You might expect a daughter to share the exact same X segment size with a cousin that her father shares but keep in mind the daughter is likely to have some extra coincidental markers added on to at least one of the borders. Her segment is often slightly longer than her father's matching segment when compared to a cousin but it is essentially the same HIR and should be IBD If there is a reasonable threshold.

I'll be presenting next week on DNA for genealogy and while I do have some Powerpoints that Tim Janzen and others kindly posted online, perhaps it makes sense now to ask what the most recent or best materials are that people are willing to share. I will be going over the basics of Y, MtDNA, and autosomal for an audience of genealogists who range from complete beginners at DNA to those who have some experience but would like a refresher. This is a newly formed DNA interest group within our local genealogy society. I'm told we will have wifi access so at least in theory I can also tour some of the major blogs and the ISOGG site, etc. Thanks, Karla -- Karla Huebner calypsospots AT gmail.com

I know the answer to that question. This is covered in page 65 and elsewhere in my book, "The Slave Children of Thomas Jefferson". Thomas Jefferson went to France in 1784. He took with him his eldest daughter Martha and one of his most important slaves James Hemings. In 1785 he was appointed US Minister to France. His wife Martha Wayles had given birth to six children but three of them had already died. Martha Wayles herself died in 1781. In 1785 the youngest remaining child of Martha Wayles, Lucy Jefferson, died in an epidemic of whooping cough. This made Jefferson fearful that his remaining child was at risk. He wrote a letter dated September 20, 1785 directing that his last remaining child Maria also called Polly be sent to him in France and that one of his slaves, whom he called his servants be sent with her, and that it be one who had already had smallpox and therefore would be immune. He suggested that Isabel, a slave who had already had small pox, be sent with Maria. However, Isabel was in the late stages of pregnancy could not go. Also, Maria did not want to go. Sally Hemings was the same age as Maria and was her playmate. The way that they got Maria to go in 1786 was they tricked her. They got her to play with her friend Sally on the ship which was at anchor. After playing for a while, the children fell asleep. The ship then cast off and when the children awoke they were far out at sea and could not return, The ship took them to England. There they were met by John Adams and his wife Abigail Adams who were friends with Jefferson at that time. Abigail was appalled upon learning that Sally was a slave as she was against slavery. She wanted Sally to be sent back to Virginia. Nevertheless, the children were sent off to France. Research by Fawn Brodie in her book Thomas Jefferson an Intimate History suggests that the sexual relationship between Thomas Jefferson and Sally started three years later in April, 1789 because Thomas Jefferson started buying Sally clothing and jewelry then. This was after she had already been in France for three years. In his interview, Madison Hemings says that Sally was pregnant when she and Thomas Jefferson returned to America in 1789. She gave birth but the child did not live long, said Madison. Thomas Jefferson kept detailed records of his slaves in his Farm Book and in his Accounts Book. This is why we know so much about him and his slaves. His Farm Book makes no mention of him having a slave named Tom. It shows that Sally Hemings gave birth to five children. He calls her Sally 73 meaning she was born in 1773 and thus was 16 when she returned to America in 1789. Her eldest child in the Farm Book is Beverley 98 (a boy, as Beverly was then used as a boys name). Subsequent children were Harriet I (who died) Harriet II born 1801, Madison born 1805 and Eston 1808. These last three were born while Thomas Jefferson was in the White House. This has left some to suggest that Thomas Jefferson could not have been their father because he was in Washington DC at that time. However, research by Fawn Brodie established that Thomas Jefferson went back to Montecello for a visit just exactly nine months before each child was born. Maria died on April 17, 1804 and Thomas Jefferson went to Montecello for the funeral. On January 19, 1805, exactly nine months later, Sally gave birth to Madison Hemings. The situation was confused by James Thompson Callender, a muckraker who started writing newspaper articles attacking Jefferson while Jefferson was president about Sally and her “high yellow” son named Tom. This is how the story about Tommy and Sally became famous in the press while Jefferson was president. This issue has come up many times over the last two hundred years and has never gone away. The book “The Five Negro Presidents” by J. A. Rogers published in 1965 cites a slander sheet published by the opposition while Jefferson was running for president saying “Tom Jefferson, son of a half-breed Indian Squaw, sired by a Virginia mulatto father”. It was actually this book that got me to start researching this. I did a lot of research