Welsh means September not March which is a shame for me. Does anyone have any idea's? All the best Heather

WESTERN MAIL WEDNESDAY DECEMBER 15.  1926.  No. 333. FAMILY ANNOUNCEMENTS - continued. DEATHS. ROSE.- On December 10th, 1926, at Church-road, Alsager, Cheshire. Florence Eleanor (formerly of Roath, Cardiff), dearly-beloved wife of William Thomas ROSE. RAYMOND.- On December 12th, at 33, Jones-street, Blaenclydach. George, the beloved husband of Isabella RAYMOND. Funeral Thursday 2.30 p.m.; G.O. MORGAN.- On December 12th, at 17, Leslie-terrace, Porth. Ann, beloved wife of David MORGAN, Blacksmith, only daughter of the late Mr. and Mrs. DAVIES, Capel Farm, Tonyrefail. Public funeral Thursday Two p.m. prompt Lletherddu. JONES.- On December 13th, residence of sister (suddenly). Dulas, Llanrwst, North Wales. Rev. E. Mona JONES (Baptist Minister), late of U.S.A., aged 74. Funeral Thursday Blaenau Festiniog Cemetery. EVANS.- At 9, Victoria-square, Penarth, on the 14th December, the beloved infant son of Mr. and Mrs. W. H. EVANS. DAVIES.- On the 11th inst., the result of an accident Walter William, the beloved husband of Violet DAVIES, 27, Tydraw-road, Cardiff. Private funeral Wednesday, leaving residence Twelve Noon for Cardiff Cemetery. DAVIES.- On December 13th, at Coal Hole Inn, Gellihaf, Maesycymmer. John DAVIES, in his 82nd year. Private funeral Saturday, leaving residence 11.15 a.m. for Ystrad Mynach Churchyard. CRIDLAND.- 10th December 1926, at 32, Hannah-street, Porth. William G. beloved husband of Caroline CRIDLAND, age 66. Funeral Thursday next, leaving the house 2.30 p.m. for Trealaw Cemetery; G.O. BARNFIELD.- Clara L. BARNFIELD, the beloved daughter of the late Henry and Margaret BARNFIELD, of Cwm-dows Farm, Newbridge, Mon., died 13th December 1926. Funeral (Strictly Private) on Thursday at Beulah Church, Newbridge. BALMER.- December 14th, at 2, Stacey-road, Cardiff. John BALMER, in his ninety-second year, dearly-beloved father of Charles S. BALMER. Funeral leaving house Two p.m. Friday. John Patrick

Help I cannot locate a death certificate for my David Thomas although I have a picture of the gravestone in Jerusalem C.M. Chapel in Pontrhydfen Neath Glamorgan. ER COF AM DAVID mab James a Ann Thomas o'r lle hwn yr hwn a Fu Farw MEDI 6 1868 yn 20 mlwydd oed There is no David Thomas who died in the July-September 1868 of the correct age or even near to it in any district. There is a few in the January-March quarter of 1868 one in Neath. That seems too far away to await burial in September. I understand that MEDI in Welsh means September not March which is a shame for me. Does anyone have any idea's? All the best Heather

And even then you probably won't get a date of birth only a date of baptism but you should get both parents which will help. Regards Lyn In Oz. > -----Original Message----- > From: glamorgan-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:glamorgan-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Dai & > Angela Bevan > Sent: Friday, 13 May 2011 4:01 PM > To: Anita > Cc: GLAMORGAN@rootsweb.com > Subject: Re: [GLA] Aberffraw birth cirtificate help wanted > > > Anita, > There are no Birth certificates before September quarter > 1837. You will > need to find church records for Aberffraw. > Dai > On 13/05/2011 00:35, Anita wrote: > > Hello, > > > > Can anyone please help me is getting a birth certificate? > > > > Robert Roberts born in Aberffraw on Anglesey., somewhere > between 1809 or 1813. >

If he passed away in September, his death could have been reported in October, in the next quarter. Look at the entries for David Thomas' in the December quarter of 1868, I am not sure of his age but quite a few are Welsh. However, if that 20 is his age, there is one age 18 in Neath. On 5/13/11, Heather Smith <heather.smith8@virgin.net> wrote: > Help I cannot locate a death certificate for my David Thomas although I have > a picture of the gravestone in Jerusalem C.M. Chapel in Pontrhydfen Neath > Glamorgan. > > ER COF AM > DAVID mab James a Ann Thomas > o'r lle hwn > yr hwn a Fu Farw MEDI 6 1868 > yn 20 mlwydd oed > > There is no David Thomas who died in the July-September 1868 of the correct > age or even near to it in any district. There is a few in the January-March > quarter of 1868 one in Neath. That seems too far away to await burial in > September. I understand that MEDI in Welsh means September not March which > is a shame for me.

