Hi, ON 03/22/2006, Kathleen Gregory wrote: > COOK-CO-IL-L-request@rootsweb.com Send a blank email with 'Subscribe' in > the subject line. Thank you. I will join that list. Don Feldbruegge

Hi Herbert, ON 03/22/2006, Herbert Schwarz wrote: > Hi Don, The Neudorf you are interested in appears to be the correct one , > as mentioned by Gerhard Reichl. The Dietz family fits well into the > picture as I had some correspondence in the past with a Dietz family > member in the U.S.A. who had connections to Neudorf. I was born in > Pfraumberg/Primda a town close to Neudorf and I visited Neudorf as a > small boy with my father the local Doctor.The area is part of the lower > Bohemian Forest at an elevation of about 2000 ft.and is surrounded by > large forests.Close to Neudorf is Dianaberg which was the seat of the > local Count with a Manor House and a large commercial Sawmill. I have > also been in touch with Gerhard Reichl and his e-mail address is > gerhard@reichl-page.de , Herb Schwarz, Ontario,Canada. Thank you for the kind response. This Neudorf certainly does sound promising to us. I was absolutely overwhelmed when I discovered so many places named Neudorf. I don't speak very much German, but I quickly realized why the name was rather popular. I just couldn't figure out how to narrow a search down to one or two villages. Obviously, the one thing that this one has is all three family names from one village. That isn't likely to happen very often. As you visited the village, I just have to ask (my wife is insisting) if you know of any photos or other descriptions of the village. I also am wondering if Neudorf is still in existence, or was it destroyed during the post-war era? Are the other places you mentioned (Pfraumberg and Dianaberg) still in existence? I suppose these are really good questions for Gerhard. I will contact him, as you and Linda have suggested, although it also seems this might be a subject of interest to others on the list. Just as a side note, my Mother's side of MY family (which I'm not researching, as I do have information already) comes from the Bishofteinitz area. That doesn't appear to be too far away from THIS Neudorf. The surname is Heindl. Regards, Don Feldbruegge

From: Dr. Michael Parak Sent: Tue 3/21/2006 5:40 AM Subject: Silesia Newsletter 36 Sehr geehrte Damen und Herren, anbei übersende ich Ihnen den SILESIA-NEWSLETTER 36 für den Monat März 2006. Mit einem Doppel-Klick auf (double click) http://www.schlesisches-museum.de/html/newsletter%2036.pdf erscheint die neueste Ausgabe. Für Rückfragen und Anregungen stehe ich Ihnen gerne zur Verfügung. Adressänderungen und neue Interessenten können mir per e-mail mitgeteilt werden. Sollten Sie den SILESIA-NEWSLETTER nicht mehr beziehen wollen, genügt eine mail mit dem Betreff "Abbestellung SILESIA-NEWSLETTER" an mparak@schlesisches-museum.de <mailto:mmparak@schlesisches-museum.de> Mit freundlichen Grüßen Dr. Michael Parak Kulturreferent

If you want to reply to this message please use <ehinds@gmail.com>. Don' reply to GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L-REQUEST@rootsweb.com. Paula Goblirsch German-Bohemian List Admin ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Elizabeth Hinds <cehinds@gmail.com> Date: Mar 23, 2006 9:45 AM Subject: Peichl/Peichel/Matzke To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L-REQUEST@rootsweb.com Greetings! I'm looking for information on a couple: Edward Peichl/Peichel and Amalia Matske/Matzke. They married around 1875 and immigrated in May 1879, arrived in Baltimore, MD from Bremen on the SS Ohio; they listed Bohemia as their origin/last residence; they settled in Jefferson, Wisconsin. I have some marriage records for their children, obituaries, etc; they had 10 children, 8 of them in WI, two in "Rathesdorf"; I also know they attended a Catholic Church in Jefferson, WI. On the passenger list, the name is spelled Peichel; I've found this spelling a couple of other places too--a birth certificate for a child born in WI, and one of their son's WWI Draft Cards. I originially posted this message on the Bavarian message list because in various census records they list Austria, Germany, Bavaria and Bohemia as their birthplace. On various marriage records, they list Ratsdorf, Germany or Rathesdorf, Austria as their place of birth. I've looked at the maps listed on this site: http://www.library.wisc.edu/etext/ravenstein/ I still can't seem to place them. Peichl/Peichel has been a difficult name to research. I began genealogy research on a larger scale within the past year, but I'm just getting started researching European records. I consider myself to be fairly proficient on the Internet and computers. If anyone has any info or advice on this name or town, please let me know. I've contacted one or two (possible) descendentsand hope to see them soon, but I thought someone here could give me a couple of pointers. I have searched the Wisconsin Historical Society marriage, death, and birth records pretty thoroughly as well as whatever books are listed in the library stacks for Jefferson County. I have yet to search through the archives/manuscripts for this building and haven't spent much time at Whitewater or Jefferson county church and govt offices yet. Thanks! Elizabeth Hinds cehinds@gmail.com

Genealogy Society of Kendall County Hill Country Seminar, The limited seating at the Sharon Carmack dinner in Boerne Texas, on Friday evening, April 21, is filling up rapidly. Those registering for the 2nd Annual Hill Country Seminar on April 22 featuring Carmack, and who wish to attend the dinner, should register immediately. Pre-registration, which must be done prior to April 10, is $35.00 and includes lunch. Registration at the door is $45.00. The seminar, sponsored by the Genealogical Society of Kendall County, will be held at the Boerne Community Center. Dinner on Friday evening is $15.00. You must register for the seminar to attend the dinner; although a person who has registered for the seminar, may bring a guest not planning to attend the seminar. Registration forms and more information as to Carmack's topics are available at http://home.earthlink.net/~35madel/ Mail your registrations to Jim Boyd, 543 Cordillera Trace, Boerne TX. 78006 4203. DO NOT TAKE IT TO THE LIBRARY. If you plan to attend mail ASAP. Edna Felps, Seminar Chairperson. 830 336 3306 edfel@gvtc.com ______________________________

COOK-CO-IL-L-request@rootsweb.com Send a blank email with 'Subscribe' in the subject line. Kathy -----Original Message----- From: Donald Feldbruegge [mailto:dhfeldbr@chorus.net] Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 7:08 PM To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] First Message Hi Kathy, At 05:25 PM 3/22/2006, you wrote: >I recommend that you also join the Cook Co. IL list. Someone from the >Chicago area may be able to assist you. Have you already checked the >Illinois State Archives online? >http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/archives/databases.html they >have marriage 1763-1900, deaths pre 1916 and 1916-1950 and they are >searchable. > > >Kathy Thank you for the archives link. I didn't know of it -- as I mentioned, I'm not at all familiar with internet searching. I did a search before and after 1916 for Katherine Reichel/Reichl/Reich, and didn't come up with any death certificates. I did find Wenzel junior and John, which I already had -- so I know it works. I'll bookmark this for future reference, ie Anna and Charles Brown/Braun. As to the Cook County, IL list, would you by chance have a link for that? I might be looking for a long time before I found it. Thank you, Don Feldbruegge ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== Forgotten how to UNSUBSCRIBE? Visit http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/mailinglist/mailinglist.html

