Hello listers! Sorry for the length of this post, but after exhausting every source I can think of, this is my last chance. I am searching the ship on which my ancestors arrived in the New World. I believe my GGG grandfather ADALBERT KARL, spouse KATHARINA MULTRUS and their four children ROSA, JOHN, JOSEPH, and ALBERT from HRADZEN, BOHEMIA, AUSTRIA near PILSEN departed BREMEN in 1859. They do not show up in any incoming passenger lists in America. To no avail I have searched the Steve Morse site using the following wildcards: ada* ade* cat* kat* ros* joh* jos* alb* and surname kar* car* har* and ear*. This leads me to believe they did not enter through the U.S. The reason I believe they departed Bremen is because in the1860 U.S. Census from Allegany, NY they indicate they were from Bremen, Germany. However in every future census, they correctly state they are from Austria. In Adalbert's obituary from 1903 it states that he and his family of four mistakenly went to DAYTON, OHIO instead of DAYTONS SUMMIT, NEW YORK. Here is a summary of the records I have searched to date: a) Every U.S. arrival site - including the Steve Morse site - for every combination I can think of. b) All of the websites of pre-1865 passsenger lists for Canadian Arrivals on the Olive Tree Genealogy site. c) The "Germans To America" Series. d) "German Immigrants: Lists of Passengers Bound from Bremen to New York, 1855-1862" e) The Leo Baca Book "Czech Immigration Passenger Lists, Volumes 1-9 " f) I have requested citizenship records of Adalbert Karl in the hope that they would reveal the date and place of entry into the U.S. but Immigration wrote me that there is no record. He was naturalized in 1866 according to the local county records, but these shed no light on his date or mode of entry to the U.S.. g) I have written to the Ship List and other genealogy listservs in the hope of finding a morsel of information that I could follow up on. I posted on the Ancestry.com message boards and received a response from a gentleman apparently writing from the Czech Republic who informed me, I quote: "Accordings to the proceeding protocoll of Regional Office of Plzen asked on 1859 Adalbert Karl from Hradzen (Hradec u Stoda) for issuing of emigrant passport to USA.There is possible to see the proces of issuing of passport sep by step there. Adalbert can be recorded as Bohemian in the books of Leo Baca (Bohemian passanger lists). Look for them in some big library. The registers of Hradzen are in the archive in Plzen. You can search yourself ther or you can hire some of Czech researcher." While promising, my replies to this post requesting further information have never been answered. I am willing to accept that the absence of data means that my ancestors must have entered through Canada on some impossible-to-trace ship. But I must at least ask the question if there are any stones I have left unturned. My questions are this: what would be the typical route for a family from Austria, departing Bremen for America in 1859? Assuming they departed Bremen, would they have stopped in the British Isles? And would there be a record of this arrival or departure? And then, would they typically have arrived at Quebec if they were bound for Dayton? Once at Quebec, would their voyage to the wrong Dayton be via the U.S. or Canada? Thank you very much for any insight you can provide, Tony Buccella

To Tony Buccella: Dear Tony: In my experience most people from Austria Hungary, especially from Bohemia traveled to Bremen, but if they lived in the South of Austria, many travel to the US via Trieste. Now this is Yugoslavia, but it belonged to Austria Hungary then. The landed not only at Ellis Island but also Galveston, Texas, Baltimore, Maryland, and they could have come to the States via Canada. You have done a tremendous search and we can eliminate repetitive information. Here is another source you might not have looked at, there are several links of immigrants arriving through Canada: http://www.dcs.uwaterloo.ca/~marj/genealogy/thevoyage.html and if all possibilities come up negative, I would suggest to you that you might search in the Austrian Hungarian Military records. Your ancestor would not have been able to leave the country, if he had not completed his military service... although some of them "escaped" and then they preferred to ship out from Rotterdam, or other Holland harbors. It depended on where they had connections. For military research you can contact the Family Research Center (Mormon