of Thomas Jefferson's Father Peter Jefferson. He was said to have ancestry “from Wales”. However, I was never able to find a ship passenger list showing that anybody named Jefferson had ever come to America or had lived in Wales. Since the DNA type of Thomas Jefferson exists almost entirely in Africa there is a real possibility that he had part African ancestry. At the time of these DNA tests, autosomal DNA testing had not been developed. Thus we only had Y-DNA testing and this was very primitive by current standards. The situation was muddled up by Minnie Shumate Woodson. I personally corresponded with her while she was alive. She had a theory that her husband's ancestor Tom Woodson was THE Tom who had been Fathered by Thomas Jefferson. However, her belief was merely conjecture. Tom Woodson had been raised on a farm near Fredericksburg Virginia. Minnie believed that he had been sent there to hide him from the newspaper reporters after this scandal had broken in the press. However, there was no evidence to support this theory. Then at age 16 he had married a woman in her late 20s named Jamima and sent to what became West Virginia where he became the patriarch of a large family. The descendants of Tom Woodson who are great in number have been DNA tested and the results have been negative proving that Tom Woodson was NOT the son of Thomas Jefferson. However, another researcher, Judith Price Justus, found a descendant of Eston Hemings in Madison Wisconsin and he was tested and this showed his DNA as being consistent with being a descendant of Thomas Jefferson. My question that started this conversation is what happened to these DNA tests. There were tests taken with descendants of Field Jefferson, descendants of Thomas Jefferson and descendants of Tom Woodson. Now that we know much more about DNA testing than we knew back in 1998 why cannot these results be made available and posted on gedmatch dot com so we can all determine for ourselves the truth of this matter and find out if we are related to these people. Sam Sloan On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 10:05 PM, Belinda Dettmann < belindadettmann@optusnet.com.au> wrote: > There is little doubt that a male Jefferson fathered Eston Hemmings. The > only doubt is which one. I don’t have a vested interest in this but I > wondered if any of the candidates other than Thomas Jefferson followed > Sally to Paris. -Belinda > > > > *From:* Sam Sloan [mailto:samhsloan@gmail.com] > *Sent:* Thursday, 15 October 2015 3:54 PM > *To:* Belinda Dettmann <belindadettmann@optusnet.com.au> > *Cc:* genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com > *Subject:* Re: [DNA] Have new DNA tests been one on the Thomas Jefferson > Sally Hemings Controversy? > > > > My book The Slave Children of Thomas Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 went > into this subject in great detail > > http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 > > Detractors and apologists have long claimed it could have been some other > relative such as the Carr Brothers, sons of Jeffersons sister, but they > are eliminated as candidates because women do not carry Y-DNA. > > Almost all of the other Jeffersons are eliminated because they were far > away ether in time or distance and never came to Monticello. > > There was only one other Jefferson who could possibly have been the > culpret. That was his younger brother Randolph Jefferson who did > occasionally visit Monticello but nobody who knew him ever suggested that > such a relationship was likely. > > Sam Sloan > > > > > > > > On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 9:44 PM, Belinda Dettmann < > belindadettmann@optusnet.com.au> wrote: > > I thought the match did not necessarily prove Thomas Jefferson himself was > the father Eston Hemmings but it could equally well have been any of > Jefferson's cousins or nephews. -Belinda > > -----Original Message----- > From: genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Sam Sloan via > Sent: Thursday, 15 October 2015 3:16 PM > To: genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com; DNA-NEWBIE@yahoogroups.com; > DNAAdoption@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [DNA] Have new DNA tests been one on the Thomas Jefferson Sally > Hemings Controversy? > > In 1998 a DNA test was done on descendants of Eston Hemings son of Sally > Hemings and on descendants of Field Jefferson uncle of Thomas Jefferson. > > The result was a match indicating that Thomas Jefferson was the father of > at > least one of the children of Thomas Jefferson. > > However, at that time only 8 haplogroups were tested as back then DNA > testing was primitive as compared to today when 111 groups were tested. > > My question is whether these tests have been upgraded in the 17 years since > the first tests were done. It seems strange that there have been no further > reports on this subject. > > I wrote one of the early books on this subject.The Slave Children of Thomas > Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 > > http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson%E2%80%93Hemings_controversy > > Sam Sloan > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > >

A discussion of Thomas Jefferson and Sally Hemings is not off topic for this list, as it encompasses both DNA and conventional genealogy. I have not read Sam's book, so I cannot comment on what conclusions he might have reached. After the original DNA test results were announced, the National Genealogical Society published a special issue of the NGS Quarterly devoted entirely to the Jefferson-Hemings controversy. Using conventional genealogy and going over the original source documents created by Thomas Jefferson during his lifetime, the conclusion they reached was that Thomas was the only Jefferson male present on the Monticello estate at the time of the conception of Eason Hemmings. The fact that the descendant of Thomas Woodson did not match the Jefferson yDNA does not mean Woodson was not Jefferson's son, it just means the line of descent was contaminated by stranger yDNA between the life of Woodson and the testing of the Woodson descendant. If you are interested in the conclusions in the NGS Quarterly, it is Volume 89, No. 3, September 2001. Marleen Van Horne

Sam, a point of clarification: You mean DYS, not haplogroups, correct? gm Sent from my iPhone > On Oct 14, 2015, at 11:16 PM, Sam Sloan via <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> wrote: > > In 1998 a DNA test was done on descendants of Eston Hemings son of Sally > Hemings and on descendants of Field Jefferson uncle of Thomas Jefferson. > > The result was a match indicating that Thomas Jefferson was the father of > at least one of the children of Thomas Jefferson. > > However, at that time only 8 haplogroups were tested as back then DNA > testing was primitive as compared to today when 111 groups were tested. > > My question is whether these tests have been upgraded in the 17 years since > the first tests were done. It seems strange that there have been no further > reports on this subject. > > I wrote one of the early books on this subject.The Slave Children of Thomas > Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 > > http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson%E2%80%93Hemings_controversy > > Sam Sloan > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

That's what I'm assuming. Turi King has published data for more DYS markers: http://www.researchgate.net/profile/Mark_Jobling/publication/6530668_Thomas_Jefferson's_Y_chromosome_belongs_to_a_rare_European_lineage/links/09e41512617a61ba22000000.pdf The M70 marker for haplogroup K2 in the above article is now T1a. Ann Turner On Thu, Oct 15, 2015 at 5:25 AM, Gregory Morley via < genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> wrote: > Sam, a point of clarification: You mean DYS, not haplogroups, correct? > > gm > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Oct 14, 2015, at 11:16 PM, Sam Sloan via <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > wrote: > > > > In 1998 a DNA test was done on descendants of Eston Hemings son of Sally > > Hemings and on descendants of Field Jefferson uncle of Thomas Jefferson. > > > > The result was a match indicating that Thomas Jefferson was the father of > > at least one of the children of Thomas Jefferson. > > > > However, at that time only 8 haplogroups were tested as back then DNA > > testing was primitive as compared to today when 111 groups were tested. > > > > My question is whether these tests have been upgraded in the 17 years > since > > the first tests were done. It seems strange that there have been no > further > > reports on this subject. > > > > I wrote one of the early books on this subject.The Slave Children of > Thomas > > Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 > > > > http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 > > > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson%E2%80%93Hemings_controversy > > > > Sam Sloan > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message >