So all is not lost! Kathy -----Original Message----- From: Donald Feldbruegge [mailto:dhfeldbr@chorus.net] Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 10:08 PM To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: RE: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] First Message Hi Kathy, At 05:25 PM 3/22/2006, you wrote: >I recommend that you also join the Cook Co. IL list. Someone from the >Chicago area may be able to assist you. Have you already checked the >Illinois State Archives online? >http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/archives/databases.html they >have marriage 1763-1900, deaths pre 1916 and 1916-1950 and they are >searchable. > > >Kathy A follow-up. After doing some more death record searching, I discovered Kane County is only available for a few years (not up on the screen, but I think it ended in 1882). Then it came back to me after all these years, when I went to the court house years ago I was told they had lost all records for some reason -- possibly a fire or something. So there will be no death certificate. I guess I need something else. Maybe a cemetery index or burial index, but I don't recall these even existing. Yes, now the frustration I had felt comes back to me. Grr. Oh, I did find the marriage record for Anna Reichl and Charles Brown indexed. Will have to send to IRAD for that. At least one bit of good news. Thank you for your help. Don Feldbruegge ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== Visit the German-Bohemian Heritage Society Web Page! http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/

Hi Kathy, At 05:25 PM 3/22/2006, you wrote: >I recommend that you also join the Cook Co. IL list. Someone from the >Chicago area may be able to assist you. Have you already checked the >Illinois State Archives online? >http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/archives/databases.html they >have marriage 1763-1900, deaths pre 1916 and 1916-1950 and they are >searchable. > > >Kathy A follow-up. After doing some more death record searching, I discovered Kane County is only available for a few years (not up on the screen, but I think it ended in 1882). Then it came back to me after all these years, when I went to the court house years ago I was told they had lost all records for some reason -- possibly a fire or something. So there will be no death certificate. I guess I need something else. Maybe a cemetery index or burial index, but I don't recall these even existing. Yes, now the frustration I had felt comes back to me. Grr. Oh, I did find the marriage record for Anna Reichl and Charles Brown indexed. Will have to send to IRAD for that. At least one bit of good news. Thank you for your help. Don Feldbruegge

I don't think it's a problem for this type of family research. Since he is German, he may more regularly monitor some of the German-language lists. I think he will be delighted to hear from you! Linda ----- Original Message ----- From: Donald Feldbruegge<mailto:dhfeldbr@chorus.net> To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com<mailto:GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 7:13 PM Subject: Re: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] First Message Hi Linda, At 05:38 PM 3/22/2006, you wrote: >Don, >You DEFINITELY want to talk to Gerhard Reichl. Yep, from Neudorf, the right >one, I'm sure, for he researches, Reichl, Ditz, Bauer. Yes, that was my thinking, also. >You can get his e-mail address, out of an earlier reply from me to him, >where I helped him with some of those, yep, Chicago connections (just click >on his name in blue). There was a lot more in the e-mails, which you can >find by looking through the archive for this list, and also from Gerhard. I thought it was bad etiquette to contact someone off-list, unless requested. I was also hoping that he was subscribed to this list and we see my "missive". If I get no response from him on this list, I will become desperate and contact him direct. Thank you, Don Feldbruegge ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== Would you like to see messages that were posted before you joined the list? To search the archives, go to: http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=GERMAN-BOHEMIAN<http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=GERMAN-BOHEMIAN>