Church in your community) and request that they look in the Family History Library Catalog under title "Grundbuchblätter-Diverse" were the Austrian Hungarian Servicemen are listed in alphabetical order. There are several microfilms and each is $6.00 (rental fee) so check out only microfilm numbers for the alphabet you will need. If you find your ancestor there, usually you will find his place of origin, the names of his parents. But if you want even more information on him, you can find his regiment by the location where he was drafted, and then you can go to the regimental records where his service, health records, appearance (height, hair and eye color) etc is recorded. The people at the Family Research Centers are very helpful and it takes just a few weeks for the microfilm to arrive at the Center where they have microfilm readers for you to use. The names are typewritten, but the records are handwritten and you can make copies of it. You will also get the latest status on their databases, because some it now databased and accessible by computer. I have not searched there for a while, but when I did, I found the place of origin of my ancestor in the Grundbuchblätter, which is the first step. I hope that this will help you open another door of possibility. Aida On Fri, Dec 12, 2008 at 7:30 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello listers! Sorry for the length of this post, but after exhausting > every source I can think of, this is my last chance. > > I am searching the ship on which my ancestors arrived in the New World. I > believe my GGG grandfather ADALBERT KARL, spouse KATHARINA MULTRUS and their > four children ROSA, JOHN, JOSEPH, and ALBERT from HRADZEN, BOHEMIA, AUSTRIA > near PILSEN departed BREMEN in 1859. They do not show up in any incoming > passenger lists in America. To no avail I have searched the Steve Morse site > using the following wildcards: ada* ade* cat* kat* ros* joh* jos* alb* and > surname kar* car* har* and ear*. This leads me to believe they did not enter > through the U.S. > > The reason I believe they departed Bremen is because in the1860 U.S. Census > from Allegany, NY they indicate they were from Bremen, Germany. However in > every future census, they correctly state they are from Austria. In > Adalbert's obituary from 1903 it states that he and his family of four > mistakenly went to DAYTON, OHIO instead of DAYTONS SUMMIT, NEW YORK. > > Here is a summary of the records I have searched to date: > > a) Every U.S. arrival site - including the Steve Morse site - for every > combination I can think of. > b) All of the websites of pre-1865 passsenger lists for Canadian Arrivals > on the Olive Tree Genealogy site. > c) The "Germans To America" Series. > d) "German Immigrants: Lists of Passengers Bound from Bremen to New York, > 1855-1862" > e) The Leo Baca Book "Czech Immigration Passenger Lists, Volumes 1-9 " > f) I have requested citizenship records of Adalbert Karl in the hope that > they would reveal the date and place of entry into the U.S. but Immigration > wrote me that there is no record. He was naturalized in 1866 according to > the local county records, but these shed no light on his date or mode of > entry to the U.S.. > g) I have written to the Ship List and other genealogy listservs in the > hope of finding a morsel of information that I could follow up on. I posted > on the Ancestry.com message boards and received a response from a gentleman > apparently writing from the Czech Republic who informed me, I quote: > > "Accordings to the proceeding protocoll of Regional Office of Plzen > asked on 1859 Adalbert Karl from Hradzen (Hradec u Stoda) for issuing of > emigrant passport to USA.There is possible to see the proces of > issuing of passport sep by step there. Adalbert can be recorded as Bohemian > in the books of Leo Baca (Bohemian passanger lists). Look for them > in some big library. The registers of Hradzen are in the archive in Plzen. > You can search yourself ther or you can hire some of Czech researcher." > > While promising, my replies to this post requesting further information > have never been answered. I am willing to accept that the absence of data > means that my ancestors must have entered through Canada on some > impossible-to-trace ship. But I must at least ask the question if there are > any stones I have left unturned. > > My questions are this: what would be the typical route for a family from > Austria, departing Bremen for America in 1859? Assuming they departed > Bremen, would they have stopped in the British Isles? And would there be a > record of this arrival or departure? And then, would they typically have > arrived at Quebec if they were bound for Dayton? Once at Quebec, would their > voyage to the wrong Dayton be via the U.S. or Canada? > > Thank you very much for any insight you can provide, > Tony Buccella > German-Bohemian Heritage Society web site http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/ > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > [email protected] with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