http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/AGY/Aberffraw/index.html and links on that page tell you where parish records are held. Note that there were already chapels of the Calvinistic Methodists and Wesleyan Methodists in the parish by the early 1800s. Note that on http://www.anglesey.gov.uk/doc.asp?cat=2667 there is indication that the Anglesey records office will be closed for an extended period from 30th May 2011. http://www.anglesey.gov.uk/upload/public/attachments/35/Anglesey_Chapel_List.pdf suggests that the CM chapel records from 1806 exist, and have been indexed by the Gwynedd Family History Society http://www.anglesey.gov.uk/upload/public/attachments/144/parish_registers_english_jan_2011.pdf shows that Anglesey Record Office holds the parish registers. Be aware that ROBERTS is a fairly common surname in that part of the world, and there may be more than one of that name in the parish. Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: "Anita" <coffecup2001@optusnet.com.au> To: <GLAMORGAN@rootsweb.com> Sent: Friday, May 13, 2011 12:35 AM Subject: [GLA] Aberffraw birth cirtificate help wanted > Hello, > > > > Can anyone please help me is getting a birth certificate? > > > > Robert Roberts born in Aberffraw on Anglesey., somewhere between 1809 or > 1813. > > > > Some of the family dates has Robert being born in 1809 and others have him > being born in 1813. > > On his marriage certificate under "Age" he wrote 5/13, 38 years. Married > on > 21/6/1851. = birth 1813 (I have marriage certificate) > > > > I am sorry I can't help with any more information, as he is a very high > brick wall in the family. > > Please contact me if anyone is able to help. > > > > Regards > > Anita in Australia

Hello, Can anyone please help me is getting a birth certificate? Robert Roberts born in Aberffraw on Anglesey., somewhere between 1809 or 1813. Some of the family dates has Robert being born in 1809 and others have him being born in 1813. On his marriage certificate under "Age" he wrote 5/13, 38 years. Married on 21/6/1851. = birth 1813 (I have marriage certificate) I am sorry I can't help with any more information, as he is a very high brick wall in the family. Please contact me if anyone is able to help. Regards Anita in Australia

Anita, There are no Birth certificates before September quarter 1837. You will need to find church records for Aberffraw. Dai On 13/05/2011 00:35, Anita wrote: Hello, Can anyone please help me is getting a birth certificate? Robert Roberts born in Aberffraw on Anglesey., somewhere between 1809 or 1813. Some of the family dates has Robert being born in 1809 and others have him being born in 1813. On his marriage certificate under "Age" he wrote 5/13, 38 years. Married on 21/6/1851. = birth 1813 (I have marriage certificate) I am sorry I can't help with any more information, as he is a very high brick wall in the family. Please contact me if anyone is able to help. Regards Anita in Australia

WESTERN MAIL WEDNESDAY DECEMBER 15 1926.  No. 332. FAMILY ANNOUNCEMENTS. IN MEMORIAM. TREHARNE.- In Ever-loving Memory of our dear brother. David Llewellyn TREHARNE, Pentre House, Pentre, Rhondda, who fell aslee December 15th, 1924.- Fondly remembered by Albert and Mary TREHARNE. PRITCHARD. In Ever-loving Memory of our dear Mother, who died at Elizabeth-street, Pentre, on December 15th 1925.- From her sorrowing Son and Daughters. PARSONS.- In Loving Memory of our dear daughter Beatrice, who passed away 15th of December, 1925, at Chepstow Hospital./verse- Remembered by her Mother, Father, Sisters, and Brother. KIFF.- In Sweet Remembrance of darling Dony, who died December 15th, 1915.- Fondly remembered by Grandma and Auties, 16, Davies-street, Porth. JONES.- In Loving Memory of my dear husband. John JONES, Confectioner, late of 4, Bridge-street, Six Bells, Abertillery, who died December 13th 1925. JENKINS.- In Loving Memory of my dear husband. Shadrach JENKINS, who passed away December 15th, 1924.- Fondly remembered by Wife, daughters Sybil and Irene, and Son-in-law./verse. EDWARDS.- In Loving Memory of Idris, the beloved son of Mr. and Mrs. T. EDWARDS, Brynteg, Pencoed, who died December 16th, 1915. DAVIES.- In Loving Memory of my dear wife, Jane, who died December 15, 1925, at 15, Holly Bush, Nelson. Ever remembered by Husband and Children. BLIGHT.- In Loving Memory of my dear wife. Jennette, who passed away December 15th, 1925.- Ever remembered by Husband and Children. ACKNOWLEDGMENTS. MORRIS.- The Widow and Family of the late Benjamin MORRIS, 71, Oxford-street, Mountain Ash, desire to thank all friends and relatives for their kind sympathy and floral tributes. CHRISTOPHER.- Mrs. CHRISTOPHER, 19, Richmond-road, Mountain Ash, wishes to thank all friends and relatives for their kind letters and sympathy. DEATHS.  WILLIAMS.- On the 13th inst., at Neathway, Dinas Powis. Ivor Parfitt, the beloved husband of Beatrice Violet WILLIAMS, and only son of the late T. J. WILLIAMS, Nautical Optician, 63, Bute-street, aged 43 years. Funeral Friday, leaving residence 11.45 a.m.: Service at St. Andrew's Church, Dinas Powis, 11.30 a.m. Interment Cardiff Cemetery 12.30 p.m. THOMAS.- December 12th inst., at 2, Brynteg-road, Blaina, Mon. Margaret, dearly beloved wife of David THOMAS. Funeral Thursday, December 16th, at 3.30p.m.; G.O.   N.F. THOMAS.- On December 10th, at Bronallt, St. Margaret's-road, Whitchurch. Annie, beloved wife of Trevor G. THOMAS. Funeral Wednesday Noon for Penderyn: Strictly private. John Patrick

