glad to see that the first 2 names show support for the  2 vwey successful British Lions   George North and Alex Cuthbert , shows that William is well aware of his positi0on in the Welsh rugby Union .   David

I've forgotten who mentioned it but some mention of Kate what's her name and Dracula? Bloodsuckers eh? This could equally describe the family as a whole no? Glad I got that off my chest. Kevin.

You are very lucky Michael,to have a surname like OUTLAW. I have been lumbered with WILLIAMS. When I started out in 1981 I did my Mother's line first. She was a WHITE , So I managed to go back several generations in to Gloucestershire, Warwickshire and Northampton.   It is fairly recently,The last ten years that I had a go on the WILLIAMS side. But I'm stuck in Llangadog with too many David WILLIAMS being born between 1792 and 1797. And that is only back to my 3 x great,grandpa. I did,with the help of several "Will's"from N.L.W; to trace back from the 17th;century to a line of the BOWEN family of Courthouse,Gower. This connected to the CRADOCK's of Long Ash Gower,then I connected to the F[F]RANKLI[Y]N family of Parc le Breos Gower. One of my ancestors,A Jenkin FRANKLYN was Under Sheriff of Glamorgan in 1541.His ancestor was The Vicar of Bishopston in 1492. Another ancestor on that line may have been killed at the Battle of Bosworth Field. Another was Davy GAM,Slain on the Battlefield,Knighted by King Henry V after the Battle of Agincourt in 1415. Mentioned in Shakespeare's play  of Henry V. This branch with one of the wives put me on to earlier lines and connected me to the Aristocrats,which then connected to Royalty. Off the top of my head,my last Royal subject was King John. Yes,I agree with you. The fun of the game is in the chase. Cheers Graham. Graham Williams, Glam;FHS# 551. of Canton,Cardiff.

I also read of a website that has some famous people who are all descended one way or another from various  Kings of England,Like King John. So am I many times. They also reckon there's 30 million Americans descended from William the Conqueror. Of course,William and Kate could have been Musical fans? As we have George MELLY. Alexander's Ragtime Band, and bringing up the rear is "Sachmo". Louis ARMSTRONG that is. Cheers Graham. Graham Williams, Glam;FHS# 551. of Canton,Cardiff.

Trying to find any descendants of Thomas HOWELL and Mary Ellen HARRIES married 1920. They had 7 children Sydney HOWELL b1917 (possibly married Mary PHILLIPS), Mary Jane HOWELL b 1918, Eluned HOWELL b1922 (possibly married Idris BOWEN), Harry HOWELL b1924 (possibly married Mavis REECE), Clarice HOWELL b1926 (or Clarissa possibly married Clifford GILES), Caradog HOWELL b1927 and Joseph HOWELL b1929. Hoping someone can give me some help. Thanks Don Howell

It's worth remembering that there's every chance that many people in this country, who are not descended from immigrants, are related to Egbert of Wessex. We each have two parents, four grandparents, eight greatgrandparents and so on, doubling in each generation. Go back ten generations and there are 1056 'parents' in that rank, another ten generations and it's more than a million! At that rate, we each have more than two trillion 'parents' in our 41st generation (more than two million million). Clearly, it's not possible that they were all separate individuals: there must be a huge amount of duplication. We are probably all related to each other! The new baby is lucky in some respects that he can prove that he is descended from Egbert of Wessex; we've probably most of us got some royal blood as well, but we can't prove it. But think on this: the baby will be denied the great pleasure of tracing his ancestry for himself, whereas i have had the pleasure of a fascinating hobby for the last thirty years. I've been lucky enough to trace several of my lines back to the middle of the sixteenth century, when parish records began. No royal blood as yet, but one direct ancestor who was falconer to Napoleon Buonaparte. I should hate to have had all of that done for me!

I remember reading some time ago that the average person in the UK has more than 100,000 sixth cousins. Robert -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Why don't the media realise that, like just about every single one of us, the royal baby is related to millions of people, high-born and low and in-betweens?

Thanks for everyone's comments. Wikipedia of course came up with an answer - see see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kings_of_Wales_family_trees I estimate that the Royal baby is 51st in direct line from the 5th century Cunedda of Gwynedd - and of course as several of you said, many thousands of others. The number is approximate as it's difficult to count among so many interlinked trees, but then so is the genealogy! Anna