Tony: From the Castle Garden (New York) website (http://castlegarden.org/): Arr. 7 Nov 1859, ship Republic, all from Bohemia, destination unknown: ADALBERT KAR UNKNOWN 7 M ADALBERT KAR FARMER 50 M CATHARINE KAR FARMER 41 F JOHANN KAR FARMER 17 M JOSEPH KAR UNKNOWN 10 M ROSALIA KAR UNKNOWN 19 Looks pretty promising! I looked for first name Adalbert in 1859 and found them right away. Urs Geiser (ugeiser AT xnet DOT com) Woodridge (DuPage Co.), IL, USA [email protected] wrote: > Hello listers! Sorry for the length of this post, but after exhausting every source I can think of, this is my last chance. > > I am searching the ship on which my ancestors arrived in the New World. I believe my GGG grandfather ADALBERT KARL, spouse KATHARINA MULTRUS and their four children ROSA, JOHN, JOSEPH, and ALBERT from HRADZEN, BOHEMIA, AUSTRIA near PILSEN departed BREMEN in 1859. They do not show up in any incoming passenger lists in America. To no avail I have searched the Steve Morse site using the following wildcards: ada* ade* cat* kat* ros* joh* jos* alb* and surname kar* car* har* and ear*. This leads me to believe they did not enter through the U.S. > > The reason I believe they departed Bremen is because in the1860 U.S. Census from Allegany, NY they indicate they were from Bremen, Germany. However in every future census, they correctly state they are from Austria. In Adalbert's obituary from 1903 it states that he and his family of four mistakenly went to DAYTON, OHIO instead of DAYTONS SUMMIT, NEW YORK. > > Here is a summary of the records I have searched to date: > > a) Every U.S. arrival site - including the Steve Morse site - for every combination I can think of. > b) All of the websites of pre-1865 passsenger lists for Canadian Arrivals on the Olive Tree Genealogy site. > c) The "Germans To America" Series. > d) "German Immigrants: Lists of Passengers Bound from Bremen to New York, 1855-1862" > e) The Leo Baca Book "Czech Immigration Passenger Lists, Volumes 1-9 " > f) I have requested citizenship records of Adalbert Karl in the hope that they would reveal the date and place of entry into the U.S. but Immigration wrote me that there is no record. He was naturalized in 1866 according to the local county records, but these shed no light on his date or mode of entry to the U.S.. > g) I have written to the Ship List and other genealogy listservs in the hope of finding a morsel of information that I could follow up on. I posted on the Ancestry.com message boards and received a response from a gentleman apparently writing from the Czech Republic who informed me, I quote: > > "Accordings to the proceeding protocoll of Regional Office of Plzen asked on 1859 Adalbert Karl from Hradzen (Hradec u Stoda) for issuing of emigrant passport to USA.There is possible to see the proces of issuing of passport sep by step there. Adalbert can be recorded as Bohemian in the books of Leo Baca (Bohemian passanger lists). Look for them in some big library. The registers of Hradzen are in the archive in Plzen. You can search yourself ther or you can hire some of Czech researcher." > > While promising, my replies to this post requesting further information have never been answered. I am willing to accept that the absence of data means that my ancestors must have entered through Canada on some impossible-to-trace ship. But I must at least ask the question if there are any stones I have left unturned. > > My questions are this: what would be the typical route for a family from Austria, departing Bremen for America in 1859? Assuming they departed Bremen, would they have stopped in the British Isles? And would there be a record of this arrival or departure? And then, would they typically have arrived at Quebec if they were bound for Dayton? Once at Quebec, would their voyage to the wrong Dayton be via the U.S. or Canada? > > Thank you very much for any insight you can provide, > Tony Buccella