Karen, Again, you have presented some valid points here.  However, there are two parties involved in any agreement to do research for hire.   The person who is hired to do the job, and the one who is doing the hiring and paying.   I acknowledge that fact that you have brought up some important questions. Nonetheless, I am concerned about one thing - these points, though valid, seem to articulate the legitimate concerns of only one of the two significant parties - the person who is hired to do the research. Ultimately, this is a discussion concerning the distribution of risk when something goes wrong in the process.   Who should bear the risk if something should go wrong?   If the researcher demands 100% payment in advance, he/she is demanding that the person doing the hiring take upon him/herself all of the risk should something go wrong.   Likewise, if the person doing the hiring refuses to pay anything up front, he/she is demanding that the researcher take upon his/herself all of the risk should something go wrong. I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT EITHER PARTY SHOULD BE REQUIRED TO TAKE ALL OF THE RISK UPON THEIR SHOULDERS.   Certainly I am not going to take 100% of the risk on myself.  No other person doing the hiring should agree to do so either. On the other hand, you should not be asked to take all of the risk on your shoulders either.   Researchers doing work for hire are earning a honest living and deserve pay for the work they do.  I do not work for my employer for free, and professional researchers do not either. But here is the other side of the scenerio you present.   If I hire a researcher to do the job, pay them 100% of the fee in advance, and then they come back and say they cannot find a thing (or worse yet, avoid my inquiries totally), how am I to know whether they (1) did the research and really did not find anything, or (2) did little or nothing at all on my project? Furthermore, if they did do the research and found nothing (a very real possibility), how am I to keep from retracing their steps at a later time, unless they present me with a detailed written report of what the did do. We both agree on the fact that expectations need to be specific, reasonable and specified ahead of time.   It is NOT unreasonable to expect a written report even if the research produces no new information about my family. So write a report saying what records were examined, and something about what was found even if it is not something about my specific family. Something would have been found of the community's history, or primary surnames of the region or whatever, so include that type of general information then.   Enough so that the person paying the bill knows that they work was done.   In my opinion, that report would be sufficient if nothing was found, and it would allow me to prevent wasting time researching that dead end at a later time as well. That is why I suggest that 50% (but no more than 50%) of the bill be paid until the person who is doing the hiring has received the results of the research.   You may be an honest, hard working, competent researcher, but not every one of the folks advertising research services is as honest as you probably are.   And the problem is that I can not tell over the net how honorable your intentions are.  Neither, for that matter, can you tell how honorable my intentions are. You brought up another point, a very good one in my opinion.  Hiring a researcher to do a series of smaller, more specific jobs before giving them a big, costly and time consuming project. This is another way of sharing the risk, and I am sure that I will farm out my jobs in small increments until I feel comfortable with a researcher. After all, it is a good idea.   However, unless I can share risk with the pro I am hiring, I would never order anything that cost more than a few dollars.  My mother did not raise me to be a fool.  I will share the risk 50-50 - that is the right thing to do from both a practical and moral perspective. But I will not assume the total risk upon my own shoulders, and I will not ask you or any other professional researcher to do likewise. -- Colleen At 08:53 AM 6/12/98 EDT, you wrote: >Other things to be considered: >1.  Are you asking for lookups?  If so, are you asking for specific heads of >families or is the person to find your ancestor as a child?  >2.  If he spends six hours looking at Millers in PA (just an example) and >doesn't find anybody for you--does he deserve to get paid?  That's a lot of >time he spent, that you won't have to...assuming he told you which reels he >looked at...so that it won't be duplicated by someone else looking for the >same person.  >3.  If you're asking for research, we all know that one can spend hours >looking through records and not always find what (or anything) we want.  Now >the person might be a certified professional and know better where to look for >a particular solution to a problem, but  some folks are going to be >disappointed if they don't have solid names & generations.  Some professional >researchers are going to charge by the hour for doing the research whether >they find anything or not.  Other professionals will spend extra time beyond >what they've been contracted for to try to find something tangible to send. >Does this mean the first one is dishonest? >4.  (Many professional research companies insist on a several hundred dollar >retainer before they even begin.)  One way to avoid being taken is to request >small amounts at a time--except sometimes it takes a lot of looking to solve a >problem--and eliminate ten of the eleven "John Miller's".    >     If you're paying for lookups, and not research, you may have to pay for >copies of the records on all eleven John Millers so that you can make your own >value judgment.   > >Perhaps  the best thing to do is to discuss what both individuals want:  just >copies of existing records, or copies of the proof of someone's ancestry. >Does the researcher absorb parking & copying fees, or is that going to be >extra?  If he looks something up in an index, is he supposed to get just the >family that has a son John, 9 years old; or do you want copies of all the >families by that surname.   If what you want is going to be more than a few >dollars, it isn't unreasonable to be expected to send a retainer.  He's going >to have expenses involved in putting your things together.  But negotiating >ahead of time, so that both know what is expected, and when, is a must.  > >Both should keep in touch if it is a long term project.  Genealogy is a fun >project, but it's not inexpensive, whether one does all the work, or contracts >it out. > >Now, if we could only convince the few to STOP TEARING THE PAGES OUT OF THE >BOOKS (or taking the very books themselves).  Some of them have my ancestors >on them too. > >Karen   > > > > >==== GenTips Mailing List ==== >Support online research! 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