My grandfather Thomas Lewis Gale was born in1872, We were always under the impression that he was born THOMAS LEWIS in Shire Newton, ran away at the age of 14 in 1886 and changed his name to THOMAS LEWIS GALE. In both the 1901 and 1911 Census he gave his place of birth as Mountain Ash. So far we have not been able to trace any family connection in the name od GALE to Mountain Ash. If he does appear in any GALE family tree from the Mountain Ash area I would welcome any news that would enable us to trace his family. Thank you Peter Gale, Port Talbot.

WESTERN MAIL TUESDAY DECEMBER 14.  1926.  No. 331. FAMILY ANNOUNCEMENTS-continued. DEATHS. JOHN.- On December 12th at Manorbedw, Clynderwen, Ben JOHN, J.P. Funeral Thursday 16th inst., at 12.30 p.m., for Nebo Chapel. JENKINS.- On Friday December 10. Captain Willie Morgan JENKINS (late Indian Army), 35, of 63, Stuart-street, Treorchy, beloved husband of Emily JENKINS (nee EDWARDS). Funeral Wednesday. 3.15. for Treorchy Cemetery; G.O. HYETT.- December 12th. at 13, Inverness-place. Hannah, widow of the late James Henry HYETT. T.V.R. in her 96th year. Funeral Thursday Two o'clock for St. Margaret's Church. DUTFIELD.- On December 13th, at the Laurels, Magor, Mon. Alderman Thomas DUTFIELD J.P., aged 75. Funeral Friday, arriving Penhow Church One o' clock. BROWN.- On December 11th. Eric Howell BROWN, beloved son of Mr. and Mrs. David BROWN, Cowbridge, age 24. Certified Master at Gelidawel School. Public funeral at Cowbridge Church, Three p.m. on Wednesday December 15th; private from home. BREEZE.- On December 12th, at 15, West-terrace, Penarth, late St. Fagan's. George, the beloved husband of Emma BREEZE. Funeral Wednesday, at St. Fagan's, Three p.m. Friends kindly meet at church. BENTLEY.- On December 11th at Llanishen Nursing Home. Minnie BENTLEY, of Cardiff. Funeral Wednesday, arriving at St. Mary's Church, Whitchurch, 1.45. MARRIAGES. LOGOTHETIS - O'DONOVAN. On December 11th at the Savoy Hotel, by Special Licence. Demeteris M. LOGOTHETIS to Olga Stella Elizabeth, second daughter of Dr. W. P. O'DONOVAN, Cathedral-road, Cardiff. BIRTHS. PENN.- On December 13th, at 9, Ystrad-street, Grangetown, to Flo, wife of Stan PENN, a son. McPHERSON.- On December 10th, at 13, Linden-road, to Mr. Mrs. Neil McPHERSON, a son. KNOWLES.- On December 11, at 4, Rose Mount Drive, Wallasey, to Nan, with of Arthur KNOWLES, a daughter. HEYCRAFT.- On December 10th, at Quetta, to Olive, wife of Captain W. S. HEYCRAFT, M.C., a son. EVANS.- On December 13th, at 9, Victoria-square, Penarth, to Mr. and Mrs. W. H. EVANS (nee Naomi CLARK), a son. CASTLE.- On December 11th, to Mr. and Mrs. Percival CASTLE, Haverfordwest, a son. BYASS.- On December 11th, at Craig-y-Parcau, Bridgend, to Geoffrey and Marion BYASS, a daughter. BOWEN.- To Evelyn, wife of W. E. BOWEN, (late of Llandrindod Wells and Port Talbot), a son, December 10th, 156, Church Lane, Upper Tooting, S.W.17. John Patrick.

Please ignore and delete the message with this title."[GLA] message from Lynda hunt" Do not follow the advice in it. Rootsweb will have removed any posibility of getting a computer infection from a message from the list. Jeff List admin

Delete this message immediately do NOT open it. If you have done, the only way I know of getting rid of the resulting problem is to download and use a program called Malwarebytes anti malware which can be used without it costing. The progrram that the email puts into your computer tells you that your computer is infected, yes it is by it. I hope this helps, best wishes, Dave