Hi Don, The Neudorf you are interested in appears to be the correct one , as mentioned by Gerhard Reichl. The Dietz family fits well into the picture as I had some correspondence in the past with a Dietz family member in the U.S.A. who had connections to Neudorf. I was born in Pfraumberg/Primda a town close to Neudorf and I visited Neudorf as a small boy with my father the local Doctor.The area is part of the lower Bohemian Forest at an elevation of about 2000 ft.and is surrounded by large forests.Close to Neudorf is Dianaberg which was the seat of the local Count with a Manor House and a large commercial Sawmill. I have also been in touch with Gerhard Reichl and his e-mail address is gerhard@reichl-page.de , Herb Schwarz, Ontario,Canada. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Donald Feldbruegge" <dhfeldbr@chorus.net> To: <GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 5:58 PM Subject: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] First Message > Hi, > > I understand that I should post a list of names/place I'm researching in > this, my first post. > > The names I'm interested in are Reichl/Reichel, Bauer/Bauers & Dietz/Ditz. > The places are Neudorf, Bohemia and Chicago/vicinity, Illinois. > > Let me give you a small bit of background. We are retired. Although I'm > somewhat familiar with computers, I'm definitely not expert at web things. > This is the first genealogy message list I've joined. I probably wouldn't > have even done this if it wasn't for a recent bit of news in the most > recent > issue of "The Heimatbrief" regarding the Bauer family in Chicago. I > decided > to take a look at the GBHS web page and discovered familiar names and > localities. > > What I'm doing is letting everyone know that I'm not very proficient at > the > new computer-based genealogy searches. My background is digging around in > court houses, libraries, cemeteries, going to the local LDS, etc. > > It was about 18 years ago, that my wife commented that she knew almost > nothing about her family, especially on her father's side. Her grandfather > had died 3 years before she was born, and her grandmother had already > remarried and removed everything relating to him from the house. Grandma > and > my wife's 2 aunts shortly moved to California, and communication became a > birthday and christmas card. My wife's father had died young of a heart > attack. I never even had met him. My wife basically didn't know anything > about her father's side of the family. I decided to undertake a search. > Boy, > did I ever have a lot to learn. > > After about 6 years or so (1994, IIRC) I seemed to have run out of leads, > and I also had located interesting information about her Mother's side of > the family. So I wrote up the information I had, and abandoned her > father's > side of the family. In about 2001, I'd pretty much finished what I could > about her Mother's side of the family and found the grandchildren and > gardening were more interesting than genealogy. In other words, I haven't > been doing any research in about 5 years. I've still been interested > enough > to continue reading and seeing what was going on. Toi summarize, not only > am > I unfamiliar with the internet-genealogy, my skills are very rusty. > > --------------------- > > On to my wife's paternal side. The Wenzl Reichl family arrived in > Baltimore, > MD, on May 8, 1878, on board the the SS Gener'l Werder. They were listed > as > coming from Bohemia. Wenzl (56) was accompanied by his wife Katharina (42) > and children Theresia (15), Wenzl (11), Johann (9), Maria (7) and Anna > (2). > (My wife's father, Joseph, was born in Chicago on June 25, 1879.) Wenzl > Sr. > died on July 15th, 1879. I got very lucky on this one, the death was > listed > in the census death index. It even led me to the coronor's report and > newspaper articles (he died of sunstroke on the hottest day in several > years). > > I followed the (fatherless) family through the following years with the > city > directories, and the census. The 1880 census had one surprise for, a son > named George (age 21) was living with the family. Where did he come from? > Had he come earlier, as often was the case? In a few years, he disappeared > from the directory listings and I was unable to find him again. > > I was able to follow Katherina with the city directories until the last > listing in the 1905 directory, likely listing residents as of 1904. Until > this time she had been living with her youngest child, Joseph, who married > in 1904. At that point, nothing. No death certificate, not in a subsequent > census/directory, just a dead end. > > Meanwhile, Theresa married George Bauers 17 DEC, 1879. He died 12 JUL 1889 > & > is buried next to Wenzl Reichl in Waldheim cemetery. His death certificate > states he had been born in Neudorf/Bohemia, and was 34 years and 1 month > old. George and Theresia had 3 children. Theresa remarried, to a man named > George Kastner. They had no children. In 1992 we located and visted one of > Theresia's granddaughters. She was living in Carol Stream, IL. We saw > photos > (and made copies) of my wife's grandfather. The first time she had ever > seen > his likeness. There were also photos of Wenzl, junior. This granddaughter > was able to provide a great deal of other details. I'll mention it later. > > Wenzl Reichl (junior) never married -- he died in 1931, in the Cook County > institution. It appears he had become a charity case. The death > certificate > was unhelpful. He was buried in Elmwood cemetery, in the "charities" are. > > John (Johann) Reichl married Katherina Dietz 04 May, 1889. Thanks to the > genealogy, we were able to locate descendants of the John Reichl family, > icluding an elderly daughter. The family members have stated that John > knew > Katherina back in Bohemia, and that he paid her ship passage to this > country > to get married. Catherina Ditz (19) arrived in Baltimore on the > Hohenzollern > on May 19, 1886, accompanied by Fransisca Ditz, age 27. Both listed their > destination as Illinois. John Reichl died 01 JUL, 1927. According to the > death certificate he had been born 27 FEB 1868, in Neudorf, Bohemia. > Katherine Dietz died 27 MAY, 1955. For some reason, I haven't gotten a > death > certificate. > > Maria Reichl married Peter Weiss on 09 MAY 1891. The moved to Aurora (Kane > County), IL. We had the honor of meeting/talking to their eldest daughter, > Elizabeth in a nursing home, in Aurora, IL. She was 100 years old, but her > mind was sharp. She clearly remembered that her mother had died on her > wedding day, 26 NOV 1913. The death certificate stated she was born in > Neudorf, Austria, on Sept 7, 1870 to Wensel Reichel and Caty Bauer. What a > sad day for the daughter to be married. She said her wedding anniversaries > were always so sad. She was able to provide many family details. > > Anna Reichl married Charles Braun (or Brown) in 1894. I don't have an > exact > date for the marriage -- I suspect they may have been married outside of > the > city of Chicago. I have no marriage record. They did subsequently live in > Chicago. I'm afraid I've neglected this branch of the family. > > Several things learned along the way. All of the records indicated that > the > Bohemian locality they came from was Neudorf. Two death records state the > mother, Katherina, had a maiden name of Bauer. The elderly descendants > have > all confirmed this. The elderly descendents informed me that Katherine > (Dietz) Reichl, had died at the Peter & Marie Weiss home in Aurora, IL, > and > was taken to Chicago by train for burial. Nobody could provide an exact > date > as it was so long ago, but it appeared likely to have been sometime > between > 1904 and 1910. I have searched very hard for a death certificate, and can > find none. > > ---------------- > > What am I "specifically" interested in: > 1. Most important is the tie to Neudorf, Bohemia. When I first attempted > to > make this connection I was horrified to discover dozens of Neudorf > villages. > It was a hopeless task trying to discover which Neudorf they were from. > The > first clue I've ever discovered is from Gerhard Reichl, inquiring about a > Ditz (Dietz) and a Bauer. This leads me to think there is a high > likelihood > that the Neudorf he refers to is the Neudorf I'm interested in. I can > locate > it on the map (well actually, that old map also shows another Neudorf a > few > miles further north), and it sounds promising. If Gerhard is monitoring > this > mailing list, I would definitely appreciate it if he could reply regarding > any of the names and dates I've listed for our immigrant ancestors. > Second, > does he know of any reputable genealogist living near him who could do a > search of the district and church records -- obviously, I'd pay them. It > appears possible that the village may have been destroyed during the > Russian > era, but if you have any old or new photos I and my wife would dearly like > to see them. Again, we are very willing to pay for copies. Please describe > to us what the countryside is like. Anything about Neudorf is welcome. > > 2. On the United States/Chicago side, my most important desire would be to > locate any death record of Katherina Reichl. I have searched in vain. Do > any of you have any suggestions? There must be some way of finding the > date > and place of her death, and perhaps this internet age has revealed it. I'm > reasonably sure it is in the 1904-1910 time period, and her descendants > were > very sure she died in Aurora, Kane County IL, and taken by train to > Chicago. > > 3. I'd also like to find the death certificate for Katherine (Dietz) > Reichel > but I don't think that should be a problem, as I have a definite date and > have even seen the headstone. > > 4. I obviously need to locate some more information regarding Anna's > marriage, death, etc. Do any of you have any suggestions for "easy" > internet > type searches? > > 5. I suppose I should try to investigate this George Reichl who appeared > so > mysteriously as a son, and then disappeared again. Again, any ideas are > welcome. > > I apologize for the length of this, perhaps one reason it has become so > long > is because I'm trying hard to reorient my own thoughts, having been away > from it for over 10 years. The posting by Gerhard Reichl this last > December > rekindled my interest. I don't believe the names Reichl and Ditz (Dietz) > are > very common, and the association of the two names is very interesting, > especially when from Neudorf, Bohemia > > Regards, > Don Feldbruegge > > > ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== > Forgotten how to UNSUBSCRIBE? > Visit http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/mailinglist/mailinglist.html > >

Hi Linda, At 05:38 PM 3/22/2006, you wrote: >Don, >You DEFINITELY want to talk to Gerhard Reichl. Yep, from Neudorf, the right >one, I'm sure, for he researches, Reichl, Ditz, Bauer. Yes, that was my thinking, also. >You can get his e-mail address, out of an earlier reply from me to him, >where I helped him with some of those, yep, Chicago connections (just click >on his name in blue). There was a lot more in the e-mails, which you can >find by looking through the archive for this list, and also from Gerhard. I thought it was bad etiquette to contact someone off-list, unless requested. I was also hoping that he was subscribed to this list and we see my "missive". If I get no response from him on this list, I will become desperate and contact him direct. Thank you, Don Feldbruegge

Hi Kathy, At 05:25 PM 3/22/2006, you wrote: >I recommend that you also join the Cook Co. IL list. Someone from the >Chicago area may be able to assist you. Have you already checked the >Illinois State Archives online? >http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/archives/databases.html they >have marriage 1763-1900, deaths pre 1916 and 1916-1950 and they are >searchable. > > >Kathy Thank you for the archives link. I didn't know of it -- as I mentioned, I'm not at all familiar with internet searching. I did a search before and after 1916 for Katherine Reichel/Reichl/Reich, and didn't come up with any death certificates. I did find Wenzel junior and John, which I already had -- so I know it works. I'll bookmark this for future reference, ie Anna and Charles Brown/Braun. As to the Cook County, IL list, would you by chance have a link for that? I might be looking for a long time before I found it. Thank you, Don Feldbruegge

Don, You DEFINITELY want to talk to Gerhard Reichl. Yep, from Neudorf, the right one, I'm sure, for he researches, Reichl, Ditz, Bauer. You can get his e-mail address, out of an earlier reply from me to him, where I helped him with some of those, yep, Chicago connections (just click on his name in blue). There was a lot more in the e-mails, which you can find by looking through the archive for this list, and also from Gerhard. Dear Gerhard, Because I have had a lot of success lately with searching newspaper obituaries online, I went right to that, to confirm Katharina's death and to see what it says about her children. I found it right off, but unfortunately it does not mention the grandchildren. It does show that Joseph her husband has also already died, however. I copy hers here, and will go back and look for more. Probably will need to look a little in the census for some birth dates. Of course, there are some problems with the frequency of the name Bauer! Linda in Minneapolis Chicago Tribune (IL) - February 29, 1940 BAUER Deceased Name: Katharina Bauer, nee Ditz --Katharina Bauer, nee Ditz, of 3411 N. Springfield, beloved wife of the late Joseph, dear mother of Ferdinand, Joseph, Margaret, George, and John. Funeral Friday, 9:30 a.m., from funeral home, 3521-23 N. Pulaski road, to St. Viator's church. Interment St. Joseph's. Independence 5800. ----- Original Message ----- From: Gerhard Reichl<about:blank>