From: Robert Williams <[email protected]> > There are plenty to choose from Anna. > As each generation doubles up,we can pick some of the more ancient Welsh > royalties on offer. > How about Rhodri MAWR,Hywel Da,and many others before them. > All of them related in one way or another to most people on this list. > Including me. >   > He's also descended via his grandmother the late Princess Diana to at least > three lines back to King Charles II[R.1660-1685] > Via his umpteen   Mistresses.[No Telly in those days!] >   Last night I wrote a letter to the South Wales Echo on the subject. > Dunno if they will print it though? > > Cheers Graham.> Why don't the media realise (and I plead guilty to having been a media person myself for over 40 years) that, like just about every single one of us, the royal baby is related to millions of people, high-born and low and in-betweens? We are all the result of a mix of ancestors, good, bad and indifferent - some ancestors we prefer to others but none of us can be choosers! On his mother's side, for instance, it's well known that the sprog descends from miners, road sweepers, some fellow who was in prison in 1881, etc, etc, etc. Kate's ancestry on both her paternal and maternal lines has been well documented, so all one has to do is add the baby's onto hers. William's lines hardly need spelling out. However, I have to say that in doing a bit of Googling yesterday I came across what has to be the best headline of all, from gulfnews.com! Are you ready for this? BRITISH ROYAL BABY RELATED TO DRACULA The article explains: "But there are other surprises in store in the royal familyŽs family tree. Through Queen Mary, the wife of King George V, who ruled from 1910 to 1936, the line stretches back, according to Beaucarnot, right to the princes of Transylvania and Walachia in Romania. That leads back in the 15th century to the Princes Dracula. Among them figures the Voivode Vlad III, also known by his patronymic name Dracula, who was was posthumously dubbed Vlad the Impaler. He inspired, by his cruelty, the Irish writer Bram StokerŽs famous vampire." I hope that if the baby really does descend from Dracula, his mum doesn't hold him too close to her neck when she's cuddling him! -- Roy Stockdill Genealogical researcher, writer & lecturer Famous family trees blog: http://blog.findmypast.co.uk/tag/roy-stockdill/ "There is only one thing in the world worse than being talked about, and that is not being talked about." OSCAR WILDE

I did wonder myself last night whether they might use a Welsh name to recognise their connection to Anglesey (was he conceived there?) as well with William being a future Prince of Wales. They would have to find one that was not difficult for non-Welsh speakers to say of course! They might not go down that path but I would not be surprised if they chose something unexpected. Martin Briscoe Fort William [email protected] -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: 24 July 2013 09:05 To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [GLA] GLAMORGAN Digest, Vol 8, Issue 236 - Welsh royal names Wasn't the Queen Mother a descendant of Prince Llewelyn? [not sure which Llewelyn]. Princess Diana had some descent from the Gamages of Coity, who had in ancient times intermarried with the Welsh. But I'm no expert, hopefully others can be of more help. It would be nice if he was given at least a Welsh middle name - Rhodri would be my choice. Wendy

There are plenty to choose from Anna. As each generation doubles up,we can pick some of the more ancient Welsh royalties on offer. How about Rhodri MAWR,Hywel Da,and many others before them. All of them related in one way or another to most people on this list. Including me.   He's also descended via his grandmother the late Princess Diana to at least three lines back to King Charles II[R.1660-1685] Via his umpteen   Mistresses.[No Telly in those days!]   Last night I wrote a letter to the South Wales Echo on the subject. Dunno if they will print it though? Cheers Graham. P.S;I recommend the Christian name's of "Charles,Phillip,Harry,Edward,George" for the new baby. If it had been a girl,It would obviously been a "Diana"somewhere in its four/five Christian names. What do others think? Graham Williams, Glam;FHS# 551. of Canton,Cardiff.

I have been to a couple of talks by the author of a couple of books on the connection between Glencoe and the Nez Perce Indians. He told how he visited the tribe and whilst there he had a meal with them in their community hall. The children were playing in a corner of the room. He said every one of those Indian children could trace a direct line back to Somerled through the MacDonalds of Glencoe and was thinking about the wealthy Americans who come to Scotland to find their roots and never get beyond a crofter or just a labourer. Martin Briscoe Fort William [email protected] -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Hugh Jordan Sent: 24 July 2013 08:51 To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [GLA] Princely Celtic forebears I would think that just about everybody on these islands is descended from a man who was alive here over 1200 years ago, Anna. Hugh

Her maternal line was entirely French. Hugh At 09:04 24/07/2013, [email protected] wrote: >Wasn't the Queen Mother a descendant of Prince Llewelyn? [not sure which >Llewelyn].

I would think that just about everybody on these islands is descended from a man who was alive here over 1200 years ago, Anna. Hugh At 19:04 23/07/2013, you wrote: >Dear List > >I suppose that the dearth of traffic on genealogical websites is due >to the seasonal weather and the excitement at the Royal birth. > >The Guardian claims that William and Kate's son is the 41st in direct >line of descent from Egbert, King of Wessex, who ruled from 802 to >839. I wondered if any of our expert genealogists could give him a >more ancient forebear from a Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) royal line? > >Anna

Wasn't the Queen Mother a descendant of Prince Llewelyn? [not sure which Llewelyn]. Princess Diana had some descent from the Gamages of Coity, who had in ancient times intermarried with the Welsh. But I'm no expert, hopefully others can be of more help. It would be nice if he was given at least a Welsh middle name - Rhodri would be my choice. Wendy