I'm afraid I haven't really followed the Jefferson/Hemings controversy, so please forgive my lack of knowledge. Do I correctly understand you to say that the Hemings descendant who was tested is a direct male lineal descendant of a son of hers? Loretta -----Original Message----- From: genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com [mailto:genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Sam Sloan via Sent: Thursday, October 15, 2015 12:54 AM To: Belinda Dettmann Cc: genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com Subject: Re: [DNA] Have new DNA tests been one on the Thomas Jefferson Sally Hemings Controversy? My book The Slave Children of Thomas Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 went into this subject in great detail http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 Detractors and apologists have long claimed it could have been some other relative such as the Carr Brothers, sons of Jeffersons sister, but they are eliminated as candidates because women do not carry Y-DNA. Almost all of the other Jeffersons are eliminated because they were far away ether in time or distance and never came to Monticello. There was only one other Jefferson who could possibly have been the culpret. That was his younger brother Randolph Jefferson who did occasionally visit Monticello but nobody who knew him ever suggested that such a relationship was likely. Sam Sloan On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 9:44 PM, Belinda Dettmann < belindadettmann@optusnet.com.au> wrote: > I thought the match did not necessarily prove Thomas Jefferson himself > was the father Eston Hemmings but it could equally well have been any > of Jefferson's cousins or nephews. -Belinda > > -----Original Message----- > From: genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Sam Sloan via > Sent: Thursday, 15 October 2015 3:16 PM > To: genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com; DNA-NEWBIE@yahoogroups.com; > DNAAdoption@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [DNA] Have new DNA tests been one on the Thomas Jefferson > Sally Hemings Controversy? > > In 1998 a DNA test was done on descendants of Eston Hemings son of > Sally Hemings and on descendants of Field Jefferson uncle of Thomas Jefferson. > > The result was a match indicating that Thomas Jefferson was the father > of at least one of the children of Thomas Jefferson. > > However, at that time only 8 haplogroups were tested as back then DNA > testing was primitive as compared to today when 111 groups were tested. > > My question is whether these tests have been upgraded in the 17 years > since the first tests were done. It seems strange that there have been > no further reports on this subject. > > I wrote one of the early books on this subject.The Slave Children of > Thomas Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 > > http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson%E2%80%93Hemings_controversy > > Sam Sloan > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without > the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

All the DNA proves is that a Jefferson was the father of Sally Hemings’s children. From what I have read, it appears more likely that the father of her children was Thomas Jefferson’s younger brother, but since the DNA cannot solve that controversy, isn’t the question of which Jefferson fathered Sally Hemings’s children off topic? Karen Parker On Oct 14, 2015, at 11:53 PM, Sam Sloan via <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> wrote: > My book The Slave Children of Thomas Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 went > into this subject in great detail > > http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 > > Detractors and apologists have long claimed it could have been some other > relative such as the Carr Brothers, sons of Jeffersons sister, but they > are eliminated as candidates because women do not carry Y-DNA. > > Almost all of the other Jeffersons are eliminated because they were far > away ether in time or distance and never came to Monticello. > > There was only one other Jefferson who could possibly have been the > culpret. That was his younger brother Randolph Jefferson who did > occasionally visit Monticello but nobody who knew him ever suggested that > such a relationship was likely. > > Sam Sloan > > > > > On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 9:44 PM, Belinda Dettmann < > belindadettmann@optusnet.com.au> wrote: > >> I thought the match did not necessarily prove Thomas Jefferson himself was >> the father Eston Hemmings but it could equally well have been any of >> Jefferson's cousins or nephews. -Belinda >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com >> [mailto:genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Sam Sloan via >> Sent: Thursday, 15 October 2015 3:16 PM >> To: genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com; DNA-NEWBIE@yahoogroups.com; >> DNAAdoption@yahoogroups.com >> Subject: [DNA] Have new DNA tests been one on the Thomas Jefferson Sally >> Hemings Controversy? >> >> In 1998 a DNA test was done on descendants of Eston Hemings son of Sally >> Hemings and on descendants of Field Jefferson uncle of Thomas Jefferson. >> >> The result was a match indicating that Thomas Jefferson was the father of >> at >> least one of the children of Thomas Jefferson. >> >> However, at that time only 8 haplogroups were tested as back then DNA >> testing was primitive as compared to today when 111 groups were tested. >> >> My question is whether these tests have been upgraded in the 17 years since >> the first tests were done. It seems strange that there have been no further >> reports on this subject. >> >> I wrote one of the early books on this subject.The Slave Children of Thomas >> Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 >> >> http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson%E2%80%93Hemings_controversy >> >> Sam Sloan >> >> ------------------------------- >> To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to >> GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the >> quotes in the subject and the body of the message >> >> > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message

