Hi everyone, I hope to hear some of your views on the following: I'm seeing for a lot of my triangulated groups for my maternal side (they triangulate with both my mum and me, that's how I know which side) that the U.S. based (and been there for many generations) cousins have lower genetic distance and SNP's (hence shares less DNA) amongst themselves (means within the other U.S. based cousins) than they do share with us (and my mum is basically 99% German with some faint traces of Bohemian and maybe Volga Germans (​https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volga_Germans). Given my mums ancestry it's pretty clear that our common ancestor was German and they are all descendants of German immigrants that went over the pond somewhere in the last 200 years (from the first German settlers to maybe the 18 hundred migrations). So if that same ancestral segment was split up through generations (given the size of max 20 cM with a median of 10 cM for our matches in the TG's) then why is it that the randomness of DNA seems to favor more the German connection (us) than the U.S. connections (the other descendants of immigrants)? From what I read it was common practice for the first settlers to marry within their own nationality/language/religious groups for the first couple of generations before mixing. Given that these settlers were mostly from small villages (which were overpopulated given the size of farms & food availability) consisting of "extended family" and they keep sending messages home about who much better the new world was, thus more of their close kin was following over and again cousin marriage happened. Whereas in Germany the poor living conditions either led to death or those remaining there been forced to move to a better place within Germany, in combination with the start of the industrial revolution and what are now big cities with lots of jobs (we just see this as a global phenomene happening again → the building of mega cities). So they had an opportunity to mix their DNA more than those immigrants in the U.S., correct? I'm wondering if anyone of you has some similar stories or theories as to why it's so. Like I wrote DNA is random, yet I see this happening way more often than not (the higher percentage of DNA with us Germans). This is a big mystery to me. Any feedback and comment is welcome. Thank you! Andreas (WEST) born BASSO My ancestors: [http://www.wikitree.com/genealogy/Basso-Family- Tree-23](http://www.wikitree.com/genealogy/Basso-Family-Tree-23)

Henry Z. Jones Jr., the highly respected genealogist who did an extensive study of the Palatine migration in 1709-1710 and later, is firmly convinced that Germans "traveled together and stayed together." These people were primarily from the Palatinate (Rhine River) region, although the group included some Swiss and others. My own family history reflects this. Of the 300+ families that arrived in the Hudson Valley of New York State in 1710, I descend from more than 50, many of whom now proven by DNA. A great many of their descendants remain in Columbia, Dutchess, Green and Ulster Counties even today. In fact, in an effort to study the genetic patterns of this group, I started a Palatine DNA Project at FTDNA many years ago. I'm no longer associated with it, but it still survives and, hopefully, will one day prove a useful database for someone. Jones also conducted studies of other settlements of Germans in America, especially later in Pennsylvania. The 1710 migration was the first large group to arrive in America. Doris On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 4:37 AM, Andreas West via < genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> wrote: > Hi everyone, > > > I hope to hear some of your views on the following: > > I'm seeing for a lot of my triangulated groups for my maternal side (they > triangulate with both my mum and me, that's how I know which side) that the > U.S. based (and been there for many generations) cousins have lower genetic > distance and SNP's (hence shares less DNA) amongst themselves (means within > the other U.S. based cousins) than they do share with us (and my mum is > basically 99% German with some faint traces of Bohemian and maybe Volga > Germans (​https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volga_Germans). > > Given my mums ancestry it's pretty clear that our common ancestor was > German > and they are all descendants of German immigrants that went over the pond > somewhere in the last 200 years (from the first German settlers to maybe > the > 18 hundred migrations). > > So if that same ancestral segment was split up through generations (given > the > size of max 20 cM with a median of 10 cM for our matches in the TG's) then > why > is it that the randomness of DNA seems to favor more the German connection > (us) than the U.S. connections (the other descendants of immigrants)? > > From what I read it was common practice for the first settlers to marry > within > their own nationality/language/religious groups for the first couple of > generations before mixing. Given that these settlers were mostly from small > villages (which were overpopulated given the size of farms & food > availability) consisting of "extended family" and they keep sending > messages > home about who much better the new world was, thus more of their close kin > was > following over and again cousin marriage happened. > > Whereas in Germany the poor living conditions either led to death or those > remaining there been forced to move to a better place within Germany, in > combination with the start of the industrial revolution and what are now > big > cities with lots of jobs (we just see this as a global phenomene happening > again → the building of mega cities). So they had an opportunity to mix > their > DNA more than those immigrants in the U.S., correct? > > I'm wondering if anyone of you has some similar stories