Dear List I suppose that the dearth of traffic on genealogical websites is due to the seasonal weather and the excitement at the Royal birth. The Guardian claims that William and Kate's son is the 41st in direct line of descent from Egbert, King of Wessex, who ruled from 802 to 839. I wondered if any of our expert genealogists could give him a more ancient forebear from a Welsh (or Scottish or Irish) royal line? Anna

Hi Althea The von Manteuffel dynasty is well-documented on the Web, such as this (free) site, which includes Klaus Ewald b. 1885: http://gw.geneanet.org/jrdus?lang=en&m=N&v=VON%20MANTEUFFEL Robert -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of althea.john Help !1 I have a Klaus Ewald Helmut von Mantueffel on my tree . I looked at his military record on line and cant remember where I saw it I have just expired on my world ancestry as had it for years and thought I`d buy the new version of family tree cos it has Premium free for 6 months but its only Uk could someone pleas look for me I think I read it on ancestry and saved it but it doesn't allow me to view it it just gives me a black picture . If its not on ancestry are there other sites I could have found it Thanks

Help !1 I have a Klaus Ewald Helmut von Mantueffel on my tree . I looked at his military record on line and cant remember where I saw it I have just expired on my world ancestry as had it for years and thought I`d buy the new version of family tree cos it has Premium free for 6 months but its only Uk could someone pleas look for me I think I read it on ancestry and saved it but it doesn't allow me to view it it just gives me a black picture . If its not on ancestry are there other sites I could have found it Thanks Althea

My thanks for all the explanations into That place, who's name now escapes me? [senior moment!]   Anyway thanks to all.   I had a gander at the "Free Reg;"site,and found Michaelston-y-fedw had been done,and found a likely candidate of our Charles CROSS. This one was baptised 23 august 1785 there,the son of William and Ceicel CROSS.   I then searched for a Marriage of William and his wife,and found it in Rudry. Thus:- William CROSS,of Michealston -y-Fedw, married to Cicely HARRIS,otp; 8 may 1765. The Christian name of "William" incidently,was the name of Charles & Susana's eldest male child. I am now on the lookout for the Marriage of Charles CROSS to Susanna in Glamorgan or Monmouthshire pre 1837. William,above,was born about 1837 in Llanedyrn.  His mother Susanna was born about 1802 in Whitchurch. Although I couldn't find their marriage on the pre 1837 Glamorganshire marriages on Microfiche. Cheers Graham. Graham Williams, Glam;FHS# 551. of Canton,Cardiff.

I think Cross Vane may be a bit of confusion on the part of the 1891 enumerator. Groes Faen (Stone Cross) is NW of Cardiff, in the parish of Llantrisant. Anna At 22:41 15/07/2013, Jeff Coleman wrote: >As for Whitecross, translating into Welsh suggests it might be Groeswen in >Eglwysilan parish, on the slopes of Mynydd Eglwysilan between Nantgarw and >Hendredenny. As his two younger siblings were born in Caerphilly that seems >possible. In 1891 it is written as Cross Vane and the younger sister is >shown > >Jeff > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Robert Williams" <[email protected]> >To: <[email protected]> >Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 6:56 PM >Subject: [GLA] Lanvedaw Glamorgan. > > >Greetings all. >I found a birth place for one of my cousin's ancestors as "Lanvedaw", in >Glamorgan. >Does anyone know where this place is please? From the 1851 census. >Obviously a misprint for somewhere perhaps. > >As I am looking for the birthplace of a Charles CROSS who was born in the >above place around abouts 1782. > >He was in Rudry in the 1851 census. > >Another place is "Whitecross" Glamorgan. >This is where a Joseph CROSS was born in about 1870. >This from the Mormon's 1881 census disc. > >Cheers Graham. > >Graham Williams, >Glam;FHS# 551. >of Canton,Cardiff. >-- > >To send to the list send to [email protected] >GLAMORGAN Family History Mailing List archives etc. are at >http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/WLS/GLAMORGAN.html >- >This site has been prepared to help you use the Glamorgan List >http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~glamorgan/ >- >A large amount of information, and a wide variety of useful links, may be >found at http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/ > >- >The South/West Wales Lookup Exchange and Gareth's Help Pages >http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~walesle/wal/AW.html and >http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ukwales2/hicks.html > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >-- > >To send to the list send to [email protected] >GLAMORGAN Family History Mailing List archives etc. are at >http://lists.rootsweb.com/index/intl/WLS/GLAMORGAN.html >- >This site has been prepared to help you use the Glamorgan List >http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~glamorgan/ >- >A large amount of information, and a wide variety of useful links, >may be found at http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/GLA/ > >- >The South/West Wales Lookup Exchange and Gareth's Help Pages >http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com/~walesle/wal/AW.html and >http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~ukwales2/hicks.html > > >------------------------------- >To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >[email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without >the quotes in the subject and the body of the message