I recommend that you also join the Cook Co. IL list. Someone from the Chicago area may be able to assist you. Have you already checked the Illinois State Archives online? http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/archives/databases.html they have marriage 1763-1900, deaths pre 1916 and 1916-1950 and they are searchable. Kathy -----Original Message----- From: Donald Feldbruegge [mailto:dhfeldbr@chorus.net] Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 4:58 PM To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] First Message Hi, I understand that I should post a list of names/place I'm researching in this, my first post. The names I'm interested in are Reichl/Reichel, Bauer/Bauers & Dietz/Ditz. The places are Neudorf, Bohemia and Chicago/vicinity, Illinois. Let me give you a small bit of background. We are retired. Although I'm somewhat familiar with computers, I'm definitely not expert at web things. This is the first genealogy message list I've joined. I probably wouldn't have even done this if it wasn't for a recent bit of news in the most recent issue of "The Heimatbrief" regarding the Bauer family in Chicago. I decided to take a look at the GBHS web page and discovered familiar names and localities. What I'm doing is letting everyone know that I'm not very proficient at the new computer-based genealogy searches. My background is digging around in court houses, libraries, cemeteries, going to the local LDS, etc. It was about 18 years ago, that my wife commented that she knew almost nothing about her family, especially on her father's side. Her grandfather had died 3 years before she was born, and her grandmother had already remarried and removed everything relating to him from the house. Grandma and my wife's 2 aunts shortly moved to California, and communication became a birthday and christmas card. My wife's father had died young of a heart attack. I never even had met him. My wife basically didn't know anything about her father's side of the family. I decided to undertake a search. Boy, did I ever have a lot to learn. After about 6 years or so (1994, IIRC) I seemed to have run out of leads, and I also had located interesting information about her Mother's side of the family. So I wrote up the information I had, and abandoned her father's side of the family. In about 2001, I'd pretty much finished what I could about her Mother's side of the family and found the grandchildren and gardening were more interesting than genealogy. In other words, I haven't been doing any research in about 5 years. I've still been interested enough to continue reading and seeing what was going on. Toi summarize, not only am I unfamiliar with the internet-genealogy, my skills are very rusty. --------------------- On to my wife's paternal side. The Wenzl Reichl family arrived in Baltimore, MD, on May 8, 1878, on board the the SS Gener'l Werder. They were listed as coming from Bohemia. Wenzl (56) was accompanied by his wife Katharina (42) and children Theresia (15), Wenzl (11), Johann (9), Maria (7) and Anna (2). (My wife's father, Joseph, was born in Chicago on June 25, 1879.) Wenzl Sr. died on July 15th, 1879. I got very lucky on this one, the death was listed in the census death index. It even led me to the coronor's report and newspaper articles (he died of sunstroke on the hottest day in several years). I followed the (fatherless) family through the following years with the city directories, and the census. The 1880 census had one surprise for, a son named George (age 21) was living with the family. Where did he come from? Had he come earlier, as often was the case? In a few years, he disappeared from the directory listings and I was unable to find him again. I was able to follow Katherina with the city directories until the last listing in the 1905 directory, likely listing residents as of 1904. Until this time she had been living with her youngest child, Joseph, who married in 1904. At that point, nothing. No death certificate, not in a subsequent census/directory, just a dead end. Meanwhile, Theresa married George Bauers 17 DEC, 1879. He died 12 JUL 1889 & is buried next to Wenzl Reichl in Waldheim cemetery. His death certificate states he had been born in Neudorf/Bohemia, and was 34 years and 1 month old. George and Theresia had 3 children. Theresa remarried, to a man named George Kastner. They had no children. In 1992 we located and visted one of Theresia's granddaughters. She was living in Carol Stream, IL. We saw photos (and made copies) of my wife's grandfather. The first time she had ever seen his likeness. There were also photos of Wenzl, junior. This granddaughter was able to provide a great deal of other details. I'll mention it later. Wenzl Reichl (junior) never married -- he died in 1931, in the Cook County institution. It appears he had become a charity case. The death certificate was unhelpful. He was buried in Elmwood cemetery, in the "charities" are. John (Johann) Reichl married Katherina Dietz 04 May, 1889. Thanks to the genealogy, we were able to locate descendants of the John Reichl family, icluding an elderly daughter. The family members have stated that John knew Katherina back in Bohemia, and that he paid her ship passage to this country to get married. Catherina Ditz (19) arrived in Baltimore on the Hohenzollern on May 19, 1886, accompanied by Fransisca Ditz, age 27. Both listed their destination as Illinois. John Reichl died 01 JUL, 1927. According to the death certificate he had been born 27 FEB 1868, in Neudorf, Bohemia. Katherine Dietz died 27 MAY, 1955. For some reason, I haven't gotten a death certificate. Maria Reichl married Peter Weiss on 09 MAY 1891. The moved to Aurora (Kane County), IL. We had the honor of meeting/talking to their eldest daughter, Elizabeth in a nursing home, in Aurora, IL. She was 100 years old, but her mind was sharp. She clearly remembered that her mother had died on her wedding day, 26 NOV 1913. The death certificate stated she was born in Neudorf, Austria, on Sept 7, 1870 to Wensel Reichel and Caty Bauer. What a sad day for the daughter to be married. She said her wedding anniversaries were always so sad. She was able to provide many family details. Anna Reichl married Charles Braun (or Brown) in 1894. I don't have an exact date for the marriage -- I suspect they may have been married outside of the city of Chicago. I have no marriage record. They did subsequently live in Chicago. I'm afraid I've neglected this branch of the family. Several things learned along the way. All of the records indicated that the Bohemian locality they came from was Neudorf. Two death records state the mother, Katherina, had a maiden name of Bauer. The elderly descendants have all confirmed this. The elderly descendents informed me that Katherine (Dietz) Reichl, had died at the Peter & Marie Weiss home in Aurora, IL, and was taken to Chicago by train for burial. Nobody could provide an exact date as it was so long ago, but it appeared likely to have been sometime between 1904 and 1910. I have searched very hard for a death certificate, and can find none. ---------------- What am I "specifically" interested in: 1. Most important is the tie to Neudorf, Bohemia. When I first attempted to make this connection I was horrified to discover dozens of Neudorf villages. It was a hopeless task trying to discover which Neudorf they were from. The first clue I've ever discovered is from Gerhard Reichl, inquiring about a Ditz (Dietz) and a Bauer. This leads me to think there is a high likelihood that the Neudorf he refers to is the Neudorf I'm interested in. I can locate it on the map (well actually, that old map also shows another Neudorf a few miles further north), and it sounds promising. If Gerhard is monitoring this mailing list, I would definitely appreciate it if he could reply regarding any of the names and dates I've listed for our immigrant ancestors. Second, does he know of any reputable genealogist living near him who could do a search of the district and church records -- obviously, I'd pay them. It appears possible that the village may have been destroyed during the Russian era, but if you have any old or new photos I and my wife would dearly like to see them. Again, we are very willing to pay for copies. Please describe to us what the countryside is like. Anything about Neudorf is welcome. 2. On the United States/Chicago side, my most important desire would be to locate any death record of Katherina Reichl. I have searched in vain. Do any of you have any suggestions? There must be some way of finding the date and place of her death, and perhaps this internet age has revealed it. I'm reasonably sure it is in the 1904-1910 time period, and her descendants were very sure she died in Aurora, Kane County IL, and taken by train to Chicago. 3. I'd also like to find the death certificate for Katherine (Dietz) Reichel but I don't think that should be a problem, as I have a definite date and have even seen the headstone. 4. I obviously need to locate some more information regarding Anna's marriage, death, etc. Do any of you have any suggestions for "easy" internet type searches? 5. I suppose I should try to investigate this George Reichl who appeared so mysteriously as a son, and then disappeared again. Again, any ideas are welcome. I apologize for the length of this, perhaps one reason it has become so long is because I'm trying hard to reorient my own thoughts, having been away from it for over 10 years. The posting by Gerhard Reichl this last December rekindled my interest. I don't believe the names Reichl and Ditz (Dietz) are very common, and the association of the two names is very interesting, especially when from Neudorf, Bohemia Regards, Don Feldbruegge ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== Forgotten how to UNSUBSCRIBE? Visit http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/mailinglist/mailinglist.html