Another possibility for seeing who you inherited your X from is ancestry composition. Since my brother and I have one Ashkenazi Jewish grandparent we can see which maternal grandparent gave us which bits of X. Shown in my post about the X http://blog.kittycooper.com/2014/01/what-does-shared-x-dna-really-mean/ On Wednesday, October 14, 2015, Philip Ritter via < genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> wrote: > If you are lucky enough to have maternal grandmother and grandchild > results in 23andMe, you can see exactly how the X has recombined. One > of my daughters got an X intact from her maternal grandmother, while the > other got a recombined X (part from my mother-in-law and part from my > deceased father-in-law). Of course that does not tell us if the intact > X came from my mother-in-law's father or from her mother, but one might > be able to determine this if some of my mother-in-law's cousins on each > side were sequenced (or if we got lucky with a single cousin). > > On 10/14/2015 8:15 PM, Brooks Family via wrote: > > Article on CeCe's site about X inheritance: > > > http://www.thegeneticgenealogist.com/2008/12/21/unlocking-the-genealogical-secrets-of-the-x-chromosome > > > > One thing to keep in mind: a man has only one X chromosome. He will > > appear to match his mother 100% on her X, but, due to recombination, it > > may be part of her paternal of X and part of her maternal X - and you > > can't determine which very easily. I'm not sure what a fully sequenced > > X result would tell you - someone with expertise would need to answer > that. > > > > ------------------------------- > > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com <javascript:;> with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > > . > > > > > > > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com <javascript:;> with the word > 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > -- --------------------------------------------------------------- Kitty Munson Cooper, web developer,programmer, San Diego,CA genetic genealogy blog at http://blog.kittycooper.com/ family history and genealogy at http://kittymunson.com

If you are lucky enough to have maternal grandmother and grandchild results in 23andMe, you can see exactly how the X has recombined. One of my daughters got an X intact from her maternal grandmother, while the other got a recombined X (part from my mother-in-law and part from my deceased father-in-law). Of course that does not tell us if the intact X came from my mother-in-law's father or from her mother, but one might be able to determine this if some of my mother-in-law's cousins on each side were sequenced (or if we got lucky with a single cousin). On 10/14/2015 8:15 PM, Brooks Family via wrote: > Article on CeCe's site about X inheritance: > http://www.thegeneticgenealogist.com/2008/12/21/unlocking-the-genealogical-secrets-of-the-x-chromosome > > One thing to keep in mind: a man has only one X chromosome. He will > appear to match his mother 100% on her X, but, due to recombination, it > may be part of her paternal of X and part of her maternal X - and you > can't determine which very easily. I'm not sure what a fully sequenced > X result would tell you - someone with expertise would need to answer that. > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message > . > >

Actually, because the X comes intact from father to daughter, the whole thing is a little less confusing than all the other chromosomes! Jim - www.segmentology.org > On Oct 14, 2015, at 5:06 PM, Teddi Montes via <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> wrote: > > So when looking at the X-any way to determine WHOSE X it might be???? > Its the one from mom or the one from dad ?? In a male or in a > female...very confusing. > > Teddi > > >> On Oct 14, 2015, at 12:41 PM, Paul Rakow via wrote: >> >> >> Will, >> >> For all practical purposes, the X a woman inherits from >> her father will be intact, while the X from her mother might >> be recombined. >> >> Fine print: there is a little bit near one end where the >> X and Y chromosomes are similar, and it is possible for DNA to >> cross over. But we don't normally worry about that. >> >> Paul Rakow >> >>> On Wed, October 14, 2015 20:23, Wjhonson wrote: >>> I understand this just now. >>> >>> >>> Does this work the same for females and their fathers? >>> I mean do the X and Y recombine into a new X >>> Or do females inherit their X strictly intact from their fathers >>> >>> >>>

