Hi Pam & everyone, call me slow (comes from being downunda?? lol) but just noticed Weber in your name list Pam, where & when? some of my Palatine German/Mohawks connect to Weber family in Stone Arabia NY pre-revolt. My Stevens/Dachstader-Docksteader line that were UEL. intersting if we connect there too best wishes & love to everyone willow (Bohemian German great-great-grandparents Franz Franz b Bohemia & Therese Drescher b Bohemia, emigrated with children to USA 1890s, possibly 'converso' Jewish way back too -- really enjoyed everyone's insights on that these last few days) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pam" <pam@ewebexpress.com> To: <GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2006 11:56 PM Subject: Re: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] Searching for family before 1700 or where did they come... > again - thank you for this history lesson ... I'm learning SO MUCH!! > > blessings~ Pam in MO > > ~Pam Frierdich-Staley~ > Warrenton, MO > http://www.michael-steppig-family-tree.com > http://www.frierdich-staley-familytree.com > Looking for surnames of MICHALEK (MICHAEL/EAL), DILLON, > CINNAUGHT/CANNAUGHT, > SCHALLOM, STEPPIG, MEES/MAES, REIS, FRIERDICH/FRIEDRICH, KRAFT, BANGERT, > DIESEL, HATTER/HOERTER, KIEFER, RAPP, MENTEL, SCHELLHORN, STALEY, WEBER, > THOELE, MITCHELL, PROBST, GOLD > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: <KarenHob@aol.com> > To: <GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2006 9:31 PM > Subject: Re: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] Searching for family before 1700 or where > did > they come... > > > In a message dated 5/9/2006 10:58:11 PM Mountain Standard Time, > akibb1@verizon.net writes: > but not all villages had churches and they only appear when the churches > were built and the recording started. > > All villages belonged to a parish community. Some people walked up to > 8-10 > km to get to church. Shoes were expensive and they would walk in their > bare > feet when weather permitted or in wooden shoes with thick woolen socks (if > they had no boots) and put on shoes just before entering the church. > > The vital records for all the villages in a single parish community would > be > kept in the church. > > Some older villages that had churches lost their pastors and the church > was > designated a chaple and was used only on certain days special to the > community > like a certain saint's day (the patron of the village). If there were > enough residents in a village with a church a chaplain might be assigned. > He was > like an assistant pastor and he would say masses on sundays and hear > confessions but the other sacraments like baptism, confirmation, marriage > had to be > conducted at the main parish church except emergency baptisms. Some > villages > built churches in the hopes that they would get a chaplain. The > churches > that were not consecrated parish churches might be used as meeting places > for > prayerful events other than Holy Mass and the sacraments. One such event > might > be saying goodby to and praying for village men who had been drafted. > > Once a church was consecrated, its use for "lay" events would be > restricted. > > Some village chapels were very small and would not hold many people. > Those > small chapels would not qualify to have a chaplain but the priest would > still > come from the parish center to say masses there on a special day. The > village would gather outside around the chapel because there might only be > room > inside for some of the most "important" people. > > The next step up for a church was to be designated a filial; (affiliated) > church. > They would have a priest permanently assigned but they were still not > considered a parish church. In theory they served only one place rather > than a whole > community of several places even if people from neighboring villages > preferred to go there rather than all the way to the parish center.. > Filial churches > could perform all the sacraments that did not require a bishop but they > did > not keep the records -- everything they recorded was sent to and kept at > the > main parish church. > > Filial churches could become parish churches if there were enough > residents > supporting them. They would then begin to keep their own records. > > When an ancestral village is known the next step is to learn the name of > the > parish community to which it belonged if it was not itself a parish > center. > It is also important to know how long it was a parish center. If it > received > that designation relatively late then some records of ancestors born there > may be with another nearby parish. > > J.G. Sommer's 16-volume collection" Das Königreich Böhmen" lists each > village in Bohemia (not including Moravia) by name and tells were its > residents went > to church and the name of the church. Gregor Wolny "Das Markgrafschaft > Mähren" does the same for Moravia. Each author wrote one volume for > each > district of either Bohemia or Moravia. An author search of the World > Catalog > should find the works of both authors - ask your research librarian to > help > you > find the book(s) you want -- the one(s) for your ancestral districts. > Sign up > for lending privelges at a college or university library to get copies of > these books at the least cost. > Check if that library will let you take a book that is more than 100 years > old out of the library reading room. (A teacher or other person > associated > with > the same institution may be able to get the books for free, take them to > his/her office and to use them for up to three months vs. 2 weeks for a > student or > other borrower.) > > An interesting complication regarding church records is how many churches > changed from catholic to protestant -- back and forth more than once -- > over the > period when religion became a political power tool among many of the > nobility. When a nobleman converted for whatever reason he would demand > that > everyone of his serfs would also convert and he would designate all > churches > in his > dominon as the denomination he chose. Even though all of the churches > began > as Catholic parishes, many became protestant for a time during the Hussite > wars and then, again, during the reformation. They returned to Roman > Catholic > inbetween those two episodes. After the Thirty Years War the areas of > Bohemia that needed new population were settled by Catholics. The Kaiser > demanded > that all noblemen either convert or swear allegiance to a Catholic Kaiser > (if > they fought on his side during the war) and that all the population of > Bohemia should be Catholic. The city of As (Asch) was allowed to remain > protestant > as were parts of Moravia (different politics there). > > So when you are looking for ancestral vital records you may find that the > church of Stes. Peter and Paul in XXX village first has documents in > Latin > written by a priest and then in Czech or German written by a protestant > pastor and > then in Latin again until German became the official language for all > records > after 1740. There are some military church books dated later than 1740 - > 1760 > that are still in Latin and I have seen reports of a few records dated as > late as the 1780s that were in Czech. > > Always remember that if your ancestors were of a different denomination > than > the denomination "of record" of their parish church, the records for that > parish should still be searched. > > Local parish churches even recorded Jewish vital records when there was no > other means for that -- no nearby synagogue or Rabbi who would take care > of > it. > > Searching the films at the LDS using the keyword "Jewish" will sometimes > show a title for a Catholic church. This in not a mistake. Examine the > film > notes for that title and there will probably be a film or two with notes > saying > it includes some records for Jewish residents of the area. > > Likewise if a search for "Evangelical" or "brethren" or "ultraquist" hits > on > a title that is not that denominatioon it may simply mean that at one time > that church was an Evangelical church or that a few protestant records are > included in the church books because there was no protestant pastor to > take > care of > that. > > Karen > > > ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== > Visit the German-Bohemian Heritage Society Web Page! > http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/ > > > > ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== > Would you like to see messages that were posted before you joined the > list? To browse the archives, go to: > http://archiver.rootsweb.com/GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L/ > >