Hi, I understand that I should post a list of names/place I'm researching in this, my first post. The names I'm interested in are Reichl/Reichel, Bauer/Bauers & Dietz/Ditz. The places are Neudorf, Bohemia and Chicago/vicinity, Illinois. Let me give you a small bit of background. We are retired. Although I'm somewhat familiar with computers, I'm definitely not expert at web things. This is the first genealogy message list I've joined. I probably wouldn't have even done this if it wasn't for a recent bit of news in the most recent issue of "The Heimatbrief" regarding the Bauer family in Chicago. I decided to take a look at the GBHS web page and discovered familiar names and localities. What I'm doing is letting everyone know that I'm not very proficient at the new computer-based genealogy searches. My background is digging around in court houses, libraries, cemeteries, going to the local LDS, etc. It was about 18 years ago, that my wife commented that she knew almost nothing about her family, especially on her father's side. Her grandfather had died 3 years before she was born, and her grandmother had already remarried and removed everything relating to him from the house. Grandma and my wife's 2 aunts shortly moved to California, and communication became a birthday and christmas card. My wife's father had died young of a heart attack. I never even had met him. My wife basically didn't know anything about her father's side of the family. I decided to undertake a search. Boy, did I ever have a lot to learn. After about 6 years or so (1994, IIRC) I seemed to have run out of leads, and I also had located interesting information about her Mother's side of the family. So I wrote up the information I had, and abandoned her father's side of the family. In about 2001, I'd pretty much finished what I could about her Mother's side of the family and found the grandchildren and gardening were more interesting than genealogy. In other words, I haven't been doing any research in about 5 years. I've still been interested enough to continue reading and seeing what was going on. Toi summarize, not only am I unfamiliar with the internet-genealogy, my skills are very rusty. --------------------- On to my wife's paternal side. The Wenzl Reichl family arrived in Baltimore, MD, on May 8, 1878, on board the the SS Gener'l Werder. They were listed as coming from Bohemia. Wenzl (56) was accompanied by his wife Katharina (42) and children Theresia (15), Wenzl (11), Johann (9), Maria (7) and Anna (2). (My wife's father, Joseph, was born in Chicago on June 25, 1879.) Wenzl Sr. died on July 15th, 1879. I got very lucky on this one, the death was listed in the census death index. It even led me to the coronor's report and newspaper articles (he died of sunstroke on the hottest day in several years). I followed the (fatherless) family through the following years with the city directories, and the census. The 1880 census had one surprise for, a son named George (age 21) was living with the family. Where did he come from? Had he come earlier, as often was the case? In a few years, he disappeared from the directory listings and I was unable to find him again. I was able to follow Katherina with the city directories until the last listing in the 1905 directory, likely listing residents as of 1904. Until this time she had been living with her youngest child, Joseph, who married in 1904. At that point, nothing. No death certificate, not in a subsequent census/directory, just a dead end. Meanwhile, Theresa married George Bauers 17 DEC, 1879. He died 12 JUL 1889 & is buried next to Wenzl Reichl in Waldheim cemetery. His death certificate states he had been born in Neudorf/Bohemia, and was 34 years and 1 month old. George and Theresia had 3 children. Theresa remarried, to a man named George Kastner. They had no children. In 1992 we located and visted one of Theresia's granddaughters. She was living in Carol Stream, IL. We saw photos (and made copies) of my wife's grandfather. The first time she had ever seen his likeness. There were also photos of Wenzl, junior. This granddaughter was able to provide a great deal of other details. I'll mention it later. Wenzl Reichl (junior) never married -- he died in 1931, in the Cook County institution. It appears he had become a charity case. The death certificate was unhelpful. He was buried in Elmwood cemetery, in the "charities" are. John (Johann) Reichl married Katherina Dietz 04 May, 1889. Thanks to the genealogy, we were able to locate descendants of the John Reichl family, icluding an elderly daughter. The family members have stated that John knew Katherina back in Bohemia, and that he paid her ship passage to this country to get married. Catherina Ditz (19) arrived in Baltimore on the Hohenzollern on May 19, 1886, accompanied by Fransisca Ditz, age 27. Both listed their destination as Illinois. John Reichl died 01 JUL, 1927. According to the death certificate he had been born 27 FEB 1868, in Neudorf, Bohemia. Katherine Dietz died 27 MAY, 1955. For some reason, I haven't gotten a death certificate. Maria Reichl married Peter Weiss on 09 MAY 1891. The moved to Aurora (Kane County), IL. We had the honor of meeting/talking to their eldest daughter, Elizabeth in a nursing home, in Aurora, IL. She was 100 years old, but her mind was sharp. She clearly remembered that her mother had died on her wedding day, 26 NOV 1913. The death certificate stated she was born in Neudorf, Austria, on Sept 7, 1870 to Wensel Reichel and Caty Bauer. What a sad day for the daughter to be married. She said her wedding anniversaries were always so sad. She was able to provide many family details. Anna Reichl married Charles Braun (or Brown) in 1894. I don't have an exact date for the marriage -- I suspect they may have been married outside of the city of Chicago. I have no marriage record. They did subsequently live in Chicago. I'm afraid I've neglected this branch of the family. Several things learned along the way. All of the records indicated that the Bohemian locality they came from was Neudorf. Two death records state the mother, Katherina, had a maiden name of Bauer. The elderly descendants have all confirmed this. The elderly descendents informed me that Katherine (Dietz) Reichl, had died at the Peter & Marie Weiss home in Aurora, IL, and was taken to Chicago by train for burial. Nobody could provide an exact date as it was so long ago, but it appeared likely to have been sometime between 1904 and 1910. I have searched very hard for a death certificate, and can find none. ---------------- What am I "specifically" interested in: 1. Most important is the tie to Neudorf, Bohemia. When I first attempted to make this connection I was horrified to discover dozens of Neudorf villages. It was a hopeless task trying to discover which Neudorf they were from. The first clue I've ever discovered is from Gerhard Reichl, inquiring about a Ditz (Dietz) and a Bauer. This leads me to think there is a high likelihood that the Neudorf he refers to is the Neudorf I'm interested in. I can locate it on the map (well actually, that old map also shows another Neudorf a few miles further north), and it sounds promising. If Gerhard is monitoring this mailing list, I would definitely appreciate it if he could reply regarding any of the names and dates I've listed for our immigrant ancestors. Second, does he know of any reputable genealogist living near him who could do a search of the district and church records -- obviously, I'd pay them. It appears possible that the village may have been destroyed during the Russian era, but if you have any old or new photos I and my wife would dearly like to see them. Again, we are very willing to pay for copies. Please describe to us what the countryside is like. Anything about Neudorf is welcome. 2. On the United States/Chicago side, my most important desire would be to locate any death record of Katherina Reichl. I have searched in vain. Do any of you have any suggestions? There must be some way of finding the date and place of her death, and perhaps this internet age has revealed it. I'm reasonably sure it is in the 1904-1910 time period, and her descendants were very sure she died in Aurora, Kane County IL, and taken by train to Chicago. 3. I'd also like to find the death certificate for Katherine (Dietz) Reichel but I don't think that should be a problem, as I have a definite date and have even seen the headstone. 4. I obviously need to locate some more information regarding Anna's marriage, death, etc. Do any of you have any suggestions for "easy" internet type searches? 5. I suppose I should try to investigate this George Reichl who appeared so mysteriously as a son, and then disappeared again. Again, any ideas are welcome. I apologize for the length of this, perhaps one reason it has become so long is because I'm trying hard to reorient my own thoughts, having been away from it for over 10 years. The posting by Gerhard Reichl this last December rekindled my interest. I don't believe the names Reichl and Ditz (Dietz) are very common, and the association of the two names is very interesting, especially when from Neudorf, Bohemia Regards, Don Feldbruegge