My book The Slave Children of Thomas Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 went into this subject in great detail http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 Detractors and apologists have long claimed it could have been some other relative such as the Carr Brothers, sons of Jeffersons sister, but they are eliminated as candidates because women do not carry Y-DNA. Almost all of the other Jeffersons are eliminated because they were far away ether in time or distance and never came to Monticello. There was only one other Jefferson who could possibly have been the culpret. That was his younger brother Randolph Jefferson who did occasionally visit Monticello but nobody who knew him ever suggested that such a relationship was likely. Sam Sloan On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 9:44 PM, Belinda Dettmann < belindadettmann@optusnet.com.au> wrote: > I thought the match did not necessarily prove Thomas Jefferson himself was > the father Eston Hemmings but it could equally well have been any of > Jefferson's cousins or nephews. -Belinda > > -----Original Message----- > From: genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com > [mailto:genealogy-dna-bounces@rootsweb.com] On Behalf Of Sam Sloan via > Sent: Thursday, 15 October 2015 3:16 PM > To: genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com; DNA-NEWBIE@yahoogroups.com; > DNAAdoption@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [DNA] Have new DNA tests been one on the Thomas Jefferson Sally > Hemings Controversy? > > In 1998 a DNA test was done on descendants of Eston Hemings son of Sally > Hemings and on descendants of Field Jefferson uncle of Thomas Jefferson. > > The result was a match indicating that Thomas Jefferson was the father of > at > least one of the children of Thomas Jefferson. > > However, at that time only 8 haplogroups were tested as back then DNA > testing was primitive as compared to today when 111 groups were tested. > > My question is whether these tests have been upgraded in the 17 years since > the first tests were done. It seems strange that there have been no further > reports on this subject. > > I wrote one of the early books on this subject.The Slave Children of Thomas > Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 > > http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 > > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson%E2%80%93Hemings_controversy > > Sam Sloan > > ------------------------------- > To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to > GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the > quotes in the subject and the body of the message > >

In 1998 a DNA test was done on descendants of Eston Hemings son of Sally Hemings and on descendants of Field Jefferson uncle of Thomas Jefferson. The result was a match indicating that Thomas Jefferson was the father of at least one of the children of Thomas Jefferson. However, at that time only 8 haplogroups were tested as back then DNA testing was primitive as compared to today when 111 groups were tested. My question is whether these tests have been upgraded in the 17 years since the first tests were done. It seems strange that there have been no further reports on this subject. I wrote one of the early books on this subject.The Slave Children of Thomas Jefferson ISBN 1-881373-02-9 http://www.amazon.com/dp/1881373029 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson%E2%80%93Hemings_controversy Sam Sloan

Article on CeCe's site about X inheritance: http://www.thegeneticgenealogist.com/2008/12/21/unlocking-the-genealogical-secrets-of-the-x-chromosome One thing to keep in mind: a man has only one X chromosome. He will appear to match his mother 100% on her X, but, due to recombination, it may be part of her paternal of X and part of her maternal X - and you can't determine which very easily. I'm not sure what a fully sequenced X result would tell you - someone with expertise would need to answer that.