or theories as to > why > it's so. Like I wrote DNA is random, yet I see this happening way more > often > than not (the higher percentage of DNA with us Germans). > > This is a big mystery to me. Any feedback and comment is welcome. Thank > you! > > Andreas (WEST) born BASSO > > My ancestors: [http://www.wikitree.com/genealogy/Basso-Family- > Tree-23](http://www.wikitree.com/genealogy/Basso-Family-Tree-23) > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Germans, like other groups, did (as Doris points out) tend to emigrate and settle together, and indeed to stay together for at least awhile. However, the length of time that they stayed together depends on which group of Germans and when they emigrated. My own German ancestors arrived in the Midwest between 1850 and 1875 and while initially they married other Germans (and to some extent their descendants have continued to marry other German descendants), by the 1920s they were pretty well assimilated. (That said, given my fairly recent German roots--I'm 3/8 German--if more Germans in Germany were to test, I would have some strong leads--a solid German DNA match helped prove my mother's unexpectedly German grandfather.) "German" in North America covers a lot of ground--people from Alsace to Russia, from the North Sea and Baltic coasts to northern Italy. That covers two major and quite a few smaller religious groups and people who emigrated over a good long period of time for diverse reasons. So I'm not surprised that Andreas gets quirky DNA results from North American matches--they may not be very closely related to one another or share much German ancestry DESPITE immigrants clumping together for awhile. On Fri, Oct 30, 2015 at 4:29 AM, Doris Wheeler via < genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> wrote: > Henry Z. Jones Jr., the highly respected genealogist who did an extensive > study of the Palatine migration in 1709-1710 and later, is firmly convinced > that Germans "traveled together and stayed together." These people were > primarily from the Palatinate (Rhine River) region, although the group > included some Swiss and others. My own family history reflects this. Of the > 300+ families that arrived in the Hudson Valley of New York State in 1710, > I descend from more than 50, many of whom now proven by DNA. A great many > of their descendants remain in Columbia, Dutchess, Green and Ulster > Counties even today. In fact, in an effort to study the genetic patterns of > this group, I started a Palatine DNA Project at FTDNA many years ago. I'm > no longer associated with it, but it still survives and, hopefully, will > one day prove a useful database for someone. Jones also conducted studies > of other settlements of Germans in America, especially later in > Pennsylvania. The 1710 migration was the first large group to arrive in > America. > > Doris > > On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 4:37 AM, Andreas West via < > genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> wrote: > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > I hope to hear some of your views on the following: > > > > I'm seeing for a lot of my triangulated groups for my maternal side (they > > triangulate with both my mum and me, that's how I know which side) that > the > > U.S. based (and been there for many generations) cousins have lower > genetic > > distance and SNP's (hence shares less DNA) amongst themselves (means > within > > the other U.S. based cousins) than they do share with us (and my mum is > > basically 99% German with some faint traces of Bohemian and maybe Volga > > Germans (​https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volga_Germans). > > > > Given my mums ancestry it's pretty clear that our common ancestor was > > German > > and they are all descendants of German immigrants that went over the pond > > somewhere in the last 200 years (from the first German settlers to maybe > > the > > 18 hundred migrations). > > > > So if that same ancestral segment was split up through generations (given > > the > > size of max 20 cM with a median of 10 cM for our matches in the TG's) > then > > why > > is it that the randomness of DNA seems to favor more the German > connection > > (us) than the U.S. connections (the other descendants of immigrants)? > > > > From what I read it was common practice for the first settlers to marry > > within > > their own nationality/language/religious groups for the first couple of > > generations before mixing. Given that these settlers were mostly from > small > > villages (which were overpopulated given the size of farms & food > > availability) consisting of "extended family" and they keep sending > > messages > > home about who much better the new world was, thus more of their close > kin > > was > > following over and again cousin marriage happened. > > > > Whereas in Germany the poor living conditions either led to death or > those > > remaining there been forced to move to a better place within Germany, in > > combination with the start of the industrial revolution and what are now > > big > > cities with lots of jobs (we just see this as a global phenomene > happening > > again → the building of mega cities). So they had an opportunity to mix > > their > > DNA more than those immigrants in the U.S., correct? > > > > I'm wondering if anyone of you has some similar stories or theories as to > > why > > it's so. Like I wrote DNA is random, yet I see this happening way more > > often > > than not (the higher percentage of DNA with us Germans). > > > > This is a big mystery to me. Any feedback and comment is welcome. Thank > > you! > > > > Andreas (WEST) born BASSO > > > > My ancestors: [http://www.wikitree.com/genealogy/Basso-Family- > > Tree-23](http://www.wikitree.com/genealogy/Basso-Family-Tree-23) > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- Karla Huebner calypsospots AT gmail.com