Hello Ray - The ethnic publications I mentioned earlier have been started after the expulsion of the Sudeten Germans, starting in 1945. The first one did not appear until after 1946 in a crude format. They are the communications media they use to provide news to the citizens of the former villages in a given district. If you need an example of what they contain I'll gladly scan a page of the ones I subscribe to. Write me a summary of whom you are looking for and I will consider what you can do. Send it to Frank@soural.com Frank -----Original Message----- From: rtklapka@aol.com [mailto:rtklapka@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 11:27 AM To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] Writing possible cousins in Europe Dear Mr. Soural, In your message of 19 Mar 2006, you mentioned the existence of local town Heimatbriefs or Heimatbotes prior to 1946. Did these account go back to the 1800s? If so, I would be very interested since my Grandparents were born in Rostitz and lived before emigration in Udanky or Undanks. They emigrated in 1909 and 1911. Sincerely, Ray Klapka -----Original Message----- From: Frank Soural <frank@soural.com> To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Sun, 19 Mar 2006 14:29:52 -0500 Subject: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] Writing possible cousins in Europe Hello All. There is a way to do that. Here is how: Every district in Bohemia and Moravia that had a substantial German population, prior 1946, has a monthly or quarterly Heimatbrief or Heimatbote in which subscribers get to announce birthdays, deaths, marriages and generally keep in touch with one another. It lists names, current addresses, their house numbers back home and maiden names of the ladies. It is the practice to have each village in a district represented by a Caretaker (Ortsbetreuer) who assembles all messages for his village and gets them ready for the printing presses. He/she is usually someone from that village who knows the history of the families. So that is as close as you can get to finding where a branch of your family now lives in Germany. I am intimately familiar with two such publications, The "Mein Heimatbote", of which I am a subscriber, issued monthly by the "Maehrisch Schoenberg" district association of former German inhabitants of the district and the "Schoenhengster Heimat" by the Schoenhengstgau German Sprachinsel (linguistic Island) which includes cities and villages like Alt Moletein, a village that has Celtic roots going back to 400BC, Landskron, Maehrisch Truebau, Zwittau, Hometown of Oscar Schindler of "Shindlers List" fame and of course Hohenstadt my Hometown (born and raised).Both districts are located in Moravia. If you are looking for cousins in those two districts write me a note. We have been successful in bringing together two families. Every other Sudeten district should have these periodicals that could be contacted. The problem is finding their mailing and contact addresses. If anyone knows of such "Heimat" publications let me know I'll put together a list for posterity. Frank -----Original Message----- From: KarenHob@aol.com [mailto:KarenHob@aol.com] Sent: Sunday, March 19, 2006 1:14 PM To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] Writing possible cousins in Europe ....Bubak listings in the whole of Germany. I plotted these out on a map to see which Bubaks lived in proximity to Bohemia. Is it appropriate to send a search letter to these people, or is there a better way to locate Bubak cousins presently with us? I am open to any suggestions and insights that you have. ---------------- Back in 1993 I found over 140 ancestral surnames in the German phone book. I selected the ones that lived in Bavaria and sent out 50 letters. The letters were in German with an English translation on a second page. First it explained that I was looking for familes with ties to an ancestral birthplace in CZ (there still was a CZ then). I said that I was interested in learning about the family history and in perhaps meeting any cousins who might want to meet me. I explained who I was, who my parens were, what my work was, who my husband was and what my daughters do. (Germans like to know "enough" about anyone who is asking them for personal informatiion.) I included family tree information on the ancestors from the specific birthplace in Bohemia who came to the US in the 1869-1870 at the bottom of the letter. The data included: Name, DOB, House number, parents names, and a little bit of history about the families who came to the US (where they settled, what happened there if it was interesting). I included information going back to about 1793 with the trade of each ancestor listed (two were Richters and one was an Ortsamtmann). I made sure that part of the letter had no English in it. I started the letter with the comment that I could read German but I could not write it very well. (A friend did the German version for me.) I kept the language simple with short sentences and I kept the letter short enough to fit on one page. I was able to fit the family history stuff on the same page but would have put it on back side of that page if needed. I sent out 50 letters. I received 16 replies. About 5 of the replies cam by FAX!!! If you have a FAX number be sure to include it. Some FAXed replies may have no other contact information so be sure to keep a master list of names and addresses on letters sent out. That way you can reply to a FAX with a FAX or you can send another letter. A FAX can actually be cheaper than a letter. If there are FAX numbers given in the German phone book for any of the contacts it may be worth testing if the response to FAXed messages is better overall than the response to letters. Of the 16 replies I received there were several that were from people who had their mother's name -- they were illegitimate, some born during WW I, and their mothers had worked as servants in another household. They knew little about her prior history. However, the town in which their mothers worked were all within a few miles of my ancestral birthplace. One of the replies came in English from a man whose family had special ties to house number 21 in Mariafels although they lived in another village. They . also had family lore about ancestors who were Richters and family members who had gone to America. They sent me a lot of information and even some photos!! I scanned the photos and returned the originals although they did not ask me to do that. My sister and I went to Germany in 1997 and we visited this family in Regenstauf. It was an amazing experience!! One of the women who was born with my ancestral maiden name looked so much like my grandmother and mother that they could have been sisters! The young man who had written me had the same family profile. They called some of their other relatives living in Germany (one in Bad Windsheim) so we could speak to each other. They served us some typical Bohemian village meals and we really enjoyed listening to the sing-song dialect they spoke -- though it took real concentration to try to understand. Fortunately the one fellow could translate. It was a wonderful visit and we are still staying in touch. Since our visit two of the women are no longer able to communicate well -- Alzheimer's disease. One of them was living at the family home when we were there and her memory of family back in CZ was still clear. She did not talk much but she had her own collection of photos she wanted us to see. Not only is it worth it to make the effort to establish contact with cousins it is important to do it SOON. The people who were expelled from CZ are getting pretty old and they will not be around much longer. The younger generations who have not become active members of Heimat organizations have little interest in their roots in Bohemia -- they consider themselves German. Some may want to find their roots as they age but right now all they can tell you is that they don't know anything about "that". One reason may be because their elders never talked about it much -- it was something they wanted to forget. We all know of ancestor's whose standard reply to questions about where they came from was, "Why do you want to know that?" or another "non-answer". I don't know if that was the case with my cousins in Regenstauf. I do know that when we showed a deep interest in what had happened in Bohemia / CZ they were very eager to tell us about it. If you plan to write to possible relatives in Germany or Austria you should know that Germans in general are reluctant to speak to strangers. Austrians may be more responsive but I have no experience with them. Some of them may read you letter and pass it on to someone else who may / may not be interested in giving a reply because they preferred not to talk about the past. Some also may have been suspicious that the letters were from someone who "wanted something." One of the relatives my cousin telephoned when we were in Regenstauf said that he had also received my letter. He did not reply. My guess is that it is better to send out many letters (at $1 or more each) than to send out too few if the response I got (16 out of 50 is 32%) is an indication of what might be expected. I also think it is very important to stay in touch as much as possible with all the respondants -- even thouse who cannot help but who were willing to reply. You never know when they will visit the US and even if you cannot go to Germany to meet them you may find they are eager to meet you. My Regenstauf mother and son came to visit several times and the first thing they wanted to see was the family homestead farm near New Ulm. They came one year during the Heritagefest and that was the high point of their travels -- learning how the old traditions still meant something to German-Bohemians in Minnesota. That kind of visit could probably "loosen more tongues" about the Heimat than any other experience. Alas! The Heritagefest is no more. Karen ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== Would you like to see messages that were posted before you joined the list? To browse the archives, go to: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.5/284 - Release Date: 3/17/2006 -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.5/284 - Release Date: 3/17/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.5/284 - Release Date: 3/17/2006 ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== Forgotten how to UNSUBSCRIBE? Visit http://www.rootsweb.com/~gbhs/mailinglist/mailinglist.html ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== Would you like to see messages that were posted before you joined the list? To search the archives, go to: http://listsearches.