Will, For all practical purposes, the X a woman inherits from her father will be intact, while the X from her mother might be recombined. Fine print: there is a little bit near one end where the X and Y chromosomes are similar, and it is possible for DNA to cross over. But we don't normally worry about that. Paul Rakow On Wed, October 14, 2015 20:23, Wjhonson wrote: > I understand this just now. > > > Does this work the same for females and their fathers? > I mean do the X and Y recombine into a new X > Or do females inherit their X strictly intact from their fathers > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Paul Rakow via <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > To: genealogy-dna <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2015 12:16 pm > Subject: Re: [DNA] X-inheritence > > > > W, > > > Your mother, being a woman, has two X chromosomes, you (male) > have just one. All of your X chromosome will match your mother, but quite > possibly, parts of it will match her on one of the Xs, and parts on the > other. But any place on your X chromosome only matches to one of your > mother's two X chromosomes. > > The match between your mother and her cousin must be on > > > the X chromosome that you don't match, at that region. > > I don't think > you can be sure that you have an intact chromosome from your mother - one > end of your X chromosome might match to the X chromosome your mother > inherited from her mother, and the other end might match to the X > chromosome your mother inherited from her father, and you would still show a > perfect match to your mother over the whole length of your X chromosome. > > Paul > Rakow > > > Wjhonson wrote: > > >> >> >> That doesnt change that her X came to me >> > intact. >> >> >> So her X matches, should match me in the exact same >> > way. >> > >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Karla Huebner >> > <calypsospots@gmail.com> > >> To: Wjhonson <wjhonson@aol.com>; genealogy-dna >> >> > <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > >> Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2015 10:08 am >> Subject: Re: >> > [DNA] X-inheritence > >> >> >> >> >> Do you know for a fact that there was no >> > recombination? Your mother got >> one X from her mother, one from her father. > Chances are your X has some of > >> each unless you can show otherwise. >> >> >> > On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 12:50 PM, Wjhonson via > >> > <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> My mother and her female first >> > cousin share 52 cms on the X >> >> >> My mother passed to me (a male) her entire >> > X intact > >> >> >> Should not I also share exactly 52cms on the X with this same >> > female >> first cousin? >> >> If not, why not? >> >> >> >> Will >>

W, Your mother, being a woman, has two X chromosomes, you (male) have just one. All of your X chromosome will match your mother, but quite possibly, parts of it will match her on one of the Xs, and parts on the other. But any place on your X chromosome only matches to one of your mother's two X chromosomes. The match between your mother and her cousin must be on the X chromosome that you don't match, at that region. I don't think you can be sure that you have an intact chromosome from your mother - one end of your X chromosome might match to the X chromosome your mother inherited from her mother, and the other end might match to the X chromosome your mother inherited from her father, and you would still show a perfect match to your mother over the whole length of your X chromosome. Paul Rakow Wjhonson wrote: > > > That doesnt change that her X came to me intact. > > > So her X matches, should match me in the exact same way. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Karla Huebner <calypsospots@gmail.com> > To: Wjhonson <wjhonson@aol.com>; genealogy-dna > <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2015 10:08 am > Subject: Re: [DNA] X-inheritence > > > > > Do you know for a fact that there was no recombination? Your mother got > one X from her mother, one from her father. Chances are your X has some of > each unless you can show otherwise. > > > On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 12:50 PM, Wjhonson via > <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > wrote: > > > My mother and her female first cousin share 52 cms on the X > > > My mother passed to me (a male) her entire X intact > > > Should not I also share exactly 52cms on the X with this same female > first cousin? > > If not, why not? > > > Will > > >

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Will wrote: > So if a father matches on the X to some cousin for say 20cms, the daughter should match *exactly* the same to that cousin > Is that correct? Not quite. The daughter received another X from her mother, and there could easily be segments matching to the cousin on that other X. The reported X matches would be the union of the two sets of matches, i.e., from either X chromosome in the daughter to however many X chromosomes (1 or 2) in the cousin. John Chandler