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/listsearch.pl?list=GERMAN-BOHEMIAN -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.6/287 - Release Date: 3/21/2006 -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.2.6/287 - Release Date: 3/21/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. 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Dear Mr. Soural, In your message of 19 Mar 2006, you mentioned the existence of local town Heimatbriefs or Heimatbotes prior to 1946. Did these account go back to the 1800s? If so, I would be very interested since my Grandparents were born in Rostitz and lived before emigration in Udanky or Undanks. They emigrated in 1909 and 1911. Sincerely, Ray Klapka -----Original Message----- From: Frank Soural <frank@soural.com> To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com Sent: Sun, 19 Mar 2006 14:29:52 -0500 Subject: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] Writing possible cousins in Europe Hello All. There is a way to do that. Here is how: Every district in Bohemia and Moravia that had a substantial German population, prior 1946, has a monthly or quarterly Heimatbrief or Heimatbote in which subscribers get to announce birthdays, deaths, marriages and generally keep in touch with one another. It lists names, current addresses, their house numbers back home and maiden names of the ladies. It is the practice to have each village in a district represented by a Caretaker (Ortsbetreuer) who assembles all messages for his village and gets them ready for the printing presses. He/she is usually someone from that village who knows the history of the families. So that is as close as you can get to finding where a branch of your family now lives in Germany. I am intimately familiar with two such publications, The "Mein Heimatbote", of which I am a subscriber, issued monthly by the "Maehrisch Schoenberg" district association of former German inhabitants of the district and the "Schoenhengster Heimat" by the Schoenhengstgau German Sprachinsel (linguistic Island) which includes cities and villages like Alt Moletein, a village that has Celtic roots going back to 400BC, Landskron, Maehrisch Truebau, Zwittau, Hometown of Oscar Schindler of "Shindlers List" fame and of course Hohenstadt my Hometown (born and raised).Both districts are located in Moravia. If you are looking for cousins in those two districts write me a note. We have been successful in bringing together two families. Every other Sudeten district should have these periodicals that could be contacted. The problem is finding their mailing and contact addresses. If anyone knows of such "Heimat" publications let me know I'll put together a list for posterity. Frank -----Original Message----- From: KarenHob@aol.com [mailto:KarenHob@aol.com] Sent: Sunday, March 19, 2006 1:14 PM To: GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L@rootsweb.com Subject: [GERMAN-BOHEMIAN] Writing possible cousins in Europe ....Bubak listings in the whole of Germany. I plotted these out on a map to see which Bubaks lived in proximity to Bohemia. Is it appropriate to send a search letter to these people, or is there a better way to locate Bubak cousins presently with us? I am open to any suggestions and insights that you have. ---------------- Back in 1993 I found over 140 ancestral surnames in the German phone book. I selected the ones that lived in Bavaria and sent out 50 letters. The letters were in German with an English translation on a second page. First it explained that I was looking for familes with ties to an ancestral birthplace in CZ (there still was a CZ then). I said that I was interested in learning about the family history and in perhaps meeting any cousins who might want to meet me. I explained who I was, who my parens were, what my work was, who my husband was and what my daughters do. (Germans like to know "enough" about anyone who is asking them for personal informatiion.) I included family tree information on the ancestors from the specific birthplace in Bohemia who came to the US in the 1869-1870 at the bottom of the letter. The data included: Name, DOB, House number, parents names, and a little bit of history about the families who came to the US (where they settled, what happened there if it was interesting). I included information going back to about 1793 with the trade of each ancestor listed (two were Richters and one was an Ortsamtmann). I made sure that part of the letter had no English in it. I started the letter with the comment that I could read German but I could not write it very well. (A friend did the German version for me.) I kept the language simple with short sentences and I kept the letter short enough to fit on one page. I was able to fit the family history stuff on the same page but would have put it on back side of that page if needed. I sent out 50 letters. I received 16 replies. About 5 of the replies cam by FAX!!! If you have a FAX number be sure to include it. Some FAXed replies may have no other contact information so be sure to keep a master list of names and addresses on letters sent out. That way you can reply to a FAX with a FAX or you can send another letter. A FAX can actually be cheaper than a letter. If there are FAX numbers given in the German phone book for any of the contacts it may be worth testing if the response to FAXed messages is better overall than the response to letters. Of the 16 replies I received there were several that were from people who had their mother's name -- they were illegitimate, some born during WW I, and their mothers had worked as servants in another household. They knew little about her prior history. However, the town in which their mothers worked were all within a few miles of my ancestral birthplace. One of the replies came in English from a man whose family had special ties to house number 21 in Mariafels although they lived in another village. They . also had family lore about ancestors who were Richters and family members who had gone to America. They sent me a lot of information and even some photos!! I scanned the photos and returned the originals although they did not ask me to do that. My sister and I went to Germany in 1997 and we visited this family in Regenstauf. It was an amazing experience!! One of the women who was born with my ancestral maiden name looked so much like my grandmother and mother that they could have been sisters! The young man who had written me had the same family profile. They called some of their other relatives living in Germany (one in Bad Windsheim) so we could speak to each other. They served us some typical Bohemian village meals and we really enjoyed listening to the sing-song dialect they spoke -- though it took real concentration to try to understand. Fortunately the one fellow could translate. It was a wonderful visit and we are still staying in touch. Since our visit two of the women are no longer able to communicate well -- Alzheimer's disease. One of them was living at the family home when we were there and her memory of family back in CZ was still clear. She did not talk much but she had her own collection of photos she wanted us to see. Not only is it worth it to make the effort to establish contact with cousins it is important to do it SOON. The people who were expelled from CZ are getting pretty old and they will not be around much longer. The younger generations who have not become active members of Heimat organizations have little interest in their roots in Bohemia -- they consider themselves German. Some may want to find their roots as they age but right now all they can tell you is that they don't know anything about "that". One reason may be because their elders never talked about it much -- it was something they wanted to forget. We all know of ancestor's whose standard reply to questions about where they came from was, "Why do you want to know that?" or another "non-answer". I don't know if that was the case with my cousins in Regenstauf. I do know that when we showed a deep interest in what had happened in Bohemia / CZ they were very eager to tell us about it. If you plan to write to possible relatives in Germany or Austria you should know that Germans in general are reluctant to speak to strangers. Austrians may be more responsive but I have no experience with them. Some of them may read you letter and pass it on to someone else who may / may not be interested in giving a reply because they preferred not to talk about the past. Some also may have been suspicious that the letters were from someone who "wanted something." One of the relatives my cousin telephoned when we were in Regenstauf said that he had also received my letter. He did not reply. My guess is that it is better to send out many letters (at $1 or more each) than to send out too few if the response I got (16 out of 50 is 32%) is an indication of what might be expected. I also think it is very important to stay in touch as much as possible with all the respondants -- even thouse who cannot help but who were willing to reply. You never know when they will visit the US and even if you cannot go to Germany to meet them you may find they are eager to meet you. My Regenstauf mother and son came to visit several times and the first thing they wanted to see was the family homestead farm near New Ulm. They came one year during the Heritagefest and that was the high point of their travels -- learning how the old traditions still meant something to German-Bohemians in Minnesota. That kind of visit could probably "loosen more tongues" about the Heimat than any other experience. Alas! The Heritagefest is no more. Karen ==== GERMAN-BOHEMIAN Mailing List ==== Would you like to see messages that were posted before you joined the list? To browse the archives, go to: http://archiver.rootsweb.com/GERMAN-BOHEMIAN-L/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. 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Thank you Anettka, Mary