So if a father matches on the X to some cousin for say 20cms, the daughter should match *exactly* the same to that cousin Is that correct? -----Original Message----- From: Paul Rakow <paul.rakow@cantab.net> To: Wjhonson <wjhonson@aol.com> Cc: genealogy-dna <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2015 12:41 pm Subject: Re: [DNA] X-inheritence Will, For all practical purposes, the X a woman inherits from her father will be intact, while the X from her mother might be recombined. Fine print: there is a little bit near one end where the X and Y chromosomes are similar, and it is possible for DNA to cross over. But we don't normally worry about that. Paul Rakow On Wed, October 14, 2015 20:23, Wjhonson wrote: > I understand this just now. > > > Does this work the same for females and their fathers? > I mean do the X and Y recombine into a new X > Or do females inherit their X strictly intact from their fathers > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Paul Rakow via <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > To: genealogy-dna <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2015 12:16 pm > Subject: Re: [DNA] X-inheritence > > > > W, > > > Your mother, being a woman, has two X chromosomes, you (male) > have just one. All of your X chromosome will match your mother, but quite > possibly, parts of it will match her on one of the Xs, and parts on the > other. But any place on your X chromosome only matches to one of your > mother's two X chromosomes. > > The match between your mother and her cousin must be on > > > the X chromosome that you don't match, at that region. > > I don't think > you can be sure that you have an intact chromosome from your mother - one > end of your X chromosome might match to the X chromosome your mother > inherited from her mother, and the other end might match to the X > chromosome your mother inherited from her father, and you would still show a > perfect match to your mother over the whole length of your X chromosome. > > Paul > Rakow > > > Wjhonson wrote: > > >> >> >> That doesnt change that her X came to me >> > intact. >> >> >> So her X matches, should match me in the exact same >> > way. >> > >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Karla Huebner >> > <calypsospots@gmail.com> > >> To: Wjhonson <wjhonson@aol.com>; genealogy-dna >> >> > <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > >> Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2015 10:08 am >> Subject: Re: >> > [DNA] X-inheritence > >> >> >> >> >> Do you know for a fact that there was no >> > recombination? Your mother got >> one X from her mother, one from her father. > Chances are your X has some of > >> each unless you can show otherwise. >> >> >> > On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 12:50 PM, Wjhonson via > >> > <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > >> wrote: >> >> >> >> My mother and her female first >> > cousin share 52 cms on the X >> >> >> My mother passed to me (a male) her entire >> > X intact > >> >> >> Should not I also share exactly 52cms on the X with this same >> > female >> first cousin? >> >> If not, why not? >> >> >> >> Will >>

I understand this just now. Does this work the same for females and their fathers? I mean do the X and Y recombine into a new X Or do females inherit their X strictly intact from their fathers -----Original Message----- From: Paul Rakow via <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> To: genealogy-dna <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2015 12:16 pm Subject: Re: [DNA] X-inheritence W, Your mother, being a woman, has two X chromosomes, you (male) have just one. All of your X chromosome will match your mother, but quite possibly, parts of it will match her on one of the Xs, and parts on the other. But any place on your X chromosome only matches to one of your mother's two X chromosomes. The match between your mother and her cousin must be on the X chromosome that you don't match, at that region. I don't think you can be sure that you have an intact chromosome from your mother - one end of your X chromosome might match to the X chromosome your mother inherited from her mother, and the other end might match to the X chromosome your mother inherited from her father, and you would still show a perfect match to your mother over the whole length of your X chromosome. Paul Rakow Wjhonson wrote: > > > That doesnt change that her X came to me intact. > > > So her X matches, should match me in the exact same way. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Karla Huebner <calypsospots@gmail.com> > To: Wjhonson <wjhonson@aol.com>; genealogy-dna > <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > Sent: Wed, Oct 14, 2015 10:08 am > Subject: Re: [DNA] X-inheritence > > > > > Do you know for a fact that there was no recombination? Your mother got > one X from her mother, one from her father. Chances are your X has some of > each unless you can show otherwise. > > > On Wed, Oct 14, 2015 at 12:50 PM, Wjhonson via > <genealogy-dna@rootsweb.com> > wrote: > > > My mother and her female first cousin share 52 cms on the X > > > My mother passed to me (a male) her entire X intact > > > Should not I also share exactly 52cms on the X with this same female > first cousin? > > If not, why not? > > > Will > > > ------------------------------- To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GENEALOGY-DNA-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of the message