In a message dated 3/20/2006 1:18:30 PM Mountain Standard Time, URUDOFSKY@aol.com writes: Marasmus: you are quite right that the treatment was goat milk. It is a form of severe protein deficiency like Kwashiokor in Africa. My grandfather Dr. med. Franz Rudofsky was a firm believer in the use of goat milk for this condition. Severe malnutrition of the lactating mothers and hence the babies was an rampant in Bohemia at the turn of the 18/19 turn of the century, particularly west of Bischofteinitz. Ulrich Rudofsky --------------- About causes of severe malnutrition in lactating mothers in the early 19th century: During that period, Napoleon was busy conquering Europe.. He invaded Bohemia and defeated the Austro-Russian allies at Austerlitz (4 miles east of Brno in CR) in December 1805. The battle was followed by the Peace of Pressburg on Dec. 26, 1806 that ended the Holy Roman Empire and gave some Austrian territory to Germany. Napoleon's army usually lived off the land and took what they needed for food when and where they found it. It was also the custom that the loser paid the winner reparations after a war. I suspect that Napoleon collected some of his reparations from Bohemians, taking cash needed to live on during the winter and to purchase seed and get fields in order in the spring. (There is a folketale about the farmers of one village who saved their seed grain from the French by sowing it on snow-covered fields. It sprouted in the spring and they had some crops but the neighboring villages whose seed grain was taken by the French had nothing.) Before 1815 there were six years in a row during which the growing season was cold and wet. Disastrous harvests slowly eroded any surplus that might have existed in Western Europe. In 1815 a huge eruption of Mount Tambora in Indonesia put so much ash and dust into the atmosphere that it is believed to have caused even worse European weather and harvests in 1815 and 1816. Al though Bohemian nobility had begun to encourage farming for surplus, not just for subsistence -- using crop rotation instead of the traditional "3 fields and fallow" method -- there was not enough stored surplus to last. By 1815 there was nothing left. In 1815, after Napoleon was finally defeated at the battle of Waterloo, England lifted her naval blockade of Europe and Austria released up to 250,000 men from her army. Cheap foodstuffs and textiles flooded into Europe, ba nkrupting many fledgling textile mills (that had already put hand-weavers out of business) and beet sugar makers. Unemployment and economic depression followed. Austria released 250,000 men to go back to homes where there was no work, no money, and no food. The famine in Western Europe was severe. One historian (Post) says that 20,000 died in Switzerland, another 20,000 in Baden Wurtemburg, yet another 20,000 in Hungary and even more died of plague and disease caused by malnutrition. The worst years were 1816 and 1817. Bohemian demographics charts give evidence that the famine was fairly severe there, too. The population fell considerably between 1815-1818 and it did not recover to pre 1815 levels for over 30 years per some charts. There was another year or two of dearth around 1830 and yet two more years in 1846-47. That last famine is documented in the Chronicles of Mies (there was some violence and arson caused by the food shortage) and perhaps in the chronicles of other towns and cities in Bohemia. The Chronicles of Mies also says that there was a Cholera epidemic in 1847-49. Any time that you find evidence of famine or epidemic in a history you may also find that your ancestral family was affected by those events if you chart the births and deaths of children during the bad years. In my case I found that among 6 families living in Bohemia 1846-47, all of whom had children born before those years, there were only 2 children who survived birth from 1846-1852. More frequent survivals began in 1852. My chart had the years from about 1840 to 1860 across the top and the family surnames and childrens hames under them along the left side. When an event occurred in a given family I put an M (marriage) B (birth) D (death) E (emigrated) A (army service) in the line for the name of the person and under the year in which it happened. The empty area where there were only 2 surviving children over a 6-year period was easy to spot. I have not done enough research to learn if any unknown children were born and died during that time. Most research I have read indicates that a malnourished woman often will not become pregnant and that malnourished mothers my not be able to feed their babies. Goat's milk may have been some of the only milk available during the worst years. I have never heard of goats being butchered for their meat and they are said to be able to survive on forage that no other animals will eat. They were usually the animal the poorest families kept if they could not affford a cow. They may have been the only animals that survived when farmers were forced to butcher other livestock because a family had to have something to eat. The picture painted by this history is a very sad one and some of the worst images are not covered above. The information I gathered about the famine appeared in the CGSI yearbook, "Rocenka", vol. 5, 2002. The article is called, "War, Famine and Economic Depression in the Nineteenth Century". That issue of Rocenka is still available at: http://www.cgsi.org/research.asp?i=8 Karen .

Marasmus: you are quite right that the treatment was goat milk. It is a form of severe protein deficiency like Kwashiokor in Africa. My grandfather Dr. med. Franz Rudofsky was a firm believer in the use of goat milk for this condition. Severe malnutrition of the lactating mothers and hence the babies was an rampant in Bohemia at the turn of the 18/19 turn of the century, particularly west of Bischofteinitz. Ulrich Rudofsky